West Ham Post Match Thread

[darkstarexodus]

Let's have a proper post match thread.

Simply not good enough today. Was always going to be challenging, with it being our 3rd fixture in a week, struggling with a few injuries and up against a direct, athletic side. However, there is no excuse for being that gutless. I can handle watching us lose - but watching us concede predictable goals and offer absolutely nothing at the other end is infuriating.

Benteke was awful today. Poor touch, made life easy on Collins, made the wrong runs and generally looked useless out there. He's had a few of these performances but has managed to bang in a goal to put a shine on. Not today. Awful.

Firmino had moments where he looked a bit brighter, notably combining with Ibe to set up Can. Still a bit of a shit house though and disappointing to see.

Coutinho was anonymous and completely off the pace.

Not too much fault with Ming, the centre backs and Can.

Smith looked bright once brought on.

Everyone else was pretty muck overall.

 

[gene hughes]

Yea. We don't have a very good team at the moment.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

Poor game for us. It really didn't help that a poor refereeing decision lead to us being a goal down very early.
We also missed Henderson in midfield massively again, and of course if we had a fit Sturridge and Ings we would not be talking about Benteke. Still it is what it is.
Those that did play - there is a growing realisation of something obvious that Lucas needs replacing , Firmino is very poor and is taking too long to settle and Benteke needs to make more of opportunities that come his way, and start bullying defenders again.
Just remember this though he's got more than 1 in every 3 this season which is not great but it's not a total shit return.
To be honest, and strange as it seems, I did not have massive issues with the back four today and Ming was our best player. Coutinho is becoming a concern. Lallana seems to be coming in for a bit of unfair stick, yes he's lightweight but he puts in a shift , brings energy to the team and can break down defences. He did more in his time on the pitch than Coutinho and Firmino did today.
Get Sturridge and Hendo back, buy a combative midfielder and we will be much improved.

 

[gene hughes]

However, we also don't look like we know what we're doing. I couldn't even see how we were trying to get into the (admittedly small) spaces behind west ham.

Benteke has perhaps the worst movement of a center forward in the final quarter that I've ever seen.

All our number tens just run aimlessly across the defense and each other.

It's embarrassing.

 

[bkwitche2]

All good points. I am hoping that some of the younger players can be brought in to the team at this point. Of course you don't want to destroy their confidence but I'd just tell them none of this is your fault and you won't beat the blame if we lose. You are allowed and expected to make mistakes when stepping in to this level of the game.

I think some of our good players may just be burnt out. Coutinho is a great example of that. I think with a few weeks rest he comes back better and ready to make an impact.

I am hopeful that Klopp can sort all of this out OVER TIME. I don't expect anything much to have changed by the next game or indeed by the end of this season.

We will probably coast to a 6th-8th place finish with a good number of draws sprinkled with some wins.

I think the real test comes next season after a January and summer of spending that lets us see what Klopp has up his sleeve. Will he be able to motivate and utilize "his" players better than Rodgers players?

Only time will tell, but asI said before, I'm hopeful.

 

[Insignificance]

I think we started ok, but then conceded a goal we could have avoided. Free kick yes, but from the free kick to the goal we had plenty of time to deny the goal.

Last part of first half and first 10 of 2nd half we again started to build some Nice interchanges. Again we conceed badly.

We again struggle to use possesion to create chnaces, and we are not clinical enough when we have the chances.

I am not sure if it is fatigue or lack of skills that make us finish Our chances so poorly. However, we must start to let the ball move even quicker between players. Ibe, Coutinho, Firmino and Lallana all use 10 touches each time they have the ball. It gives the opposition all the time in the world to regroup. Again they need movement Ahead of them to release the ball, but far to often they make bad Choices when they have one.

And for gods sake get hold of a player that can create a half chance from a set piece. We are really poor there.

 

[the count]

As poor as we were I didn't think the Hammers were much better. The difference between the two sides was that they carried a viable goal threat while we didn't.
Can and Lovren are probably the only two players to come out of today with any credit.
When you play with small full backs it is to be expected that opposing strong tall players will target them. It cost us both goals today and almost a third.
Brad Smith had a decent cameo and at least seems to be able to cross the ball.
I am hoping that the poor run of form of Coutinho, Firmino and Lallana is mostly down to the lack of mobility ahead of them.
They were similarly poor last season with Mario up to and only improved when Sterling played as a striker.
We lack winners in the squad it seems. Games like today don't seem to hurt the majority of players enough it seems.

 

[Bradley]

Didn't see the game, had it on the radio but I can't help but have sympathy for Klopp.

He probably didn't realise the state of the squad.

 

[gene hughes]

I expect Klopp to stop trying to play three attacking midfielders behind Benteke against teams that sit deep and are good on the counter.

