Torres doubtful

[Garmy]

According to the ever cheerful Harry Harris, our financial situation is dire and we're gonna have to sell a player to finance Reina's new deal.

I'm just waiting for a full strength squad back, and hopefully some fresh air in January.

-------------------------------------------------------------

Torres

Riera Gerrard Benayoun

Mascher Aquilani

Insua Agger Carra Johnson

Reina

Subs: Cavalieri, Kuyt, Ngog, Aurelio, Kelly, Lucas.....

-------------------------------------------------------------

Yes, options, please.

 

[rage]

rebel i agree with you. purslow is a stupid cunt - he gave rafa taht long term contract for starters.

 

[Sunny]

[quote author=rage link=topic=36882.msg977265#msg977265 date=1257177059]
rebel i agree with you. purslow is a stupid cunt - he gave rafa taht long term contract for starters.
[/quote]

What do you think of our owners rage ? And why is Purslow a cunt ? Because he's said we've got no money ? Turn it in boys. He would have been instructed by the two Americans to give Benitez that contract.

 

[Tinto]

I don't think there will be anyone coming in during the Winter window as we need to pay the next installment on Aqualini. So, the money has been spent already.

 

[Garmy]

[quote author=Tinto link=topic=36882.msg977270#msg977270 date=1257177400]
I don't think there will be anyone coming in during the Winter window as we need to pay the next installment on Aqualini. So, the money has been spent already.
[/quote]
Then let us offer sacrifices to God to keep our players injury-free and to all have the stamina of Dirk Kuyt at his peak.

 

[Sunny]

Sooner or later we have to face facts. Before anything else, the production of profit is more important than what happens on the pitch. That is the main driver for the Americans, nothing else. If success is a by-product then of course that makes them happy as they can merchandise more and it makes us happy. If we're not successful - do they really care ? They'll still make lots of money from loyal fans whilst piling on more and more debt on the club and spouting off a load of delaying spin/lies to us.

In my view, they are the real problem. We had a real chance to invest this year, strenghten the squad and push on from last year. That didn't happen - our squads weaker if anything and we've hit injuries to key players that we're unable to backfill from our less than average squad. Benitez does have to and should hold his hands up to the mistakes he makes though - he does make them - as do we all from time to time.

I can't see what problem is with Purslow. He's a facilitator more than anything. The two morons at the top pull all the strings and they haven't even got the capacity to speak to each other - and when they lower themselves to speak to us it's a crock load of a lies. I fucking really hate them. I love Liverpool so much but the thought I line their pockets with my money every game just doesn't sit well with me at the moment.

 

[peekay]

[quote author=rebel23 link=topic=36882.msg977246#msg977246 date=1257175425]
[quote author=peekay link=topic=36882.msg977243#msg977243 date=1257175153]
[quote author=rebel23 link=topic=36882.msg977145#msg977145 date=1257163232]
I can't see it Mark, even players like Falcao and Chamach (sp) who were available for £5m would do but we're not linked to anyone, ANYONE . it's very fucking stupid and worrying

the owners have no clue what they're doing.


[/quote]

Falcao moved to Porto in summer. No way we are getting him. Chamakh is a good option. So is Toni. He is desperate to get out of Bayern. But Inter are favorites to land him. Goran Pandev is another good player available for 5 million. He is also desperate to move out of Lazio. Again, Inter are favorites to land him.
[/quote]

We could have got Falcao for £5m no?

We could have got Negredo, Higuain, numerous others

there will be some in January, Chamakh with 6 months on his contract, is the right age (25) and an international with experience. perfect if we can get him but my prediction is they won't stump up or we'll have to sell a player first



[/quote]

Much lesser than 5 million, Porto paid around 3 million for him. And his wage demands will be reasonably low.

Rumour was that Rafa wanted one of Negredo, Higuain, as a part of the Xabi deal but the owners wanted cash. I still think we could get Higuain on loan with an option to buy in January. He is a class player who does not even make the bench half the time this season at Real. I will be dazed if we buy some one in January especially as BBC reported that we might have to sell Babel to finance the new deal for Pepe.

