Cahill for 15m?

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=39859.msg1089855#msg1089855 date=1271631281]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=39859.msg1089848#msg1089848 date=1271631054]
If Benitez paid 15 million quid for a centre half before buying a striker he'd need shooting on the spot. Unless he had 200 million in his arse pocket.
[/quote]

Our defense has cost us just as much as our attack this season, surely?
[/quote]

I wouldn't go that far Farky. Don't let our reasonable goals for kid you too much either most of those are in periods when Torres has been playing, and if people don't find this worrying there is something wrong, he has accounted for exactly a third of them personally.
The facts speak for themselves we need another top striker before we think about anything

regards


1 Chelsea 35 24 5 6 86 32 54 77
2 Man Utd 35 24 4 7 78 27 51 76
3 Arsenal 35 22 5 8 78 39 39 71
4 Tottenham 34 19 7 8 62 34 28 64
5 Manc City 34 17 11 6 69 42 27 62
6 Aston Villa 34 15 13 6 48 35 13 58
7 Liverpool 34 16 8 10 54 33 21 56
8 Everton 35 14 12 9 57 48 9 54
9 Birmingham 35 12 11 12 35 43 -8 47

 

[Mistadobalina]

15 million will seem like chump change to the new owner. Its going to be a very exciting summer.

The Europa cup will be a nice way to finish a dreadful season on a mini high, and then the world cup to look forward to...maybe we will sign an upcoming star from the tournament?

Id take a look at Aguero, Pato and Ribery too, as well as Cahill.

Without Champions league distractions next year and a massive transfer budget to blow you could see us lift number 19 next season.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=39859.msg1089933#msg1089933 date=1271666772]
[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=39859.msg1089855#msg1089855 date=1271631281]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=39859.msg1089848#msg1089848 date=1271631054]
If Benitez paid 15 million quid for a centre half before buying a striker he'd need shooting on the spot. Unless he had 200 million in his arse pocket.
[/quote]

Our defense has cost us just as much as our attack this season, surely?
[/quote]

I wouldn't go that far Farky. Don't let our reasonable goals for kid you too much either most of those are in periods when Torres has been playing, and if people don't find this worrying there is something wrong, he has accounted for exactly a third of them personally.
The facts speak for themselves we need another top striker before we think about anything

regards


1 Chelsea 35 24 5 6 86 32 54 77
2 Man Utd 35 24 4 7 78 27 51 76
3 Arsenal 35 22 5 8 78 39 39 71
4 Tottenham 34 19 7 8 62 34 28 64
5 Manc City 34 17 11 6 69 42 27 62
6 Aston Villa 34 15 13 6 48 35 13 58
7 Liverpool 34 16 8 10 54 33 21 56
8 Everton 35 14 12 9 57 48 9 54
9 Birmingham 35 12 11 12 35 43 -8 47
[/quote]

you can't deny though we have taken the lead in a shit load of games i.e. a winning position to piss it away by conceeding a goal. look at babel's wonder goal in the CL on 84 min (84 MINIUTES FFS!!) I'm sorry but you should be seeing that out and taking the win.
as I said in my earlier post I personally would by a stirker first and foremost but I can totally understand rafa wanting to cut out the sloppy defending that has completely and utterly undermined our season.

 

[Squiggles]

The striker situation has been made worse by Benitez for playing Dirk in the RW spot.

I don't think this gets enough attention on here.

Dirk is/can be a striker, and yet we've chosen N'gog over him for this role loads of times, or decided against pairing them together when they've actually looked quite threatening as a partnership.

We certainly need another striker, but it's a flaw in our squad that's been made far worse by Benitez's tactical decisions.

