You mean two more years.
For those saying that Kenny deserves another year
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You mean two more years.
Not really ... Just realistic. I don't see any club bragging about the 'Super Cup' in Italy (it's like the Charity Shield) and the World Club Cup is almost always won by the European teams, who are in general stronger. I'm surprised you didn't mention the European Super Cup ... Before he got fired (December if I remember correctly), they were 10+ points behind the leaders. He opened his mouth saying "I need full backing blah blah" and Moratti couldn't be bothered. You say they needed 're-building'? The team is still bloody good - they have some fantastic young talent & some veterans (Milito, Zanetti, Cambiasso, etc etc). They could have easily finished top 4 ... as they did last year (when they finished SECOND).
Defend Rafa all you like ... He would have probably stayed at Inter had he got the backing. Someone will hire him eventually - his record is still impressive with Valencia and the two trophies with us (+ 2nd place finish) - but he creates a lot of drama, which while it helped us, it screwed him royally in Valencia and Inter ...
you've been waiting to use that one.
His attitude was all wrong in Milan. It was hard not to think he wasn't trying to get sacked, or just so shell-shocked from dealing with Hicks and Gillett for so long he was still gripped by the madness. Not since Clough went to Leeds has any good manager got it so startlingly wrong.
I think it's wrong to say kenny 'deserves' another season but I do think he should get one.
I'm not "bragging" about anything but I think Rafa deserves a bit of defending.Pointing out that he won what was there to be won during his time at Inter is not invalidated by your point that they were nothing trophies.He did his job well enough to win them is my point.
Your original question(rhetorical it seemed to me -as if the answer was obvious to all and was "shit")-was, how did Rafa do at Inter.I have pointed out that he won what he could in the short time he was there.Now you say that means nothing cos they were crap tophies.I beg to differ.Whenever we have won the Charity Shield or the European Super Cup even we have been quite chuffed.We failed to win the CWC under Rafa,due to very poor officiating and to a S American team as I remember, but still we would all have been well pleased to add it to our tally.
It's no good saying Inter came "SECOND " to refute a point they have won nothing since he left y' know.They still need rebuilding if they are to get back to the winning ways you rightly point out they had with JM.They are not going to until Moratti spends some dough-as Rafa was right to point out.JM knows when to move on.
I'm not saying Rafa is a bad manager, I'm calling a spade a spade. He was poor at Inter. So he won 2 out of the 3 trophies Mourinho put him in line to compete in - not bad. Inter, with Mancini and Mourinho, were winning or challenging for the league year in, year out. Now you're using our mentality - a club that is fighting to finish in the top 4 and prides itself on cups - to compare it to Inter's? He was 10 points+ off the top at mid-season. That's something WE complain about at Liverpool, and we don't really have that much of a chance to win the league ... He did it with a team that had just dominated the league yet again.
You're being a tad bit unfair with your last paragraph. You didn't say they'd 'won nothing,' you said, "as evidenced by what they have done since firing Rafa." I wished we 'needed re-fitting' and could finish 2nd, as Inter did - a mere 6 points from Milan. Their squad is good enough to challenge, and win the league imo (and I hate them). They still have a very good GK (Cesar), defense (is Maicon still there?), midfield (Cambiasso, Stankovic etc) and Milito (who can still bang 'em in with the best of 'em). JM left for a better opportunity - he didn't leave because of Moratti (unless I'm wrong as I thought they were still close, and JM never said anything negative about him ... maybe Roopy can comment), he left to manage the richest team in footy as he'd done everything he could with Inter.
I don't think there's a need to 'defend Rafa' - I think he's a good manager, and did some wonderful stuff with Valencia and us. But his last few years (2 with us, and 1/2 with Inter) were poor (to put it nicely) and to want him back now to a difficult situation is not the right move imo.
I think you DO need to 'defend rafa' because some people carry on like he was fucking clueless.
The reason I don't want Rafa back isn't football or results based, it's because half the fans want him and half the fans don't, so going the match would get even worse as people would grumble and argue with each other from the first match.
The next manager, whenever they're appointed, needs to have a clean slate and full support at the ground.
The next manager, whenever they're appointed, needs to have a clean slate and full support at the ground.
I'm quite obviously not though - that's why the need to defend him as if I've talked about Rafa like Ross is unnecessary.
SOUNESS!!!
