Man City vs Liverpool PL

[Frogfish]

Our midfield pecking order, based on quality, longevity and impact:

Henderson
Gini
Fabinho
Milner
Shaqiri
Keita

The first three of much of a muchness, I don't think anyone would disagree that they are the top three midfielders we have, aside from Thiago who is a non-entity at the moment (though I'm sure you've already decided he's the best midfielder to have ever played for us, already). Shaqiri has been in and out the team because of injury, but pretty much always has an impact, Milner is versatile and always available, you know what you get with him. Keita has been injured, a passenger, occasionally quite good, but too often a massive massive let down.

If someone gave you that list when he signed, you'd be woefully underwhelmed and disappointed, well anyone else would be, you'd probably say he is the foundation for all of the other midfielders in the list, or some other bollocks.

Hyperbole doesn't become you. Yes I am disappointed in Keita as he is clearly a much better player than he has been for us but to disregard his improved performances and the statistics which demonstrate that he possesses the skills that are perfectly suited to our pressing style is to play the blind monkey. He needs to be more consistent and remain injury free.

Fabinho - world class. Possibly the best DM around.
Henderson - consistent and a leader
Thiago - proven, just needs to do it here once his injuries clear up and then he'll start most games
Gini - Consistent, strong and keeps possession well but not exceptional in attack or passing
Keita - has the potential to be a regular first team starter. Needs to put in more of those exceptional games. Do that and he would relegate Gini.
Shaqiri - will never be a first team regular but great to have as backup and have in the squad.
Milner - love the guy but he is aging and it shows in his game. I suspect this could well be his last season.

 

[tomasjj]

Skew what?

He's been a massive let down, compared to our other apparently less talented and less fashionable, lower priced midfielders. You don't need any stats or context for that. Whatever it was that people thought we were getting, he's fallen waaaay short of those expectations.

Completely agree that he has been a massive let down.
Not sure he can turn it around - it depends on his ability to stay fit.

Read my post, and you know what I referred to when I said skew. Momo was dishing out stats. If used, they should be done so properly.

 

[Woland]

I have been extremely vocal in my disappointment with Henderson from day one, but I struggle to see a team in world football that he wouldn't improve right now. I don't think we were wrong in saying he wasn't good enough, he just worked really hard and he's now the best midfield general in the world. Klopp is special and Henderson is the evidence.

 

[Frogfish]

In his first shite season? As opposed to his second shite season? Or this one where (once again) it's November and he hasn't even got going.

I'm happy that Klopp sees it that way, his record with players is excellent, but every manager has the odd duff signing here and there. If you want to go down the whole "who's got the coaching badges" route, we can do this all day.

His second season was our PL winning one - I posted his stats above. If you think they are shite then we hardly have a decent midfielder on our books.

 

[tomasjj]

Wouldn’t start Milner against the best field in England with De Bruyne, Rodri, Foden or (Silva / Gundogen). Gini and Henderson are definites and between Shaq and Naby then.

4231 then?
Hendo Gini

Salah Firmino Jota
Mane

 

[rubans]

4231 then?
Hendo Gini

Salah Firmino Jota
Mane

No way dude, too risky for this game.
Bobby starts for me instead of Jota and probably Shaq ahead of Naby because he just seems to have a good record when he starts.
Keep Jota and bring him on for the second half.
I will be happy with a defensive no high line showing and see how we do. Because it’s city away, happy to sit back and see how we do. They will attack so let’s see how we counter...

 

[mark1975]

I hope at least one of Shaqiri or Jota starts.

 

[tomasjj]

No way dude, too risky for this game.
Bobby starts for me instead of Jota and probably Shaq ahead of Naby because he just seems to have a good record when he starts.
Keep Jota and bring him on for the second half.
I will be happy with a defensive no high line showing and see how we do. Because it’s city away, happy to sit back and see how we do. They will attack so let’s see how we counter...

I am not sold on it, hence the question.

But I also worry about either Milner, Keita or Shaq starting in midfield against the City midfield away.

 

[rubans]

I am not sold on it, hence the question.

But I also worry about either Milner, Keita or Shaq starting in midfield against the City midfield away.

If Thiago was available then would have been no brainer for me and same with Fab.
But then last season we went with that and was way too open so will be quiet the challenge.

 

[Hansern]

"He's a quality player", no he isn't. He's very average.

You’re average.

 

[Gary25]

You’re average.

You should take up comedy, it's never too late. It seems my definition of a quality footballer is very different to yours.

 

[mwake]

Just skimmed through about the conversation on Keita. Seems like there's two camps, he's crap and he's a decent player who hasn't been able to fulfill his potential consistently. I'm definitely in the second group.

We definitely haven't had the player we were sold on YouTube with any consistency but we have seen periods where Keita had been the best player on the pitch.

Unfortunately he looks like one of those players who form gets reset after an injury ask it takes him a while to get back up to speed. But when he does he is boss player, he has great technical abilities for a defensive midfielder so much so that for a period before Thiago joined he was our main creative outlet from midfield.