 

[TheBunnyman]

We do need a better back-up striker, but I can't agree that it's THE top priority when our left flank is so utterly shit. LB and LW are the twin priorities for me, as none of our options are good enough for our first XI.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=39859.msg1089978#msg1089978 date=1271671761]
We do need a better back-up striker, but I can't agree that it's THE top priority when our left flank is so utterly shit. LB and LW are the twin priorities for me, as none of our options are good enough for our first XI.
[/quote]

How can you say that Bunny? The facts speak for themselves. With Torres in the team, we score goals, when he isn't we don't.
Two reasons - Yes, Torres is a top drawer player, but our back up is barely Championship standard.

It does not matter how shit or great our wide play is, if we have no one to stick the ball in the onion bag, and we haven't for large lumps of the season.

Even when Torres is playing, there is only ever likely to be one or two men in the box to get on the end of anything. United could have shite wide players and get away with it, you only have to put a ball into the box and there are usually at least four people looking for it.

regards

 

[TheBunnyman]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=39859.msg1090027#msg1090027 date=1271679958]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=39859.msg1089978#msg1089978 date=1271671761]
We do need a better back-up striker, but I can't agree that it's THE top priority when our left flank is so utterly shit. LB and LW are the twin priorities for me, as none of our options are good enough for our first XI.
[/quote]

How can you say that Bunny? The facts speak for themselves. With Torres in the team, we score goals, when he isn't we don't.
Two reasons - Yes, Torres is a top drawer player, but our back up is barely Championship standard.

It does not matter how shit or great our wide play is, if we have no one to stick the ball in the onion bag, and we haven't for large lumps of the season.

Even when Torres is playing, there is only ever likely to be one or two men in the box to get on the end of anything. United could have shite wide players and get away with it, you only have to put a ball into the box and there are usually at least four people looking for it.

regards

[/quote]

Exactly - so it's as much tactical as personnel. Torres is possibly the world's best striker: it's obvious we're going to miss him when he's not there. I'm not saying we don't need a better back-up striker; clearly we do. I just think it's a lesser priority than the left flank - for the obvious reason that, when you look at our first-choice XI, our two most glaring weaknesses are at LB and LW. The crapness of that flank affects not just scoring statistics but the way the whole team plays. It's like a soldier going into battle with one arm and one leg. We're fatally unbalanced, and it's shown in almost every display this season.

 

[Squiggles]

We've got a world class striker in Fernando Torres. We've got a pretty decent striker in Dirk Kuyt.

At LB we've got nobody

And at LW we've got the departing Albert Riera, and Babel, who has shown no progression here and could also be on his way.

In short, we can't rely on anyone on the left hand side of the pitch. That's how Bunny can say it.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=39859.msg1090034#msg1090034 date=1271680822]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=39859.msg1090027#msg1090027 date=1271679958]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=39859.msg1089978#msg1089978 date=1271671761]
We do need a better back-up striker, but I can't agree that it's THE top priority when our left flank is so utterly shit. LB and LW are the twin priorities for me, as none of our options are good enough for our first XI.
[/quote]

How can you say that Bunny? The facts speak for themselves. With Torres in the team, we score goals, when he isn't we don't.
Two reasons - Yes, Torres is a top drawer player, but our back up is barely Championship standard.

It does not matter how shit or great our wide play is, if we have no one to stick the ball in the onion bag, and we haven't for large lumps of the season.

Even when Torres is playing, there is only ever likely to be one or two men in the box to get on the end of anything. United could have shite wide players and get away with it, you only have to put a ball into the box and there are usually at least four people looking for it.

regards

[/quote]

Exactly - so it's as much tactical as personnel. Torres is possibly the world's best striker: it's obvious we're going to miss him when he's not there. I'm not saying we don't need a better back-up striker; clearly we do. I just think it's a lesser priority than the left flank - for the obvious reason that, when you look at our first-choice XI, our two most glaring weaknesses are at LB and LW. The crapness of that flank affects not just scoring statistics but the way the whole team plays. It's like a soldier going into battle with one arm and one leg. We're fatally unbalanced, and it's shown in almost every display this season.
[/quote]

