No "big names"

[Frogfish]

I'll be honest and say I don't see a major issue with not signing 'big names' and this is quite aside from the fact that Klopp feels teamwork can overcome a team of individual superstars (though that may be another matter if they also gel as a team !) and that we have indeed already strengthened in key positions (Karius, Matip & Mane) and could well do even more before the transfer window closes.

Look at Arsenal when they were building their stadium, they were circumspect in the market, treading water until the stadium was finished. I know FSG said that the cost of building the stadium would not impact our transfer kitty but that was before we failed to get into any European competition.

Naturally we are now a less attractive proposition for any ambitious player however that also, paradoxically, gives us a good chance of making Top 4. The sale of unwanted players, that we needed to divest ourselves of, to trim the squad size, will bring in maybe £100m (assuming Benteke is sold) and that may be all we spend for a net zero transfer figure. This is the perfect opportunity to strengthen the squad, whilst downsizing it, and consolidate without splurging too much this Summer.

Once we (hopefully) make Top 4 on the back of no Euro football and improved team tactics, personnel and understanding, we can then spend big next Summer when the stadium and new pitch will both be completely finished and contributing to increased match day income, the team should by then be showing sustained progress and competitiveness in the PL (and maybe a cup under our belts to improve our image to prospective acquisitions) and we can go all out to get the higher quality players needed to fill the gaps that will become obvious as the season progresses. I just pray that our injury jinx of recent seasons dissipates !

 

[Frogfish]

Carra.

“I am still hoping they (Liverpool) will bring a couple of players in, maybe at left-back, maybe one in midfield. But I think the fact that Liverpool haven’t got European football this season will be a massive help to Jurgen Klopp and the players and it gives them a great chance of getting into the top four.

With Jurgen Klopp, you can see the way he wants his teams to play, the way they train, training is a big part of that and getting the sort of stamina levels and fitness levels, ready to go and play at a weekend. That was the problem for them last season, they couldn’t train properly because they had so many games. You are either recovering or building up to a game so you can’t put the training in that you want.

He has brought a fitness coach in from Bayern Munich, it is pretty obvious that the team will be firing on all cylinders physically, whether they have got the quality on the pitch remains to be seen with whoever he buys or if some of the players they have got there surpass the levels they have done in the past few seasons. But I think they will be a difficult nut to crack next year, they will be a nightmare to play against if they are really ready and firing and doing that pressing and closing down that Jurgen Klopp likes.”

 

[gkmacca]

I'm a little bit confused. I've seen you variously purport to be God and Jesus .. and you sign off as a Judge. Master of disguise ? Or the Devil incarnate ?!

I'd be more doubtful of the fact that the Supreme Being claims to reside near Brum!

 

[gkmacca]

I'll be honest and say I don't see a major issue with not signing 'big names'

I don't think that many fans are obsessed with big names and/or big transfer fees. What we want, surely, are big talents. Whether that means well-known or lesser-known or unknown talents, I don't care. We want new players who make us look up and think, 'Wow! That's surely the hope. For far too long we get players who aren't big names but aren't big talents, either. You look at them and try to imagine them developing into a player who is stronger, faster, craftier and much more ruthless. And that never really happens. That's the niggling thing about Bascombe's spin on it, implying it's some childish yearning for the most expensive and well-established stars in the world. We all know about the difficulty of getting top players, and about the need to develop and blend a team. But we also know talent when we see it, and we notice mediocrity, too. So what we want is a marked improvement in talent spotting, a huge improvement in our scouting system and a more professional, prompt and decisive performance form the CEO and his team.

 

[keniget]

I don't think that many fans are obsessed with big names and/or big transfer fees. What we want, surely, are big talents. Whether that means well-known or lesser-known or unknown talents, I don't care. We want new players who make us look up and think, 'Wow! That's surely the hope. For far too long we get players who aren't big names but aren't big talents, either. You look at them and try to imagine them developing into a player who is stronger, faster, craftier and much more ruthless. And that never really happens. That's the niggling thing about Bascombe's spin on it, implying it's some childish yearning for the most expensive and well-established stars in the world. We all know about the difficulty of getting top players, and about the need to develop and blend a team. But we also know talent when we see it, and we notice mediocrity, too. So what we want is a marked improvement in talent spotting, a huge improvement in our scouting system and a more professional, prompt and decisive performance form the CEO and his team.

