Lucas
- Thread starter Roger REDerer
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[quote author=Roger REDerer link=topic=36269.msg957403#msg957403 date=1254678373]
[quote author=ILD link=topic=36269.msg957374#msg957374 date=1254677398]
Masher giving away possession and Carragher getting beating by Drogba were the defining moments of the game, but sure lets blame Lucas for us not winning sure, why not.
[/quote]
You know...some of you guys prefer to pinpoint the problem but when it comes to dissecting the problem, you all fail to notice the root itself.
They scored because of Mascher and Carra's mistakes but up until then, both of them played fairly ok. At least they stood up and didn't remain anonymous unlike Lucas.
The balance of the team's shape was lost from the beginning, it was only a matter of time someone would be penalized for the amounting pressure from the chavs. Unfortunately it was Mascher and Carra this week.
If we continue to play like this against the scums, we will lose our 4th game in less than 10. Gerrard and Mascher have to be our CM for now until Aquilani becomes fit again.
[/quote]
Lucas didn't give away posession anymore than anybody else today, Roger. If Torres' header had gone in and we'd held on for a 1-0, you'd not be moaning about him like this.
Again, I agree that he's not good enough for a championship winning team, but under our current circumstances, we have no other choice, and he's been alright.
[quote author=ILD link=topic=36269.msg957374#msg957374 date=1254677398]
Masher giving away possession and Carragher getting beating by Drogba were the defining moments of the game, but sure lets blame Lucas for us not winning sure, why not.
[/quote]
You know...some of you guys prefer to pinpoint the problem but when it comes to dissecting the problem, you all fail to notice the root itself.
They scored because of Mascher and Carra's mistakes but up until then, both of them played fairly ok. At least they stood up and didn't remain anonymous unlike Lucas.
The balance of the team's shape was lost from the beginning, it was only a matter of time someone would be penalized for the amounting pressure from the chavs. Unfortunately it was Mascher and Carra this week.
If we continue to play like this against the scums, we will lose our 4th game in less than 10. Gerrard and Mascher have to be our CM for now until Aquilani becomes fit again.
[/quote]
Lucas didn't give away posession anymore than anybody else today, Roger. If Torres' header had gone in and we'd held on for a 1-0, you'd not be moaning about him like this.
Again, I agree that he's not good enough for a championship winning team, but under our current circumstances, we have no other choice, and he's been alright.
No, shite mistakes lost it for us. The bench maybe didn't win it for us, but that's different from "losing it"
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=36269.msg957347#msg957347 date=1254676906]
It wasn't Lucas who needlessly gave the ball away for what led to the goal that would change the game.
Nor was it Lucas that strolled arounf from an advanced midfield position and did just about f#$! all of anything today.
He isn't the reason we lost today. He was ok, as usual, so far this season.
Change the record, you twat.
[/quote]
To be fair, the usual cover up for his bad performance is that, he didn't do anything wrong.
Which to me is the problem itself. He is too much of as passenger to have in the team. He may not be the reason for us conceding the two goals and losing the game, but i'm going to squarely lay the blame for struggling against the better teams on this chap.
I have no problem having him as a sub, but he can't start games for us. Not when we still have the option of playing Gerrard in the center.
I would like to know why Rafa has given this lad so much backing, ahead of other youngsters at our club. Rafa better have a very good explanation for that. This has gone on for far too long. I was all for giving him a chance at the start of the season, but it is more than evident he is not up to it. Rafa needs to bench him. He shows no spark, and is afraid to make mistakes and contributes nothing positive to the team....but ya he doesn't do anything wrong.
It wasn't Lucas who needlessly gave the ball away for what led to the goal that would change the game.
Nor was it Lucas that strolled arounf from an advanced midfield position and did just about f#$! all of anything today.
He isn't the reason we lost today. He was ok, as usual, so far this season.
Change the record, you twat.
[/quote]
To be fair, the usual cover up for his bad performance is that, he didn't do anything wrong.
Which to me is the problem itself. He is too much of as passenger to have in the team. He may not be the reason for us conceding the two goals and losing the game, but i'm going to squarely lay the blame for struggling against the better teams on this chap.
I have no problem having him as a sub, but he can't start games for us. Not when we still have the option of playing Gerrard in the center.
