So... about that 4th spot

[Ryan]

Here's why we're getting some average results; we've got some average players.

We have too few world class players, hence we're reliant on the sane player winning us games out of nothing. Then when he doesn't do it, he's a shit finisher, a cheat, and a diver.

Look at Man City. World class players everywhere, and they're winning the games we're drawing. Until we have better players, we'll continue to get these results.

 

[Gary25]

Do you rate Bellamy, Ryan? Can't recall you commenting on him. Just wondering.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47257.msg1415483#msg1415483 date=1319323974]
Here's why we're getting some average results; we've got some average players.

We have too few world class players, hence we're reliant on the sane player winning us games out of nothing. Then when he doesn't do it, he's a shit finisher, a cheat, and a diver.

Look at Man City. World class players everywhere, and they're winning the games we're drawing. Until we have better players, we'll continue to get these results.
[/quote]

Comparing us to the richest club in the history of football is not valid -

Compare us to Manure who churn out victories (like Norwich H) when they don't have world class players everywhere, but have enough 'game changing' players to win most games (Young, Rooney, chicarito, Nani, Wellbeck etc). We only have, it seems, Suarez at the moment (Gerrard will be when he's fully fit)

 

[Ryan]

Look at the money we've spent and fucking wasted letall. Don't be stupid.

 

[RedZeppelin]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47257.msg1415483#msg1415483 date=1319323974]
Here's why we're getting some average results; we've got some average players.

We have too few world class players, hence we're reliant on the sane player winning us games out of nothing. Then when he doesn't do it, he's a shit finisher, a cheat, and a diver.

Look at Man City. World class players everywhere, and they're winning the games we're drawing. Until we have better players, we'll continue to get these results.
[/quote]

i agree with all that and it's why i am so flat at the moment , because the players we signed this summer were meant to get us there or at least the club believe they will . I mean can you see us going out and replacing alot of them so quickly ? No . So who knows how long it will be before we get those better players .

 

[dogboy]

[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=47257.msg1415284#msg1415284 date=1319309705]
Today has well and truly broken my erection.

We are fucking wank and so many things dont work. We look fucking hopeless in front of goal. After spending 100m we look a worse side than last season.
Today alone
Kuyt doesnt seem to have a position.
Downing is what we knew he was. Not very good.
Enrique and Johnson were both shit.
Suarez is a cunt. I dont like him at all. And he doesnt score enough goals.
We put Carroll on after we took off our wingers.
Henderson isnt very good.

Then overall
We shouldnt have sold Meireles.
We shouldnt have loaned Aquilani
The theory being they wouldnt play enough games.....behind who? Henderson and Downing? Adam? PLEASE!!

OH FUCK I COULD GO ON AND ON.
Im proper livid.
My WHOLE contention that we would win the league this year was based on Maxi and Meireles movement and creativity. We took that out of our team and we look shite.
I think the Suarez thing is whats really tipping me over the edge. He is such a fucking bellend and i dont get all this 'Yeah but hes our bellend' well i tell you what I might buy into that if he was a halfway decent striker but he isnt, and playing his as a loan frontman is making me feel like fucking killing everyone I know.

Andy Carroll should have played today. Downing should have played on the left and Maxi on the right Suarez in behind with Adam and Gerrard. It was a perfect opportunity to show what we bought this unit for, what we spent this 100 million on designing. But no. Same fucking slow unambitious ponderous no scoring shite.
[/quote]

 

[dogboy]

Sorry Oncy, you were relying on Maxi and Merieles to win the league? Seriously????

 

[Red Mullet]

[quote author=dogboy link=topic=47257.msg1415490#msg1415490 date=1319325383]
Sorry Oncy, you were relying on Maxi and Merieles to win the league? Seriously? ???
[/quote]


:laugh:

 

[Oncy]

[quote author=dogboy link=topic=47257.msg1415490#msg1415490 date=1319325383]
Sorry Oncy, you were relying on Maxi and Merieles to win the league? Seriously????
[/quote]Along with Suarez, Gerrard, Carroll, Aquilani and whatever talent we invested in this summer yes.
However we didnt invest in ANY talent sold Aquilani and Meireles and dropped Maxi and Carroll.

 

[LarryHagman]

Meireles aside, it's not really about whose not playing for me. Maxi, whilst enjoying a few good games last year, is hit and miss. I agree, he may be worth a shot but his absence doesn't really cost us. Aqua's move has cost us zero because, by and large, that's what he provided whilst he was here. To say we would be better if he was here is pure speculation, he would probably be sat in the stand with a feigned injury. And I'm happy to see Carroll benched as the footy we play when he is, is much better.
The Meireles thing is a bit baffling though. Not only did he look good last year, he looked good this, replacing Carroll etc. the movement, link up play, was great. The fact that he's gone to a direct rival and looked to be one of their better, more creative players is a bit galling.
Kenny plays his players coz he spent the money. What else do you expect him to do? He's got to back his own. But, he has be judged on that like anyone else.