I agree completely regarding balance we really do need that, without doubt, and it is a priority, but not the most pressing one.
In my own mind I know that if we had brought in a £15m - £20m striker, we would be in or around that fourth spot or even better. I don't think we would be that much better off if we had merely improved our left side.
I said weeks ago, if we are to compete at all we need four players, 3 top players - on the right, on the left , up front and a decent leftback around £70m-£80m. Without flogging anyone, which means the squad strength goes up too.
My argument is that we do make chances even when the left is so conspicuously awful, but when Torres is not there we have no chance of converting them. We need a forward to play alongside Torres to share the knocks and support him, but more than that we need someone to stick in that Dirk or N'gog can support when Torres is not there.
If you don't score goals you don't win matches.

regards

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=39859.msg1090050#msg1090050 date=1271682140]
We've got a world class striker in Fernando Torres. We've got a pretty decent striker in Dirk Kuyt.

At LB we've got nobody

And at LW we've got the departing Albert Riera, and Babel, who has shown no progression here and could also be on his way.

In short, we can't rely on anyone on the left hand side of the pitch. That's how Bunny can say it.
[/quote]

Thats the point Squiggles HE IS NOT THERE HALF THE FUCKING SEASON so we have a "pretty decent striker" to back up, but he doesn't. We have a fucking load of shit to back up.

[size=14pt]AHHHHHGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH[/size]

 

[Sunny]

A striker is an absolute priority for us. Top of the list. Utmost importance. I just can't understand why people cannot see this.

 

[refugee]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090056#msg1090056 date=1271682644]
A striker is an absolute priority for us. Top of the list. Utmost importance. I just can't understand why people cannot see this.
[/quote]

We have signed one though, whether he is any good or not is another question.

 

[Molbystwin]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090056#msg1090056 date=1271682644]
A striker is an absolute priority for us. Top of the list. Utmost importance. I just can't understand why people cannot see this.
[/quote]

Could not agree more, centre back is not the problem.

 

[Fox]

The fact we all suspect Rafa may do this despite the fact we have 4 decent CBs says a lot.

I hope to fuck if any decent money is available a new manager has the chance to have a go with it not Rafa again.

 

[Sunny]

[quote author=refugee link=topic=39859.msg1090058#msg1090058 date=1271682830]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090056#msg1090056 date=1271682644]
A striker is an absolute priority for us. Top of the list. Utmost importance. I just can't understand why people cannot see this.
[/quote]

We have signed one though, whether he is any good or not is another question.
[/quote]

Is he an out and out striker though ? And has he actually signed yet?

 

[Sunny]

[quote author=Fox link=topic=39859.msg1090063#msg1090063 date=1271683112]
The fact we all suspect Rafa may do this despite the fact we have 4 decent CBs says a lot.

I hope to fuck if any decent money is available a new manager has the chance to have a go with it not Rafa again.


[/quote]

Hello Fox , long time !

 

[Squiggles]

I know, Vlad.

But having a fucking shit player all the way through the season is equally, if not more damaging. You treat everyone who does not agree with you to the letter on your striker issue as an idiot.

We do need a striker, and from a financial POV it probably needs to be the priority, but I'd sooner get the LB and LW deals wrapped up first.

 

[Sunny]

[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=39859.msg1090068#msg1090068 date=1271683615]
I know, Vlad.

But having a fucking shit player all the way through the season is equally, if not more damaging. You treat everyone who does not agree with you to the letter on your striker issue as an idiot.

We do need a striker, and from a financial POV it probably needs to be the priority, but I'd sooner get the LB and LW deals wrapped up first.
[/quote]

Why do you think that mate ? Surely if we don't score goals it's impossible to win games ?

 

[Squiggles]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090071#msg1090071 date=1271684187]
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=39859.msg1090068#msg1090068 date=1271683615]
I know, Vlad.

But having a fucking shit player all the way through the season is equally, if not more damaging. You treat everyone who does not agree with you to the letter on your striker issue as an idiot.

