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Shelvey

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rurikbird

Part of the Furniture
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I keep thinking that we made a big mistake letting him go. I think Klopp would love to work with him and coach him into the next Sahin, he has the talent and all those discipline issues can be ironed out with good coaching. It's so hard to find a playmaker these days, it's such a premium position and we had one who is a local and chose to sell him rather then let him develop and see how far he can go. Even from a financial standpoint, we let a young British player, a future England international go for what, 5M pounds? That's criminal.

 
We were all made up with 5 mill. Simple as that. That title challenge wouldn't have happened if we'd kept him.
 
It was a good move for his career to leave at that moment to get regular playing time. But we should not have let him go without a buy-back close.
 
Nope. He's never have gotten the game time he has needed to kick on and its not like he's a major improvement on what we have now anyways.

Still glad we sold him.
 
I keep thinking that we made a big mistake letting him go. I think Klopp would love to work with him and coach him into the next Şahin, he has the talent and all those discipline issues can be ironed out with good coaching. It's so hard to find a playmaker these days, it's such a premium position and we had one who is a local and chose to sell him rather then let him develop and see how far he can go. Even from a financial standpoint, we let a young British player, a future England international go for what, 5M pounds? That's criminal.


We will get Shinji Kagawa when Coutinho decides he wants to play for Barcelona.
 
Nah, he's to inconsistent for me and he's probably found his level at Swansea.

Should have gotten more than 5 mill though.
 
He's got a better range of passes than anyone in our current midfield, a better ability to switch from short to long and change the tempo. I can understand why Rodgers tired of him, he was immature, had bad habits and seemed slow to learn. And it was Shelvey who pushed for a move. But many of the most interesting, imaginative and distinctive midfielders go through a phase of being judged 'too inconsistent'. (It's often forgotten now but even Gerrard went through a period when people said he was too inconsistent, undisciplined and injury prone.) It's the interchangeable grafters who emerge more or less fully formed. We should have fought more to hold on to him and work with him - the worst thing that would have happened was we would have sold him for more money.
 
It's a shame, it reminds me alot of what happened with Murphy under Benitez, was he too hasty?

[article] Midfielder Shelvey, 23, told BBC Sport Rodgers even called his dad in a last-ditch attempt to halt the move.

"I was on the way to Swansea and he told me I didn't have to go," said Shelvey, who faces his former club in the Premier League on Monday.

"He spent hours on the phone to my dad in an effort to try and get me to stay. But I had made up my mind to come." [/article]
 
I remember saying at the time it would've been better for it to have been a loan or a sale with a buy back clause.

He did need to get away and play regular football though. A two year loan would've been great for us though. Talented kid.
 
I for one am surprised that a 20 year old who showed he could cope with the Premiership at that early stage has gone on to be better in his mid twenties.

Rodgers got rid of him because he wasn't what he wanted in the short term. Which is why managers can't be allowed to dictate transfer policy.

There was some general opinion that Luis Alberto was a direct replacement and improvement on Shelvey!

We also nearly swapped Henderson for Dempsey.
 
I think also there was a disconnect about where Shelvey wanted to play (at the base of midfield) and where Rodgers wanted him to play (as the furthest midfielder forward).
 
I for one am surprised that a 20 year old who showed he could cope with the Premiership at that early stage has gone on to be better in his mid twenties.

Rodgers got rid of him because he wasn't what he wanted in the short term. Which is why managers can't be allowed to dictate transfer policy.

There was some general opinion that Luis Alberto was a direct replacement and improvement on Shelvey!

We also nearly swapped Henderson for Dempsey.

Rodgers didn't "get rid of him" though, Shelvey's comments since suggest it was at least mostly his own decision, Rodgers tried to persuade him to stay.
 
It's a shame, it reminds me alot of what happened with Murphy under Benitez, was he too hasty?

[article] Midfielder Shelvey, 23, told BBC Sport Rodgers even called his dad in a last-ditch attempt to halt the move.