Nailed it.

 

[Frogfish]

I don't think that many fans are obsessed with big names and/or big transfer fees. What we want, surely, are big talents. Whether that means well-known or lesser-known or unknown talents, I don't care. We want new players who make us look up and think, 'Wow! That's surely the hope. For far too long we get players who aren't big names but aren't big talents, either. You look at them and try to imagine them developing into a player who is stronger, faster, craftier and much more ruthless. And that never really happens. That's the niggling thing about Bascombe's spin on it, implying it's some childish yearning for the most expensive and well-established stars in the world. We all know about the difficulty of getting top players, and about the need to develop and blend a team. But we also know talent when we see it, and we notice mediocrity, too. So what we want is a marked improvement in talent spotting, a huge improvement in our scouting system and a more professional, prompt and decisive performance form the CEO and his team.

I agree Macca. And I think in Karius, Matip and Mane we have done that, all young players and all highly rated without being superstars with insane transfer fees on their heads.

Obviously the Euros (and Copa America) have had a major impact on transfer business this Summer, making it very messy for all clubs in all leagues with players going straight off on holiday after their nation was eliminated.

I don't think any of our board or scouts has been remiss so far this Summer, though we won't know that until the transfer season closes. I can understand them not wanting to over-pay or under-sell too and without the full facts it becomes difficult to ascertain whether any failed deal can be blamed on the board.

 

[Arn]

I don't think that many fans are obsessed with big names and/or big transfer fees. What we want, surely, are big talents. Whether that means well-known or lesser-known or unknown talents, I don't care. We want new players who make us look up and think, 'Wow! That's surely the hope. For far too long we get players who aren't big names but aren't big talents, either. You look at them and try to imagine them developing into a player who is stronger, faster, craftier and much more ruthless. And that never really happens. That's the niggling thing about Bascombe's spin on it, implying it's some childish yearning for the most expensive and well-established stars in the world. We all know about the difficulty of getting top players, and about the need to develop and blend a team. But we also know talent when we see it, and we notice mediocrity, too. So what we want is a marked improvement in talent spotting, a huge improvement in our scouting system and a more professional, prompt and decisive performance form the CEO and his team.

I think that we already have that player, Woodburn. If you believe the reports then he the best young talent from our Academy in a long time. Didn't knew much about him but after the Fleetwood game I read many articles and looked at clips about him. Is he our best young talent since Gerrard? Most probably.

He will probably not get much if any playing time for the first team in a competitive game this season. When you have such a big young talent that get the chance then it will give the whole club a lift. It gives everyone a big hope for the future.

 

[rurikbird]

I don't think that many fans are obsessed with big names and/or big transfer fees. What we want, surely, are big talents. Whether that means well-known or lesser-known or unknown talents, I don't care. We want new players who make us look up and think, 'Wow! That's surely the hope. For far too long we get players who aren't big names but aren't big talents, either. You look at them and try to imagine them developing into a player who is stronger, faster, craftier and much more ruthless. And that never really happens. That's the niggling thing about Bascombe's spin on it, implying it's some childish yearning for the most expensive and well-established stars in the world. We all know about the difficulty of getting top players, and about the need to develop and blend a team. But we also know talent when we see it, and we notice mediocrity, too. So what we want is a marked improvement in talent spotting, a huge improvement in our scouting system and a more professional, prompt and decisive performance form the CEO and his team.

That's why I really hope we can sign players like Coric and Brandt – top talents that aren't "big names" yet. Chilwell seem to be highly rated by almost everyone and hopefully we'll get him eventually, even if we have to wait one more year, same goes for Dahoud. Grujic looks like a top talent already and we have several very promising U21 and U18 players coming up – and being given chances to contribute by the manager, which is so important.

