Rodgers out !!!
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So.. What is good about him?
He was supposed to have a system where we are to utilize the ball setting up players in good position. Possesion based but still not only rolling the ball sideways - Well that demands two things. Pace on the ball and off the ball. We have none. And the players he select is not going to start moving either the feet or the ball with any pace.
He was supposed to give youth a chance- Joe Cole, Stuart Downing etc shows otherwise. One thing is being smashed 3-1 at home as a learning process for young potential stars... Another thing is the sad bullshit we witnessed yesterday. It is worthless and humiliating.
So far Rodgers have offered nada. He has made the team worse, and his stupid decisions are costing us big time. Introducing Hendo and Joe fucking Cole yesterday!! That must have scared the shit out of Villa.... He looks like he have absolutely no clue, and I guess that is what it is all about.
Rodgers doesn´t have a clue about who will contribute... Joe Cole had a goal, and i suddenly the new hit. Things happen due to coincidense and not because we have a plan. So if Assaidi suddenly played a game and had a good cross, he would be the new hit. He just have to take a lottery number and wait for the draw.
The biggest issue we have is what we all knew would be a massive problem in the summer, and that was not Rogers problem or his making he was let down and they have admitted that, that was Ian Ayre or the owners, although had he not been so adamant about not having Carroll near the team it might have helped.
The problem yesterday was partly of his making, playing so many players out of position and partly that we defended atrociously , all three things came together in the same game in a perfect storm.
It just highlights the need for a couple of decent players in this coming window.
Just how a team can have 70% possession, the lions share of the shots, nearly all the corners and get battered is bizarre, that is not to say it wasn't a fair result.
We can't just keep shedding managers.
Stop being such a hysterical bunch of women, and wait until he gets a couple of forwards before laying into him.
The problem yesterday was partly of his making, playing so many players out of position and partly that we defended atrociously , all three things came together in the same game in a perfect storm.
It just highlights the need for a couple of decent players in this coming window.
Just how a team can have 70% possession, the lions share of the shots, nearly all the corners and get battered is bizarre, that is not to say it wasn't a fair result.
We can't just keep shedding managers.
Stop being such a hysterical bunch of women, and wait until he gets a couple of forwards before laying into him.
So we're unbeaten for several games, then go and lose ONE and now he's underperforming? We've failed to consistently hit the heights, but then we knew on the last day of the transfer window that we had one genuine threatening attacker, so we knew consistency would be difficult to grasp.
There is some blind optimism, granted, but getting hysterical about an odd game that we don't see happen too often is just going the other way. We might not be wiping the floor with sides, but we've also performed well in games where it's been staggeringly obvious that we're lacking another attacking player or two to give us that edge. You can see that in the way we're dominating games but letting mistakes creep in by putting ourselves under pressure through not finishing chances.
People seem content to write it how they like, Macca doesn't like the guy so whatever he says/does (even down to him being misquoted with the "2nd" comment) is being used as a stick to beat him with.
I'm not sold on Rodgers, and I think that's largely a fair write up Keni (though the reaction to one game is ridiculous by some - I'm replying to the thread more than anything), but you know, four months in, not a massively different squad to last season and shy of a few experienced heads that we lost through no fault of Rodgers, I don't think it's too prudent to give him time and to have expected the odd bolt out of the blue like this. We have one striker at the moment and plenty of other issues that need addressing in the transfer market.
As I said earlier. The hypocrisy by some people on here is laughable. Kenny got a reprieve by many last season (me included), and most thought that he deserved another go at it. Despite having a similar season to this AND squadering £100m in the process.
Contrast that to the season Rodgers is having with less money and a depleted squad and explain where the consistency is. We all know what the difference is. One's a club legend and the other is a young guy trying to make his mark, but ultimately on a hiding to nothing because of fans who want everything yesterday and possess zero patience. Amazing really and pretty fucking sad. Best fans in the World. And if people want to take offense to that, I couldn't give a flying fuck. There's enough genuine positive lads on here who get a kicking continuously for supporting the team and putting a positive spin on things through thick and thin.
Undefeated for a while and then we get a reminder of what our flaws are and suddenly catastrophe has hit and people start rewriting the season. Wake the fuck up.
I don't know why I'm acting surprised though, we should be used to this bollocks by now. Fans will moan for the rest of the season with typically unrealistic expectations, pressure will lead to the guys at the top getting trigger happy, and we'll all be at it again this time next year with someone else. At least the "told yer so's" will be therapeutic for a while, until the knives come back out again for the next poor cunt.
