Tactics

[ILD]

When we beat Chelsea I was excited for times ahead and posted this thread; http://www.sixcrazyminutes.com/forums/index.php?topic=47692.msg1433358#msg1433358

I originally had my concerns on whether Kenny was jumbling up his tactics and we needed to go back to the pass and move philosophy that we deployed at Fulham away last season. It was us at our best IMO under Kenny.

That line up today was a mess. The onus was on the extra CB to join in with out attacking play but we should have withdrawn a CB and kept on an attacker as we we're clearly dominating possession. Stoke we're here for the draw and Sorenson was time wasting from early on. On a side note, I miss Wonderman too btw.

 

[Ryan]

Krump - I see you left Carroll's name out of that "hopeless wankers" list. Just admit it, he's shit isn't he?

 

[Woland]

Carroll is bollocks but at least he gets dropped.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=48302.msg1464565#msg1464565 date=1326619745]
Ha. I might take it back up again if I'm bored enough. It'd make a welcome change for everyone from Spider's efforts anyway
[/quote]

I'm as bored of doing it as you are of reading it.

missed a sea of chances, again.
no one in the box, again.
no proper service to the strikers, again.
brilliant performance from the opposition keeper, again (not yesterday though, he didn't have to make a save.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...

 

[Frogfish]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=48302.msg1464501#msg1464501 date=1326586914]
[quote author=Frogfish link=topic=48302.msg1464376#msg1464376 date=1326560446]
Sorry but Kenny just isn't getting this, we need to commit to attack rather than retaining possession. I'd prefer us to lose the odd match than to play out tepid home draw after tepid home draw. What 6 home draws ? Win 3 and lose 3 and we're still 3 points better off.
[/quote]

I just don't believe Kenny isn't 'getting it'. You only have to look at Fulham last season, when players were bombing into the box like, well, since Kenny was last in charge, to see what he wants. His reaction every time we scored was such a relief after years of negative tactics. What he thinks we can currently do, however, is another matter, and that's obviously open to debate, and I appreciate the frustration. But I don't believe he's been 'Raffad'.
[/quote]

This is the conundrum though. If you look at the way we played the 2nd half of last season and the 1st half of this you could be led to believe we are watching a completely different team with a totally different mentality. The number of times you could count more than 2 players in the Stoke box when we took the ball to the by-line or crosses came in could be counted on one hand. From defence to the opposing box we play thoughtful, possession based football but are totally lacking in commitment in the box. That is the manager's responsibility.

Compare us to any team from United to Blackburn when it comes down to players in the box. Often our attackers are out-numbered 7 or 8 to 2 or 3, even if they get to the ball first the chances are the quality of their shot will be hindered by pressure from 2 or 3 defenders. Resulting in less real goal scoring chances and more low-probability shots from distance. It is inexplicable and IMO a key indicator as to why we have one of the lowest number of goals scored in the EPL.

 

[Sunny]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=48302.msg1464349#msg1464349 date=1326559810]
We've not been doing ourselves any favours, have we?

When you're at home, dominating possession with percentages approaching near enough 70% and basically playing a game of attack vs defence, it's not particularly encouraging when:

- you're playing a lone striker

- your midfielders struggle to show any kind of movement or create numbers in the box

- you're relying on a CB (Skrtel) to provide an attacking outlet on the right wing largely because you're playing three at the back

The main issue we have of course is down to playing personnel not being good enough, but still. It's been a frustrating to see how Kenny has set the team up times.
[/quote]

Can't disagree with any of that Keni

 

[mark1975]

We haven't bought well, that's the crux of it. Whether Henderson and Carroll benefit us further down the line is neither here nor there (and I have serious doubts about that latters ability to do so), we have needed, for about the last 5yrs, to identify key problems and sort them out permanently. We've give ourselves the basis of a good squad, but only if the real out and out quality were there in the first team, instead we've invested heavily in Downing who looks low on confidence and ideas, Carroll who's doing a great impression of a League One player, and Jordan Henderson who has been hit and miss and too often anonymous.

The £70m odd that we spent there could have give us a real step up. We're in a risky predicament when we're throwing money at shite because the powers that be won't want that to become a habit and they'll be reluctant to back us if they don't see a return.

I haven't even looked at the table this season, such is my lack of confidence in us and the way the league, the game and the FA has gone. We should be playing like we did at Fulham last season, we haven't hit those heights enough and Kenny's team selections are falling into the same trap that Ged's and Rafa's did - He's too preoccupied with the opposition. I like Kenny and want him to do well and I think the signs are sometimes there, we keep the ball alot better but the end product is still lacking. If we buy two quality attackers then I think we will do well, but I'm not sure whether I trust him to buy the right players and if we don't buy or we buy poorly, we're gonna continue to stuggle.

For the amount spent, to play 5 defenders and a lone Dirk Kuyt who is getting past it these days, that's just criminal.

The honeymoon period is coming to it's end.