I would like to know why Rafa has given this lad so much backing, ahead of other youngsters at our club. Rafa better have a very good explanation for that. This has gone on for far too long. I was all for giving him a chance at the start of the season, but it is more than evident he is not up to it. Rafa needs to bench him. He shows no spark, and is afraid to make mistakes and contributes nothing positive to the team....but ya he doesn't do anything wrong.
[quote author=Skullflower link=topic=36269.msg957391#msg957391 date=1254677936]
where's the fucking money to replace him, rog? you total bell.
[/quote]
Gerrard should've partnered Mascher in midfield today.
Stevie was completely useless in the hole today simply because there was hardly any supply from midfield to him to feed on.
where's the fucking money to replace him, rog? you total bell.
[/quote]
Gerrard should've partnered Mascher in midfield today.
Stevie was completely useless in the hole today simply because there was hardly any supply from midfield to him to feed on.
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957406#msg957406 date=1254678482]
Spent the afternoon with a manc on one side and a blue on the other.... nearly got barred.
[/quote]
How did you manage that?
Least you don't have a boss that's a manc.
Spent the afternoon with a manc on one side and a blue on the other.... nearly got barred.
[/quote]
How did you manage that?
Least you don't have a boss that's a manc.
[quote author=Roger REDerer link=topic=36269.msg957414#msg957414 date=1254678624]
[quote author=Skullflower link=topic=36269.msg957391#msg957391 date=1254677936]
where's the fucking money to replace him, rog? you total bell.
[/quote]
Gerrard should've partnered Mascher in midfield today.
Stevie was completely useless in the hole today simply because there was hardly any supply from midfield to him to feed on.
[/quote]
He wasn't that great when he did move back there... giving away the ball countless times.
[quote author=Skullflower link=topic=36269.msg957391#msg957391 date=1254677936]
where's the fucking money to replace him, rog? you total bell.
[/quote]
Gerrard should've partnered Mascher in midfield today.
Stevie was completely useless in the hole today simply because there was hardly any supply from midfield to him to feed on.
[/quote]
He wasn't that great when he did move back there... giving away the ball countless times.
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=36269.msg957409#msg957409 date=1254678566]
Lucas didn't give away posession anymore than anybody else today, Roger.
[/quote]
But do you count on him to step up at least once when others are having a mare as you say? Has he shown that he can do that even once?
Lucas didn't give away posession anymore than anybody else today, Roger.
[/quote]
But do you count on him to step up at least once when others are having a mare as you say? Has he shown that he can do that even once?
I didnt see that as a game we lost.... i saw that as a gamble we lost. A coin toss.
We are as more or less as good as Chelsea and we were today also, to actually win you need to be better and know so or be lucky and we were neither today.
Lucas is a total passenger it is true, he has never EVER won us a game and he has had a helping hand in a few of our defeats IMO. Today he didnt stand out in a negative way so by his standards it was a good game.
It a kneejerk stupid thread, but then look who started it.
Forget it and move on....
what teams next anyway??
We are as more or less as good as Chelsea and we were today also, to actually win you need to be better and know so or be lucky and we were neither today.
Lucas is a total passenger it is true, he has never EVER won us a game and he has had a helping hand in a few of our defeats IMO. Today he didnt stand out in a negative way so by his standards it was a good game.
It a kneejerk stupid thread, but then look who started it.
Forget it and move on....
what teams next anyway??
Sunderland away I think
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36269.msg957405#msg957405 date=1254678459]
I don't get this calling our own players a cunt unless they're the likes of some horrible fucker like Diouf. Lucas is average but it's not his fault he gets picked week in week out. What do you want him to say, "Don't pick me boss I'm not good enough"?
[/quote]
Quite. Maybe rage has scared people because they don't want to be accused of being 'gay'.
I don't get this calling our own players a cunt unless they're the likes of some horrible fucker like Diouf. Lucas is average but it's not his fault he gets picked week in week out. What do you want him to say, "Don't pick me boss I'm not good enough"?
[/quote]
Quite. Maybe rage has scared people because they don't want to be accused of being 'gay'.
[quote author=Red Mullet link=topic=36269.msg957415#msg957415 date=1254678735]
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957406#msg957406 date=1254678482]
Spent the afternoon with a manc on one side and a blue on the other.... nearly got barred.
[/quote]
How did you manage that?
Least you don't have a boss that's a manc.
[/quote]
Old friends ... one of them flew back to spain just to sit there in case he could gloat.