 

[Sunny]

Why are we having to sell players (or not buy players) to finance new contracts. Surely player acquisitions and sales etc should be part of a capital budget. Salaries should form part of the revenue budget which is a year-on-year re-occurring cost. I'm no accountant but the logic doesn't add up.

 

[vantage]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=36882.msg977297#msg977297 date=1257180025]
Why are we having to sell players (or not buy players) to finance new contracts. Surely player acquisitions and sales etc should be part of a capital budget. Salaries should form part of the revenue budget which is a year-on-year re-occurring cost. I'm no accountant but the logic doesn't add up.
[/quote]
Cos we're owned by two skint septics.

 

[Jürgen4PM]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=36882.msg977276#msg977276 date=1257178057]
Sooner or later we have to face facts. Before anything else, the production of profit is more important than what happens on the pitch. That is the main driver for the Americans, nothing else. If success is a by-product then of course that makes them happy as they can merchandise more and it makes us happy. If we're not successful - do they really care ? They'll still make lots of money from loyal fans whilst piling on more and more debt on the club and spouting off a load of delaying spin/lies to us.

In my view, they are the real problem. We had a real chance to invest this year, strenghten the squad and push on from last year. That didn't happen - our squads weaker if anything and we've hit injuries to key players that we're unable to backfill from our less than average squad. Benitez does have to and should hold his hands up to the mistakes he makes though - he does make them - as do we all from time to time.

I can't see what problem is with Purslow. He's a facilitator more than anything. The two morons at the top pull all the strings and they haven't even got the capacity to speak to each other - and when they lower themselves to speak to us it's a crock load of a lies. I fucking really hate them. I love Liverpool so much but the thought I line their pockets with my money every game just doesn't sit well with me at the moment.
[/quote]

Top post Sunny.

I really can't describe how sick i feel knowing that these two complete utter wankers are leaching off of our club. People won't agree, but for me at the moment we should all be venting our anger at G&H whilst getting fully behind the team and staff.

It will be a great day when these two cunts have finally left.

 

[Tinto]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=36882.msg977297#msg977297 date=1257180025]
Why are we having to sell players (or not buy players) to finance new contracts. Surely player acquisitions and sales etc should be part of a capital budget. Salaries should form part of the revenue budget which is a year-on-year re-occurring cost. I'm no accountant but the logic doesn't add up.
[/quote]

Because we're not... we're selling assets to pay back the banks.

 

[drizzt]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=36882.msg977297#msg977297 date=1257180025]
Why are we having to sell players (or not buy players) to finance new contracts. Surely player acquisitions and sales etc should be part of a capital budget. Salaries should form part of the revenue budget which is a year-on-year re-occurring cost. I'm no accountant but the logic doesn't add up.
[/quote]

Because the money for the capital budget comes from the bank account that the money from the revenue budget also comes from. Alas, this same bank account is where the money for the interest payment budget comes from.

 

[vantage]

Good post Sunny.

 

[Red Mullet]

[quote author=Sunny link=topic=36882.msg977276#msg977276 date=1257178057]
Sooner or later we have to face facts. Before anything else, the production of profit is more important than what happens on the pitch. That is the main driver for the Americans, nothing else. If success is a by-product then of course that makes them happy as they can merchandise more and it makes us happy. If we're not successful - do they really care ? They'll still make lots of money from loyal fans whilst piling on more and more debt on the club and spouting off a load of delaying spin/lies to us.

In my view, they are the real problem. We had a real chance to invest this year, strenghten the squad and push on from last year. That didn't happen - our squads weaker if anything and we've hit injuries to key players that we're unable to backfill from our less than average squad. Benitez does have to and should hold his hands up to the mistakes he makes though - he does make them - as do we all from time to time.

I can't see what problem is with Purslow. He's a facilitator more than anything. The two morons at the top pull all the strings and they haven't even got the capacity to speak to each other - and when they lower themselves to speak to us it's a crock load of a lies. I fucking really hate them. I love Liverpool so much but the thought I line their pockets with my money every game just doesn't sit well with me at the moment.
[/quote]

Good post Sunny.