"I was on the way to Swansea and he told me I didn't have to go," said Shelvey, who faces his former club in the Premier League on Monday.

"He spent hours on the phone to my dad in an effort to try and get me to stay. But I had made up my mind to come." [/article]

I guess these days he can point to his England caps and say he did the right thing. It always frustrates me though when we get a player at a young age, invest time and money in them, coach them, advise them, develop them, then let them move on to flourish elsewhere, where another club gets the benefit of our coaches' hard work. It'll always happen, but these days it's almost as if our group of kids is so big we don't seem to know how to value each one properly. It worries me particularly with the wonderful glut of young attacking talent we've got at the moment - they've all been sent off on loan, not many to suitable clubs and coaching set-ups, without that much monitoring. I hope Klopp really looks at them all carefully asap.
 
I like Shelvey. He is allways one of the first I buy into my Fantasy Team. He has a real heart, and the way he gave Fergie a mouthful is just legendary!!

Never know if it was right or wrong for him to leave, but we can allways bring him back. He has that energy Level all Clubs need.
 
I can't think of a player less suited to a high energy pressing style that may be introduced by Klopp.

Jonjo can certainly pick a pass when given time, but my impression is that he isn't a tackler and that his stamina is suspect. Even in last night's international he was unable to react to a surging run as he doesn't possess pace.

I think he made the right choice. Good luck to him.
 
I don't know if he's the right player for the club but he's someone I always enjoy watching. And that time he got picked to play up front in a cup tie. I'd gone the game with my mate Stu and we saw the team sheet, figured he must be up front, and both put a tenner on him at 10/1 for first goal, which he duly scored with a header half way through the first half or thereabouts. Love Jonjo.
 
I guess these days he can point to his England caps and say he did the right thing. It always frustrates me though when we get a player at a young age, invest time and money in them, coach them, advise them, develop them, then let them move on to flourish elsewhere, where another club gets the benefit of our coaches' hard work. It'll always happen, but these days it's almost as if our group of kids is so big we don't seem to know how to value each one properly. It worries me particularly with the wonderful glut of young attacking talent we've got at the moment - they've all been sent off on loan, not many to suitable clubs and coaching set-ups, without that much monitoring. I hope Klopp really looks at them all carefully asap.

That's a two way street though Macca. We do it to other clubs and it must be tough for the coaches to be able to sort the wheat from the chaff when they are still not fully developed or adapting to the team's requirements. We obviously can't afford to hold on to them all.
 
Oh sure, but loaning players out is a two-pronged policy which I don't think is always practiced with enough prudence by the staff here. On the one hand we loan out certain players because we're basically looking to get rid. On the other hand we loan out certain other players because we're looking to help them speed up their development for us. When it's the second aim, we really need to be much more hands-on, I think, from picking the club to monitoring how they're handled.

Some clubs, for example, seem to take our players more with a view to have a look at them playing for the reserves for a few months rather than give them a chance in their first team. And my advice to them would be: if you want to see how they play in the reserves, come up to Kirkby and see in them play in OUR reserves, against better opposition. If they want to have them on loan, they should really be confident they want to play them. Of course, if a player gets the chance and struggles, then fair enough - we've all learned something. But too often we send them off to warm benches.

The mancs, for example, are far more ruthless than us about this - every unofficial means available is used to make sure the loanees are either coached properly and given chances or just called back to the club. The pressure is always on: it's the mancs doing THEM a favour, not, as is often implied in our case, the other way round.

And when it comes to the likes of Kent, Ojo and Wilson, well, was there really such a careful deliberative process before it was decided that, say, Kent would benefit more from sitting on the bench watching Coventry enacting Tony Mowbray's somewhat limited tactics rather than getting some time playing for the first team in the Europa League and the cup competitions here? I know there were arguments for and against in all of these cases, but too often it seems like we act out of a lack of consensus rather than a clear and coherent policy tailored to each talent.
 
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