Lucas

[Halmeister]

He played 29 games. Look if we had Matic or fucking Makelele or whatever id be all over benching Lucas but to pinpoint him as the reason we wont hit top 4?!
Nah.

27 in the league isn't "all season" though, is it? I'm just being pedantic really. But our best run of form came when Gerrard was playing deep and Lucas was on the bench.

He's not THE reason we won't get top 4. But like 99% of our squad we need better in his position. And that is the reason we won't get top 4

 

[Woland]

He's shite.

 

[Wiberg]

27 in the league isn't "all season" though, is it? I'm just being pedantic really. But our best run of form came when Gerrard was playing deep and Lucas was on the bench.

He's not THE reason we won't get top 4. But like 99% of our squad we need better in his position. And that is the reason we won't get top 4

Our defense was shambolic with Gerrard sitting deep as you call it. More like headless chicken. We let goals in all over the place.

That "run of form" was all about two great strikes and a great offensive stride.

With a real DM we would probably have won the PL that season.

 

[Halmeister]

Our defense was shambolic with Gerrard sitting deep as you call it. More like headless chicken. We let goals in all over the place.

That "run of form" was all about two great strikes and a great offensive stride.

With a real DM we would probably have won the PL that season.

Err we won 14 on the bounce when Gerrard played there. We were conceding loads, but scoring more.

The rest of the post isn't really relative to my point.

 

[Leo]

Is it true that Wiberg can't use the Internet without typing Gerrard?

 

[Halmeister]

Is it true that Wiberg can't use the Internet without typing Gerrard?

Ahh one of them, is he?

 

[Leo]

Ahh one of them, is he?

Yup.
He actually blamed Gerrard this season when Arsenal battered us with Lucas as dm and Gerrard was suspended.
Trufax.

 

[Halmeister]

Yup.
He actually blamed Gerrard this season when Arsenal battered us with Lucas as dm and Gerrard was suspended.
Trufax.

Bahahaha. How?!

 

[Leo]

Bahahaha. How?!

It's in the Arsenal game thread from April I think.
We were 2 nil down and he said this is down to Gerrard.
Fucking mental.

 

[Ryan]

Ha, I love the fact that Ryan makes it sound like nobody on SCM knows what a dm contributes to in a team set up like ours.

I'll keep an eye out for your erudite, well constructed tactical analyses from now on then.

 

[Gary25]

I'll keep an eye out for your erudite, well constructed tactical analyses from now on then.

You don't really think Lucas can do it week in week out for us do you?

He's a valuable squad player but can't rely on him over the course of the season.

 

[Ryan]

You don't really think Lucas can do it week in week out for us do you?

He's a valuable squad player but can't rely on him over the course of the season.

No I don't, but I'd be shocked if he didn't start most games for the first few months of the season given a) the run of fixtures we've got, b) the 4-3-3 we'll be playing, d, we don't have anyone else who can perform that role at this stage, and d) the amount of new players we've brought in who'll take time to gel.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Lucas badly needs upgrading on but for now is all we have in that position.

I'd love to see Can moulded to play that role but not sure Rodgers will do it.

 

[Wiberg]

Yup.
He actually blamed Gerrard this season when Arsenal battered us with Lucas as dm and Gerrard was suspended.
Trufax.

I blamed the Gerrard issue for the season. That's true. He had just managed to throw the scum game at home at that point.

You really are a cunt.... Never seen a decent post about football from you. You're just here being a cunt. Strange.

 

[Wiberg]

Err we won 14 on the bounce when Gerrard played there. We were conceding loads, but scoring more.

The rest of the post isn't really relative to my point.

We did and it has absolutely no relevance to the Lucas issue. Not even close.

 

[mark1975]

We did and it has absolutely no relevance to the Lucas issue. Not even close.

The "Lucas" issue only became an issue because of the manner of the goals we conceded against Chelsea and Palace, for the time leading up to that we were in great form and were overpowering most teams with quick, decisive play. So in essence, you saying if we'd played him we'd have won the league isn't necessarily true. If we'd played him would we have been as quick playing the ball out from those deep positions on the break? Would we have had the assists and goals that Gerrard contributed? Hindsight is great and all, but we were one of the form teams and one of the most exciting watches in Europe without him. The biggest damage our title challenge took was the injury to Henderson. *IF* we'd put Lucas on at half time against Palace, then maybe things would have been different. We gambled and blew it, we needed goals and were 3-0 up and flying, so I wouldn't blame us for being bold and thinking we could score more.

Let's not act like Lucas was the saviour of that campaign that we just didn't see, we were fucking AWESOME in the run in, aside from two games. The need for Lucas in the overall picture of that spell of form, was irrelevant.