 

[Mors]

We had 65% possession and 2 shots on target, they had 35% and 10 shots on target.
From what I can tell, Klopp is all about having a snap shot from everywhere as Dortmund used to do it. It's a farce, what's the point of these silly bastards having shots from 35yards that are no where near? Going back to the bad old days of Agger and Riise wasting good attacks.
In the final 3rd we've been woeful this season. Klopp 'should' do something this month about it, but I'm pretty certain he wont.

 

[Raz]

Klopp needs to go back to the 442 that beat Leicester.

 

[darkstarexodus]

Poor game for us. It really didn't help that a poor refereeing decision lead to us being a goal down very early.
We also missed Henderson in midfield massively again, and of course if we had a fit Sturridge and Ings we would not be talking about Benteke. Still it is what it is.
Those that did play - there is a growing realisation of something obvious that Lucas needs replacing , Firmino is very poor and is taking too long to settle and Benteke needs to make more of opportunities that come his way, and start bullying defenders again.
Just remember this though he's got more than 1 in every 3 this season which is not great but it's not a total shit return.
To be honest, and strange as it seems, I did not have massive issues with the back four today and Ming was our best player. Coutinho is becoming a concern. Lallana seems to be coming in for a bit of unfair stick, yes he's lightweight but he puts in a shift , brings energy to the team and can break down defences. He did more in his time on the pitch than Coutinho and Firmino did today.
Get Sturridge and Hendo back, buy a combative midfielder and we will be much improved.

Agree with all of the above. Giving up the early goal, you just knew though that our team doesn't have enough fight in it to overcome. Henderson, Origi, Sturridge and Ings are all big losses, either due to talent or compete levels.

Benteke's confidence looks low and no sign of the beast who batters defenders from pillar to post. Though he has often frustrated this year, his overall record is decent and I'm willing to persist with him both because there is something there and because of a lack of alternatives.

Despite the lack of end product I think Lallana has been one of our best players over the past 4 to 6 weeks. Although since that has coincided with a poor run of team form I'm not sure how much that is worth.

 

[cloggypop]

We looked tired and we lost. Not a massive surprise really.

 

[jexykrodic]

Sloppy start which continued throughout. Lots of missplaced passes and inability to create once we did get the ball in advanced positions. Benteke left with just low grade bits and pieces to work with. Klopp has little to call upon at present to make any useful substitutions.

Credit to West Ham for being resilient under pressure and making the most of their luck on the counter by giving their forwards quality service.

A game to forget and move on from, hopefully Klopp will get a break and some of his injured players will return. I do think he needs to freshen the squad if the right players become available, he must be very tempted to delve into the Bundesliga to get players he knows and can communicate his plans to.

 

[jexykrodic]

As poor as we were I didn't think the Hammers were much better. The difference between the two sides was that they carried a viable goal threat while we didn't.
Can and Lovren are probably the only two players to come out of today with any credit.
When you play with small full backs it is to be expected that opposing strong tall players will target them. It cost us both goals today and almost a third.
Brad Smith had a decent cameo and at least seems to be able to cross the ball.
I am hoping that the poor run of form of Coutinho, Firmino and Lallana is mostly down to the lack of mobility ahead of them.
They were similarly poor last season with Mario up to and only improved when Sterling played as a striker.
We lack winners in the squad it seems. Games like today don't seem to hurt the majority of players enough it seems.

Excellent post although I'd add Mignolet to players with credit from the match.

 

[Squiggles]

We were just dreadful. People were right to fear the worst for this fixture, although it would be have been nice if we could have surprised people.

The manner in which we lost was very concerning. We looked like eleven strangers on the field without a style of play or approach. Very little to take from the match.

 

[mom]

Klopp needs to do what he does and we need to be patient with him.
New squad, new club, new league and new set of fixtures to contend with.
I know he's been going on about how he rates the squad, but even if he didn't, what else do you expect him to say? Anything else would destroy confidence when the window is shut. If he really does rate them, we won't see any activity over the next few weeks. I doubt that will happen. But who knows.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

Excellent post although I'd add Mignolet to players with credit from the match.

My Liverpool MOM by some some distance although he will never know when to come if his line or stay

 

[Red Astaire]

'I'm angry' - Klopp

West Ham 2-0 Liverpool

Liverpool
Liverpool manager Jurgen Klopp: "It was not enough from my team today because in the decisive moments we were there but we were not there. All the TV stations now tell me that the situation with Alberto Moreno was a foul, but we didn't react right in this situation. There was no whistle. We have to avoid the cross.
"What makes me angry is that we had an opportunity to play fighting football but we scored no goal today.
"It's our responsibility. I told the players immediately after the game: summary - not enough. If you know in the other team there's Andy Carroll, how can you allow crosses?"

 

[hmmmmm1]

Mignolet was part at fault for the first goal, he should have come for the cross which was in the 6 yard box.

He is always rooted to the line

 

[jexykrodic]

Klopp knows what he's about from the interview extract and will address the issues. There is a lack of both game intelligence and resilience. Sounds to me like he's seen enough.

