• You may have to login or register before you can post and view our exclusive members only forums.
    To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Sack-Ho or keep?

Forums Unread posts
Status
Not open for further replies.
Although I think Skrtel has been huge this season and is deservedly high on Morses 'Man of the Match' league, he can be a bag of mistakes when his mood is wrong. With him and Agger at 29 I think we have seen the best they have to give and it's not good enough.
Sell both and bring in Hummels to be the head man in amongst himself, Sahko, Ilori & Toure.

Edit: Sami Hyppia for defensive coach.
 
I am in the pro- Sakho camp. One of the few defenders worth keeping as I think there is actual scope for growth in both ability and game intelligence. Skrtel and Agger are both passing their peak, unlikely to change playing styles to fit into the system and are not going to learn to understand the game any more/ just become leaders over night.

It has certainly been a frustrating season from a defensive POV.

Do you think the leadership we would have gained from Pepe in goal of the defence would outweigh the benefits we have made from having Mig in goal?
 
There's no doubt that Sakho is our future. But I still would have picked Agger ahead of Sakho for the last three games
 
One thing I would definitely dispute is that it's inevitable that defenders need a long time to adapt and start showing good form.

Agger was very young when he signed, just 21 I think, and had Carra and Hyypia ahead of him, so it was only natural he'd get 6 months or so to bed in. But once 06/07 started he was there right away, and doing well, too.

I think people remember Skrtel for a couple of really dodgy early performances when he first came, but that skews things, because they were just isolated games, and again, by the start of the following season (and I think well before) he was a dependable part of the first team.

Sakho is 24 now, and IMO is beyond any initial settling in period. He's also had several years playing a decent league and for a top international side. I think what we're seeing right now is more or less what he can offer.

Basically I think he's been disappointing. For £18m you expect top quality.
 
Pepe was part of a leaky defence last season too, so I don't think we would have gained much there. Anyway, Napoli wants to take him permanently now, and with him still having 2 seasons left on his contract, this is as good a time as any to sell him.
 
Carra from 1.49 onwards


[article=http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/29327/9298962/jamie-carragher-liverpool-collapse-at-crystal-palace-not-acceptable]Carragher says Rodgers' preferred central defensive pairing of Mamadou Sakho and Martin Skrtel lack leadership skills - and there was evidence of it in the 3-2 win over Norwich last month.

And he believes Liverpool paid the price for trying to chase down Manchester City's superior goal difference instead of tightening up at the back.

"Goal difference could become a factor, so you're thinking 'get to 3-0 and now try to get goals and move forward'," Carragher added.

"Liverpool were throwing men forward and people were staying up front and maybe weren't coming back, but the back four and the defensive side of this team have shown they can't cope with the pressure.

"When they come under pressure, we saw them at Norwich dropping back into the box. Sakho and Skrtel don't communicate enough and they're not pushing out. They're good players, but they're not leaders.

"They need people out there pushing people out. You can't keep dropping back against these teams, inviting pressure and think you'll get away with it.

"We mentioned a couple of weeks ago the Norwich game and they got out of jail. We mentioned on the day it could have easily been 3-3.

"They basically haven't learned the lesson of that Norwich game. You think of the City game when they let people back into the game as well, the 3-2 situation, and it just continuously goes on and on for the last few months.

"They've been getting away with it. Tonight is the night that they haven't got away with it and they've probably lost the league title."

Carragher also accused the central defenders of showing weakness both physically and mentally - and says the duo's record shows they are not good enough.

"I look at those centre-backs and that's weak mentally for me, not pushing out," he added.

"You do that as a centre-back. In plenty of tough away games you keep driving out and then you've got to come back and then you've got to keep pushing out.

"It's your goalkeeper as well. I don't think there's enough leadership or communication in the two centre-backs or the goalkeeper especially.

"Sakho is new. Brendan Rodgers has gone with him and Skrtel as a partnership and he's got Daniel Agger on the bench. I've mentioned before I don't think he's the biggest fan of Daniel Agger and that's why he always seems to leave him out.

"That's 17 games Sakho and Skrtel have played together now and one clean sheet. They always concede goals whenever they play together."[/article]
 
peterhague said:
One thing I would definitely dispute is that it's inevitable that defenders need a long time to adapt and start showing good form.

Agger was very young when he signed, just 21 I think, and had Carra and Hyypia ahead of him, so it was only natural he'd get 6 months or so to bed in. But once 06/07 started he was there right away, and doing well, too.

I think people remember Skrtel for a couple of really dodgy early performances when he first came, but that skews things, because they were just isolated games, and again, by the start of the following season (and I think well before) he was a dependable part of the first team.

Sakho is 24 now, and IMO is beyond any initial settling in period. He's also had several years playing a decent league and for a top international side. I think what we're seeing right now is more or less what he can offer.

