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Ian Ayre

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Bang on Tal.

Apparently Kono was a Summer target, we were only alerted to him because of interest from other clubs and because we didn't spend the money on Salah, like you say, we matched the asking price and no one could have accounted for the actions of their owner. It happens. But lets blame Ayre and take the obvious surmise that we didn't offer enough, or something.
 
Ha, I stopped paying attention last night at 8PM so I had no idea this morning. Normal people would go straight to the propert broadcasters to find out the news. I came here to see whether the latest thread was called 'Ian Ayre - The Useless Thundercunt' or 'KonoI'veForgottenYourNameAlready'.

It's a bit galling that we had £16M spend to cement our CL dreams and we couldn't manage it, but as others have said, winger was never one of our major priorities, IMO.

To cut it short then, we matched the buy out clause (£15m) in his contract that allows us to talk to the player, but their Chairman refused to sign on the dotted line and remained adamant they didn't want to sell. Ayre's fault, obv.
 
I'm not that bothered about missing out on Kono, largely because I don't know the player that well and because a winger wasn't our highest priority (I really hope everyone saying this doesn't jinx us).

That said, it's disappointing that the club, for one reason or another, seem to be failing to secure targets time and again.

The bottom line is failure and that needs addressing.
 
Much like a manager is only as good as his squad, a negotiator is only as good as his resources allow him to be.

It's pretty clear we did everything we could to close deals - but I think it's obvious our financial situation (FFP) didn't allow us to go to the lengths needed. That has little to do with Ayre's ability. You can't one day credit his ability to get deals done with sponsors and then say he's a shit negotiator when a transfer can't be done. Negotiation is an easily transferable skill, it's not like he forgets how to do it just because it's for a player and not a sponsor.

We needed a player because Alberto, Ilori and Aspas have had no impact on our season. We hadn't got 20m sitting around to close a deal easily because of those decisions.

So let's start taking a look at the people who are without doubt fucking up.
It's not necessarily the case that negotiation is an easily transferable skill. It's often a horses for courses approach. I've been part of deals for funds, where the negotiators are completely different depending on the scenario. For example, VC type deals with young promoters barely require much negotiation; they're desperate to get the money - I've led negotiations as a 1st year law associate. Not the case in an investment in more mature companies. But that's more a deal-specific than a negotiator-specific example. Its also the case with negotiators I believe. Some are terrible at the subtleties of a new jurisdiction. I've dealt with clients who have different negotiators for different jurisdictions, because cultural subtleties and expectations require that. I've also been on the sell-side of a transaction where the buyer was an American company led by a highly aggressive negotiator, who frequently liked to cuss during the negotiations. The sell-side which was basically a super-rich local family got massively pissed off with this guy, and asked us to ask the buyers to fuck off basically. The buyers got the message and changed the negotiator immediately, and the deal got done a while later.

So I don't think its that simple to say that negotiation is easily transferable. Also I don't necessarily think marketing deals are comparable with aggressive acquisition ones. Especially ones where you deal with stubborn billionaire oligarchs. Require a different skill-set and many subtleties.

This is not to say that Ayre and his team lack that, because we really don't know what the fuck is happening. It could well be that resources have them hamstrung. But one thing I don't believe is the crap about the owner not willing to sell. One thing any half-competent negotiator can gauge, almost instantaneously, is whether the opposite party is posturing or just doesn't want to do business. If this cunt never wanted to do business, we'd have pulled out ages ago. This is just media spin we've put on this IMO. We didn't get the deal done because we couldn't match their terms.

Which brings us to the larger question of fund allocation and priorities. We've signed a fair load of players under Rodgers, and at least 4 of them - Borini, Assaidi, Aspas and Alberto (that's 25 million right there) are players Rodgers has abandoned within 6 months or less. That reeks of bad transfer strategy.

Rodgers clearly wants an attacking player - that much is evident from the Mkhitaryan, Willian, Costa, Salah and Konoplyanka links. If we've repeatedly being forced to miss out on them, there is an issue that needs fixing. It's obviously too simplistic to blame only Ayre. It is however very certainly down to a combination of SOMETHING - scouting, wasteful expenditure on other targets, and very possibly negotiation.

Whatever it is, we need to identify it and fix it.

As simplistic and stupid it is to crucify Ayre, it is equally stupid and simplistic to sit back and think 'shit happens' or 'we can't compete with City or Chelsea'.
 
By playing tight (not paying over the odds), and doing so consistently, we acquire an image of being tight. This takes time to build up and is painful, as it means we will miss out on targets.

However, it is worth it in the long run. When clubs and agents learn of our willingness to walk away from deals we don't like, they are forced to play it straight - thus saving us both time and money.

Note that creating this image is especially difficult and time consuming when you are widely known as the softest seat at the table.
 
