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Is nobody going to say it?

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[quote author=CAD link=topic=48657.msg1481961#msg1481961 date=1329081738]
[quote author=StevieM link=topic=48657.msg1481957#msg1481957 date=1329081056]
The point is that Suarez shouldn't of obliged that bitter old cunt and given him something to moan about.
[/quote]

Of course it's a valid point. With all the PC going around how couldnt it be?

But some people are losing perspective. REALLY losing it. Fergie calling this incident a disgrace, with the above mentioned incidents in mind, is laughable. Some people are acting like Suarez has done a Cantona or worse?! Hard to see how these people can call themselves fans of LFC and support that twofaced fucker Fergie and his hilarious disgrace statement. That's imo is far worse than a missing handshake.
[/quote]

This
 
Luis Suárez must show Liverpool he is worth the trouble of keeping him
The Uruguayan striker brought shame on the club. If he does not show a professional and dignified response he should be sold

Andy Hunter
guardian.co.uk, Sunday 12 February 2012 18.54 GMT

All apologies from Liverpool and not before time, but the issue raised in anger by Sir Alex Ferguson at Old Trafford on Saturday remains one that confronts Kenny Dalglish and Fenway Sports Group, the club's owners, in the cold light of a shameful day. The Anfield hierarchy has to consider washing its hands completely of Luis Suárez.

It is not the Manchester United manager's place to tell Liverpool that their £22.8m striker should never play for the club again following his refusal to shake the hand of Patrice Evra and, as his handling of Eric Cantona shows, no club gives up on a talented problem lightly. When a club is also four points off the final Champions League qualifying place and the majority of its £110m recruitment drive over the past 12 months has failed to justify the expense, the importance of the finest purchase is magnified. But not to the extent, as Suárez demonstrated against United, where the player believes himself more important than his club or manager.

Until Sunday morning, when the condemnation rose higher and the penny dropped at Liverpool, Suárez has been overindulged, erroneously defended and absolved from the responsibility of his actions ever since he called Evra "negro" at Anfield last October. It was shocking to witness the Uruguayan refuse the Frenchman's hand. Less so, however, when consideration is given to how Liverpool and Dalglish, as recently as last Monday in the manager's case, have encouraged the portrayal of Suárez as the innocent victim throughout this depressing episode.

He repaid them by bringing shame on the club and embarrassing one of the most revered names in Liverpool's history. Dalglish was still heading for his seat in the dugout at Old Trafford when the handshakes took place, or did not in the case of Suárez, Evra and Rio Ferdinand. The striker had assured him there would not be an issue prior to last week's statement that read: "I know he will shake the hand of Patrice Evra." The byproduct was that toe-curling interview with Sky's Geoff Shreeves, one that reflected the manager's position on the entire saga, and subsequent admission from Dalglish that his conduct was not befitting a Liverpool manager. Suárez had landed him in it.

At what point do Dalglish, John W Henry and Tom Werner, Liverpool's principal owner and chairman respectively, decide the baggage outweighs the goods with Suárez? Ferguson thinks that point has arrived and the question must have crossed the minds of the US owners as they formulated a response with its employees on Merseyside on Sunday.

Henry and co awoke to a new development in the Suárez controversy on Sunday morning: the criticism was on their doorstep. The Boston Herald carried a report condemning Liverpool and an article in the New York Times opened with the line: "If the Fenway Sports Group is to be the responsible team owner in soccer that it has proved to be in baseball, it needs to get hold of Liverpool, its club in England's Premier League, and repair its global image fast."