I don't know if Arsenal will catch us soon but, as I mentioned last week, I expect the chase for 4th to be tight between us, Arse & Spurs. If I had to gamble, I'd go with Spurs.

And I disgaree with Keni in the OP, I don't think there are plenty of decent team in the division, anyone with top 4 aspirations should be easily dispatching about 75% of this League at home, inc Norwich (no offence Norwich).

 

[Vlads Quiff]

Just to get things in perspective. We did not miss Lucas at all. We did not miss anyone holding. Gerrard was not great but very little came through the middle and the midfield created loads of chances, many of which we should have stuck away. The goal came from down the left and Pepe should have done better. There were very few daft free kicks given away, certainly less than when LL is there.
Same team next time, just put in Carroll for Kuyt, thanks Kenny

Vlads Quiff - aged 56 and a half


regards

 

[LeTallecWiz]

we'd have won with Lucas though Vlad. He's a genuinely beautiful human being, and that's what we were missing today.

 

[MaBigTip]

[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=47257.msg1415496#msg1415496 date=1319327082]
And I'm happy to see Carroll benched as the footy we play when he is, is much better.
[/quote]

I don't give a shit if our footy is beautiful. I want to win and Andy Carroll has helped us win consistently enough to be in our team almost every week.


Carroll
Bellamy Suarez Downing

Adam Gerrard

Enrique Skretl Coates Kelly

Or some close variation of that. I want Carroll and Suarez together up front. I want Gerrard and Adam in the midfield, its fine if it is a midfield 3. And as many games as you can put him in get Bellamy in there. Also Johnson should never play RB for us again, RW, LB or nothing.

Its fine if you still feel Carra needs to be in there every game to tell the other players what to do. But alls I know is Coates stops that goal today, and Reina feels much more comfortable with crosses coming in if Coates is in there.

 

[Fabio]

We weren't overly bothered in the midfield granted Vlad, but the gap between gerrard/ Adam and kuyt/ Suarez was enormous. If Lucas was in the squad then they could have been closer and been involved on more attacks

Hell, even if Henderson was ahead of gerrard/ Adam we would have looked much better

 

[mark1975]

Agreed, and I hate to keep banging on about it, but whether Lucas is there or not, we've been leaving a fucking big gap infront of the defence all season, Saha had the run of it against Everton, constantly picking the ball up there with no one covering and protecting the back four, Norwich had loads of pot shots from the same position yesterday. We sorely miss a natural defensive midfielder at times, against a decent side we'll get found out. That said, we played reasonably well but have this stupid tendency to over elaborate, and Reina fucked up, no two ways about it.

 

[RolandG]

At the minute, we're not consistent or good enough for that coveted 4th spot. On our day we can beat anyone but those days are too few and far between.

 

[spider-Neil]

I think we will challenge for 4th right until may but I don't think we'll get it. I think spurs will be more consistent and have more match winners. we look like we're going to drop too many silly points.

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47257.msg1415428#msg1415428 date=1319317548]
Gerrard and Adam need to sort which one of them pressures the attackers and which goes forward to help. So many fucking times they both backed off or refused to go forward.

Fuck the haters. We missed Lucas
[/quote]

When you have 60% possession and have 29 attempts on goal, it's fair to say there probably wasn't too much wrong with the midfield.

Lucas would have added precisely nothing out there yesterday.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=47257.msg1415641#msg1415641 date=1319366898]
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47257.msg1415428#msg1415428 date=1319317548]
Gerrard and Adam need to sort which one of them pressures the attackers and which goes forward to help. So many fucking times they both backed off or refused to go forward.

Fuck the haters. We missed Lucas
[/quote]

When you have 60% possession and have 29 attempts on goal, it's fair to say there probably wasn't too much wrong with the midfield.

Lucas would have added precisely nothing out there yesterday.
[/quote]

You just don't get it Ross - we'd have won with Lucas. That's all that matters.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=47257.msg1415641#msg1415641 date=1319366898]
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47257.msg1415428#msg1415428 date=1319317548]
Gerrard and Adam need to sort which one of them pressures the attackers and which goes forward to help. So many fucking times they both backed off or refused to go forward.

Fuck the haters. We missed Lucas
[/quote]

When you have 60% possession and have 29 attempts on goal, it's fair to say there probably wasn't too much wrong with the midfield.

Lucas would have added precisely nothing out there yesterday.
[/quote]

precisely

 

[Fabio]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=47257.msg1415649#msg1415649 date=1319367356]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=47257.msg1415641#msg1415641 date=1319366898]
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47257.msg1415428#msg1415428 date=1319317548]
Gerrard and Adam need to sort which one of them pressures the attackers and which goes forward to help. So many fucking times they both backed off or refused to go forward.

Fuck the haters. We missed Lucas
[/quote]

When you have 60% possession and have 29 attempts on goal, it's fair to say there probably wasn't too much wrong with the midfield.