 

[King Binny]

Mark, do you think we have won more games with Lucas? He played those two matches with Lucas and Gerrard. A hopeless setup.

As far as I recall we won a lot more with Lucas than without. Problem was that we lost so many with Gerrard. A player Dodgers had to play last season.

@kingBinny; do you the stats outlining the win ratio with Lucas with and without Gerrard?

9 goals against stoke is completely irrelevant considering no-one could have closed a god damn thing with Gerrard in the engine room.

I'm afraid not, but there was this infographic in Jan:

and in Jun:

OptaJoe‏@OptaJoe
833 - Since he joined Liverpool in July 2007, Lucas Leiva has made more tackles than any other player in the Premier League (833). Steel.

while someone did this in Feb:

https://djmsportanalysis.files.wordpress.com/2015/02/the-importance-of-lucas-leiva-to-liverpool.pdf

 

[mark1975]

So basically in an attacking side he proved detrimental, and in a team without any real outlet that constantly invited pressure, he proved a success. Who'd have thought it?

 

[gkmacca]

It was good to see him get forward a bit in that last game and even have a couple of shots on goal (wayward, of course, but Didi and Mascher were also known for their punts high and wide - what is it about DMs and technique?). There's no reason why he can't do that regularly and I hope he does so.

 

[Hansern]

I'll keep an eye out for your erudite, well constructed tactical analyses from now on then.

Didnt say I dont enjoy reading most of your posts mate. Its more that some of them have a tone like you've stumbled across a gardening forum, and try to explain the tactical side of football to a bunch of women that dont have a clue about anything else than flowers and shovels.

Oh wait, you might be on to something 🙂

 

[Leo]

I blamed the Gerrard issue for the season. That's true. He had just managed to throw the scum game at home at that point.

You really are a cunt.... Never seen a decent post about football from you. You're just here being a cunt. Strange.

You got owned again in this thread so maybe it's time to try a new sport maybe.
You were bragging about drinking a 50 quid bottle of wine on your holidays in some look at me destination a few weeks back.
So maybe that's your thing.

 

[Halmeister]

Yeah I was gonna argue back, but Mark summed it up perfectly up there. As did the stats.

 

[Judge Jules]

Lucas badly needs upgrading on but for now is all we have in that position.

I'd love to see Can moulded to play that role but not sure Rodgers will do it.

He'd be right not to. Can's not fundamentally a defensive player and would be wasted there, even if (which is far from certain) such a move worked. We do need someone in there IMO (though unfortunately I don't think Rodgers shares that view) but it needs to be someone who knows the job, not the umpteenth square peg we've tried to squeeze into a round hole.

 

[Leo]

Is Rossiter ready yet?
From what I've seen of him he seems intelligent enough to play the dm role in a couple of years.
His game intelligence is superb and can pick passes through the eye of a needle.
Would like to see him play there during the Europa league maybe.

 

[keniget]

He'd be right not to. Can's not fundamentally a defensive player and would be wasted there, even if (which is far from certain) such a move worked.

I agree.

Also, judging by some of his performances and the fallout from Germany's U-21 exit in the summer, there is a degree of arrogance present in Can and I think we'd have a lot more success in trying to focus / harness it rather than stamp it out by stifling his natural instincts.

When you compare Yaya Toure the DM and Yaya Toure the box-to-box MF / AM, you know which one you'd rather have in your side. Let's not faff about here. Can has got Yaya Toure potential and thinks he's a bit of a star (in the making) - let's go for broke and see if we can make him one.

 

[dmishra]

Yep. Agreed.

 

[Jürgen4PM]

He's shite.

^^^^^^

 

[Halmeister]

I agree.

Also, judging by some of his performances and the fallout from Germany's U-21 exit in the summer, there is a degree of arrogance present in Can and I think we'd have a lot more success in trying to focus / harness it rather than stamp it out by stifling his natural instincts.

When you compare Yaya Toure the DM and Yaya Toure the box-to-box MF / AM, you know which one you'd rather have in your side. Let's not faff about here. Can has got Yaya Toure potential and thinks he's a bit of a star (in the making) - let's go for broke and see if we can make him one.

Yep. I would definitely liken him to Yaya if there was a player I thought he could go on to be. Sitting at the base of a midfield trio won't do him any good.

 

[Fabio]

I blamed the Gerrard issue for the season. That's true. He had just managed to throw the scum game at home at that point.

You really are a cunt.... Never seen a decent post about football from you. You're just here being a cunt. Strange.

He pulled you up on being a cunt. Don't throw a wobbly because you can't take it

Less of the bellend reaction please

 

[Hansern]

Interview with Maschers agent claiming he wants to move from Barca, preferebly to Serie A.
Imagine swapping Lucas for him. That would be ace.

We need an upgrade quickly imho.
Lucas can stay for the year as back up.