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Liverpool vs Everton. Tuesday, 28th January, 20.00

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Rosco said:
I understand what he's saying, but where I'm at is if you look around the world at other sports you'll see being 6'3 doesn't mean you're not agile.

And that's mainly because from what I can see football treats its players as endurance athletes - and there are very few tall endurance athletes - like marathon runners essentially.

Whether that is the best approach to it is questionable in my book.
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The NBA is a perfect example. Arguably the most physically taxing major sport out there, and a large number of the players are both extremely tall and agile.

You'd imagine if the same athletes put in the same amount of training into being a FB, they would still be wildly successful. It's just a matter that the majority of physically gifted athletes don't end up playing FB, it's the least essential position.
 
Frogfish said:
I hope this is right (and I believe that 'Bookies are rarely wrong' even more now) :

Liverpool 4/5
Draw 11/4
Everton 16/5

The usual pessimism 6CM is infamous for should see a few of you get on Everton pronto !
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Guilty as charged, Everton are nearly 4/1 on Betfair and that's a crazy price for 2 such evenly matched teams. I hope I'm wrong and we stuff the bastards but IMO Everton are a 11/4 shot and I've taken the value. I'm on a bit of a winning streak at the moment with the betting too so it doesn't augur well for us.
 
red_maradona said:
It is that time of month again? I'm posing a question about an area of weakness, I don't have the answers Sherlock, but last time I checked flanno is a defender and sterling has shown more promise as a fullback this season then Kelly. How toy conclude this means 11 attackers is beyond me.
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I'm just bored of people like you ignoring the blatant weakness of our ability to not concede or suggesting that the solution is to play a winger in defence.

If you can't see the flaw in that, then I'm not going to bother.

As for the 11 attackers jibe, this was simple me exaggerating to make a point. You don't seem to appreciate the issues we have at FB and CM if you think the solution is to play attacker players in defensive positions.
 
Whirly said:
The NBA is a perfect example. Arguably the most physically taxing major sport out there, and a large number of the players are both extremely tall and agile.

You'd imagine if the same athletes put in the same amount of training into being a FB, they would still be wildly successful. It's just a matter that the majority of physically gifted athletes don't end up playing FB, it's the least essential position.
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I am stunned Whirly, too stunned to continue the debate but I think the majority of posters would disagree with the notion that very tall people can become "wildly successful" at full back with training.
 
I'm bricking it. Must win game and we're probably without Allen which means we're horribly short on midfielders.
Still, as Ryan said, this game will be won all over the pitch not just in midfield. When we beat them 3-0 at Anfield our central midfield was Spearing and Gerrard.

Cant wait for the game to start but at the same time I want it to be over. Strange feeling.
 
I would think that the reason that there aren't tall full backs is because from a young age, the taller players are put into the centre, and the smaller players out wide, so that's where they're used to playing. It's nothing to do with where their talents lie(if you discount height as a talent).

I can't see a reason why you couldn't have a taller full back.
 
Gerry_A_Trick said:
I would think that the reason that there aren't tall full backs is because from a young age, the taller players are put into the centre, and the smaller players out wide, so that's where they're used to playing. It's nothing to do with where their talents lie(if you discount height as a talent).

I can't see a reason why you couldn't have a taller full back.
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Spot on imo. If you're tall in England you're a striker or a centre back. Simple as that.

If you're shite at footy you're in goal.
 
Gerry_A_Trick said:
I would think that the reason that there aren't tall full backs is because from a young age, the taller players are put into the centre, and the smaller players out wide, so that's where they're used to playing. It's nothing to do with where their talents lie(if you discount height as a talent).

I can't see a reason why you couldn't have a taller full back.
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I think more likely what happens is what happened to me when I became manager of a local team..............

The right back was a 6'2" gangly 18 year old who was decent on the ball, read the game very well but regularly got skinned on the outside by fast wingers. Within a couple of games I told him he was playing CB from now on, he was very unhappy and said he couldn't play CB because he was shite in the air. I told him so was Alan Hansen but it didn't stop him becoming the best British CB ever. I put him at centre back/sweeper beside another tall guy who COULD head the ball and they were brilliant together and he went on to captain Cambridge University 1st team at CB.