Broke a bar stool, punched a wall and my hand is swollen, spat on the floor final whistle... the french bird who was siiting near me who ive always had a bit of a twinkle for me tried to start a conversation and .... i cant remember really ... she left.
Red mist.
Im chilling now.
calm.
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957406#msg957406 date=1254678482]
Spent the afternoon with a manc on one side and a blue on the other.... nearly got barred.
[/quote]
How did you manage that?
Least you don't have a boss that's a manc.
[/quote]
Old friends ... one of them flew back to spain just to sit there in case he could gloat.
Broke a bar stool, punched a wall and my hand is swollen, spat on the floor final whistle... the french bird who was siiting near me who ive always had a bit of a twinkle for me tried to start a conversation and .... i cant remember really ... she left.
Red mist.
Im chilling now.
calm.
[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=36269.msg957422#msg957422 date=1254679038]
Sunderland away I think
[/quote]
Good.
That will be a good win when we get it.
cunts.
Sunderland away I think
[/quote]
Good.
That will be a good win when we get it.
cunts.
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957429#msg957429 date=1254679309]spat on the floor final whistle[/quote]
why?
why?
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957429#msg957429 date=1254679309]
[quote author=Red Mullet link=topic=36269.msg957415#msg957415 date=1254678735]
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957406#msg957406 date=1254678482]
Spent the afternoon with a manc on one side and a blue on the other.... nearly got barred.
[/quote]
How did you manage that?
Least you don't have a boss that's a manc.
[/quote]
Old friends ... one of them flew back to spain just to sit there in case he could gloat.
Broke a bar stool, punched a wall and my hand is swollen, spat on the floor final whistle... the french bird who was siiting near me who ive always had a bit of a twinkle for me tried to start a conversation and .... i cant remember really ... she left.
Red mist.
Im chilling now.
calm.
[/quote]
Are you barred, too?
[quote author=Red Mullet link=topic=36269.msg957415#msg957415 date=1254678735]
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957406#msg957406 date=1254678482]
Spent the afternoon with a manc on one side and a blue on the other.... nearly got barred.
[/quote]
How did you manage that?
Least you don't have a boss that's a manc.
[/quote]
Old friends ... one of them flew back to spain just to sit there in case he could gloat.
Broke a bar stool, punched a wall and my hand is swollen, spat on the floor final whistle... the french bird who was siiting near me who ive always had a bit of a twinkle for me tried to start a conversation and .... i cant remember really ... she left.
Red mist.
Im chilling now.
calm.
[/quote]
Are you barred, too?
[quote author=madmax link=topic=36269.msg957419#msg957419 date=1254678993]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=36269.msg957409#msg957409 date=1254678566]
Lucas didn't give away posession anymore than anybody else today, Roger.
[/quote]
But do you count on him to step up at least once when others are having a mare as you say? Has he shown that he can do that even once?
[/quote]
No, I guess that's almost everybody's problem with him. Still, he's a junior player filling the shoes of a senior player. He's largely been a squad player and youngish and I doubt if he feels comfortable in the side yet. I don't know if he will ever prove to be good enough but to target him for special criticism is harsh.
(And yes I do admit I was doing it myself when I was watching the match today)
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=36269.msg957409#msg957409 date=1254678566]
Lucas didn't give away posession anymore than anybody else today, Roger.
[/quote]
But do you count on him to step up at least once when others are having a mare as you say? Has he shown that he can do that even once?
[/quote]
No, I guess that's almost everybody's problem with him. Still, he's a junior player filling the shoes of a senior player. He's largely been a squad player and youngish and I doubt if he feels comfortable in the side yet. I don't know if he will ever prove to be good enough but to target him for special criticism is harsh.
(And yes I do admit I was doing it myself when I was watching the match today)
basically lucas' problem is he doesn't know when to get forwards to support the forwards. I'll also add if rafa has specifically told lucas AND masher to hold and shield the defenders then the fullbacks aren't getting forwards enough because the CM should be covering their runs. bottom line our attacking players are asked to do too much with too little options around them.
with alonso you had the luxury of both midfielders sitting deep because xabi could hurt you from a deep position with alonso gone both masher and lucas need to flip a coin to see who plays further forwards because as it stands neither is giving anything going forwards.
with alonso you had the luxury of both midfielders sitting deep because xabi could hurt you from a deep position with alonso gone both masher and lucas need to flip a coin to see who plays further forwards because as it stands neither is giving anything going forwards.
