Explain like I'm 5

[mark1975]

I think he has good ideals about how a team should play, but ultimately, like anything, it's down to having the individuals to execute the approach effectively.

We clearly haven't got that. We can argue all day about his fuck ups in the transfer market, but the players haven't always been at his disposal and we lost a brilliant catalyst in Suarez.

He needs to be able to adopt an effect Plan B/C when things don't go his way, rather than rigidly sticking to his ideals without the players to carry it out effectively.

 

[6TimesaRed]

I think he has good ideals about how a team should play, but ultimately, like anything, it's down to having the individuals to execute the approach effectively.

We clearly haven't got that. We can argue all day about his fuck ups in the transfer market, but the players haven't always been at his disposal and we lost a brilliant catalyst in Suarez.

He needs to be able to adopt an effect Plan B/C when things don't go his way, rather than rigidly sticking to his ideals without the players to carry it out effectively.

^This... The plan B we resorted to last night when Lambert came on (lumping it upfield) made us look even more clueless..

 

[DHSC]

One thing we did very well last season was to score early goals, thus forcing the opposition to not park the bus. This season we are so slow to come out of the blocks.

Dunno if this is classified as tactics though.

 

[Squiggles]

Our best chances last night (Johnson run and Henderson) came from the wider areas. We no longer have the movement or the guile to pick are way through teams that defend well. Therefore moving the ball out wide would have helped. The manager should have move to 4-4-2 - moved Henderson back, replaced Coutinho with Lallana. He then should have pushed fullbacks forward with Sterling and Ibe tasked on the getting the ball accurately into the box. I'd have kept Ballotelli on because it suits his game and bought Borini on.

 

[Hansern]

We also have about 3 goals from 150 corners this season, with one being an OG.
Last season we scored a shitload from set pieces.

 

[red_maradona]

This is the team we should have played
-------ming-------
magic-skrtel-lovren-moreno
---------lucas---------
-----can------hendo----
----------coutinho--------
-------ballo------sterling---

Hendo and Can dominate midfield.
Ballo has a partner upfront
sterling presses

 

[Jack D Rips]

Two of those players are out injured though.

 

[Rosco]

One thing we did very well last season was to score early goals, thus forcing the opposition to not park the bus. This season we are so slow to come out of the blocks.

Dunno if this is classified as tactics though.

I think it is. If you get a goal up the other team cant sit back all the time

 

[Rosco]

We also have about 3 goals from 150 corners this season, with one being an OG.
Last season we scored a shitload from set pieces.

That was one of the good luck factors last year

 

[tombrown]

Play as a team

Pass and move

Every player to give 110%

But remember it is a game of two halves ... and don't forget to keep playing right to the final whistle.

Have players who can put the ball in the net

Have players who can defend

Use substitutes astutely

Be bold & adventurous but identify risk and mitigate accordingly

 

[6TimesaRed]

One thing we did very well last season was to score early goals, thus forcing the opposition to not park the bus. This season we are so slow to come out of the blocks.

Dunno if this is classified as tactics though.

And that why Chelsea played the way the did at anfield last season....

Intentionally slowed us down by wasting time.. To stop us taking control of the game early on..

Basterds!!!!!

 

[Rosco]

Probably quiffing, but last night sterling fucked us up time & again by cutting inside. If he'd have gone outside a few times I think we'd have stretched them a whole lot more.

That said, whenever Johnson & sterling got outside they had to cut back in & go around the edge of the box cos we had no players inside the area to cross to.

As much as that little shit Owen pisses me off, he always says that a quick cross into the box is what strikers thrive on & defenders hate, & he's spot on.

Problem is we have no real crosser of the ball (Henderson arguably the best?), & no striker currently to take advantage of that.

When the opposition is quite literally filling the area with defenders you need to do two things, drag them put of position, & give them multiple types of threats to deal with. Last night we only did two things, shoot from distance, & try to pass through the centre after going wide & going back around the box.

Utterly predictable.

Yup, and the likes of Pulis would know that on average 1 in 18 shots from outside the box results in a goal, and 1 in 20 crosses result in a goal.

Arguably we're below average at both? So it's obvious what to do against us.

So if they're going to allow us to shoot from distance and cross we need to put our best foot forward with the team.