TBF to G&H they have improved the business side of LFC, look at the example of Standard Chartered. Although, this augments well with making top dollar out of the club.

 

[peekay]

This is from Tony Barrett

Fernando Torres has a hernia that could require surgery if he is overplayed, Rafael Benítez has been warned.

Liverpool’s medical staff delivered the worrying prognosis during the build-up to the club’s crucial Champions League match against Lyons tomorrow night.

Steven Gerrard is definitely out of the group E tie at the Stade Gerland because of a groin problem. The Liverpool captain is joined on Benítez’s lengthy casualty list by Fábio Aurélio, Albert Riera, Martin Skrtel and Martin Kelly.

Torres has been included in the squad that travels to France today and is likely to start tomorrow’s game — when anything other than victory will leave their hopes of qualifying for the knockout stages hanging by a thread — and play through the pain.


The inguinal hernia has been affecting the striker for most of the past month since the problem developed while on international duty with Spain in early October.

Liverpool have attempted to mask the severity of Torres’s condition by nursing him through matches and allowing him to train only immediately before games, when his physical condition is deemed good enough. Since the 25-year-old suffered his latest setback, though, there have been real fears that he could need an operation.

It is hoped that the combination of rationing the striker’s appearances and occasionally allowing him to miss training will allow Torres the rest time he needs for surgery to be averted.

Benítez is aware, however, that even these precautions may not be enough to spare his £22 million record signing from having to have an operation.

Torres was substituted after an hour of Liverpool’s 3-1 Barclays Premier League defeat away to Fulham on Saturday, a decision that puzzled many fans and caused Ronnie Whelan, the former Anfield captain, to call for the manager’s head.

But it now seems clear that it was simply the latest example of Benítez’s desire to protect the forward from exacerbating the seriousness of his condition.

“I was surprised with the critics after the game because Fernando has had problems in the last month after the international games,†Benítez said. “We are trying to manage because he was close to having an operation.

“He is not comfortable. He has not got the power he had before, so we have to manage and try to protect him. He cannot play well if you keep pushing him. Maybe if you push him he will be injured for a long time.

“So, I am really surprised with the critics. When you talk about big names, people just analyse the names and not how the player is when he is on the pitch. He was not 100 per cent fit. We have to take Fernando to Lyons because we don’t have too many options.â€

Benítez already faces the prospect of Gerrard having to undergo groin surgery to correct a problem he suffered while on duty with England.

“Gerrard won’t travel to Lyons,†Benítez confirmed. “He has no chance. He is improving but we have to wait. He has had an injection but we have to wait two or three days and see how he reacts.

“Skrtel also has no chance. He has a small muscle problem. It’s not too big but he is feeling something.â€

At a time when Benítez’s position as Liverpool manager is being questioned like never before after six defeats in their past past seven games, his injury concerns are mounting.

The situation is so dire that Alberto Aquilani, the Italy midfield player, has been added to the squad despite not having fully recovered from illness, while Benítez has also been forced to call on David Ngog and Daniel Agger even though the pair are nursing slight knocks.

“Agger is improving — he will travel and we will then decide,†Benítez said. “He felt something in his back but it’s much better now. We have to wait and see how he reacts. Ngog is much better, so he could be available.â€

Benítez has taken the unusual step of naming a 20-man squad, with Stephen Darby, the 21-year-old right back who has never started a game for the club, included in case Glen Johnson fails to recover from the calf strain that has kept the England defender out of action since Liverpool’s victory over Manchester United nine days ago.

Uefa has also given the club special dispensation to promote Danny Ayala, the 18-year-old centre back, into the squad from their B-list.

 

[Farkmaster]

There's no problem with them somewhat limiting the on the field success of the club, for the betterment of the club long term. Arsenal have been doing this for the last few years, it just isn't as noticeable because they exchange higher wage packets and a phenomenal scouting/youth development program for big purchasing.

I'm glad to see the owners growing the commercial side of the business, however matchday gate receipt revenue is the glaring undeveloped thing that was the prime reason they were sold the club in the first place. It's a disaster for us to be hamstrung for no reason.