We do need a striker, and from a financial POV it probably needs to be the priority, but I'd sooner get the LB and LW deals wrapped up first.
[/quote]

Why do you think that mate ? Surely if we don't score goals it's impossible to win games ?
[/quote]

My only frustration Sunny is that I completely agree that we need a striker and I've said it needs to be a "financial priority". I've said in time and time again. But it gets ignored entirely if I propose we also replace our fucking shit LB and our outgoing left wingers.

The whole squad needs a revamp, daring to suggest we replace one position ahead of another shouldn't be such a staggering prospect. We need to replace these players first because we will literally have *nobody* to play there next season.

 

[keniget]

Players in wide positions never score goals, eh?

 

[TheBunnyman]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=39859.msg1090080#msg1090080 date=1271685865]
Players in wide positions never score goals, eh?

[/quote]

Exactly. I think Vlad's being a little bit over-literal in his striker obsession. What we need to do is get our forward players in more attacking positions generally. It's obviously a matter of opinion, but mine is that having a left side of Insua and Babel/Riera/Yossi has cost us more points this season than having Wash as our second-choice striker rather than, say, Van Nistelrooy. It doesn't mean I'm blind or stupid, just that I don't think football is *quite* as simple as some posters are making it out to be.

 

[refugee]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090065#msg1090065 date=1271683340]
[quote author=refugee link=topic=39859.msg1090058#msg1090058 date=1271682830]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090056#msg1090056 date=1271682644]
A striker is an absolute priority for us. Top of the list. Utmost importance. I just can't understand why people cannot see this.
[/quote]

We have signed one though, whether he is any good or not is another question.
[/quote]

Is he an out and out striker though ? And has he actually signed yet?
[/quote]

No idea on either count, but I would imagine that if he doesn't sign then it pretty much guarantees that Rafa is gone and we don't want him to sign any more players that the new manager may not want.
http://www.liverpoolfc.tv/news/media-watch/jovanovic-confirms-move

 

[Sunny]

[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=39859.msg1090076#msg1090076 date=1271684974]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090071#msg1090071 date=1271684187]
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=39859.msg1090068#msg1090068 date=1271683615]
I know, Vlad.

But having a fucking shit player all the way through the season is equally, if not more damaging. You treat everyone who does not agree with you to the letter on your striker issue as an idiot.

We do need a striker, and from a financial POV it probably needs to be the priority, but I'd sooner get the LB and LW deals wrapped up first.
[/quote]

Why do you think that mate ? Surely if we don't score goals it's impossible to win games ?
[/quote]

My only frustration Sunny is that I completely agree that we need a striker and I've said it needs to be a "financial priority". I've said in time and time again. But it gets ignored entirely if I propose we also replace our fucking shit LB and our outgoing left wingers.

The whole squad needs a revamp, daring to suggest we replace one position ahead of another shouldn't be such a staggering prospect. We need to replace these players first because we will literally have *nobody* to play there next season.
[/quote]

I see what you're saying. I don't think we'll ever have *nobody* playing in those positions - whether they are good enough is a completely different question of course. It still think we need an additional goalscorer first.

 

[Sunny]

[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=39859.msg1090081#msg1090081 date=1271686226]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=39859.msg1090080#msg1090080 date=1271685865]
Players in wide positions never score goals, eh?

[/quote]

Exactly. I think Vlad's being a little bit over-literal in his striker obsession. What we need to do is get our forward players in more attacking positions generally. It's obviously a matter of opinion, but mine is that having a left side of Insua and Babel/Riera/Yossi has cost us more points this season than having Wash as our second-choice striker rather than, say, Van Nistelrooy. It doesn't mean I'm blind or stupid, just that I don't think football is *quite* as simple as some posters are making it out to be.