A positive if belated step has been taken and it now falls to Suárez to present a convincing argument to remain a Liverpool player over the final months of the season, however antiquated that may seem in the days of absolute player power. A professional, dignified response and Liverpool will have no reservations that he is worth the trouble. Anything less – and his public apology is only the start – any more problems for Dalglish, the owners, those working tirelessly behind the scenes to protect the club's reputation and closely with the Anthony Walker Foundation plus other anti-racism groups, and he should be sold at the earliest opportunity.
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=48657.msg1#msg1 date=1329095247]
Luis Suárez must show Liverpool he is worth the trouble of keeping him
The Uruguayan striker brought shame on the club. If he does not show a professional and dignified response he should be sold

Andy Hunter
guardian.co.uk, Sunday 12 February 2012 18.54 GMT

All apologies from Liverpool and not before time, but the issue raised in anger by Sir Alex Ferguson at Old Trafford on Saturday remains one that confronts Kenny Dalglish and Fenway Sports Group, the club's owners, in the cold light of a shameful day. The Anfield hierarchy has to consider washing its hands completely of Luis Suárez.

It is not the Manchester United manager's place to tell Liverpool that their £22.8m striker should never play for the club again following his refusal to shake the hand of Patrice Evra and, as his handling of Eric Cantona shows, no club gives up on a talented problem lightly. When a club is also four points off the final Champions League qualifying place and the majority of its £110m recruitment drive over the past 12 months has failed to justify the expense, the importance of the finest purchase is magnified. But not to the extent, as Suárez demonstrated against United, where the player believes himself more important than his club or manager.

Until Sunday morning, when the condemnation rose higher and the penny dropped at Liverpool, Suárez has been overindulged, erroneously defended and absolved from the responsibility of his actions ever since he called Evra "negro" at Anfield last October. It was shocking to witness the Uruguayan refuse the Frenchman's hand. Less so, however, when consideration is given to how Liverpool and Dalglish, as recently as last Monday in the manager's case, have encouraged the portrayal of Suárez as the innocent victim throughout this depressing episode.

He repaid them by bringing shame on the club and embarrassing one of the most revered names in Liverpool's history. Dalglish was still heading for his seat in the dugout at Old Trafford when the handshakes took place, or did not in the case of Suárez, Evra and Rio Ferdinand. The striker had assured him there would not be an issue prior to last week's statement that read: "I know he will shake the hand of Patrice Evra." The byproduct was that toe-curling interview with Sky's Geoff Shreeves, one that reflected the manager's position on the entire saga, and subsequent admission from Dalglish that his conduct was not befitting a Liverpool manager. Suárez had landed him in it.

At what point do Dalglish, John W Henry and Tom Werner, Liverpool's principal owner and chairman respectively, decide the baggage outweighs the goods with Suárez? Ferguson thinks that point has arrived and the question must have crossed the minds of the US owners as they formulated a response with its employees on Merseyside on Sunday.

Henry and co awoke to a new development in the Suárez controversy on Sunday morning: the criticism was on their doorstep. The Boston Herald carried a report condemning Liverpool and an article in the New York Times opened with the line: "If the Fenway Sports Group is to be the responsible team owner in soccer that it has proved to be in baseball, it needs to get hold of Liverpool, its club in England's Premier League, and repair its global image fast."

A positive if belated step has been taken and it now falls to Suárez to present a convincing argument to remain a Liverpool player over the final months of the season, however antiquated that may seem in the days of absolute player power. A professional, dignified response and Liverpool will have no reservations that he is worth the trouble. Anything less – and his public apology is only the start – any more problems for Dalglish, the owners, those working tirelessly behind the scenes to protect the club's reputation and closely with the Anthony Walker Foundation plus other anti-racism groups, and he should be sold at the earliest opportunity.
[/quote]
My arse.
 
At what point do Dalglish, John W Henry and Tom Werner, Liverpool's principal owner and chairman respectively, decide the baggage outweighs the goods with Suárez? Ferguson thinks that point has arrived

This is frightening. Not only that Ferguson intervine and say those words, but that they actually are picked up by everyone and acknowledge that he has his say on the matter. he is a paraniod psykopat and still he is given a green light to dictate media and a lot of other blind followers. Fucking hell.
 