 

[spider-Neil]

I think some people are doing kenny a bit of a disservice. alright, yesterday was awful and we created next to nothing but a lot a games this season we've battered the opposition. we've been ridiculously unfortunate to lose lucas for half a season and then to lose suarez for 8 games because the fa were intent on setting an example.

despite our woes we're 5 points off a CL place (given our season I find that incredible) and we're in a cup semi final (regardless of how much that cup has been devalued). I think kenny has done 'okay' in his first full year back.

there is no arguing that we've wasted money but we do have a solid foundation now, I think there are very few players we need to ship out and we can only build on that if we spend our money wisely. I haven't written off kenny yet and one game (with a disasterous team selection) isn't going to change that.

 

[mark1975]

Have we really 'battered' them though Neil? Some of our attacking play reminds me of when Evans was in charge, all side-ways passes, tonnes of possession but spending the entire game tip toeing around the edge of the opposition box, throwing in aimless punts at players who can't read the game well enough and ultimately producing fuck all.

FFF made a valid point in the other thread and it's something I've said a few times when watching us this season, we're like Arsenal, we're great statistically in the 'completed passes and kept possession' section, but at the end of the day it's the score that matters. You can say we've been unlucky, everyone has games like that and yeah, we've hit the woodwork a record amount of times, but we've also put the ball wide dozens of times and straight at the keeper, usually the product of hopelessness and a lack of invention and usually down to a frustrated players just having a pop because they can't get beyond the opposition's backline.

We need a striker and someone who can carve teams open, our midfield and attack, for all the 'easy on the eye' passing, is largely inept, slow and short of ideas.

 

[Woland]

Last season I had fans of other clubs telling me that the good form in the league was a blip because KK was under no pressure and we'd see true colours this year.

I laughed it off. Not laughing now.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=48302.msg1464636#msg1464636 date=1326628491]
Have we really 'battered' them though Neil? Some of our attacking play reminds me of when Evans was in charge, all side-ways passes, tonnes of possession but spending the entire game tip toeing around the edge of the opposition box, throwing in aimless punts at players who can't read the game well enough and ultimately producing fuck all.

FFF made a valid point in the other thread and it's something I've said a few times when watching us this season, we're like Arsenal, we're great statistically in the 'completed passes and kept possession' section, but at the end of the day it's the score that matters. You can say we've been unlucky, everyone has games like that and yeah, we've hit the woodwork a record amount of times, but we've also put the ball wide dozens of times and straight at the keeper, usually the product of hopelessness and a lack of invention and usually down to a frustrated players just having a pop because they can't get beyond the opposition's backline.

We need a striker and someone who can carve teams open, our midfield and attack, for all the 'easy on the eye' passing, is largely inept, slow and short of ideas.
[/quote]

yes we have 'battered' teams. look at manu and city for example, should either team really have escaped anfield with a point? we're taking yesterday's game and retoactively applying it to the entire season when in previous games we've created loads of chances and just haen't finished them. also many MOTM performances for opposition keepers at anfield this season, off the top of my head I can think of three.

 

[FoxForceFive]

[quote author=Woland link=topic=48302.msg1464569#msg1464569 date=1326621085]
How come being Liverpool manager always fucks people in the head?

What formation was that? Was it 5-4-1 or 3-7-0 or what? And why did Dalglish think it was a good time to invent a new one?

The only thing I can think of is ego. You must have a massive ego to change a naturally balanced formation for a new one that everyone else in the fucking ground can see is never going to produce goals. To stick with hopeless wankers likes Downing and Henderson because you bought them and Maxi isn't even on the bench.

Fucking wank.
[/quote]

Not only that but it means something more worrying. It means no-one in our backroom or playing staff has the balls to tell Kenny when he's wrong, or he ignores them when they tell him.

Every single fan knew that formation/team was wrong on so many levels, so obviously people within the club did too, but either couldn't, or didn't do anything about it.

A manager needs someone to tell them when they're wrong, if Kenny doesn't have that then we have a massive problem.

 

[gkmacca]

[quote author=Woland link=topic=48302.msg1464642#msg1464642 date=1326628735]
Last season I had fans of other clubs telling me that the good form in the league was a blip because KK was under no pressure and we'd see true colours this year.

I laughed it off. Not laughing now.
[/quote]

Be honest, you're never laughing.

 

[Woland]

Well I'm that pissed off with footy that I'm going to have a few beers and go and watch a film this afternoon.

Sod super sunday. Wank, booze, sunday lunch and films.

 

[gkmacca]

[quote author=Woland link=topic=48302.msg1464678#msg1464678 date=1326631599]
Well I'm that pissed off with footy that I'm going to have a few beers and go and watch a film this afternoon.

[/quote]

Escape to Victory?

 

[doctor_mac]

[quote author=Woland link=topic=48302.msg1464580#msg1464580 date=1326623814]
Wow, we've got a special formation for playing Stoke at home - with a fifty percent success rate? Awesome.
[/quote]

It had a 100% success rate before yesterday though.

 

[FoxForceFive]

That's maths for you.

 

[Gary25]

Kenny's fucked up too many times this season. Poor team selection, poor tactics, mis-management of players, the whole works.

Hopefully he can get us the Carling Cup, something to cheer at least but as for next season and beyond, i don't think he's up to it.