If you're going to cross the ball, without Sturridge available it seems bizarre not to play Lambert. If we need distance shooting, Henderson is really all we have these days.

We're ill equipped to break teams like these down IMO.

The early cross is such a simple idea - yet we never do it. You want the ball going in while the defenders are retreating. Not when they're set in position

 

[the count]

It's no coincidence our counter attacking game really kicked into gear last season when we made Gerrard the anchor of the midfield.

But Lucas and Allen play too many sideways passes to allow quick counters

Not disagreeing with that but the reason this was so successful was that there was Suarez and Sturridge up front who started to move as soon as Stevie received the ball anticipating the pass.
Fast forward to the start of this season and we had Stevie looking up to find no movement of note ahead of him which led to the demise of that system being deployed.
Hendo has got a decent long ball in him as does Can but they are of no use if there is nobody ahead of them anticipating it.

 

[jexykrodic]

One thing we did very well last season was to score early goals, thus forcing the opposition to not park the bus. This season we are so slow to come out of the blocks.

Dunno if this is classified as tactics though.

Yes, you need to impose your game on the opposition. At present we're playing tippy tappy at the back allowing the opposition to set. We need to mix it up with an early long ball or the likes of Can bringing the ball up to the midfield area thereby keeping the opposition guessing.

I have no idea why we are allowing nervous defenders to have multiple touches of the ball before releasing it. It builds pressure. Why do we do it?

 

[EmreCan Idol]

I think one of the problems we have is trust. Last season Suarez would trust Sturridge, Sterling, Henderson and Coutinho with a pass and make the run beyond the defender. All five built an understanding, committed themselves to an attack.

This season....well it's individuals. Henderson and Coutinho will still knock it between each other and created a few chances last night. Coutinho obviously enjoys playing with Sturridge but he's been Hodgsoned for most of the campaign.
There's rarely any width, no ' third man ' running and in the last few games we've made Villa, WBA and Hull resemble Chelsea at Anfield last season. Ibe's been that one player who hasn't tried to replicate last seasons attacking moves without last seasons start strikers. I think we all saw Sterling's chipped through ball last night which was 20 yards away from any Liverpool player - Balotelli strolling around dreaming of firework displays and silly hats.

I hope Rodgers encourages Ibe to keep committing the fullback on the outside because Sterling and Coutinho mostly cut inside. We've been far too predictable this season.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Pick 11 players and dock pay from any player who isn't moving into a position to recieve the ball from the man in possession at all times. Our movement off the ball is non existent bar a couple of players

 

[RedStar]

I dont think there is one tactic necessarily that will allow you to dominate teams that come to park the bus, its largely about having enough variation in your play that the opposing team cannot settle into a comfortable pattern in defence. We dont seem to have that this year, largely because our front line has been so static and the only players presenting any threat are Coutinho and Sterling which makes it alot easier to force them wide or just out number them.

One of the things we did really well at times last year was to win the ball back high up the pitch, parking the bus relies of the defensive team being well organised and getting banks of men behind the ball in positions, if you can turn the ball over within 40 meters of their goal you have a much better chance of opening them up as half of their team are effectively out of position in a defensive sense. This requires tireless aggressive pressing from everybody, not just one or two players, if you press individually you will just waste energy and the opposing team will pass their way out, if you press as a unit you can be very successful at this. Last year Suarez led from the front in this regard and others followed suit, this year Sterling has done it at times, as has Coutinho but Sturridge and Balotelli have been laughable.

 

[Markeh]

Against an obvious park the bus side I'd start with not picking 3 centre backs or shite strikers who can't remember what a goal feels like.

So I'd have this side in mind for playing shit teams, it's not going to suit every opposition but I like having all our dangerous goal scoring players on the pitch in reasonable positions.

--------- Sturridge ---- Sterling
------------------ Coutinho
------ Lallana -------------- Henderson
------------------- Lucas
-- Johnson - Sakho - Skrtel -- Ibe

*Lallana I'm not sure about, Allen or even Can could go there. I feel like Can should definitely be in the side but I'm not totally sure where.

*With Sturridge injured I'd probably go with Lambert or nobody, that's how shite our Italian forwards are imo

 

[Ryan]

Football tactics.

