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Sack him

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Anyway, my issue with Rodgers. He hasn’t a clue how to set a team up defensively. He said this last week…



“We have conceded a large number of soft goals, there’s no argument about that, but I think it is just a lack of coaching time that is hurting us. We need to reinforce basic principles at defensive set pieces, but we know that already. We have to get better and we will be working on it."



That’s a disgrace right there. Who do you think you’re kidding Rodgers? You’ve been in the job for 3 seasons now, and the same mistakes that were evident away to West Brom in game one, are the same as the ones we saw on Saturday past.



Here’s some facts to counter your bullshit Rodgers.



  • You’ve used 7 different centre backs in the last 18 months, and god knows how many different CB pairings.
  • In the last 18 months you’ve spent close to $80M on defenders and a goalkeeper (not including the 4 or 5 loans and free transfers on defenders).
  • You’ve tried 5 different defensive midfielders in that time (Gerrard, Lucas, Allen, Henderson, Can) all to minimal effect.
  • Of the top 12 teams in the league this year, only Everton have conceded more goals than us.
  • Of the top 15 teams in the league last year, only Newcastle conceded more than us.
We are a lower table club when it comes to defending, and we’ve spent 80M in 18 months on defenders to get us there. So do not feed the fans pure shite about having “a lack of coaching time” Rodgers. This defending malaise isn’t a blip, it’s a trend. It’s how we’ve played for 3 seasons.


I watched us on Saturday just retreat and retreat defensively to a point where I was convinced we were hoping Chelsea would score so that it’d allow us the opportunity to go and chase the lead again. I do not understand why our two central defenders continually run backwards and drop deep. They must be getting instructed to do so, cos if they’re doing that of their own free will and Rodgers is allowing it to happen, then we’re beyond fucked. Someone posted a video of how Gerrard got overran in DM the other day. It’s a reasonable video, he’s diving in when he should be standing off, he’s getting easily outnumbered, and he’s too slow on the turn. But did it strike anyone else that everytime Hazard, or Fabregas, or whomever got around him that they then had a fucking acre of space to run into? Why is there such an enormous gap between Gerrard and our centre backs? Because our centre backs are running backwards that’s fucking why. At the first sign of fear, even if it’s 40-50 yards from goal, Skrtel runs backwards. He simply does not know how to defend a line. He’s been with us for 7 years now too. That is fucking frightening.



Lovren too, Agger did the same, Sakho just goes where he’s told, Toure at least understands you have to move up the pitch but he’s too fucking old. It’s not the players though. We have this debate every week about who should play CB, somebody even suggested Emre Can there last week. Christ. Every week of every year we are presiding over which of our CB’s is the least shit, and therefore they should play. Again, it’s not the players. It’s the system. If you can make a hacker like Gary Cahill fit into your system, then you can do it with Dejan Lovren & Martin Skrtel. They’re not horrendous, they’ve just never been educated. You don't just buy a defensive 'leader' and expect him to fix your woes, you've got to build the system around him and let him lead it on the pitch. 'Go be a leader' is not defensive coaching. Moyes had Phil Jagielka and Sylvain Distin – two absolute mediocrities – as the best CB pairing in the country for 2 or 3 years - because he taught them, and obviously drilled them on the training ground mercilessly. It’s not hard.



And that’s my concern. It’s not that hard to educate defenders, to build a system, and to win games regularly. It really isn’t. You need money ($80M is a decent start), time (into the third season now Brendan), and you need the capacity to coach defending (getting found wanting here I'd say).



Our Manager doesn’t know how to defend. We have a striker coming back from injury around whom our whole season seemingly hangs. We’ve, on the short term evidence anyway, replaced Suarez badly, we’ve got a dysfunctional midfield, an awful goalkeeper, and we’re on our way out of our Champions League group. The scary bit of the lot is that Rodgers doesn’t seem to have a plan to fix the structural issues. I was screaming at the TV on the weekend at Skrtel. Stop running so fucking deep. And there's Rodgers writing notes. They came back out in the second half, as they do every week, and did the same thing again. He doesn't even see it.



We have, and I mean this, the worst defence I've ever seen in my Liverpool-supporting life. Sturridge coming back will only put lipstick on this pig.



So yeah, Rodgers is on notice as far as I’m concerned.




This is from October 2012 - and how you said he setting out the defence. Didn't work then and doesn't work now.



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"tony said:
I think it could be solved by the centre backs pushing up the field by 5 to 10 yards - just compressing the gap to the midfield. Skagger have the pace to cope with this. There does seem to be a massive space sometimes in front of them, but some of the goals have come from horrendous mistakes which have nothing to do with the system. Hopefully we are getting them out of our system! By the way I think you are a bit harsh on Johnson he does get caught out of position but he is also played out of position from time to time - generally I think hes beeen really good this season"

That's not going to happen.​
One of the crucial pieces of Rodgers' 4-3-3 is ensuring the opposition have to run around like fuck so he sets his own team up so they take full advantage of the whole ground. The longer and wider we setup, the further the opposition have to run.​
Therefore the gap between defence and midfield will stay large. You'll still see the likes of Allen dropping deep to pick it up but by and large the distance between our midfield 'line' (and I use that terms loosely) and our back 2/3 central defenders will remain the same.​
By strecthing us out and keeping the ball at the same time, it means the opposition can't press in numbers. e.g. if they sent 4 people chasing down our centre-backs, we'd just move it forward quickly and catch them out. Thus, the opopsition run around individually, get tired, we keep the ball, and find space eventually.​
Anybody who watched Rodgers Swansea side at Anfield last year would have seen this perfectly.​
Plus, he likes his centre backs to pick it up from Reina to start attacks. The other advantage is that if the opposition's 2 strikers push ont our centre backs then Reina can just loft it over the op to a full-back in the gaps. If our midfield had dropped deep to compress the gap - this would be impossible and we'd have to hoof it long and probably lose it.​
This would all be so much easier to explain on a chalkboard.​
 
I'm not sure a coach would make a difference, because at the core of it Rodgers doesn't seem to be detailed enough in terms of how he wants his defence to set up, particularly the central defence. You'd be asking a coach to come up with a system whereas realistically it should be coming from the manager. If it's not coming from Rodgers, then it's going to be difficult for any coach to come up with something that will fit seamlessly in to the overall setup of the team.