 

[Hansern]

We looked tired and we lost. Not a massive surprise really.

Nope. Tired and loads if injuries

 

[jexykrodic]

Mignolet was part at fault for the first goal, he should have come for the cross which was in the 6 yard box.

He is always rooted to the line

I thought it was a great cross and Mignolet was entitled to let his defender deal with it.

 

[Frogfish]

I expect Klopp to stop trying to play three attacking midfielders behind Benteke against teams that sit deep and are good on the counter.

Yes I was a little surprised at the attacking formation we put out. 4-3-3 would have been better as when West Ham broke we were over-ran in midfield. Lucas wasn't great but 2 against what seemed like 4-5 at times was taking the piss.

 

[Frogfish]

Mignolet was part at fault for the first goal, he should have come for the cross which was in the 6 yard box.

He is always rooted to the line

I thought so too.

 

[Frogfish]

'I'm angry' - Klopp

West Ham 2-0 Liverpool

Liverpool
Liverpool manager Jurgen Klopp: "It was not enough from my team today because in the decisive moments we were there but we were not there. All the TV stations now tell me that the situation with Alberto Moreno was a foul, but we didn't react right in this situation. There was no whistle. We have to avoid the cross.
"What makes me angry is that we had an opportunity to play fighting football but we scored no goal today.
"It's our responsibility. I told the players immediately after the game: summary - not enough. If you know in the other team there's Andy Carroll, how can you allow crosses?"

A 'Like' for Klopp.

 

[Frogfish]

First off I didn't agree with the subs and this is on Klopp, as was starting 4-2-3-1 which was probably a little too aggressive for our 3rd match in a week with virtually the same team (due to injuries) and in the PL.

Moreno's pace was very helpful and I thought he was one of our better players, so I was very surprised to see him pulled. Same for Firmino, he was retaining possession well in a very compact West Ham defence, and creating a chance or two, Benteke should have been pulled instead the useless fat lump. Collins pissed all over him for MoM, now that's embarrassing.

Clyne and Lucas are shite at crossing.

Note: Lallana should take all corners from the left and Ibe from the right.

Mignolet was definitely partly to blame, for me, in that first goal. The header was only 6-7m out and came from a floaty cross not a bullet.

Lovren (both headers coming from the RCB area) needs to look at himself for leaving Clyne (twice) to try to win a header against much taller men, in fact it was 1 against 2 (one of which was Carroll) for the second. In neither case was there anyone for Lovren to mark !

Ibe had a good game, powerful and kept possession well he laid it off into dangerous areas a number of times but neither Coutinho nor Firmino were able to make anything from it. He looked our most dangerous attacker all game without getting a real chance at goal (lovely early doors shot though).

 

[Red Astaire]

First off I didn't agree with the subs and this is on Klopp, as was starting 4-2-3-1 which was probably a little too aggressive for our 3rd match in a week with virtually the same team (due to injuries) and in the PL.

Moreno's pace was very helpful and I thought he was one of our better players, so I was very surprised to see him pulled. Same for Firmino, he was retaining possession well in a very compact West Ham defence, and creating a chance or two, Benteke should have been pulled instead the useless fat lump. Collins pissed all over him for MoM, now that's embarrassing.

Clyne and Lucas are shite at crossing.

Note: Lallana should take all corners from the left and Ibe from the right.

Mignolet was definitely partly to blame, for me, in that first goal. The header was only 6-7m out and came from a flatly cross not a bullet.

Lovren (both headers coming from the RCB area) needs to look at himself for leaving Clyne (twice) to try to win a header against much taller men, in fact it was 1 against 2 (one of which was Carroll) for the second. In neither case was there anyone for Lovren to mark !

Ibe had a good game, powerful and kept possession well he laid it off into dangerous areas a number of times but neither Coutinho nor Firmino were able to make anything from it. He looked our most dangerous attacker all game without getting a real chance at goal (lovely early doors shot though).

A very good summary. @Frogfish I've decided you are really quite clever.

 

[kingjulian]

Injuries pushed us to play Lucas and therefore we lost ....its simples...



Also why yhe duck was this not a Sunday game? We have played Sunday on so many meaningless occassions and the one time we play saturday is less than two days fromour previous game...


Gotta feel for all those who ran their heart.

Firmino wil get some stick and rightly so....but his workrate is Suarezisque....he needs to find a way to gel with the team and be more confident. He doesnt have that byte to his game that Suarez had...see what i did there?

 

[the count]

Injuries pushed us to play Lucas and therefore we lost ....its simples...



Also why yhe duck was this not a Sunday game? We have played Sunday on so many meaningless occassions and the one time we play saturday is less than two days fromour previous game...


Gotta feel for all those who ran their heart.

Firmino wil get some stick and rightly so....but his workrate is Suarezisque....he needs to find a way to gel with the team and be more confident. He doesnt have that byte to his game that Suarez had...see what i did there?

Suarez had megabytes