The issue here is not whether or not Fergie thinks he should play for us its an issue of why he selfishly sandbagged a manager and set of owners that has stood behind him every step of the way and defended him beyond any reasonable expectation, in the face of such loyalty he fucks Kenny over and leaves him open to a savaging in the press over an issue that should have been buried
 
[quote author=RedStar link=topic=48657.msg1482101#msg1482101 date=1329121465]
The issue here is not whether or not Fergie thinks he should play for us its an issue of why he selfishly sandbagged a manager and set of owners that has stood behind him every step of the way and defended him beyond any reasonable expectation, in the face of such loyalty he fucks Kenny over and leaves him open to a savaging in the press over an issue that should have been buried
[/quote]

Thats not my issue at all. maybe your issue, but not mine. To me he stood up for something he believed in, and rightly so. That it pisse dFergie even more up makes it even better. Fergie shouldn't set our agenda even if him, media, FA and you think so.
 
So who thinks Suarez will be gone in the summer? 🙁

I'd like to think despite all this mess, he has a future at LFC. He's a great player and we need all the great players we can get.
 
I have seen and heard nothing except universal condemnation of Liverpool FC and Suarez in the print and broadast media. With the very honourable exception of John Barnes.

This immense heap of journalistic odium is all posited on the assumption that the goalmouth incident involving Evra and Suarez took place in the way that Evra and Ferguson claim that it took place.

All the journalists refer to Suarez as having been "convicted" or "found guilty" of racial abuse but it is really inappropriate to use these terms when he merely ended up on the wrong side of a very flawed FA inquiry which used methods that would never be allowed in an English court, and came to its conclusions on the balance of probabilities and the value judgement that Evra was a reliable witness whereas Suarez wasn't. None of this would be acceptable as a part of a fair legal procedure.

Until this enquiry is re-visited by fair-minded people whose opinions matter, this nasty affair will continue to rankle.
 
While I don't doubt that most observers have little to no regard for the Independent Commission, you're absolutely wrong about its "methods be[ing] never allowed in an English court, and came to its conclusions on the balance of probabilities and the value judgment that Evra was a reliable witness whereas Suarez wasn't."
 
*AMAZING* SUAREZ VS MAN UTD (ANFIELD UNSEEN FOOTAGE) 2011

This is the reason Fergie wants rid of him. He humiliated the old fucker big time, and that doesn't go unpusnished. There have been refs humilating him by not give him the favour in a 50/50 or so, and they dont ref Man U games anymore. They have been on the poor end of characteristic killings, and are off his neck. Luis humiliated him to the extent that he ddn't know what team to send out on his next anfield visit, and more accidentally than not I guess, Evra was caught in a position where he either had to lie about whats been said, or make Fergie look like a fool for dragging him to the ref. What would you have done? Evra was forced to stick to his lie and the the rest is a shame. In the meantime plenty of people are being shafted up the arse by Fergie, who dictates the agenda for everyone... Hope it feels good to ride the old fucker!"
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=48657.msg1482071#msg1482071 date=1329093076]
[quote author=Niall K link=topic=48657.msg1482066#msg1482066 date=1329091313]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=48657.msg1482065#msg1482065 date=1329090954]
[quote author=Niall K link=topic=48657.msg1482055#msg1482055 date=1329089408]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=48657.msg1481995#msg1481995 date=1329084986]
Ha, smug. Cheers Sheik btw.
[/quote]

Thanks. I stuck up for you too you prick
[/quote]

I ain't into sharing.
[/quote]

You can have him mate
[/quote]

Ha! Seriousl, apologise i didn't notice your comments.

And anyone else's for that matter.
[/quote]

It's cool. I was only messing about
 
[quote author=Portly link=topic=48657.msg1482151#msg1482151 date=1329129718]
I have seen and heard nothing except universal condemnation of Liverpool FC and Suarez in the print and broadast media. With the very honourable exception of John Barnes.