Basically I think he's been disappointing. For £18m you expect top quality.
Click to expand...

Disagree. IMO he hasn't been at all bad overall, besides which Ligue 1 isn't a strong league and his first season has been interrupted by injury.
 
Judge Jules said:
Disagree. IMO he hasn't been at all bad overall, besides which Ligue 1 isn't a strong league and his first season has been interrupted by injury.
Click to expand...


Ligue 1 isn't a bad standard, and he's played in it for years. Plus he's an international.

Even if he hasn't been at all bad, is that enough? For £18m?
 
peterhague said:
One thing I would definitely dispute is that it's inevitable that defenders need a long time to adapt and start showing good form.

Agger was very young when he signed, just 21 I think, and had Carra and Hyypia ahead of him, so it was only natural he'd get 6 months or so to bed in. But once 06/07 started he was there right away, and doing well, too.

I think people remember Skrtel for a couple of really dodgy early performances when he first came, but that skews things, because they were just isolated games, and again, by the start of the following season (and I think well before) he was a dependable part of the first team.

Sakho is 24 now, and IMO is beyond any initial settling in period. He's also had several years playing a decent league and for a top international side. I think what we're seeing right now is more or less what he can offer.

Basically I think he's been disappointing. For £18m you expect top quality.
Click to expand...

Of our CBs, Sakho has probably been the least error prone. I'm not really sure what you expect from your central defenders.

If you want leadership, you should be looking to the veterans in that area: Johnson, Skrtel, and probably Gerrard.
 
peterhague said:
Ligue 1 isn't a bad standard, and he's played in it for years. Plus he's an international.

Even if he hasn't been at all bad, is that enough? For £18m?
Click to expand...

I thought the fee was that many euros rather than pounds TBH, but it's a fair enough question either way. I'll want him to improve on this season but IMO yes, for a first season it's been good enough to justify the fee.
 
Whirly said:
Of our CBs, Sakho has probably been the least error prone. I'm not really sure what you expect from your central defenders.

If you want leadership, you should be looking to the veterans in that area: Johnson, Skrtel, and probably Gerrard.
Click to expand...


In the main, I want to have confidence they're going to stop us conceding goals. Sakho inspires very little of that in me.
 
Sounds like you have thinking issues, and you're projecting your incompetencies onto your keyboard. 🙂
 
The defence is our over-riding priority this summer.Not sure if those who use Henderson's absence as an excuse for the goals against Palace saw the matches against Fulham, Cardiff, Hull, Everton, West Ham, Stoke, Swansea and Newcastle among others. We have been conceding [bad] goals like that all season and it's time the spotlight was shone on the defenders instead of trotting one excuse after another. Once we concede one goal, however fortuitous, we always look likely to concede another one immediately, and probably a third too. There is a desperate lack of leadership and organisation in a crisis. I'm not convinced by Sakho and Skrtel as a centre-back pairing. At 3-1 in such an important match, decent defenders would have regrouped and kept their wits about them but instead they resorted to type and were flat-footedly caught out for two more. I for one would like to see Illori back and having a chance. But Sakho has to start playing like a £17 million player or we should cut our losses.
 
OK I will compromise Sakho can stay, I always liked him but I can't see a pairing, promote Illori and Andre bring in Caulker and sell the other two
 
This season is probably difficult to judge the guy. He hasn't had the ideal debut season, what with all the changes and stop-starts.

Started with a stretch of 8 games (1 cup game). During this period:
- he was played out of position at LB in a couple of games if I remember correctly,
- we switched between playing two and three at the back,
- we switched between Enrique and Cissokho at LB... playing with the latter obviously hasn't helped

After the away defeat to Arsenal, he went to the bench for the next 4 games. He returned to the starting lineup in early December and started 5 games before picking up the injury at Chelsea which kept him out of the game for three and a half months. On his return, he spent the next half a month on the bench before returning to the starting lineup for this final stretch of games (6 so far) in April.

Summary: start 8 games - bench 4 games - start 5 games - out 3 months - bench 4 games - start 6 games.

Sure, Agger has had a disjointed season as well (though he didn't have that 3-month layoff), but he has the advantage of familiarity (despite having to play with Cissokho) that Sakho lacks.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Modo
    • Like
  • Locked
Happy Quansah
2
Replies
34
Views
781
Frogfish
Frogfish
rurikbird
    • Like
Young players watch
2 3 4 5 6 7
Replies
186
Views
4K
King Binny
King Binny
Frogfish
    • Like
  • Locked
Should they stay or should they go.
2 3
Replies
85
Views
2K
737Max
737Max
dee
  • Locked
Claire Balding's love child is gagging for it
2 3 4
Replies
90
Views
3K
dee
dee
rurikbird
    • Like
  • Locked
Slot – first impressions?
2 3 4
Replies
103
Views
3K
Oncy
Oncy
Back
Top Bottom