 

[Fallon]

[quote author=peekay link=topic=36882.msg977578#msg977578 date=1257215025]
This is from Tony Barrett

Fernando Torres has a hernia that could require surgery if he is overplayed, Rafael Benítez has been warned.

Liverpool’s medical staff delivered the worrying prognosis during the build-up to the club’s crucial Champions League match against Lyons tomorrow night.

Steven Gerrard is definitely out of the group E tie at the Stade Gerland because of a groin problem. The Liverpool captain is joined on Benítez’s lengthy casualty list by Fábio Aurélio, Albert Riera, Martin Skrtel and Martin Kelly.

Torres has been included in the squad that travels to France today and is likely to start tomorrow’s game — when anything other than victory will leave their hopes of qualifying for the knockout stages hanging by a thread — and play through the pain.


The inguinal hernia has been affecting the striker for most of the past month since the problem developed while on international duty with Spain in early October.

Liverpool have attempted to mask the severity of Torres’s condition by nursing him through matches and allowing him to train only immediately before games, when his physical condition is deemed good enough. Since the 25-year-old suffered his latest setback, though, there have been real fears that he could need an operation.

It is hoped that the combination of rationing the striker’s appearances and occasionally allowing him to miss training will allow Torres the rest time he needs for surgery to be averted.

Benítez is aware, however, that even these precautions may not be enough to spare his £22 million record signing from having to have an operation.

Torres was substituted after an hour of Liverpool’s 3-1 Barclays Premier League defeat away to Fulham on Saturday, a decision that puzzled many fans and caused Ronnie Whelan, the former Anfield captain, to call for the manager’s head.

But it now seems clear that it was simply the latest example of Benítez’s desire to protect the forward from exacerbating the seriousness of his condition.

“I was surprised with the critics after the game because Fernando has had problems in the last month after the international games,†Benítez said. “We are trying to manage because he was close to having an operation.

“He is not comfortable. He has not got the power he had before, so we have to manage and try to protect him. He cannot play well if you keep pushing him. Maybe if you push him he will be injured for a long time.

“So, I am really surprised with the critics. When you talk about big names, people just analyse the names and not how the player is when he is on the pitch. He was not 100 per cent fit. We have to take Fernando to Lyons because we don’t have too many options.â€

Benítez already faces the prospect of Gerrard having to undergo groin surgery to correct a problem he suffered while on duty with England.

“Gerrard won’t travel to Lyons,†Benítez confirmed. “He has no chance. He is improving but we have to wait. He has had an injection but we have to wait two or three days and see how he reacts.

“Skrtel also has no chance. He has a small muscle problem. It’s not too big but he is feeling something.â€

At a time when Benítez’s position as Liverpool manager is being questioned like never before after six defeats in their past past seven games, his injury concerns are mounting.

The situation is so dire that Alberto Aquilani, the Italy midfield player, has been added to the squad despite not having fully recovered from illness, while Benítez has also been forced to call on David Ngog and Daniel Agger even though the pair are nursing slight knocks.

“Agger is improving — he will travel and we will then decide,†Benítez said. “He felt something in his back but it’s much better now. We have to wait and see how he reacts. Ngog is much better, so he could be available.â€

Benítez has taken the unusual step of naming a 20-man squad, with Stephen Darby, the 21-year-old right back who has never started a game for the club, included in case Glen Johnson fails to recover from the calf strain that has kept the England defender out of action since Liverpool’s victory over Manchester United nine days ago.

Uefa has also given the club special dispensation to promote Danny Ayala, the 18-year-old centre back, into the squad from their B-list.
[/quote]

Oh for the sake of fuck :'( So that would be Torres out for 3 weeks (if not a tad more) if he has to have an operation.

 

[Farkmaster]

Fuck, awful. So much of our first team is absolutely decimated.

Oh, and note to the "supporters". You should now change your position from "why did he take Torres off" and the wonderful denial of various injuries, to "He caused these injuries due to his selfish desire to win games".