This immense heap of journalistic odium is all posited on the assumption that the goalmouth incident involving Evra and Suarez took place in the way that Evra and Ferguson claim that it took place.

All the journalists refer to Suarez as having been "convicted" or "found guilty" of racial abuse but it is really inappropriate to use these terms when he merely ended up on the wrong side of a very flawed FA inquiry which used methods that would never be allowed in an English court, and came to its conclusions on the balance of probabilities and the value judgement that Evra was a reliable witness whereas Suarez wasn't. None of this would be acceptable as a part of a fair legal procedure.

Until this enquiry is re-visited by fair-minded people whose opinions matter, this nasty affair will continue to rankle.
[/quote]

Portly I suggest you go down and sit in the Courts for a while and view proceedings. Everything you listed is standard practice in civil cases.
 
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48657.msg1482194#msg1482194 date=1329131232]
Portly I suggest you go down and sit in the Courts for a while and view proceedings. Everything you listed is standard practice in civil cases.
[/quote]

Having been through a divorce many years ago, I am aware that there is scope for a lot of legal misbehaviour and unproven tittle-tattle is listened to by judges and taken into account. However, the difference between the FA inquiry and a civil court is that in a civil court, if a case goes unfairly against you, you normally have a right to appeal to another court, which you are entitled to expect will come at the previous decision impartally. This of course would not have been the case had Liverpool appealed against the FA decision.

And of course, had Merseyside Police received a complaint from a member and charged Suarez in the same way John Terry was, the subsequent proceedings would have not been in civil law, but criminal law where the standards of evidence are much higher.
 
Go sit in on any non-league football match in the country, you will find that scoring goals is standard practice. But does that make Jamie Vardy of Fleetwood Town a comparable goalscorer to Wayne Rooney?

If you actually sat down and read the report, the "balance of probabilities" was assessed by a non-league equivalent of civil court proceedings. As I said to you in the old thread that sunny buried in a hole in the desert, you should simply trust that dantes knows more about mathematics and how to calculate probabilities than a QC can even begin to imagine.
 
[quote author=monsieurdantes link=topic=48657.msg1482267#msg1482267 date=1329134241]
Go sit in on any non-league football match in the country, you will find that scoring goals is standard practice. But does that make Jamie Vardy of Fleetwood Town a comparable goalscorer to Wayne Rooney?

If you actually sat down and read the report, the "balance of probabilities" was assessed by a non-league equivalent of civil court proceedings. As I said to you in the old thread that sunny buried in a hole in the desert, you should simply trust that dantes knows more about mathematics and how to calculate probabilities than a QC can even begin to imagine.
[/quote]

Unfortunately it's a legal test, not a mathematical one.
 
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48657.msg1482273#msg1482273 date=1329135079]
[quote author=monsieurdantes link=topic=48657.msg1482267#msg1482267 date=1329134241]
Go sit in on any non-league football match in the country, you will find that scoring goals is standard practice. But does that make Jamie Vardy of Fleetwood Town a comparable goalscorer to Wayne Rooney?

If you actually sat down and read the report, the "balance of probabilities" was assessed by a non-league equivalent of civil court proceedings. As I said to you in the old thread that sunny buried in a hole in the desert, you should simply trust that dantes knows more about mathematics and how to calculate probabilities than a QC can even begin to imagine.
[/quote]

Unfortunately it's a legal test, not a mathematical one.
[/quote]

Oh, really?

There is no authoritative or exhaustive list of these tests, and different judges make
different uses of, and place different emphases on, the available tests.

...blah blah blah....

We shall say a little about four of these tests: demeanour, inconsistency, credit and
probability.

...blah blah blah...