Overall it's frustrating his injuries, he's in a similar bracket to Ox. I don't know about his contract but as much as I do like Keita I wonder how much faith Edwards and Klopp will have in giving him a contact extension considering the amount of time he is in the treatment room? Then again didn't sick note Lallana say he could have stayed at Liverpool but wanted to play?

 

[Hansern]

You should take up comedy, it's never too late. It seems my definition of a quality footballer is very different to yours.

The one thing we can agree on is having a different definition of a sicknote.

 

[tombrown]

I'll say it again - I like Naby

 

[FoxForceFive]

I like him, but I've lost patience with him tbh.

He's just not available enough to get a run in the side, & if any player screams of needing to get a run in the side to find his form it's Naby.

 

[RedStar]

I like him, but I've lost patience with him tbh.

He's just not available enough to get a run in the side, & if any player screams of needing to get a run in the side to find his form it's Naby.

To be fair he did get a run post shutdown and he was one of our better players second half of last season. Of course his lack of availability is still a massive problem but then thats no different to Matip, Shaq, Ox etc

 

[Gary25]

To be fair he did get a run post shutdown and he was one of our better players second half of last season. Of course his lack of availability is still a massive problem but then thats no different to Matip, Shaq, Ox etc

Matip Shaq Ox have all had big moments and spells of form in a Liverpool shirt. Keita hasn't.

 

[6TimesaRed]

Matip Shaq Ox have all had big moments and spells of form in a Liverpool shirt. Keita hasn't.

That's a bollocked statement that.


During the restart of the premier League he was by far our best player..

Superb at times.. tbf..

 

[Gary25]

That's a bollocked statement that.


During the restart of the premier League he was by far our best player..

Superb at times.. tbf..

The League was won less than a week into it restarting. Our games following that meant next to nothing as a result. Keita unlike the others mentioned has yet to make a vital and significant contribution over a period of time. I don't think that's up for debate.

 

[keniget]

There is no question that given the fee, hype and year we waited for him, Keita been a massive disappointment. He's obviously got talent though, which makes it all the more frustrating. I've long since given up on him turning into the 2 in 1 beast of a midfielder we were promised but I've still got hope he'll prove himself a good first teamer (though first he needs to prove he can stay fit).

I think Klopp will definitely play Firmino tomorrow. Kieta with Gini and Hendo in midfield and Nat Phillips at the back.

I think we'll lose as we're really exposed defensively this year (even before VVD got injured).

 

[Hansern]

Matip will start, not Phillips

 

[i_rushie]

It's no good expecting Naby to play like he did in those videos of him in Germany. It's not going to happen, just like Gini has not, in 5 years, played like he has been playing for his country. We want to be thrilled and wowed, but they are incredibly disciplined athletes.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Skew what?

He's been a massive let down, compared to our other apparently less talented and less fashionable, lower priced midfielders. You don't need any stats or context for that. Whatever it was that people thought we were getting, he's fallen waaaay short of those expectations.

Keita has spit in the face on Doc Mac’s campsite that’s for sure.

 

[MomoWASright]

(Not wearing a) Bib theory - Firm and Keita to start.

 

[Dreambeliever]

I can't believe Henderson is such an important player now. Absolutely shite for years, now world class. Madness.

so you are saying we just need to give Keita time 😀

 

[Dreambeliever]

Our midfield pecking order, based on quality, longevity and impact:

Henderson
Gini
Fabinho
Milner
Shaqiri
Keita

The first three of much of a muchness, I don't think anyone would disagree that they are the top three midfielders we have, aside from Thiago who is a non-entity at the moment (though I'm sure you've already decided he's the best midfielder to have ever played for us, already). Shaqiri has been in and out the team because of injury, but pretty much always has an impact, Milner is versatile and always available, you know what you get with him. Keita has been injured, a passenger, occasionally quite good, but too often a massive massive let down.

If someone gave you that list when he signed, you'd be woefully underwhelmed and disappointed, well anyone else would be, you'd probably say he is the foundation for all of the other midfielders in the list, or some other bollocks.

could be a case for Jones to be ahead of Keita at this stage.

 

[MomoWASright]

Has the team been leaked yet?

 

[dogboy]

Matip Shaq Ox have all had big moments and spells of form in a Liverpool shirt. Keita hasn't.

I'd sell all of them to be honest.

 

[mom]

Keita is a quality player.
Too often injured, sadly.

 

[FreshRed]

I have been extremely vocal in my disappointment with Henderson from day one, but I struggle to see a team in world football that he wouldn't improve right now. I don't think we were wrong in saying he wasn't good enough, he just worked really hard and he's now the best midfield general in the world. Klopp is special and Henderson is the evidence.

I think you might say that Henderson is a world-class leader combined with being a very good footballer.

He is the clear leader (among leaders) of a world-class football team. Yes, would improve any team in world football. World-class, IMHO.