FSG owe us more ...

[LeTallecWiz]

They've brought in Klopp, #6 and soon inshallah #19 ... However, if they want to dominate - and in the process, even make more money, they really should invest a wee bit more ... The below is tough reading considering what where we are and what we can maintain ...

 

[Woland]

They became billionaires by being extremely savvy cautious operators. Our competitors became billionaires by stealing a nations wealth or inheriting a fortune they don't give a fuck about. We can see the results of this playing out. Pros: The stats team. They got Klopp. They know a good deal when they see it. Cons: Will they fuck spend any money unless they see a cast iron guaranteed return.

 

[FoxForceFive]

Unfortunately, there are parallels within the financial world history to draw from here.

During the great depression, & every recession since, the uber wealthy became even more wealthy, as they can buy assets at knock down prices.

There's little difference here, Chelsea, PSG, City & perhaps Newcastle, will be able to buy the best players.

The rest of the worlds club's will be trying to run as actual businesses, & no business would spend future revenue when that future revenue is in doubt. It's fucking insanity.

We think of clubs as huge revenue generators, partly cos they pushed that image, but I heard on a podcast the other day someone saying that Liverpool make about the same as an out of town tesco superstore.

Using that analogy, if you're the manager of that store, & you've been told that thanks to the Coronavirus you have no idea whether there'll be any customers the following week, would you buy the same amount of stock as normal?

Like I said, it'd be insane to do so.

It's a huge kick in the teeth, cos I think we were on the cusp of becoming a generation defining side winning trophy after trophy, but it is what it is.

 

[Mors]

To be behind the top 2 isn't exactly surprising, but as for some of the others like Brighton and Watford etc.
But, to be fair, who would swap Klopp, the players he's bought out of that net spend, and the expanded stadium - to be in the position of Watford or Brighton.

 

[MomoWASright]

We’re treated like a business where they are treated like a hobby which is a money black hole.

 

[HC]

They became billionaires by being extremely savvy cautious operators. Our competitors became billionaires by stealing a nations wealth or inheriting a fortune they don't give a fuck about. We can see the results of this playing out. Pros: The stats team. They got Klopp. They know a good deal when they see it. Cons: Will they fuck spend any money unless they see a cast iron guaranteed return.

This

 

[LeTallecWiz]

They became billionaires by being extremely savvy cautious operators. Our competitors became billionaires by stealing a nations wealth or inheriting a fortune they don't give a fuck about. We can see the results of this playing out. Pros: The stats team. They got Klopp. They know a good deal when they see it. Cons: Will they fuck spend any money unless they see a cast iron guaranteed return.

But once he goes, we will be reliant on the stats team entirely ... and if we look at Dortmund as an example, what have they won since he left?

 

[juniormember]

I think we just have to hope that those that they've employed on the commercial/operational side continue to increase revenue so there are more funds to play with during transfer windows. We made something like 20m profit last fiscal year I think? And that was without spending much in transfers. Now with all the lost revenue due to COVID I can understand why we'll likely have nothing to spend.
There's no point saying they should spend their own money because they never will, as Woland says.
Of course the supporter in me completely agrees with you LTW. Now's our chance to stay at the top and we're probably throwing it away.

 

[Hansern]

We’re throwing it away because we didnt want to commit 100 mill £ to a Werner deal?
Thats very far fetched, to say the least.

 

[RedStar]

They've brought in Klopp, #6 and soon inshallah #19 ... However, if they want to dominate - and in the process, even make more money, they really should invest a wee bit more ... The below is tough reading considering what where we are and what we can maintain ...

The key part of this post is "if they want to dominate" Ive seen nothing to suggest they do. They are a smart business operationz they know that to keep the club appreciating in value it has to be sucessful, but only moderately so. Building a team to dominate for 4 or 5 years takes a huge outlay, look at City or Chelsea before them. There is glory in writing your name in the history books but not necessarily much more money. Barca have hoovered up titles at an incredible rate for a decade now. Massive revenues and tickets sold out for every game, they are still struggling to break even. I dont see FSG ever commiting to that model.

This current team is good enough to compete for another 2 maybe 3 seasons with luck, and hopefully we add more silverware in that period, we should. But we wont build a dynasty like we had in the 70s/80s or Utd had in 90s/00s.

 

[Mamma Mia]

Without getting drawn into the discussion of what they could / should be doing better, I'm just trying to imagine being in their shoes and having overseen the turnaround and success over the past few years, as well as all the positives in place for the future.

I'd be pretty annoyed by this reaction.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Without getting drawn into the discussion of what they could / should be doing better, I'm just trying to imagine being in their shoes and having overseen the turnaround and success over the past few years, as well as all the positives in place for the future.

I'd be pretty annoyed by this reaction.

The question is - what is the goal? to win 19/6 and then push on and become what the Mancs were in the last 30 years? or rest on our laurels? We have Klopp for 3-4 more years - and we've seen how Dortmund have progress without him (great signings, great managers, great players - no trophies of note as far as I know). We need to capitalize on this - and aim to push our dominance. We have such a good core - add pieces now, and the Mancs can be looking at us on top again after years of looking down at us. Do we push on, or stand pat ...

 

[Mors]

Can anyone who knows their shit with baseball, explain what FSG are upto out there, and where the Redsox money came from? I understand they've bankrolled some big contracts and won the wrold series a couple of times under them, but are there any similarities to us? Have they had a for 'transfer windows' where they've spent fuck all? Have FSG put any of their own money into the Red Sox?

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Can anyone who knows their shit with baseball, explain what FSG are upto out there, and where the Redsox money came from? I understand they've bankrolled some big contracts and won the wrold series a couple of times under them, but are there any similarities to us? Have they had a for 'transfer windows' where they've spent fuck all? Have FSG put any of their own money into the Red Sox?