Lucas would have added precisely nothing out there yesterday.
[/quote]

precisely
[/quote]

and? Possession means precisely fuck all. Its what you do with the ball. Suarez created 12 chances on his pissing own, the others fell to the wingers mainly. There was no drive or movement from gerrard and adam. They seemed hesistant to bomb forward or close down.

I'm sorry, lucas isn't the greatest DM in the world, but at least he gives gerrard license to roam, something we lacked badly yesterday

 

[mark1975]

I think that was the point they were making Fabs. We need a goalscorer, arguing the toss about the function of the midfield is neither here nor there when the chances are being created anyway. I do think we need more protection defensively but offensively, well we created nearly 30 chances but couldn't convert. That's not because the players aren't in the positions, it's because they're not finding the back of the net.

 

[Woland]

[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47257.msg1415652#msg1415652 date=1319367604]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=47257.msg1415649#msg1415649 date=1319367356]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=47257.msg1415641#msg1415641 date=1319366898]
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47257.msg1415428#msg1415428 date=1319317548]
Gerrard and Adam need to sort which one of them pressures the attackers and which goes forward to help. So many fucking times they both backed off or refused to go forward.

Fuck the haters. We missed Lucas
[/quote]

When you have 60% possession and have 29 attempts on goal, it's fair to say there probably wasn't too much wrong with the midfield.

Lucas would have added precisely nothing out there yesterday.
[/quote]

precisely
[/quote]

and? Possession means precisely fuck all. Its what you do with the ball. Suarez created 12 chances on his pissing own, the others fell to the wingers mainly. There was no drive or movement from gerrard and adam. They seemed hesistant to bomb forward or close down.

I'm sorry, lucas isn't the greatest DM in the world, but at least he gives gerrard license to roam, something we lacked badly yesterday
[/quote]

We didn't have Gerrard for months but now his position is the problem? He did a far better job of DM than Lucas manages both in the second half last week and yesterday.

 

[Fabio]

For me its gerrard or adam. Not both.

We do need a better DM, but we need someone to link the attack too. Near enough everything was passed to the wings or suarez had to come deep to get the ball. Either play suarez deep and carroll up top, or play henderson behind suarez.

Thats all my point is. We'll then have more bodies running in to the box from crosses (which seems to be a problem for us year on year), and have options for attack, rather than pass to the wingers.

 

[Oncy]

I think we missed Lucas too. The number of times they picked the ball up between midfield and defense was mental. I think id like to see
Reina
Enrique
Skrtel
Carragher
Johnson

Lucas
Gerrard
Suarez

Maxi
Carroll
Bellamy

Or
Reina
Enrique
Skrtel
Carragher
Johnson

Downing
Gerrard
Lucas
Maxi

Suarez

Carroll.

Or even
Reina
Enrique
Skrtel
Carragher
Johnson

Lucas
Adam

Suarez
Gerrard
Maxi

Carroll.

Basically Carroll up front. HELPING suarez.

 

[Fabio]

I've wanted the third formation for while Andy. Originally with downing in it...but he's not set much alight so far so bring maxi back

 

[robinhood]

[quote author=Shelvey link=topic=47257.msg1415521#msg1415521 date=1319337394]
Carroll
Bellamy Suarez Downing

Adam Gerrard
[/quote]



I hope we see this soon.

 

[King Binny]

So much so for Arsenal's worst start for 58 years and our best start in 17 years. We lead them by 2 points at the moment. :-[

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47257.msg1415652#msg1415652 date=1319367604]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=47257.msg1415649#msg1415649 date=1319367356]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=47257.msg1415641#msg1415641 date=1319366898]
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47257.msg1415428#msg1415428 date=1319317548]
Gerrard and Adam need to sort which one of them pressures the attackers and which goes forward to help. So many fucking times they both backed off or refused to go forward.

Fuck the haters. We missed Lucas
[/quote]

When you have 60% possession and have 29 attempts on goal, it's fair to say there probably wasn't too much wrong with the midfield.

Lucas would have added precisely nothing out there yesterday.
[/quote]

precisely
[/quote]

and? Possession means precisely fuck all. Its what you do with the ball. Suarez created 12 chances on his pissing own, the others fell to the wingers mainly. There was no drive or movement from gerrard and adam. They seemed hesistant to bomb forward or close down.

I'm sorry, lucas isn't the greatest DM in the world, but at least he gives gerrard license to roam, something we lacked badly yesterday
[/quote]

You're right it is what we do with the ball that matters, Gerrard and Adam use the ball much better than Lucas. hence why he would have been pointless yesterday (even more so than usual)

 

[keniget]

I don't think our midfield was great yesterday but it wasn't our problem and it's a little pointless to focus on it.

The problem, as has been said, was atrocious finishing, awful substitutions and worst of all plain 'ol average players.

I am glad this thread has become a place of misery. The 6-1 drubbing of Utd was amusing, but ultimately just showed us how far off we are. Poo.

More misery please.