Well it's a debate for tomorrow as I'm off to bed - it's after 03.00 here! I'd love to see stats though ( @King Binny ) because it seems my brain forgets details rather too quickly for my liking nowadays!
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Burnley (H) - Sat 15:00
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Trent playing at RB or inverted RB - everyone can see he's not a very good defender and we have a problem on that side. Sure, his attacking prowess has more than often outweighed/papered over his defensive problems, but it doesn't mean it's the only/best answer to just keep flirting with danger. The answer has been obvious for ages, we just keep taking risks and then when it doesnt pay off we try to fix it in game. Rather than, you know, having the best of both worlds and playing a proper RB and Trent from the off.
When Klopp leaves it will for me be the one blemish on his time with us. Something he's never truly got to grips with and sorted 100%. To think otherwise is just a CDNW mentality.
When Klopp leaves it will for me be the one blemish on his time with us. Something he's never truly got to grips with and sorted 100%. To think otherwise is just a CDNW mentality.
I’m more in the 2 losses in 34 games and 3rd best defence in the league camp in regards to why a mid season shift in position wont happen.
Trent is key for us from RB. Been so for 300 games. No need to change before the run in.
The talk of him being a bad defender is over exaggerated to the extreme btw.
We didn’t forget about inversion - Gomez inverted on the left instead.
We need that extra man in the midfield or the DM gets overrun.
The inverted FB is essential to how we play, so the only way it’s going is if we play a double pivot at the base of the midfield.
If we do that in order to play a “proper fullback” then either pick which one of the 3 forwards you’re dropping or go with significantly weakening our forward press by pulling one of the other midfielders out.
If we do that in order to play a “proper fullback” then either pick which one of the 3 forwards you’re dropping or go with significantly weakening our forward press by pulling one of the other midfielders out.
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Excuse me, we lost! Your thread starting privileges have surely been revoked!!
Like Klopp, Brizzle has credit in the bank to mitigate that shitshow.
I'm fighting on four front hombré. It was a hectic Christmas period, too many scotches and not enough squatses. I am almost rejuvenated and ready for the run in.
Although if I have to start many more threads saying "i wonder if we'll learn from the last game and play a right back at right back" I might lose my mind.
It was clearly related to the Judge Jules disappearance, which makes it even more important that he's found, healthy and well, as soon as possible.
Those who follow the true pre match thread anti-jinxiness... we didn't get one for this game
Does this mean that JJ was Jason all along?
cc: @tomasjj @doctor_mac
Does this mean that JJ was Jason all along?
cc: @tomasjj @doctor_mac
If you need me to avoid defeat against City just let me know. 😉
Actually very concerning.
That’s the point though - we didn’t go through January without it.
The system we play has one full back inverting while the other gets further forward.
While Trent was out, Gomez inverted on the left allowing Bradley to get up and down.
When Trent inverts then Gomez, Robbo or Tsimikas play as a more traditional LB.
Gomez even inverted when he played RB.
It works because the inverted player gives us an overload in the centre, which means we can play through opposition press more effectively.
In theory that’s supposed to give us more control and make it harder for other teams to play through us. It also means the only way the opposition can match us for numbers in the centre is by pulling one of their wide players inside.
I mean, we saw last season what happens when you go with a single DM against teams in the Premier League - too much space for one person to cover and too few passing options to play through a well drilled press.
Our problem is more the risk/reward of playing a more direct style and trying to get the ball forward fast to catch teams in transition and utilise Darwin better.
We give up control when we move the ball fast and direct. We give up opportunities when we slow things down and give opposition time to re-set and we can’t catch them out in transition.
That’s modern football for you.
Our problem is more the risk/reward of playing a more direct style and trying to get the ball forward fast to catch teams in transition and utilise Darwin better.
We give up control when we move the ball fast and direct. We give up opportunities when we slow things down and give opposition time to re-set and we can’t catch them out in transition.
That’s modern football for you.
The start of the second half against arsenal, there was clear instruction for jones to drop deeper to aid macca. Personally, i don't know why we don't just try the traditional double pivot, with 2 flying full backs?
Bradley ibou vvd robbo
endo trent
Macca can drop in for endo or trent, and we have szob, jones, elliott, gravy (urgh) who can all drop in as the 10. To be honest, the way mo plays cuttin inside, he's pretty much a secondary 10 anyway. Effectively play a 4-2-2-2? but with the inversion coming from the winger to the number 10 position rather than reduce defensive stability
All these discussions about inverted fullbacks like it’s something radical.
Some of you younger ones probably don’t know much about total football then.
Pep, Klopp, Xabi, De Zerbi and many of today’s modern managers who favour a high press all play some brand of what was once known as total football. Tiki taka, gegenpressing, false 9 - call it whatever you want - total football has been around for decades. Its basically where every outfield player is skilled enough to take up any position on the pitch and still be able to contribute to the collective whole. Nothing new under The Lying Rag.
I think in the PL, City comes closest to playing that sort of football. Any player can come in and slot in easily into any position and still be effective.
The Dutch used to produce some of the most talented players ever. Whatever happened to them now ?
Some of you younger ones probably don’t know much about total football then.
Pep, Klopp, Xabi, De Zerbi and many of today’s modern managers who favour a high press all play some brand of what was once known as total football. Tiki taka, gegenpressing, false 9 - call it whatever you want - total football has been around for decades. Its basically where every outfield player is skilled enough to take up any position on the pitch and still be able to contribute to the collective whole. Nothing new under The Lying Rag.
I think in the PL, City comes closest to playing that sort of football. Any player can come in and slot in easily into any position and still be effective.
The Dutch used to produce some of the most talented players ever. Whatever happened to them now ?
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It different to total football. Everyone moves around and fills in for each others positions; here it's just Ibou covering for 2 positions and hoping trent can bother his arse to run back
If it was total football we'd see less of these issues, but other different problems
Ah, the Tim Robinson Band. Sing if you're glad to be 2-4-6-8 cul de sac
Like I said earlier, then you lose one of the forwards and you have one less player in the forward press.
Having Mo drop into the 10 position completely fucks our forward press - it’s the two 8’s - normally Curtis and Dom - that lead our press - Mo just isn’t good at that and it’s not going to make best use of his skills.
I think it’s a possible (or even likely) future formation when Mo leaves, but even then I’d give it 2 games against low block teams before the threads start about going back to 3 up front because we can’t score.
We’ve had an amazing set of results since employing a an inverted full back system - I don’t see why we need to change it on the back of one bad result.
Jason is not present.
That is why.
Is he ever?
We've had a great set of results but it's always the exact same issue; the defence is stretched due to Trent not getting back to help ibou.
In games against a counter attacking side it hinders is, as we're short at the back against pace on the right side. Against more sensible sides they just hound our 6, like arsenal did, like city did, like Brighton did.
Our best period of success was when we had a right back behaving like a right back.
I'd argue that we've had a great period of results in spite of the inversion, rather than because of it
We won't. Least not this season
Is Jason JJ?
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