I won't paste the whole thing, god forbid you pity me for wasting more time. But in essense by legal test, you mean a test where the student is allowed to turn up to the exam, write his own questions, and then answer them. Is this standard practice in civil courts? No, it is not. The legal tests are applied according to what a judge deems is fair and appropriate. The FA's commission applied these tests according to what would allow them to find Suarez guilty. The fact they are legal tests, does not mean what they did is legal.
 
What a judge deems as "fair or appropriate" is not a subjective matter or down to his opinion. It is actually objective, given that the judge is expected to know the law and be impartial. You don't get to arbritarily decide how to weigh evidence. All you get to do is follow a pre-existing judgement in a related case. Or failing that, you need to make a fair choice that does not infringe upon the rights of either party. And either way, this is very mathematical because the judge in theory has no choice. He can only make the right decision. Also the judge has a relatively simple mind, which is easy to predict, and easy to convert into mathematical relationships based on all the factors I just mentioned.

The reason you are going to lose this argument is because the FA commission infringed the rights of Suarez. They racially discriminated against him based upon the definition of racism given by the UN. So you can't hide behind the notion of a "legal test" and expect that dantes won't find the correct angle from which to assassinate you from.
 
At risk of belabouring the point, Courts get get their estimation of evidence wrong a lot of the time, far more often than most on this forum seem to think. It's an unavoidable risk in our adversarial litigation process, because Tribunals (such as the Independent Commission) and the Courts only hear the evidence presented by the parties, in the manner so chosen by the lawyers. It really boils down to your lawyer persuading the Tribunal or Court. The truth of what happened is quite irrelevant, only that at closing address, the Tribunal or Court is left with the impression that you're probably right (in a civil case) or not guilty beyond a reasonable doubt (in a criminal proceeding). It's why people do get convicted wrongly, and allegedly guilty people are found innocent all the time (yes, even with a higher standard of proof). It's not mathematical, it's really quite human.

For this reason, I always thought an appeal from the decision of the Independent Commission was untenable. Because at appeal, the test changes to one from discharging the onus of proof on the balance of probabilities, to whether the result was so manifestly perverse. I think I could say given the evidence, the result was improbable, but perverse? It's a damn high hurdle to clear. Appellate Courts have always been loathe to make that kind of finding. I think the fact that Suarez chose not to pursue an appeal after advice from his lawyers suggest that he's received very similar advice.
 
REFEREE Phil Dowd took the decision to reverse the protocol for the pre-match handshakes when Liverpool FC faced Manchester United at Old Trafford last Saturday.

As the away team the Reds should have remained still as United walked down the line to welcome the visitors.

However, Dowd decided it would be best for Liverpool striker Luis Suarez, who was the centre of attention following his infamous spat with Patrice Evra, to keep moving.

As it turned out Suarez snubbed Evra but Dowd was close enough to step in to calm the situation following the United defender’s angry reaction.

Dowd had made both teams aware of the change at the usual pre-match meeting with managers and captains.

A reversal of the handshake also took place in a Premier League match in 2010 before Manchester City’s Wayne Bridge refused to shake John Terry’s hand.
 
Thought Dowd handled the situation with Suarez and Evra very well to be honest.
Before the match, at half-time and especially at full-time.

Fair play.
 
In England, there is the idea of the "Big Club." There's no algebraic equation that determines whether a club is "big" or not, but if there were it would read something like years in existence + number of trophies x stadium capacity + worldwide following . And going by that equation, or just simply the eye test, you would be right in saying that the two biggest clubs in English football history, Liverpool and Manchester United, played one another on Saturday.

United and Liverpool exude an aura of importance and permanence. Even when the results are not going their way, they manage to maintain their stature. It's that aura that attracts new players to their locker rooms and new fans to their gates. But no matter how fixed clubs want their positions in the world of football, and in the hearts and minds of their supporters, they are still ultimately judged by the actions of those who represent them.

On Saturday, Liverpool striker Luis Suarez made his club look small.

