You're letting reason and facts get in the way of a narrative.
Virgiling on the vandijkulous
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You're letting reason and facts get in the way of a narrative.
If our scouts cant find 5 better CBs in world football than Dejan Lovren they should all be sacked.
So out of that dozen you mentioned zero? So name five for sale that will make us stronger.
I'm pretty sure there are good defenders out there in the £30m bracket, if you target the right clubs, markets, quality, age bracket etc. As opposed to the "£60m because of one good season in the Premiership" type.
The point still stands, our scouting is shite, we more or less always succumb to overpaying for half decent Premiership players.
The point still stands, our scouting is shite, we more or less always succumb to overpaying for half decent Premiership players.
United bought Lindeløf in the 30 m +, Young versitaile defender market. Noone can define him as a good purchase or a failure yet. Will he strengthen them or will he be sold next summer?
It is difficult to hit it right, and it may be that our scouts are shit, or maybe they are good enough to state that this and this and this guy is not the quality we want after all. Scouts are not sent out to see if there is a player there. They are also monitoring the player through different tests. All the guys we claim to have been interested in might have been studied and then decided against based for all we know. The socalled interest is not necessary a bid, although a players agent will allways use the interest to build up his own case.
To underline how difficult it is again let's use United as an example. They clearly need a New midfield maestro. Carrick have been around for long, and he need replacing. Which United have tried and tried. But they end up with him claiming his Place after all, as the ones they brought in couldn't do the job as well as needed. So this season they try with Matic. But they have bought Schneiderlin, Schweinsteiger, Herrera etc etc to replace him, and now they have named him Captain of their Club.
Keeping Sakho is almost looking like the best option. Any defender we sign will be expensive and probably lacking in experience, we'll be paying shit loads for nothing but hyped up potential. After looking on the net for 15 minutes there really aren't that many defenders that would slot immediately into the first team that are currently obtainable.
Laporte? Howdes? Koulibaly?
Smalling, Ogbonna...
Seriously the choice is pretty limited.
Laporte? Howdes? Koulibaly?
Smalling, Ogbonna...
Seriously the choice is pretty limited.
Pointing and protesting about the scum being shit will do nothing to prevent Hoffenheim scoring against us. This is the problem.
I'm not really sure what point you're trying to make.
That it's hard to find good players? That other clubs make mistakes and struggle too? That nobody quite knows what goes on behind closed doors? That ultimately time will tell whether certain decisions are good ones? That Klopp and his team most likely know a great deal more about football than us fans?
These are all truisms.
I just think it's incredibly lazy to fall back on them continually. It's like you're more interested in taking away other peoples opinions than offering up your own.
And to make matters worse, it feels like it's all set up to excuse failure... and in a way that there is always a future get-out because you offloaded all responsibility.
If the suggesting in the transfer window is that there are players out there that might improve us, the answer is we have to trust in Klopp, the market is difficult and so forth and so forth. Then if it transpires later on in the season that there were several players that might have improved us, the answer is well, how do you we didn't go after them and there may be reasons x, y and z that we couldn't get them yada yada yada.
It's all immaterial. Who cares if it's hard?
Some clubs do better, some clubs do worse. We want the club to be one of those that do better... and as a direct consequence, win things.
Alternatively, we can spend the next 25 years going over all the reasons why "it's hard" and telling ourselves that we're not alone in our struggles and that we need to trust in the next owner / manager / whoever.
And i've mentioned Ben Gibson for similar reasons.
Cool name, never heard of him before but I'm certain he's better than Klavan already.
He used to run a fan website called Koptalk.
Was that his brother Fat?
It's difficult to get it right with any signing Insig. We can spend £60m on VVD and he could have injury problems again, he might not settle into our system (as many haven't). There's always a risk. There are plenty of other examples of clubs getting it right. Let's not forget, United signed those "replacements" over the course of a couple of different managers being at the club. Mourinho targeted Matip and got him at Chelsea, and had bought other good standard DM's before that too.
So far Klopp has bought two defenders and got it half right, while his record with attackers has been resoundingly good it seems (assuming Salah and Solanke continue as they are).
I'm really really surprised that the height of our ambitions is paying twice last seasons going rate for a player who's both had a severe injury problem and only really a short spell of good form in this league. I was impressed whenever I saw him play last season, so I think there's clearly talent there, but for it to be a situation with both VVD and Kieta that it's all or nothing with both, it kinda says it all about our ability to scout well - especially when we continually go down the route of fucking up negotiations and having clubs try to bend us over.
I don't want us to be buying the standard 3rd/4th choice alternative, but if a scouting network is worth it's salt, it has a couple of options that are of the required quality.
Haha, very true
I think Klopps comments are more a public support to the current squad before a few weeks of PL start and CL qual. Giving them confidence etc. And a way not to say anything wrong about the clubs intentions.
Its quite obvious that there are better CBs out there and that we need to sign one.
If the VVD deal is gone, go for Manolas.
He'd be a good fit for us, and will cost less.
Its quite obvious that there are better CBs out there and that we need to sign one.
If the VVD deal is gone, go for Manolas.
He'd be a good fit for us, and will cost less.
The point was a response to a statement that our scouting is shit. It's easy to accuse the scouting to be shit based on the fact that we haven't bought any, but the argument could og the other way, that our scouts works, and they just have sanctioned against purchases.
And yes of course we wan't to be the ones doing this better than others and as a consequence win things. However, with Klopp I assume he wants a fundation that can challenge for and win things over and over again. That four titles out of the next ten is more important than next years title. He has a certains tyle that suits us, and being a stubborn bastard I assume he knows pretty much which players he want to add and which ones he doesn't want to add cause they make us marginally better for a astronomic fee or perhaps no better at all.
Let us look at an example (and use this as an example): Left back is a problem for us. We have looked into it, and sought after players. We have probably scouted several players. Last season we accomodated Milner to that space. I assume that Klopp has been aware of the weaknesses for Moreno and at the same time worked with him. Now he seem willing to give Moreno a chance, as an alternative to Robertson. Is this because there ain't a better Left back out there? I guess not. City has been buying fullbacks for plenty money. And I assume we have have scouted several left backs as well. So why are we stuck with Moreno still? Probably not because our scouts are shit, rather that we don't find value for the Money at this stage, and Moreno having the progress Klopp hoed for and hence give him the chance.
Good post. For many years now we've been buying those second or third-choice players that we thought were good enough, only to find they weren't. It's hard enough to get it right when you go for your first choices, let alone those further down the list. Klopp appears to want an end to buying "nearly" men and I'm willing to take the risk if he is.
^This. Almost every single signing is a calculated risk. A gamble.
The risk increases presumably as you go deeper into the list, until, at some point, it equals the risk presented by continuing with what you have.
I don't know why (call me stupid, naive, whatever) but I still like Moreno. I know he can be a liability but he still has potential. He's a known quantity (a shit known quantity according to most on here) but if he is in any way coachable, then a coaching staff such as Klopps should be able to improve him. I'm willing to give him another chance.
The risk increases presumably as you go deeper into the list, until, at some point, it equals the risk presented by continuing with what you have.
I don't know why (call me stupid, naive, whatever) but I still like Moreno. I know he can be a liability but he still has potential. He's a known quantity (a shit known quantity according to most on here) but if he is in any way coachable, then a coaching staff such as Klopps should be able to improve him. I'm willing to give him another chance.
Why didn't he hand it in ages ago?
Money
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