Surely you didn't go around genuinely impressed with those games? It wasn't a run of great style, goals and drive, was it? It was generally a run in which the team managed (just) not to lose whilst huffing and puffing to no real effect. So like his magical early substitutions, this is now a cause to get the bunting out? It's this desperate over-eagerness by his supporters to seize on the most tiny and trivial things as signs of great managerial ability that only serves to make him look more pathetic than he might look.
As for your attempt to claim that ANYTHING that Rodgers says or does is used to criticise him, well, you know full well that isn't true, and I've said some positive things about his signings and some of his other actions, so, once again, a poor bit of stooping to misrepresent my argument.
I dont care about results one way or the others. We will not be top four and we will not be relegated... But I do care about performances, progress and signds about what will happen in the future. Maybe we have been unbeaten in a lot of games in arow, but we have not been good. We have not shown anything suggesting we will become good. We have not utilized the squad, however thin it is. We have not introduced any promising youngsters, but rather given Cole, Hendo and Downing the chance to shine. We have not set up any triangles and we have not come back in any game due to a small change in pace and energy.
We have been poo, we have bee easy to defend against and we have been consistent in one thing: Dont test their goalie.
We have been poo, we have bee easy to defend against and we have been consistent in one thing: Dont test their goalie.
I give up. When he's given youngsters a chance, apparently he's been forced to. Now he's not giving them a chance?
Go and have a look at the team sheets in all competitions this season and look who's figured. Wisdom, Suso, Sterling, Coady, Morgan, Yesil, Robinson, etc. How many should he play before he's either not having his hand forced or we all just pretend it didn't happen?
Like I said, when people start rewriting stuff to fit their agenda, it all becomes painfully transparent. And pretty fucking pathetic.
That's the same with PeterHague & Rafa though - he just says one or two things negative about Rafa so we don't out him as a "Rafa is the second coming of Jesus" Rawkite! 😉
Yes, quite, so YOU stop it, too. I haven't said anything about his not playing kids, so don't generalise about 'people' in that shifty way because it suits you in this thread.
Rodgers reminds me of the typical aspirant, anxiously waiting for the new season to load up on Football Manager. Armed with fearless and lofty ambitions, he spends hours tirelessly processing the data and stats at his disposal. His determination and dedication to find the best combination of numbers that will give him the best probability of a winning team, really is admirable.
Despite the various challenges imposed on his team, namely the lack of funds to revamp the entire squad into his mold, he perseveres and bravely tries to make the best of what he has got - hoping that by winning games, it will gain the confidence of the board and fans and fingers crossed, land a windfall of funds to buy a few choice players. This obviously, includes the constant lookout for an opportunity to wheel and deal to survive.
After an intensive autopsy of the team, he realizes he has inherited a bunch of under-performing and lazy misfits. He decides to offload them to raise cash to buy a few 'good' players he's scouted. He manages to sell most of them - only to discover to his dismay, the board has vetoed against spending all that cash raised on 'good' players. Transfer window closes. Uh oh.
Season begins. Results are average. He immediately goes back to the drawing board. Tweaks the tactics and team. Tries again. Another loss. Setback. Rethinks about tactics and considers dropping players who are low in morale. Including his star players. Due to the lack of options, he reluctantly involves players that he's ticked as 'transfer-listed'. Results fluctuate. He trudges on, treating each game as a written-off formality as he anxiously waits for the next transfer window to buy and mold his team into his image.
January's transfer window opens.........*to be continued*.........
Please feel free to continue everyone, as the plot thickens.......try not to end it the way we all know it will turn out to be. It's the season of hope and festive cheer, not doom and gloom.
Despite the various challenges imposed on his team, namely the lack of funds to revamp the entire squad into his mold, he perseveres and bravely tries to make the best of what he has got - hoping that by winning games, it will gain the confidence of the board and fans and fingers crossed, land a windfall of funds to buy a few choice players. This obviously, includes the constant lookout for an opportunity to wheel and deal to survive.
After an intensive autopsy of the team, he realizes he has inherited a bunch of under-performing and lazy misfits. He decides to offload them to raise cash to buy a few 'good' players he's scouted. He manages to sell most of them - only to discover to his dismay, the board has vetoed against spending all that cash raised on 'good' players. Transfer window closes. Uh oh.