YOu don't pay other clubs for players in general in American sports (You can in some trades, which I think you see mostly in the NBA).
You just shell a shitload on contracts

 

[Aidan O' Neill]

That table doesn't include the wage increases over that time. I'd guess the front 3 are on a decent wedge, VVD and Allison definitely earn more than those they replaced. Their first few seasons here they spent far more than they got out it. I think they've been very good owners.

 

[Silver Sean]

Christ.

 

[tombrown]

Fleecing Barcelona for Coutinho is the difference between being 4th or 14th in that list

 

[bluebell]

So next season is a complete write-off then? It's not even guaranteed if we sell we'll be able to buy

 

[Spionkop69]

I prefer that our success rate on transfers for sometime has been very good. They've also got great fees for players we've sold, such as Ibe & Solanke.

We spend within our means because we don't have bottomless pit owners. We have sensible and successful owners with a history of getting it right this way.

Look at Utd. Spend loads, haphazard buys for premium prices, who mostly don't or haven't delivered and bought mostly by leveraging debt on to the accounts.

If the Glazers wanted out, they'd have to find very rich buyers to sort out the debt. Frankly, why would they want out? They're not spending their own money, they're getting dividends and have been for a while.

I'll stick with our sustainable and successful transfer policy thanks. Especially in this uncertain financial climate.

Who was the last expensive dud we bought?

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Christ.

Don't get me wrong Sean - my gripe isn't with what FSG has done, my concern is we're missing an opportunity here to put our foot on the pedal and really put ourselves in a difference class for the foreseeable future ... I'm grateful, but we were fucking great for decades because we always kept teams strong, by pushing out aging or under-performing players and replacing them with the best talent we could pluck. Hopefully, Spion's analysis above works but I want us to be fucking great for decades now ... Once every 30 years is not good enough.

 

[Rosco]

I prefer that our success rate on transfers for sometime has been very good. They've also got great fees for players we've sold, such as Ibe & Solanke.

We spend within our means because we don't have bottomless pit owners. We have sensible and successful owners with a history of getting it right this way.

Look at Utd. Spend loads, haphazard buys for premium prices, who mostly don't or haven't delivered and bought mostly by leveraging debt on to the accounts.

If the Glazers wanted out, they'd have to find very rich buyers to sort out the debt. Frankly, why would they want out? They're not spending their own money, they're getting dividends and have been for a while.

I'll stick with our sustainable and successful transfer policy thanks. Especially in this uncertain financial climate.

Who was the last expensive dud we bought?

Naby

 

[Mors]

YOu don't pay other clubs for players in general in American sports (You can in some trades, which I think you see mostly in the NBA).
You just shell a shitload on contracts

Is that money for the massive contracts, money they've put in, or all self generated? I know they spent money on ground

 

[Mamma Mia]

It's not that I don't understand where this sentiment is coming from, but it's a bit like when Dreamy starts a match thread 5 minutes after the final whistle in a big game we win.

We haven't even won the league yet.

 

[Gary25]

We’re throwing it away because we didnt want to commit 100 mill £ to a Werner deal?
Thats very far fetched, to say the least.

Thought Werner was £50mil or so??

 

[737Max]

Thought Werner was £50mil or so??

£45m in wages over 5 years plus Chelsea are paying his agent £12m

 

[Gary25]

£45m in wages over 5 years plus Chelsea are paying his agent £12m

Don't really include wages when a transfer fee is being talked about. Of course it's mentioned but it's never been a thing to include it in a transfer fee.

 

[RedStar]

Don't really include wages when a transfer fee is being talked about. Of course it's mentioned but it's never been a thing to include it in a transfer fee.

Its always thrown in when people want to justify not signing somebody, as though we spent 2 years scouting him on the belief he was going to come and play here for free.

 

[Hansern]

Its always thrown in when people want to justify not signing somebody, as though we spent 2 years scouting him on the belief he was going to come and play here for free.

We didnt have Covid-19 as a factor in prior transfer windows. It would be a bit short sighted not to include all the outlays at this point of uncertainty.

 

[Hyena]

I don't think FSG 'owe' us anything. They have pretty much done as good as they can.

The fact is, our owners are one of the poorest in the Premier League. We are not a club that could afford to break FFP, because we don't have the means to. Chelsea on the other hand, have the cash and have been keeping their powder dry for a while now.

This is an uncertain period for all clubs and while I do think they should have spent on Werner, this is a decision I can live with.

 

[Silver Sean]

Don't get me wrong Sean - my gripe isn't with what FSG has done, my concern is we're missing an opportunity here to put our foot on the pedal and really put ourselves in a difference class for the foreseeable future ... I'm grateful, but we were fucking great for decades because we always kept teams strong, by pushing out aging or under-performing players and replacing them with the best talent we could pluck. Hopefully, Spion's analysis above works but I want us to be fucking great for decades now ... Once every 30 years is not good enough.

So do I. And it wasn’t aimed at your post per se. But we are never going be like City or Chelsea or Man Utd. Our owners have taken us from the brink of doing a Leeds to English, European and World champions their way. And it will stay the same. We don’t have sugar daddies or run at a massive debt. And we were never likely to pay a new player more than an established one. If Klopp had genuinely wanted Werner I believe we would have got him. Don’t you? I agree that we should build from a position of power like we did in the past but in the past we would be reading daily about Salah or Mane leaving for Spain but we’re not. That’s progress too. And who knows what effect this pandemic will have on the game and on us? I’m willing to trust those who’ve got us here despite being a bit gutted we’ve not grabbed Werner. After so much shit ownership and underperforming over the past 30 years I just want to enjoy what we have and not bemoan what we don’t, I guess