Fair play you can clearly marshal an argument and you have a better recall of the detail of what I said than I have(ha ha).You're right that Inter were in a good position when he joined them and I thought he was making a mistake going there following on from JM's period of success there.He might have succeeded if he'd had more time and been more diplomatic(ha!)we'll never know as he isn't obviously.I do think he'd regretted his move by Christmas though and wasn't unhappy to be fired.
I feel the need to defend Rafa against unreasoning prejudice against him(of which there is way too much)and for that reason I'll fight his corner if it seems to me it needs doing.Your criticisms of his time at Inter are fair but there is another view of what happened and I've done my best to express it.
He looked for all the world like someone who'd taken the job because he thought he should, without ever really wanting it, which is just what he was. I've no doubt family pressure played its part as well. What worries me on his behalf is that there's no guarantee the same thing won't happen wherever else he goes. I actually wonder if he shouldn't try and find a different occupation altogether.
Spell checker add ons for your browser are free. Just saying.
And looking is all you would do, unless an otherwise intelligent and successful manager suddenly becomes stupid enough to come here
And what would that be that would pay him anything like he can get as a football manager.
It's hard making a living today never mind getting paid 16 million for six months work and then get told to take a hike.Apart from politics or acting where could he get that kind of money?
The guy has won 2 Spanish league titles, a UEFA Cup and a European Cup with underdog teams and you think he should try something else.Maybe we all should.
We pay extremely high salaries. That mitigates most other reasons you can come up with for whoever we'd want not wanting to come here.
Trying to be a smartarse are you? Typing on my Ipone isnt easy as it autocorrects nearly every word.
And a typo or two doesnt hide the fact of the points made either.
We've lost some world class players in Alonso, Mascherano and Torres, and a few good ones in Meireles and Aquilani.
However Kenny has been given over £100mil to try and replace these players and he's fucked it up good and proper.
I believe everything that can be said about Kenny's management has already been said.
This league season can't be saved, no matter how we do in the remaining league fixtures.
To the "Kenny should be sacked" posters:
What I want to know is, does winning the Fa cup buy Kenny another year?
A simple yes or no will suffice.
No, IMO.
This league season can't be saved, no matter how we do in the remaining league fixtures.
To the "Kenny should be sacked" posters:
What I want to know is, does winning the Fa cup buy Kenny another year?
A simple yes or no will suffice.
No, IMO.
I just hope Rafa doesn't make the same mistake with Madrid, as I can see JM jumping ship (especially if he wins La Liga & the Champions League). It's a lose/lose situation.
You have every right to defend Rafa. Some of the criticism laid into him - as it is with every manager, and player, nowadays it seems - goes far too far.
So, it's a little bit like the fans and Dalglish have been married for 35 years with kids and everything. And now the fans are like, oh fuck this I'm gonna go pay for that better looking prostitute over there instead
That analogy only works if you're used to paying your wife for sex.
I can't help but think some people are playing devils advocate in terms of backing Kenny. Hodgson wasn't afforded as much sympathy and patience and we all know Kenny is, but it's to detriment of our future because we're going nowhere with him in charge.
If we give him another season, he's not suddenly going to become a good manager and put the many wrongs, right. Lets have a good crack at the Cup and whether we win it or not, hope that Kenny steps down in the summer and we bring in a bright, enthusiastic, tactically astute manager who can bring out the best in a talented group of players(albeit new players will still be required).
I know he had a nightmare at Chelsea, but i wouldn't be totally against Vila Boas taking over. He's still going to be a top manager imo.
I'd say a manager that has won this league before is more likely to it again than a manager who's been a high profile failure here.
Surely you realise Krump that there is no such thing as a free lunch😉
I agree, but I'm not sure about AVB
Absolutely, which is why it feels a bit stupid when people mention Dalglish's work in deontological terms when he's earning fuckloads of money for it.
That so many Liverpool fans is so full of shit surprises me.... Comparing Kenny with Hodgson? What the fuck is going on? During woy we had 10 000 empty seats at Anfield. Yeah, Kenny Made a few mistakes, but we have had zero margin on our side in Any game. Look behind the fucking results and see that we had deserved better in 80 % of the games... When you look at chavs yesterday and sum today They are given results for free... We had none of that. Some of the players has not delivered and backed Kenny by dying for the badge, but the KIng deserves that the fans Get behind him! He is part of the reason the whole nation hate this club, and he certainly deserves more than the sore loser's shit he is being served.
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