Season begins. Results are average. He immediately goes back to the drawing board. Tweaks the tactics and team. Tries again. Another loss. Setback. Rethinks about tactics and considers dropping players who are low in morale. Including his star players. Due to the lack of options, he reluctantly involves players that he's ticked as 'transfer-listed'. Results fluctuate. He trudges on, treating each game as a written-off formality as he anxiously waits for the next transfer window to buy and mold his team into his image.
January's transfer window opens.........*to be continued*.........
Please feel free to continue everyone, as the plot thickens.......try not to end it the way we all know it will turn out to be. It's the season of hope and festive cheer, not doom and gloom.
You said he's been forced to play them.
What are FSG up to these days anyway? You couldn't shut them up prior to this season, or see more than a few matches without seeing Werner with his stupid fat grin or Henry with his enervated airs making their presence felt. Now you're more likely to hear from Bob Paisley. It's a strange way of supporting their young manager.
THAT I stand by. That's not contrary, which is the aim of your snipes on this thread. Lump everyone in together and condemn 'these people' with their incoherent arguments. It's lazy.
How's it lazy? Read Insigs response. It wasn't just directed at you, a few people seem selective about what credit they want to give him. Saying he hasn't played the kids isn't just wide of the mark, it's painfully incorrect, which is what I was having a go at in my reply to him.
I didn't see the game (I was looking at Rapunzel dresses in a Disney shop you could barely move in- joy!) and I didn't read the match thread but it's probably come to something when I didn't really need to. We've all seen it before.
I don't think the knives are out though Mark. Everyone wants Rodgers to do well ultimately and I think a lot of the arguments aren't directed at him but at each other and the views that get expressed on here.
I think there is very justifiable criticism and frustration. Rodgers has been naive at times, in my opinion, and I also think that there is much more that he can do to get this team more organized and more prepared psychologically. I think that when a manager can't buy his way out of a problem you get a measure of the man - right now I wish there was more to be impressed with.
I don't think the knives are out though Mark. Everyone wants Rodgers to do well ultimately and I think a lot of the arguments aren't directed at him but at each other and the views that get expressed on here.
I think there is very justifiable criticism and frustration. Rodgers has been naive at times, in my opinion, and I also think that there is much more that he can do to get this team more organized and more prepared psychologically. I think that when a manager can't buy his way out of a problem you get a measure of the man - right now I wish there was more to be impressed with.
If think that's about the size of it. And Keni - I agree, I'm not saying he's doing everything right, I do think his hands are tied somewhat though, but I do think we've played some good stuff, I'm not too impressed with his defensive organisation though, I think his set up is too open to getting whacked by a counter attack.
You're a super fan ... but not like Rael mind.
The reason I couldn't stand Rage was that he seemed more eager to be proved right about Benitez than to see the team improve. I'm most definitely not like that. And he actually seemed to be amused when the team lost. Again, I'm certainly not like that. If Rodgers proves me wrong, believe me, I'll be delighted, because whenever the club does badly it's agony for me. So disagree with me but don't impose motives and meanings on me. You know who you are.
As far as the defence is concerned, again, it bothers me that individuals seem to be held culpable rather than the coaching. It seems a long time ago since Skittles was hailed as brave for that awful error against Man City. Since then we've seen Reina and Enrique given a bit of a public negging and Downing, even though he was sent to play there, left to get a few more barbs from the critics. To some extent they all deserved it, and in Reina's case you could say that it's helped him, but it's clear that behind the individual failings there's something wrong with the coaching. For all of his failings, Rafa would never focus on personalities and focus instead of making the system work better. That's surely what needs doing now. There's little evidence of things being put right on the training ground and too much pointing at individual players.
As far as the defence is concerned, again, it bothers me that individuals seem to be held culpable rather than the coaching. It seems a long time ago since Skittles was hailed as brave for that awful error against Man City. Since then we've seen Reina and Enrique given a bit of a public negging and Downing, even though he was sent to play there, left to get a few more barbs from the critics. To some extent they all deserved it, and in Reina's case you could say that it's helped him, but it's clear that behind the individual failings there's something wrong with the coaching. For all of his failings, Rafa would never focus on personalities and focus instead of making the system work better. That's surely what needs doing now. There's little evidence of things being put right on the training ground and too much pointing at individual players.