Nah I mean someone to coach Rodgers
 
Nah I mean someone to coach Rodgers


Ah. Gotcha.

I find it surprising that he's studied a number of coaches home and abroad and hasn't seemed to have come up with a system for basic defending (if indeed he hasn't). Especially working for so long under Mourinho.

In fact, it seems so negligent a thing to do, it makes me question whether it's actually down to the centre backs we have just losing the plot for some reason.
 
Clutching at straws all this 'he doesn't know what he's doing' stuff. If our club needs better defensive coaching then so do most clubs, all but Southampton have conceded double figures.
 
This is from October 2012 - and how you said he setting out the defence. Didn't work then and doesn't work now.



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"tony said:
I think it could be solved by the centre backs pushing up the field by 5 to 10 yards - just compressing the gap to the midfield. Skagger have the pace to cope with this. There does seem to be a massive space sometimes in front of them, but some of the goals have come from horrendous mistakes which have nothing to do with the system. Hopefully we are getting them out of our system! By the way I think you are a bit harsh on Johnson he does get caught out of position but he is also played out of position from time to time - generally I think hes beeen really good this season"

That's not going to happen.​
One of the crucial pieces of Rodgers' 4-3-3 is ensuring the opposition have to run around like fuck so he sets his own team up so they take full advantage of the whole ground. The longer and wider we setup, the further the opposition have to run.​
Therefore the gap between defence and midfield will stay large. You'll still see the likes of Allen dropping deep to pick it up but by and large the distance between our midfield 'line' (and I use that terms loosely) and our back 2/3 central defenders will remain the same.​
By strecthing us out and keeping the ball at the same time, it means the opposition can't press in numbers. e.g. if they sent 4 people chasing down our centre-backs, we'd just move it forward quickly and catch them out. Thus, the opopsition run around individually, get tired, we keep the ball, and find space eventually.​
Anybody who watched Rodgers Swansea side at Anfield last year would have seen this perfectly.​
Plus, he likes his centre backs to pick it up from Reina to start attacks. The other advantage is that if the opposition's 2 strikers push ont our centre backs then Reina can just loft it over the op to a full-back in the gaps. If our midfield had dropped deep to compress the gap - this would be impossible and we'd have to hoof it long and probably lose it.​
This would all be so much easier to explain on a chalkboard.​

I think there is an important distinction to be made between when you have the ball and when you don't.
 
I think there is an important distinction to be made between when you have the ball and when you don't.


Yep, pretty much.

There's no 'tactic' behind madly running backwards every time the opposition advance past the halfway line, it's just a combination of poor decision-making and extremely poor coaching. Especially with guys that you work with every day for years.
 
Sadly he needs to go.. Their is a cancer in the squad.. Clearly not playing for the manager and I think he is clueless in respect of what to do to turn it around.

His signings are not performing.. he can't get the team to do the basics, like defend.. Managers fault..

Laughable performance from Rodgers today.
 
im usually all for giving managers time, and rodgers has earned some, but there are no signs that we're going to get better, how long do we give him before its too late?
 
im usually all for giving managers time, and rodgers has earned some, but there are no signs that we're going to get better, how long do we give him before its too late?
I was all for giving him till Christmas.. I don't even think that is wise now..

Change is required, urgently... We are in a ridiculous mess and it is all Rodgers doing..
 
I was all for giving him till Christmas.. I don't even think that is wise now..

Change is required, urgently... We are in a ridiculous mess

We'er in a mess that was created by losing on our top target (again), by not forcing Borini out, by signing players who played at a very high level last year - and cannot replicate ti this year and by not making a move for Valdes when we knew we had a problem with mign ... Not 100% his fault, and he's not a 'cancer' ... firing him will probably set us back a few years ... I wish we had Arsenal's problems ... They have money, a stadium and a far better squad ... oh well.
 
Its funny though. Even in the first season you could see the basis of the team taking shape. Its regressed beyond recognition at this moment.

Someone needs to get his head out of his arse and start going back to basics. It doesn't matter if we lose whilst getting sorted, its a whole different matter doing the same fuckinh clueless shit week in and out.
 
We'er in a mess that was created by losing on our top target (again), by not forcing Borini out, by signing players who played at a very high level last year - and cannot replicate ti this year and by not making a move for Valdes when we knew we had a problem with mign ... Not 100% his fault, and he's not a 'cancer' ... firing him will probably set us back a few years ... I wish we had Arsenal's problems ... They have money, a stadium and a far better squad ... oh well.
Rodgers is not the Cancer, but there is a cancer in the squad created by Rodgers mistakes
 
We'er in a mess that was created by losing on our top target (again), by not forcing Borini out, by signing players who played at a very high level last year - and cannot replicate ti this year and by not making a move for Valdes when we knew we had a problem with mign ... Not 100% his fault, and he's not a 'cancer' ... firing him will probably set us back a few years ... I wish we had Arsenal's problems ... They have money, a stadium and a far better squad ... oh well.
You're taking as though we have had one bad transfer window. Rodgers signing have been dreadful for his entire time here, with a few exceptions
 
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