[/quote]

of course it's not that simple Bunyn but let's face it - players in wide positions should score goals - but ours don't. Well not enough anyway. Maxi, Babel, Rieira, Yossi - there's not been enough goals from those positions. At the moment we're fucked without Torres

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090089#msg1090089 date=1271686739]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=39859.msg1090081#msg1090081 date=1271686226]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=39859.msg1090080#msg1090080 date=1271685865]
Players in wide positions never score goals, eh?

[/quote]

Exactly. I think Vlad's being a little bit over-literal in his striker obsession. What we need to do is get our forward players in more attacking positions generally. It's obviously a matter of opinion, but mine is that having a left side of Insua and Babel/Riera/Yossi has cost us more points this season than having Wash as our second-choice striker rather than, say, Van Nistelrooy. It doesn't mean I'm blind or stupid, just that I don't think football is *quite* as simple as some posters are making it out to be.

[/quote]

of course it's not that simple Bunyn but let's face it - players in wide positions should score goals - but ours don't. Well not enough anyway. Maxi, Babel, Rieira, Yossi - there's not been enough goals from those positions. At the moment we're fucked without Torres
[/quote]

I think it issimple, football is a simple game.
It could not be more simple, it is so simple it is basic.
We have all our eggs in one basket with Torres. We have no plan "B" when Torres is not there. Our goals are like a tap being turned on and off when he is in or out of the team. We need another top notch striker to play alongside Torres when fit, and to give us options when he is not. It does not matter how many chances the team make from any position, including the left, if there is no one at the sharp end we do not score goals.


regards

 

[Judge Jules]

But that someone wouldn't invariably have to be Torres himself (or any other specific player) if we got as many men forward as often as the Chavs or ManUre do. In that event we (and our points total) would not have suffered so much from missing even a player of Torres' calibre. No-one would willingly do without such a player but there's enough ability in that squad to have scored more goals, and done better all round, had they been deployed more sensibly.

 

[Fox]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=39859.msg1090066#msg1090066 date=1271683354]
[quote author=Fox link=topic=39859.msg1090063#msg1090063 date=1271683112]
The fact we all suspect Rafa may do this despite the fact we have 4 decent CBs says a lot.

I hope to fuck if any decent money is available a new manager has the chance to have a go with it not Rafa again.


[/quote]

Hello Fox , long time !
[/quote]



Hi Sunny, you are well I assume.

Desperate times for the club and a new contract where I am not that busy = return to 6cm

As for the Torres cover debate, it would not be that bad if he was a striker with an excellent injury record, but his is a shocker even before this season. Rafa made a massive mistake and I hope he pays for it with his job. Time for a change, someone else deserves the chance with any new funds this summer.

 

[keniget]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=39859.msg1090090#msg1090090 date=1271687139]
I think it issimple, football is a simple game.
It could not be more simple, it is so simple it is basic.
We have all our eggs in one basket with Torres. We have no plan "B" when Torres is not there. Our goals are like a tap being turned on and off when he is in or out of the team. We need another top notch striker to play alongside Torres when fit, and to give us options when he is not. It does not matter how many chances the team make from any position, including the left, if there is no one at the sharp end we do not score goals.

regards
[/quote]

So you're effectively saying that 4-4-2 is the only formation the game of football allows in order to be successful?

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=39859.msg1090103#msg1090103 date=1271690122]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=39859.msg1090090#msg1090090 date=1271687139]
I think it issimple, football is a simple game.
It could not be more simple, it is so simple it is basic.
We have all our eggs in one basket with Torres. We have no plan "B" when Torres is not there. Our goals are like a tap being turned on and off when he is in or out of the team. We need another top notch striker to play alongside Torres when fit, and to give us options when he is not. It does not matter how many chances the team make from any position, including the left, if there is no one at the sharp end we do not score goals.

regards
[/quote]

So you're effectively saying that 4-4-2 is the only formation the game of football allows in order to be successful?
[/quote]

No

regards

 

[keniget]

So, are you saying that no matter what player we get for the left, he would do nothing to alter our attack and enable us to cope without a top class striker up front?