Suarez is very much the kind of player that makes supporters of whatever team he is playing for (formerly Ajax, now Liverpool and the Uruguay national side) say, "He might be a bastard, but he's our bastard." To see him feigning injury, diving, biting, fouling, and then pleading innocence to the referee or, most infamously, blocking an opponent's shot on goal with his hand during a World Cup match, is to see a master of all the little things that can change the course of a match. These are the dark arts of football, and Suarez is a magician.

He also has magic at his feet. While injuries and exhaustion have limited his effectiveness for Liverpool this year, he is still one of the Premier League's most dangerous attacking players. His season came to an abrupt halt in late December when the English FA banned him for eight games after he was found guilty of racially abusing Manchester United defender Patrice Evra during a match in October.

After the October match, when the accusations first started flying, and throughout both his public trial via the world football media and official FA-conducted investigation (if you don't have time to read that one, here's a shorter version), Liverpool unequivocally, some would say even blindly, stood by Suarez. Even after he was banned, his teammates wore T-shirts emblazoned with his image, out of support for the player. Throughout the ordeal, Liverpool manager Kenny Dalglish ardently defended his player, maintaining that the issue was one of a cultural misunderstanding rather than of racial abuse.

After serving his ban, Suarez returned to action last week against Tottenham. Moments after entering the game, he kicked Scott Parker in the stomach, seemingly unintentionally, though some would argue otherwise. He also gave Liverpool another dimension to their play, darting across wings, trying to get behind the Tottenham back line. All at once, we saw both the good and bad sides of the man and his magic.

Saturday we saw the worst side. Liverpool was playing United in the first league clash between the two since the October match when the Suarez-Evra incident occured. The ceremonial pre-match handshake, which involves smiling for cameras and players paired with children, was the subject of much debate beforehand. Would Suarez shake Evra's hand? Would Evra offer his? Would a line be drawn under this regrettable incident?

Ferguson insisted his player would shake Suarez's hand. Dalglish claimed Suarez would shake Evra's. But when the moment came, Suarez appeared to skip by Evra on the line, enraging the Frenchman as well as his United teammate, Rio Ferdinand.

I can remember the details of the match about as well as I can remember the motivations of characters in The Hurt Locker. It hardly seemed to matter. Your attention was focused on the ticking bomb, not the people around it. Even though, on the whole, I've seen nastier Manchester United-Liverpool matches, few felt this tense. At halftime Suarez booted the ball toward the United bench, and while United keeper David de Gea was walking into the locker rooms, someone allegedly spat on him. It was a nasty and edgy game that United won, 2-1, Wayne Rooney scoring both for the Red Devils and Suarez netting Liverpool's only goal.

Immediately following the final whistle, Evra began an extended victory lap celebration. Then, in talking to the media afterward, Ferguson launched into a scathing attack on Suarez and Liverpool, saying, "For a club with their history, I'd get rid of him, I really would. He is a disgrace to Liverpool Football Club. That player should not be allowed to play for Liverpool again. The history that club has got … and he does that today. It could have caused a riot."

Initially, Dalglish stood by his player, practically incinerating a reporter who asked what he thought of Suarez avoiding the handshake, "'I'll have to take your word for it, I wasn't there. Ask him, take it from him … I think you're very severe and bang out of order to blame Luis Suarez for anything that happened here today. Both sets of fans behaved really well, there was banter between each other, no problem."

A day later, Dalglish's defiance would seem embarrassingly misguided. By Sunday, the club's managing director, Ian Ayre, made a statement that was almost as strongly worded as Ferguson's: "We are extremely disappointed Luis Suarez did not shake hands with Patrice Evra before yesterday's game. The player had told us beforehand that he would, but then chose not to do so. He was wrong to mislead us and wrong not to offer his hand to Patrice Evra. He has not only let himself down, but also Kenny Dalglish, his teammates and the club."

