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Blackburn Away

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-----------------Doni----------------
Flanno--Coates--Skrtel--Aurelio?
---------Spearing--Shelvey---------
---Maxi-----Gerrard-------Bellamy
---------------Suarez------------------


Please.
 
Ryan said:
I have no idea how many times they've played together Mark, but I'm gonna gues it's about 15, maybe 20 times. I'm happy for someone to provide me the exact figure.

And in that time they haven't combined once. Not even one time. And we paid youknowhowmuch for that?
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Thats not true though is it. Not that it matters to much but they did in the FA cup.
 
Gerry_A_Trick said:
That's not quite accuate.

"Liverpool have scored 37 league goals; 21 of them (56.7%) have been scored with Andy Carroll on the pitch, despite starting only 16 games."

So in Carroll has started about 50% of the time, and presumably played more due to subs, and about the same percentage of goals have been scored in that time. So it's just the wording that makes it look like he should play more.
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Its not. He should play more. As we score more goals and get more points on the board.
 
Ryan said:
I'm up against people arguing the old Carroll and Downing partnership equalling points debate.

We're 8th and they haven't combined for 1 goal all season. For just the 55 million quid.

I'M FUCKED
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I come in peace. Hands over my head, I'm not armed.
Now, they've combined for one goal. Just saying.

 
If we're talking cups then Carroll and Downing started in our best wins of the year against Manure in the FA Cup and Man City in the carling cup.
 
Its the only thing Im agreeing with Ryan, they didnt combine. At all.
Everyone's talking about Carroll but Downing has been even worse, useless.
 
There's two main problems I can see with the Downing/Carroll combo:

1) Downing has been shit at aerial crosses, he just chips/floats a nothing ball over. (He's pretty good at non-aerial crosses)
2) Carroll has been shit at attacking the few decent whipped at pace crosses teamates have provided. When he does manage to get his head on it and direct it goalwards, that's about the sum of it.

Ergo it hasn't worked very well.

On the other hand, I do think both players provide something that their competition for places doesn't, hence we tend to do better with them in the side. Just not 55m better.
 
The main problem is Carroll's flat out refusal to get into the box, it's embarrassing for a striker.
 
Hansern said:
We pick up 1.95 points when he and Downing starts, and 1.05 when they dont.

And how is 6,7% more goals the same?
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Because it's a small sample, it's two goals difference over the course of a season. It didn't include the last game either, so it's now one goal difference.
And the stat only goes into games he's started, not whether he came on as a sub in the other games, or if he was actually on the pitch when the goals were scored. It's a rubbish, misleading stat.

The stat on points gained when certain players play is a rubbish one too.
 
Mystic said:
The main problem is Carroll's flat out refusal to get into the box, it's embarrassing for a striker.
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carroll drops deep because he is isolated, I'm pretty sure he feels if he doesn't drop deep to collect the ball then he isn't going to get a touch all day.
 
Hansern said:
Indeed. All he ever talks about is the transfer fees, and its like a broken record. Which of course has no relevance when we're trying to field the side that wins us the most points.
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or the fact we need better players as if anyone with eyes needed reminding.
 
Gerry_A_Trick said:
Because it's a small sample, it's two goals difference over the course of a season. It didn't include the last game either, so it's now one goal difference.
And the stat only goes into games he's started, not whether he came on as a sub in the other games, or if he was actually on the pitch when the goals were scored. It's a rubbish, misleading stat.

The stat on points gained when certain players play is a rubbish one too.
Click to expand...

I think we'll leave it at that then.
 
I think the fact that we're twice as likely to win when they play is more than just an interesting stat. It's probably key to our problem this season. We've persisted with losing ways and ignored winning ones.
 
It's a rubbish stat.

Here's the 11 games we've won in the league:
Arsenal - Caroll goes off after 71, we score in the 78th and 90th minute
Bolton - Carroll comes on when we're 3-0 up, ends 3-1
Wolves - 2-1 Carroll plays 90 minutes
Everton - 2-0 Carroll plays 90 mintues and scores
West Brom - 2-1 Carroll plays 90 mintues and scores
Chelsea - Carroll comes on in 90th with the score 2-1
QPR - Carroll doesn't play
Villa - Carroll comes on when we're 2-0 up
Newcastle - Carroll plays 90 minutes
Wolves(A) - Caroll plays and scores
Everton - Carroll plays

So, Carroll has been on the pitch while we've won 6 of them, and we've won 5 others(probably against the tougher sides, but we'll leave that aside). Carragher has been involved in 5, and not in 6. Kelly is the same. Johnson has been involved in 6. What exactly do we learn from that? Well, pretty much nothing. We've generally beaten the easier sides, and Carroll tends to play against them more.

For years the stats used to show we'd win more without Gerrard too. It didn't mean he shouldn't play. It's a rubbish stat, that doesn't take lots of things into account(opposition etc. etc.)
 
the biggest arguement for playing carroll again and again is you can clearly see him improve when he is given a minor run and just as he gets into 'relative' form he is dropped.
 
Stats aside, Kenny has a job to save and unless he or the owners have already made up their minds the only way he can do that is by winning games.

United turned up at Blackburn last week looking for a point. They probably walked away with 3 because of De Gea in the first half and then they do their smash and grab raid late on. I want to see attacking options tonight because the way we have been playing 451 invites other teams to have a go at us and usually opposing teams get points converting the only chances they get all game (Arsenal, QPR, Wigan, Villa). We can't play a high line with Carragher so the gap between the back 4 and midfield has to compensate for that, inevitably leaving the solitary striker exposed.

If Carragher plays, he plays. But 442 should give us more attacking options and also send out a statement of intent. That's what I want to see tonight going into Saturday. We did it for the last 15 minutes against Villa....
 
Looks like Sterling could be involved vs Blackburn. He's not in the squad for today's reserves game.

AqH9xLmCQAEkiGc.jpg
 
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