[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=36269.msg957435#msg957435 date=1254679474]
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957429#msg957429 date=1254679309]spat on the floor final whistle[/quote]
why?
[/quote]
because somebody tweaked an unfunny bone.... did you get barred whadda??
good man....
i think my behaviour today was reprehensible but my tab is ridiculous so they really couldnt do anything....
barring me would have cost them too much.
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=36269.msg957429#msg957429 date=1254679309]spat on the floor final whistle[/quote]
why?
[/quote]
because somebody tweaked an unfunny bone.... did you get barred whadda??
good man....
i think my behaviour today was reprehensible but my tab is ridiculous so they really couldnt do anything....
barring me would have cost them too much.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36269.msg957441#msg957441 date=1254679586]
basically lucas' problem is he doesn't know when to get forwards to support the forwards. I'll also add if rafa has specifically told lucas AND masher to hold and shield the defenders then the fullbacks aren't getting forwards enough because the CM should be covering their runs. bottom line our attacking players are asked to do too much with too little options around them.
with alonso you had the luxury of both midfielders sitting deep because xabi could hurt you from a deep position with alonso gone both masher and lucas need to flip a coin to see who plays further forwards because as it stands neither is giving anything going forwards.
[/quote]
We didn't know how sweet we had it with Alonso orchestrating play. But that has been done to death.
As I said already, mistakes lost us the game, not Lucas. No need for another thread. Lucas is a player who the majority agree probably isn't good enough but directly is not at fault for games we lose. It's not rocket science.
basically lucas' problem is he doesn't know when to get forwards to support the forwards. I'll also add if rafa has specifically told lucas AND masher to hold and shield the defenders then the fullbacks aren't getting forwards enough because the CM should be covering their runs. bottom line our attacking players are asked to do too much with too little options around them.
with alonso you had the luxury of both midfielders sitting deep because xabi could hurt you from a deep position with alonso gone both masher and lucas need to flip a coin to see who plays further forwards because as it stands neither is giving anything going forwards.
[/quote]
We didn't know how sweet we had it with Alonso orchestrating play. But that has been done to death.
As I said already, mistakes lost us the game, not Lucas. No need for another thread. Lucas is a player who the majority agree probably isn't good enough but directly is not at fault for games we lose. It's not rocket science.
[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36269.msg957376#msg957376 date=1254677407]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36269.msg957353#msg957353 date=1254676979]
lucas went off to find rafa the vaseline.
[/quote]
i haven't a problem with homosexuality. i just can't see any other way that lucas is playing. its definitely not what he's doing on the pitch that's getting him picked is it?
[quote author=rage link=topic=36269.msg957353#msg957353 date=1254676979]
lucas went off to find rafa the vaseline.
[/quote]
[/quote]
i haven't a problem with homosexuality. i just can't see any other way that lucas is playing. its definitely not what he's doing on the pitch that's getting him picked is it?
its ok i don't think you're gay either and if you were it would make fuck all difference to me.
i reckon if we were managed by a baboon you'd be peeling bananas for him at the very least.
so what did you think of my proposed tactics? see how we were transformed with gerrard in the middle and yossi in the team?
i reckon if we were managed by a baboon you'd be peeling bananas for him at the very least.
so what did you think of my proposed tactics? see how we were transformed with gerrard in the middle and yossi in the team?
Lucas offers nothing in a pivotal role in the team.
Either the formation needs changing or Lucas needs dropping.
Either the formation needs changing or Lucas needs dropping.
Even by your standards Rog, this is a pretty woeful one.
Lucas was in no way culpable yesterday, and I thought he did a fine job. He certainly offered a lot more than the other luminaries in the side - Gerrard, Torres, Riera, Kuyt, etc.
I'll be honest, and this isn't personal Rog. I lose absolute respect for any poster who jumps onto a website and lambasts one sole player after a loss. It's the clearest indicator you'll ever get of what little football kowledge that poster has.
Lucas was in no way culpable yesterday, and I thought he did a fine job. He certainly offered a lot more than the other luminaries in the side - Gerrard, Torres, Riera, Kuyt, etc.
I'll be honest, and this isn't personal Rog. I lose absolute respect for any poster who jumps onto a website and lambasts one sole player after a loss. It's the clearest indicator you'll ever get of what little football kowledge that poster has.