I agree with everything dmishra said except for this part: "One thing any half-competent negotiator can gauge, almost instantaneously, is whether the opposite party is posturing or just doesn't want to do business"

I'd have to question how easy it is to second-guess the strategy of a multi-billionaire oligarch who:

a. probably didn't get to where he is today by being so transparent and easy to predict
b. was very, very unlikely to play any part in the negotiations himself but left it to his management team
c. could easily have just changed his mind later, to the equal surprise of his own people.
 
I think the bottom line is how we are leaving ourselves open to failure. We've gone in for players pretty much in that up and coming bracket since the Summer, those that and have attracted interest from our rivals and from other big clubs. We need to look at the profile of player we're going for and not get ahead of ourselves, there's no point putting ourselves in the mix for players, from a perspective of being out of Europe, when the other potential suitors are likely to be challenging for either Europe, domestic success or both. That's the short term, if we get in the CL it SHOULD be a different story.

I'd also look to knock speculation on the head and not be so open about what we're doing behind the scenes, it seems the World and it's wife know who we're after and all of a sudden as soon as that interest is announced, the big guns start gate crashing. That just might be the way it seems from the outside, it may just be that other clubs show they're hands once their forced into it by our own interest.

It's easy saying failure is the bottom line, it is, but have a look at how we've lost alot of these players and who to. Like I said, the biggest failure is maybe either being too ambitious, or too open about our ambitions.
 
I'm not that bothered about missing out on Kono, largely because I don't know the player that well and because a winger wasn't our highest priority (I really hope everyone saying this doesn't jinx us).

That said, it's disappointing that the club, for one reason or another, seem to be failing to secure targets time and again.

The bottom line is failure and that needs addressing.
I've been one of many here to suggest we need a CM and full-backs more than anything. I'd be the last to suggest however that we don't need more attacking talent. We very certainly do, and when a premier talent becomes available to us, I want us to sign him.

I frankly don't see a wealth of great wingers/wing-forwards out there currently. Draxler, Reus, Yarmolenko and Konoplyanka are the ones I can really think of. I didn't particularly rate Willian or Salah for that matter. Draxler and Reus are beyond our reach. The Ukrainian lads are the most realistic, and I think Konoplyanka is the more talented of the two. I'm quite disappointed we missed out. Value wise, he was the best we could've got.
 
The last deal just sounded as though the selling club made it impossible, so I wouldn't blame Ayre or anyone else for that. But we really need to improve our strategy with transfers. And even if Ayre was any good at the football side of his job, it's surely too much for one man to do effectively. We need someone to concentrate purely on that aspect and do it quietly and ruthlessly.
 
I agree with everything dmishra said except for this part: "One thing any half-competent negotiator can gauge, almost instantaneously, is whether the opposite party is posturing or just doesn't want to do business"

I'd have to question how easy it is to second-guess the strategy of a multi-billionaire oligarch who:

a. probably didn't get to where he is today by being so transparent and easy to predict
b. was very, very unlikely to play any part in the negotiations himself but left it to his management team
c. could easily have just changed his mind later, to the equal surprise of his own people.
Even the most whimsical of business persons is unlikely to host you for 3 days in his city and completely waste your and his own people's time over long and protracted negotiations if he is completely unwilling to business, as is being portrayed by the media. Also worth considering that its highly unlikely that this deal commenced only 3 days ago. We'd have been notified about his potential availability a few months ago, and would've have certainly sent out feelers and exchanged preliminary correspondence with Dnipro. It's only once we missed out on Salah that we decided to focus on this dude for real.

But its naive to think that we flew in our MD and a medical team without even knowing whether the opposite party was willing to do business. I wouldn't accuse Ayre of 'such' incompetence. What is far more likely is that we failed to meet their terms because we just didn't have the resources too. We're now publicly pinning it on their unreasonableness as we don't want to look like cheap cunts.
 
Value wise, he was the best we could've got.


I don't know. As said, I'm not really clued up on the player in question so hard for me to gauge to what extent we've missed out here, but unlike in other situations in the past, it does feel like there are other options to pursue in the summer.

The worry is that we end up seeing a repeat of the last two transfer windows in terms of protracted negotations and missing out on players we have spent a lot of time and money pursuing. Hopefully steps will be made to ensure we don't see a repeat of previous failures.
 
I don't know. As said, I'm not really clued up on the player in question so hard for me to gauge to what extent we've missed out here, but unlike in other situations in the past, it does feel like there are other options to pursue in the summer.
You think? I can't think of very many good young wingers out there at the moment.
 
We've had players who aren't well known poached from under us in the last two windows in Mkhitaryan, Willian, and Salah. I'm not sure how serious negotiations with Diego Costa were, but at the time he wasn't very well known either. We clearly devoted a large amount of our resources to Konoplyanka these last few days, and also failed.

These aren't household names who are moving to bigger clubs we're missing out on, imagine the competition for well established players.

They might not be household names to the fans but I'm damn sure all the top teams around Europe more than just knew of them. Look where the first three went.
 
Chelsea were linked with Willian for years. Costa was already a household name in Spain.
 