Everyone is frustrated by Rodgers' inability to formulate any sort of cohesive approach to attacking teams.

So what should we be doing and why:

We're facing a team below us in the league, who we know are going to try and park the bus and hope for a counter attacking or set piece opportunity.

What players do we pick? What's the strategy? And why?

And if someone does articulately explain it to you (like me), what will that solve for you?

 

[juniormember]

And if someone does articulately explain it to you (like me), what will that solve for you?

How would a 5 year old take it?

 

[Rosco]

And if someone does articulately explain it to you (like me), what will that solve for you?

It won't solve anything, but if you know what the optimal strategy against a park the bus team is you can begin to judge the approach the manager has taken given the resources at his disposal

 

[mark1975]

It won't solve anything, but if you know what the optimal strategy against a park the bus team is you can begin to judge the approach the manager has taken given the resources at his disposal

Well look at Chelsea, despite the boring tag, they have an ability to fight with teams battling against relegation AND to draw out teams who put players behind the ball (not that Leicester are particularly defensive, but they've done it against other relegation fodder).

I think the crux of it is having goals in the team, you always have a fighting chance. We don't. Chelsea struggled against Hull but had enough in them eventually. We just lack any cutting edge at the moment.

 

[Rosco]

Well look at Chelsea, despite the boring tag, they have an ability to fight with teams battling against relegation AND to draw out teams who put players behind the ball (not that Leicester are particularly defensive, but they've done it against other relegation fodder).

I think the crux of it is having goals in the team, you always have a fighting chance. We don't. Chelsea struggled against Hull but had enough in them eventually. We just lack any cutting edge at the moment.

Cutting edge, goals in the team = clichés

Presumably this isn't what's taught in the Uefa coaching badges.

I'm asking about what the tactical theory is on how to approach a team that parks the bus. Without a reference to teams, or players.

 

[mark1975]

Cutting edge, goals in the team = clichés

Presumably this isn't what's taught in the Uefa coaching badges.

I'm asking about what the tactical theory is on how to approach a team that parks the bus. Without a reference to teams, or players.

They might be cliche's, which is the response I half expected, but it's still true. Chelsea have everything, they fight, the have class and they have goals. That's three cliche's right there but it's the fundamental parts of a successful Premiership side.

Watch balls tossed in to a Chelsea team against relegation fodder, they battle. We don't. That's for starters.

 

[Rosco]

Right,

But that's nothing to do with the x's and o's which is what I'm asking about.

Your answer is essentially have lots of really good expensive players. If that's the problem then Rodgers is doing nothing wrong, we just don't spend like Chelsea so can't be expected to beat Hull

 

[StevieM]

Why the fuck would I explain it like you're 5.

I'd put on a Disney DVD and let the whole thing mesmerise you till you fell asleep.

 

[Rosco]

Why the fuck would I explain it like you're 5.

I'd put on a Disney DVD and let the whole thing mesmerise you till you fell asleep.

It's not a fucking trap

 

[mark1975]

Right,

But that's nothing to do with the x's and o's which is what I'm asking about.

Your answer is essentially have lots of really good expensive players. If that's the problem then Rodgers is doing nothing wrong, we just don't spend like Chelsea so can't be expected to beat Hull

It's not really about having loads of expensive players, it's about having the right combination of players. That doesn't have to be an expensive ask, you just have to buy to suit your needs (cf your point about Benteke's output). There are small details tactically, like Sterling refusing to exploit the acres of space on the outside of the fullback, and instead cutting in to run into a wall of players. So it's naivety on our part aswell.

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, that it's complex? That it isn't? That it's just down to buying expensive players, ergo the manager doesn't matter?

 

[Rosco]

It's simple. In order to judge how well a manager is approaching a game you need to consider:

1. Identify the optimal strategy - what set of tactics (in theory) is the best way to approach the team.

2. Identify specific areas of weakness in the opposition.

3 By merging the theory and the knowledge of the opposition you get an ideal game plan.

4. Determine how best your squad can execute that plan plan.

If you don't know what no. 1 is you can't judge how well a manager is doing tactically.

It isn't simply good tactics = good results Or vice versa

So I'm asking what no. 1 is against a team who will Park the bus?

 

[StevieM]

It's not a fucking trap

Look.... big kitties that can speak and are nice...