So this kid played junior football and started senior football at right back without anyone putting him in the centre and the only reason I did was because wasn't a particularly good right back but had talent.

I think with junior players the first instinct is not necessarily putting the taller players at CB but putting the best headers there; if they're tall AND good in the air that's a huge bonus.
 
Pesam said:
I am stunned Whirly, too stunned to continue the debate but I think the majority of posters would disagree with the notion that very tall people can become "wildly successful" at full back with training.
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Stunned? Well then.

Tall athletes who are agile typically either become powerful attackers or play a different sport because that's where their natural talents are best used. A good fullback isn't as valuable as a good striker, so if you could pick one or the other you would mold a player to be in a position of higher value to the club.

It's not that being tall holds back modern fullbacks, it's that fullbacks are typically either converted CBs or wingers, and the physically larger and more athletic players play in higher value positions.
 
Whirly said:
Stunned? Well then.

Tall athletes who are agile typically either become powerful attackers or play a different sport because that's where their natural talents are best used. A good fullback isn't as valuable as a good striker, so if you could pick one or the other you would mold a player to be in a position of higher value to the club.

It's not that being tall holds back modern fullbacks, it's that fullbacks are typically either converted CBs or wingers, and the physically larger and more athletic players play in higher value positions.
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There are a ton of 'big' fullbacks.

This is a really weird discussion you guys are having.
 
Whirly said:
Stunned? Well then.

Tall athletes who are agile typically either become powerful attackers or play a different sport because that's where their natural talents are best used. A good fullback isn't as valuable as a good striker, so if you could pick one or the other you would mold a player to be in a position of higher value to the club.

It's not that being tall holds back modern fullbacks, it's that fullbacks are typically either converted CBs or wingers, and the physically larger and more athletic players play in higher value positions.
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Couldn't disagree more with any of your points Whirly but honestly we're so far apart on this I don't see the point in continuing the debate; especially in a match-day thread and while I'm supposedly quite busy today. We'll just have to disagree and accept the fact you're probably in the wrong ;-)
 
keniget said:
There are a ton of 'big' fullbacks.

This is a really weird discussion you guys are having.
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There are 184 full backs playing in the top 4 divisions at present and I can't think of more than a couple who might be 6'3" or taller.
 
Pesam said:
There are 184 full backs playing in the top 4 divisions at present and I can't think of more than a couple who might be 6'2" or taller.
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Well, I didn't go back through the thread to establish what qualifies as being "tall".

Ivanovic, Smalling, Kolarov, Chiellini are a few that are over 6'2.

I would say that if a player is over 6ft then he can be classed as "physically larger" and there are loads more examples in that bracket. And more still that are 5'10 and above who you can still argue no longer fit the Alves / Lahm type mould.
 
keniget said:
Well, I didn't go back through the thread to establish what qualifies as being "tall".

Ivanovic, Smalling, Kolarov, Chiellini are a few that are over 6'2.

I would say that if a player is over 6ft then he can be classed as "physically larger" and there are loads more examples in that bracket. And more still that are 5'10 and above who you can still argue no longer fit the Alves / Lahm type mould.
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Physically larger yes but the tall gangly types like Kelly are not suited to full back. Ridgewell does a good job at full back too and he's 6'2" but I honestly think that 6'2" is not ideal for a full back and that's why there's so few of 'em and pratically none taller.

BTW United fans do not rate Smalling as a full back.
 
Hansern said:
Chiellini is a cb but yeah there arent many full backs over 6"2.
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He's played LB enough times to be considered.

I know a couple of them are also CBs as well but they have played fullback quite a lot.

As for Kelly, I think he showed a lot of promise when he broke though. He was pacey, athletic and there was no real issue with being gangly. But yeah, we all saw him moving over to CB at some point.
 
If you guys want to continue to measure full backs it's prob best you don't do it in the match build up thread, & maybe start a separate thread for it.
 
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