Ok fair enough, I just noticed you'd been a bit agitated on here of late *handshakey*



People seem to be taking it for granted these days that everyone should buy in January. United bought because they had to, because they've been so shit, it gives Moyes more time and it had to be done because they've been so poor. Chelsea sold Mata, which funded Salah and Zouma (who they don't get till the Summer anyway) they brought back Matic but have always had the capacity to spend (what's new?), City have bought no one (not that they need to), Spurs have bought no one, Arsenal have brought in a loanee (and missed out on loads of targets again), Everton have brought in no one.



Like I said, if people want to criticise something, criticise that we're not scouting for gems that won't be pounced upon by the big guns, there's no point in us going head to head with Chelsea and City, because we'll more often than not lose out to financial and European Football pulling power - by the same token we spend in the tier that contains Spurs and Arsenal, two clubs in the capital who are in Europe.



FSG have proven they are full of shit? Go and look at what we've spent, at the commercial deals we're bringing in to pay dividends further down the line, people seriously need to get a grip and have a dose of perspective. We nearly went under 4 years ago, we've spent big since then and got back in the thick of it, did people expect a title and a conveyor belt of £30m signings?



Get real.



Don't mean to come across as a stressed out twat, just can't help being pissed off with the things already mentioned, ill wind my neck in after ive replied to your post.


You say get real but all you seem to be doing is sticking your head in the sand and going all ott whilst ignoring whats actually happened.

'did people expect a title and a conveyor belt of £30m signings?' - really? of course not, who does?, what i do expect is the suits to give the manager as much help as possible to achieve our (and their supposed) goal of CL football, even more so with the massive opportunity we have found ourselves in, we should of been going all out to make sure the manager got what he wanted, is that really asking to much?

I don't know why you or anyone brings what our rivals have done into it, its out of our control and really has nothing to do with us what they do in the transfer market, what we are in control of is ourselves and we should be or should of been focussed on maximising our chances of CL football this window but instead we have done nothing.

'Like I said, if people want to criticise something, criticise that we're not scouting for gems that won't be pounced upon by the big guns'

Why? whats that got to do with us screwing this window up and handicapping instead of increasing our chances of CL?, scouting unearthed gems is another subject altogether, we needed players to help us right now.


'there's no point in us going head to head with Chelsea and City'

We rarely do, we were not up against anyone for Kono, we weren't exactly head to head against Chelsea for Salah, we were in there well before them and if we hadn't of been so inept we would of had Salah before Chelsea even had the chance to come in for him.


FSG have proven they are full of shit?

Yep, if they really wanted CL football like we were led to believe they would of gotton things done in this window, maybe even pushed the boat out a bit because of where we are in the league, instead we sign nobody and leave it all on Rodgers to peform his miracle, massive pile of bullshit for me, can't believe it really, they might well get lucky but if we don't then i expect more people will realise they are indeed full of shit, this is the season where it has to happen, can't help but fear we wont get a better chance for quite some time, thats whats so frustrating.


One of the rare times i haven't agreed with whatever you have said on here.
 
Ayre needs to be fucked off, that's for sure. But its no stress what happened, we lost out on a player we didn't actually need. It wasn't like spurs last summer where they lost their only player, and needed a rebuild. Losing out on cockplanker is like losing out on a 3rd goalkeeper for me. I wouldn't want any of our top 4 dropping after their last game, not for cockplanker.
 
Ayre doesn't need fucking off

I'm sure he's following what the owners are saying. Not his fault
 
Ayre needs to be fucked off, that's for sure.


Nah, he seems to be doing well in what I believe was his original remit - increasing commercial revenue and all that.

As Macca said, it feels like we need someone to come in alongside Ayre (or above him) and take on some responsibility.
 
What trend is there? Really?

Salah is the only one we were really in for.

Dempsey a year and a half ago

So Salah and the kono kid?

Considering our resources and a lack of CL footy we shouldn't be surprised or disappointed
 
Nah, he seems to be doing well in what I believe was his original remit - increasing commercial revenue and all that.

As Macca said, it feels like we need someone to come in alongside Ayre (or above him) and take on some responsibility.

Ok, I need to reword that then - He needs to be fucked off from signing players. If he's great and bringing in commercial deals then great, keep him, but in another role nowhere near transfers after ballsing up about 8 in succession.
 
Ok, I need to reword that then - He needs to be fucked off from signing players. If he's great and bringing in commercial deals then great, keep him, but in another role nowhere near transfers after ballsing up about 8 in succession.

It's two in succession
 
Mors in inept, sensationalist, stupid nicknaming posts shocker.

Tell you what, I'd have Modo over this prick every fucking day!
 
If I didn't have you ignore you cunt, I'd call you a cunt and tell you bang it up your arse and stop stalking me. Stupid fucking tapatalk means I on occasion have to read your stalking bollocks as the ignore doesn't work on there. Apart from that, go and play with the fucking traffic retard.
 
My eyes hurt when I see all the bad language in these fightin' posts. The use of the c word especially. Brings the tone of the site down some what old boy.
 
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