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=36269.msg957642#msg957642 date=1254697420]
Even by your standards Rog, this is a pretty woeful one.
Lucas was in no way culpable yesterday, and I thought he did a fine job. He certainly offered a lot more than the other luminaries in the side - Gerrard, Torres, Riera, Kuyt, etc.
I'll be honest, and this isn't personal Rog. I lose absolute respect for any poster who jumps onto a website and lambasts one sole player after a loss. It's the clearest indicator you'll ever get of what little football kowledge that poster has. [/quote]
I'd have to say I agree with that bit. Pointing out people's mistakes is one thing, but the whole blaming one player after each and every poor result (and usually the "scapegoat" player) is one of the most annoying things about internet forums.
Even by your standards Rog, this is a pretty woeful one.
Lucas was in no way culpable yesterday, and I thought he did a fine job. He certainly offered a lot more than the other luminaries in the side - Gerrard, Torres, Riera, Kuyt, etc.
I'll be honest, and this isn't personal Rog. I lose absolute respect for any poster who jumps onto a website and lambasts one sole player after a loss. It's the clearest indicator you'll ever get of what little football kowledge that poster has. [/quote]
I'd have to say I agree with that bit. Pointing out people's mistakes is one thing, but the whole blaming one player after each and every poor result (and usually the "scapegoat" player) is one of the most annoying things about internet forums.
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=36269.msg957768#msg957768 date=1254729290]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=36269.msg957642#msg957642 date=1254697420]
Even by your standards Rog, this is a pretty woeful one.
Lucas was in no way culpable yesterday, and I thought he did a fine job. He certainly offered a lot more than the other luminaries in the side - Gerrard, Torres, Riera, Kuyt, etc.
I'll be honest, and this isn't personal Rog. I lose absolute respect for any poster who jumps onto a website and lambasts one sole player after a loss. It's the clearest indicator you'll ever get of what little football kowledge that poster has. [/quote]
I'd have to say I agree with that bit. Pointing out people's mistakes is one thing, but the whole blaming one player after each and every poor result (and usually the "scapegoat" player) is one of the most annoying things about internet forums.
[/quote]
I was in a supermarket the other day and the two lads in front on me in the queue we're talking about Liverpool and blaming our poor start due to Lucas being on the starting team. I made a snap decision to decide they knew nothing about football if they could lay blame on one person for anything. This morning I had the same gut feeling when someone in work said this beauty to me, " What the fuck was he doing bringing on a left back when we're losing"?. I tried to explain to them then he has already brought on Yossi and Babel and Aurelio made perfect sense to bring on next as he is excellent on the ball and delivers an accurate final ball in the final third as opposed to Insua who was tiring. They still weren't having it and replied with the same crap, "yeah but he still brought on a fucking left back".
I give up.
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=36269.msg957642#msg957642 date=1254697420]
Even by your standards Rog, this is a pretty woeful one.
Lucas was in no way culpable yesterday, and I thought he did a fine job. He certainly offered a lot more than the other luminaries in the side - Gerrard, Torres, Riera, Kuyt, etc.
I'll be honest, and this isn't personal Rog. I lose absolute respect for any poster who jumps onto a website and lambasts one sole player after a loss. It's the clearest indicator you'll ever get of what little football kowledge that poster has. [/quote]
I'd have to say I agree with that bit. Pointing out people's mistakes is one thing, but the whole blaming one player after each and every poor result (and usually the "scapegoat" player) is one of the most annoying things about internet forums.
[/quote]
I was in a supermarket the other day and the two lads in front on me in the queue we're talking about Liverpool and blaming our poor start due to Lucas being on the starting team. I made a snap decision to decide they knew nothing about football if they could lay blame on one person for anything. This morning I had the same gut feeling when someone in work said this beauty to me, " What the fuck was he doing bringing on a left back when we're losing"?. I tried to explain to them then he has already brought on Yossi and Babel and Aurelio made perfect sense to bring on next as he is excellent on the ball and delivers an accurate final ball in the final third as opposed to Insua who was tiring. They still weren't having it and replied with the same crap, "yeah but he still brought on a fucking left back".
I give up.
S
Squiggles
Guest
We bought on Aurelio because our squad is largely devoid of options.
We've a thread bare squad - there's not much point denying it.
We've a thread bare squad - there's not much point denying it.
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