 

[madmax]

IF this is true then i can certainly see why Rafa would like to nurse him till at least nthe next international break and time the surgery.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=36882.msg977585#msg977585 date=1257217184]
Fuck, awful. So much of our first team is absolutely decimated.

Oh, and note to the "supporters". You should now change your position from "why did he take Torres off" and the wonderful denial of various injuries, to "He caused these injuries due to his selfish desire to win games".
[/quote]

Rage's reply to this is notably absent, even though he's bumbling his way through the other threads calling Rafa a liar for leaving out N'Gog and co on Saturday, they're not really injured, he just doesn't want to win games.

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=36882.msg977585#msg977585 date=1257217184]
Fuck, awful. So much of our first team is absolutely decimated.

Oh, and note to the "supporters". You should now change your position from "why did he take Torres off" and the wonderful denial of various injuries, to "He caused these injuries due to his selfish desire to win games".
[/quote]

Given that 8 of the 10 players currently injured are suffering with muscle injuries it's fair to say it probably has less to do with bad luck and more to do with the wrong type or intensity of training.

 

[rage]

rafa is a liar. we'll see if n'gog, aurelio and agger miraculously recover. oh and someone please explain why we took yossi off? i've yet to come across an explanation that says anything other than he wanted to save him for wednesday night. he gave u the game on saturday, accept it. its not the first time he's done this and every time i see it done i consider it to be a greater act of cowardice.

if torres is looking like he may need an operation and rafa still risks him for wednesday then we can all see that torres is like a queen in a game of chess being sacrificed. usually a sign of desperation, on few occasions a tactical success. we'll know soon enough how this tuens out.

everyone knew we shouldn't go the season with one recognised striker - rafa should have prioritised this position when he foolishly got rid of keane without having a replacement. instead he used robbie keane as a pawn in his struggle with parry.

didn't rafa also hire the idiot from newcastle to look after training/injuries? are all these injuries a coincidence?

oh and mark sorry but i don't tend to post at 4 in the morning.

 

[Glock21]

[quote author=rage link=topic=36882.msg977604#msg977604 date=1257234426]
rafa is a liar. we'll see if n'gog, aurelio and agger miraculously recover. oh and someone please explain why we took yossi off? i've yet to come across an explanation that says anything other than he wanted to save him for wednesday night. he gave u the game on saturday, accept it. its not the first time he's done this and every time i see it done i consider it to be a greater act of cowardice.

if torres is looking like he may need an operation and rafa still risks him for wednesday then we can all see that torres is like a queen in a game of chess being sacrificed. usually a sign of desperation, on few occasions a tactical success. we'll know soon enough how this tuens out.

everyone knew we shouldn't go the season with one recognised striker - rafa should have prioritised this position when he foolishly got rid of keane without having a replacement. instead he used robbie keane as a pawn in his struggle with parry.

didn't rafa also hire the idiot from newcastle to look after training/injuries? are all these injuries a coincidence?

oh and mark sorry but i don't tend to post at 4 in the morning.

[/quote]

Rafael gave up on the league since the Sunderland defeat Rage. Its crystal clear. The blind support has to stop. The stubborn Rafael supporters should just take a fucking hard look at what Rafael has done this season. Rafael knows he has fucked up. Substitutions last week against Fulham shows. Benayoun was in disbelieve.

Rafael is too dependent on two players and he has bought wrongly in Aquilani and its all has gone wrong for him so fucking early in the season. Stubborn children here should realize that Rafael is not the man. 6 years and counting. Dare i say Houllier has won more than Rafael in 6 fucking years!!!

 

[Farkmaster]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=36882.msg977603#msg977603 date=1257233933]
[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=36882.msg977585#msg977585 date=1257217184]
Fuck, awful. So much of our first team is absolutely decimated.

Oh, and note to the "supporters". You should now change your position from "why did he take Torres off" and the wonderful denial of various injuries, to "He caused these injuries due to his selfish desire to win games".
[/quote]

Given that 8 of the 10 players currently injured are suffering with muscle injuries it's fair to say it probably has less to do with bad luck and more to do with the wrong type or intensity of training.