If you look around, you will still see some shouting out in defense of Suarez, claiming that Evra moved his hand. Some have suggested that Dalglish and and the team would still be standing behind his player were it not for the influence of Liverpool owners John Henry and Tom Werner, or Liverpool club sponsors Standard Chartered. It's the money; it's a conspiracy; it's the media; it's Ferguson.

No. It's on Suarez. When I first became acquainted with Liverpool (and for the sake of transparency, when I first became a fan), I was overcome with how romantic the club was. Its history was full of triumphs and tragedy. It seemed to have a familial air to it, with the fans in the famous Kop End of Anfield singing, "You'll Never Walk Alone." You don't have to be a Liverpool supporter to understand this romance. You only need to watch the below video, of A.C. Milan fans singing the Liverpool anthem, just days following the Hillsborough disaster, to understand the affection, empathy, and admiration this club engenders.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFX07w2-4ls&feature=player_embedded

Like Barcelona, Liverpool seemed like more than a club to me. It was an idea about what a sporting institution could mean to a local and global community of fans.

When Suarez failed to grasp Evra's hand, he failed to grasp what Liverpool means to people. To shake Evra's hand would not have been a capitulation to Ferguson, to anti-Liverpool media bias, or anyone or anything else; it would have a been a statement that said, "What's done is done." It was simply the right thing to do.

Suarez failed to honor Kenny Dalglish, a man who helped lead the club out of the dark days following Hillsborough, who has been the beating heart of the club's revival since Henry and Werner took over. And in that he failed to honor Liverpool itself. Often, as a player, Suarez behaves like a child, and he's rewarded for it — with goals, with free kicks, with psychological advantages over his opponents. On Saturday, he needed to be a grown-up. He needed to repay the faith his manager, his teammates, and his club's fans had put in him. He failed to do that. He looked small. And he brought Liverpool down to his level.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7573607/week-25-your-hand-mine
 
ok. the author sounds like a little girl.

When Suarez failed to grasp Evra's hand, he failed to grasp what Liverpool means to people. To shake Evra's hand would not have been a capitulation to Ferguson, to anti-Liverpool media bias, or anyone or anything else; it would have a been a statement that said, "What's done is done." It was simply the right thing to do.


and that bit is complete bullshit. nobody shook hands after hillsborough. there was an investigation, people got to the bottom of it and then brought about changes to make sure it would never ever happen again. alongside that, the people who were wronged did not quit fighting on behalf of the victims. that is liverpool. that is what liverpool means.

all this bullshit about moving on, shaking hands, forgetting, looking to the future. fuck off. no matter what side you are on, if you aren't interested in getting to the bottom of the issue, if all you want is to brush it under the carpet and pretend everything is ok again, then you're a fucking selfish spineless coward.
 
Well, I know you love the thought that the proper british rebel would have bent over and just taken it up the arse... but don't you find it a little bit fun to see someone who doesnt't.. someone whos ego is challenging sir fergie and gis followers to a point where they loose it completely? Don't you enjoy at all the thought that the only thing occupying this slimy motherfucker for the whole match was the hate towards this little uruguayan... all he could care about after going top of the league was how much luis Suarez pisses him off... or do you actually enjoy having his cock up your arse? For all I know you do...
 
The good thing to come out of this, is that his cock is probably only up ian ayre's arse. So it no longer hurts me to think the club is being raped, as its just that one spineless person who runs it.
 
Congratulations Dantes. But for the well over-the-top media hysteria over a handshake, I would have thought it was a singularly petty and unremarkable incident. But I see you've hit the nail on the head in your perceptive analogy with the hillsborough inquest now.
 
[quote author=i_rushie link=topic=48657.msg1482777#msg1482777 date=1329255682]
Congratulations Dantes. But for the well over-the-top media hysteria over a handshake, I would have thought it was a singularly petty and unremarkable incident. But I see you've hit the nail on the head in your perceptive analogy with the hillsborough inquest now.
[/quote]

You're getting much better at understanding my posts.
 
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