So far I'm very happy with the business we've done – I think every player will improve us, which is better than signing 8 players only half of whom are any good. I just hope we can add a couple of more in the similar vein.

 

[Frogfish]

I think that we already have that player, Woodburn. If you believe the reports then he the best young talent from our Academy in a long time. Didn't knew much about him but after the Fleetwood game I read many articles and looked at clips about him. Is he our best young talent since Gerrard? Most probably.

He will probably not get much if any playing time for the first team in a competitive game this season. When you have such a big young talent that get the chance then it will give the whole club a lift. It gives everyone a big hope for the future.

He's 16 and not even on a pro contract yet. And needs to build up a lot of muscle. I'd be surprised if he got a single game in any competition for the first team this season.

 

[Hansern]

Gruijc looks a great talent, Karius the same and lets hope we can add a few more.

 

[Hansern]

Klopp interview in the German media today:

Klopp on the transfer fees in the PL: "Guardiola, Mourinho and Conte don't go to Aldi."

 

[rurikbird]

And one more thought about sustaining success in an ultra-competitive league, which is something both @gkmacca and @keniget alluded to in this thread. Historically, the teams with the most sustained success have been ones who were able to harness a generation of talents that came through their youth system (which is structured to produce a certain kind of player), supplemented by a few well-chosen key additions. United in the 90's were like this, Barca in 2000's, us in the 80's, Ajax and Bayern in the 70's, etc.

We are very fortunate to have a manager who not only trusts young players, but is demanding and meticulous enough to build the youth system in a way to maximize the chances of our young players making it in the first team (to be fair, Rodgers and Rafa did some good things in that direction as well and FSG have been very supportive). Just a few years ago our immediate youth reserves were mostly a bunch of no-hopers who were there just to make up the numbers and played a completely different style and formation to the first team - now I can name at least 5-7 young players who could meaningfully contribute to the first team already this season, and even more who will surely come up in the seasons ahead.

I would much rather to be in this position, with a manager like Klopp, then having to buy a Falcao AND a Di Maria every season and changing managers every couple of seasons just to stay competitive enough for 4th or 5th place. That's not a strategy for sustained success. Or let's take City - they spent years chasing Guardiola and supposedly molding the team in advance to suit his style, yet now it's been revealed he only wants to keep literally 3 players out of the whole squad he inherited. They limped to 4th place in a weakest league in years, way behind Leicester and Spurs, and it looks like the team they spent years and countless millions building will be basically broken up and started all over again.

Chelsea did a lot of smart and ambitious things early in Abramovich's tenure, but recently they've lost their way, totally lacking patience to promote any of their numerous young players (and selling would could have been their future core players such as De Bruyne, Lukaku, Sturridge etc) and instead buying player after player seemingly based on name recognition rather then ability. For me Arsenal has by far the most sound strategy and sustainable base for success among the "big" clubs, but they've been hamstrung by Wenger's apparent lack of ambition.

So while @keniget is absolutely right that in recent years every time it looked like we were on the we verge of having a good team, we've blown it badly, I think we are finally doing the right things right now. I have no doubt that Klopp will build a team capable of competing at the very top; I just hope that once it happens FSG will not let it be torn apart the way Dortmund have been.

 

[the count]

. Just a few years ago our immediate youth reserves were mostly a bunch of no-hopers who were there just to make up the numbers and played a completely different style and formation to the first team - now I can name at least 5-7 young players who could meaningfully contribute to the first team already this season, and even more who will surely come up in the seasons ahead.

.

Sadly, while agreeing with you, I see this as much a poor reflection of the general quality of the first team as it is the higher quality of the reserves

 

[Red Bird]

Sadly, while agreeing with you, I see this as much a poor reflection of the general quality of the first team as it is the higher quality of the reserves

If that's the case, I think that makes the case making sure that purchases are genuine upgrades on what we already have (including the sprogs.)

 

[LarryHagman]

No big names thread started by Zlate Nikolovski-Normski-Adamski.