[/quote]

Oh, please. None of us is remotely qualified to speculate, even if we had the specifics, on the nature and cause of their injuries. We are given vague descriptions for these injuries and little else. "Muscle Injuries". That's about as medically lucid as "a knock". Would you advise weightlifting, pilates, or yoga?

I might also remind you that Gerrard and Torres were both injured on international duty.

Further, are you going to tell me injuries to the likes of Aurelio and Agger must be put down to training difficulties? Aurelio can injure himself breathing, and Agger has been plagued with injuries of late.

Rage, Rafa can't win with you, because whatever happens you just shift your polemic after the fact to suit the new available evidence. If some players are able to play on Wednesday, it's evidence that they weren't really injured, rather than him successfully timing their return. If, on the other hand, any of those same players get injured, you'll say he rushed them back.

If you aren't satisfied the players are injured, you decided it's a lie perpetrated by Rafa. If you are, then it's because Rafa brought in personnel that can't attend to their treatment.

You are so transparent.

 

[Oncy]

Lol@rage being ignored by 7 users now.
Tee Hee.

 

[manwithnoname]

Poor the Osama

 

[Jack D Rips]

[quote author=Glock link=topic=36882.msg977612#msg977612 date=1257235955]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36882.msg977604#msg977604 date=1257234426]
rafa is a liar. we'll see if n'gog, aurelio and agger miraculously recover. oh and someone please explain why we took yossi off? i've yet to come across an explanation that says anything other than he wanted to save him for wednesday night. he gave u the game on saturday, accept it. its not the first time he's done this and every time i see it done i consider it to be a greater act of cowardice.

if torres is looking like he may need an operation and rafa still risks him for wednesday then we can all see that torres is like a queen in a game of chess being sacrificed. usually a sign of desperation, on few occasions a tactical success. we'll know soon enough how this tuens out.

everyone knew we shouldn't go the season with one recognised striker - rafa should have prioritised this position when he foolishly got rid of keane without having a replacement. instead he used robbie keane as a pawn in his struggle with parry.

didn't rafa also hire the idiot from newcastle to look after training/injuries? are all these injuries a coincidence?

oh and mark sorry but i don't tend to post at 4 in the morning.

[/quote]

Rafael gave up on the league since the Sunderland defeat Rage. Its crystal clear. The blind support has to stop. The stubborn Rafael supporters should just take a fucking hard look at what Rafael has done this season. Rafael knows he has fucked up. Substitutions last week against Fulham shows. Benayoun was in disbelieve.

Rafael is too dependent on two players and he has bought wrongly in Aquilani and its all has gone wrong for him so fucking early in the season. Stubborn children here should realize that Rafael is not the man. 6 years and counting. Dare i say Houllier has won more than Rafael in 6 fucking years!!!


[/quote]

5 years Glock

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=36882.msg977621#msg977621 date=1257237977]
Lol@rage being ignored by 7 users now.
Tee Hee.
[/quote]

He may be on a crusade that is a bit one dimensional Andy, but I suspect that those using the ignore button just don't like the fact that the basis of his argument is becoming more and more credible.
Thank fuck society and politics don't have an ignore button.


regards

 

[gkmacca]

Vlad, that's like saying someone who wanders around the village dribbling and trying to get a ball to plop into a cup is now being proven a political sage because he's been shouting 'Education, monkey, gnah!' for thirty years as modern democracy struggles to find its Jeffersonian dynamic. Don't indulge a simplistic and smugly dogmatic ranter. Otherwise most of redcafe deserve plaudits, too.

 

[Y1]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=36882.msg977682#msg977682 date=1257245178]
Vlad, that's like saying someone who wanders around the village dribbling and trying to get a ball to plop into a cup is now being proven a political sage because he's been shouting 'Education, monkey, gnah!' for thirty years as modern democracy struggles to find its Jeffersonian dynamic. Don't indulge a simplistic and smugly dogmatic ranter. Otherwise most of redcafe deserve plaudits, too.
[/quote]

Agreed.