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Lucas as central defender

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Was that the same period where he didn't get a look in for England? He was a good defensive left back but offered almost nothing going forward. We used to joke about him crossing the halfway line.

I was more referring to him as a CB where I think the idea of him being spoken about in the same light as the Hyppia or Hansen is laughable.

He was solid with some superb displays but equally some absolute rubbish for long periods and was dropped on more than one occasion

He was dropped once, by dalglish, when he was thirty fucking four. Still after that Rodgers had to bring him in for half a season because Skrtel and Agger were playing like dicks. Can you honestly name me the time frame where he was rubbish for a long period? Seriously? I bet you can't. Reina won the golden gloves what 3 times? with the 4th best team in the league and Carragher played at least 90% of those games.
 
Anyone that thinks Carra was anything but a top class defender and top player for us quite frankly needs to be put down - very few people read the game like him and could organise a defence like him- he was/is also a great student of the game
 
Every perma crocked player has a great rep

Ha, hard to argue with that as it's often the case - not always though. Everyone knew Michael Owen was useless after his first year back in England and same goes for Andy Carroll soon after he signed for us (well Fat Sam was an exception thankfully).
 
Another car crash.

About the DM.:
I would say that I would prefer never to see Lucas on the pitch while Can and/or Allen is on it. None of these players should ever be allowed to play at the same time. Allen Shouldn't even be allowed near the bench.

I hope that answers your question and Merry Xmas.
 
Ledley King was a fantastic player.

Fantastic? Fuck me. Nah. It was like Agger mythology. The more injured he got, the more fantastic he allegedly was. He wasn't better than Carragher, unless you want to take isolated spells of fitness as a given against 15 years of being an ever present.

I seriously don't know why I'm bothering arguing the toss, it's fucking obvious.

Next someone will say Micah fucking Richards was a better player too.
 
Anyone that thinks Carra was anything but a top class defender and top player for us quite frankly needs to be put down - very few people read the game like him and could organise a defence like him- he was/is also a great student of the game

Yeah. All of that. Plus he was actually *technically* (as the kids like to say) a really good footballer, too.

It fucking drives me nuts when his basic skill levels are denigrated- or indeed ignored - and some kind of , we've all read it: "great heart/ desire/ last ditch/ never gave up/ super Scouse loved the club bleeds red/ " bollocks, becomes the narrative.

That shit is spouted as if he's some kind of great example of how those things overcame his lazily assumed, and non-existent, deficiencies.

Yeah, those positives, they're all accurate, if you want.

But even without those ephemeral, mystical qualities, he was, at a fundamental level, a talented and gifted footballer, who could pass, tackle, control to a very high, very Liverpool, standard.

No qualifiers, no 'but he wasn't Alan Hansen' or fucking whoever; Jamie Carragher was one of the best defenders to ever play for Liverpool, and was a brilliant player
 
Every perma crocked player has a great rep
BPI-JT-England-Ecuador-00675-2773558.jpg
 
Yeah. All of that. Plus he was actually *technically* (as the kids like to say) a really good footballer, too.

It fucking drives me nuts when his basic skill levels are denigrated- or indeed ignored - and some kind of , we've all read it: "great heart/ desire/ last ditch/ never gave up/ super Scouse loved the club bleeds red/ " bollocks, becomes the narrative.

That shit is spouted as if he's some kind of great example of how those things overcame his lazily assumed, and non-existent, deficiencies.

Yeah, those positives, they're all accurate, if you want.

But even without those ephemeral, mystical qualities, he was, at a fundamental level, a talented and gifted footballer, who could pass, tackle, control to a very high, very Liverpool, standard.

No qualifiers, no 'but he wasn't Alan Hansen' or fucking whoever; Jamie Carragher was one of the best defenders to ever play for Liverpool, and was a brilliant player

Bang on. Well said
 
Yeah. All of that. Plus he was actually *technically* (as the kids like to say) a really good footballer, too.

It fucking drives me nuts when his basic skill levels are denigrated- or indeed ignored - and some kind of , we've all read it: "great heart/ desire/ last ditch/ never gave up/ super Scouse loved the club bleeds red/ " bollocks, becomes the narrative.

That shit is spouted as if he's some kind of great example of how those things overcame his lazily assumed, and non-existent, deficiencies.

Yeah, those positives, they're all accurate, if you want.

But even without those ephemeral, mystical qualities, he was, at a fundamental level, a talented and gifted footballer, who could pass, tackle, control to a very high, very Liverpool, standard.

No qualifiers, no 'but he wasn't Alan Hansen' or fucking whoever; Jamie Carragher was one of the best defenders to ever play for Liverpool, and was a brilliant player
Well said - incidentally I think the other person you described was Dirk Kuyt [emoji48]
 
It is.

The whole idea of moneyball is to find value that others cant find via the use of stats to build a better inforned picture.

Literally none of our signings fall into that category .

We've stuck with buying overpriced Premiership proven talent because our managers have been as stupid as our fans

But if you place any weight at all upon statistics, then you are including stupid information in your decision making process. You are statistically more likely to get it wrong. What I'm saying is that statistics is just a guise for being lazy, turning off your brain, and being unwilling to do the hard work of building a team. The only reason that statistics ever work, is because over a very large sample or over a very long time, your data will include every eventuality multiple times. The results will even out into a nice bell shaped curve like this.

normal67.gif



Let's use the history of Liverpool. The average net number of goals we score per game is, I don't know let's say 1.7. Over the last 120 odd years that is the mean. So if you can plot all of that data out from every single game, it will be a bell curve. That gives you a good guide as to the future, where over the next hundred years our goal scoring will fall under a similar distribution with a similar standard deviation. All good.

The point is, it is lazy. It doesn't factor in that goalscoring isn't a random phenomenon at all. It is deterministic. It depends upon fundamental reasons and mechanisms. Using your brain will tell you that at this point in time with this squad and with Lucas in our team, we are fucking shit. We are fucking shit. For the foreseeable future we will not be scoring anywhere near 1.7 net goals per game. Yet you would still have us follow the statistics and place our spread bets around 1.7. Why? Because it is "objective" or is "evidence based" or is "clever"? Don't listen to statisticians. Listen to me, I'm @dantes. You'd get wiped out and end up broke because you'd be wrong. You would be ignoring the reality of Lucas which is before your eyes. If you go to the gambling thread and see how @Pesam places his bets, and the background research of the deterministic factors he takes into account, that's how you make good decisions. But people no longer want to work that hard, or spend the time to become that clever.

It's a problem in every field. In medicine, in scientific research, in options trading. Lazy people using off the shelf statistics equations, instead of understanding the true mechanics and making their own equations. The last hundred years of stock price data falls under a random distribution which is how investment banks model it. Now why do you suppose they fucked up? Statistics are static, once all the results are in they model the entire collection. That is all they do. The real world needs you to react, adapt and model things which are changing, or are dynamic. Only a good scout can do that. Just because over many years and lots of players, a certain statistic works.... it is completely useless for one club, at one time with one player. Those statistics are built up using all clubs in all countries. What if something about Liverpool makes us an outlier? A black swan? Then for us, the statistics will be wrong every single time. And you would never know why because you would never use your brain.
 
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