I have
1 fella on the way out yesterday when I was criticising the players. I promptly ignored him and talked louder about how the players were shite
Tactically yesterday we had them beat. We were just sloppy and shit at scoring
Which is a good point, we are not getting anyone else apart from Suarez on the sheet, is Own Goals still our second highest scorer? Apart from Maxi, their games played v goals was pretty shit, and consequently no great loss, but we surely the plan would have been to get rid of three or four past their sell by date players and bring in a couple of decent ones.
As I said earlier, we are always going to have days when our defence has a real off day, and that is compounded when we have the eternal problem of us being incapable of scoring from the chances we create, we can't rely on Suarez all the time.
Yesterday was always going to happen at some point before we sorted the striker thing out.
It really was gross negligence of someone not to get this sorted in the summer, and that person certainly was not Rogers.
The other thing is we didnt score enough last season, and were still not scoring enough now. I don't think the failure to bring in another attacker is what's killing us, even though it would help.
Our midfield and defence are bigger issues for me, and they won't be sorted easily. We have bodies, but they aren't up to it and a lot of them are unmoveable on their current contracts.
Our midfield and defence are bigger issues for me, and they won't be sorted easily. We have bodies, but they aren't up to it and a lot of them are unmoveable on their current contracts.
I think the problem yesterday (I can't say whether this captures our season in a microcosm, as I've been working too much to watch us and that was the first game I've seen in ages) is encapsulated in the first half an hour - where we absolutely battered them, and did actually create a few clear cut chances - but every time the final pass was just a little behind, or there was something not quite right, or their keeper made a good save.
Then Villa get a little bit of space open up in front of our goal, having barely been in our half, Benteke takes a speculative shot and it goes in. I think it may have even been their first attack? One attack, one shot, one goal - completely against the run of play. After that we still weren't too bad until the second goal went in, at which point mentally we crumbled.
I think (at the risk of stating the bleeding obvious) that's the problem. Mentally we're weak. All that time when we were parked around the Villa box, nobody wanted to step up and take on the shot, it was all passing them to death but no end product - the exact opposite to what Villa did to us. There's not enough winners in the team, not enough people willing to step up and take some responsibility. Fair enough in the latter stages of the second half it was difficult to get any space for a shot as Villa had parked the bus by that point, but maybe we just need some bigger cojones and for people to have a go.
The possession stuff looks good, and if we were scoring goals it'd be fucking ace, because we'd be putting goals past them and then not letting them have the ball, so we'd be winning loads, but right now we're just looking pretty and then they score, and the good stuff goes to shit and we look all panicky.
More goals and a bit more bottle and we'd be winning more games and Rodgers would be sitting pretty. It's a long term project, we all knew that, we should see how it pans out a bit more before putting the boot in
Then Villa get a little bit of space open up in front of our goal, having barely been in our half, Benteke takes a speculative shot and it goes in. I think it may have even been their first attack? One attack, one shot, one goal - completely against the run of play. After that we still weren't too bad until the second goal went in, at which point mentally we crumbled.
I think (at the risk of stating the bleeding obvious) that's the problem. Mentally we're weak. All that time when we were parked around the Villa box, nobody wanted to step up and take on the shot, it was all passing them to death but no end product - the exact opposite to what Villa did to us. There's not enough winners in the team, not enough people willing to step up and take some responsibility. Fair enough in the latter stages of the second half it was difficult to get any space for a shot as Villa had parked the bus by that point, but maybe we just need some bigger cojones and for people to have a go.
The possession stuff looks good, and if we were scoring goals it'd be fucking ace, because we'd be putting goals past them and then not letting them have the ball, so we'd be winning loads, but right now we're just looking pretty and then they score, and the good stuff goes to shit and we look all panicky.
More goals and a bit more bottle and we'd be winning more games and Rodgers would be sitting pretty. It's a long term project, we all knew that, we should see how it pans out a bit more before putting the boot in
maybe so but with kuyt ,Bellamy,maxi we had people who you would expect to score once in a while whereas with the young kids they still seem goalshy and not convincing threat at the moment .
Suso and Sterling have a bad habit of side-footing shots towards the top corner which obviously worked against 5 foot nothing youth keepers, but sadly for them it amounts to nothing more than a tame pass back in the premier league. For that reason I don't expect them to score many goals from outside the box, nor do I expect Rodger's system to create fuck all chances inside the box.
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