YES! Been waiting for this thread. Thank you good SirGoing to put some thoughts on the 2020-21 accounts in this thread for anyone who can be arsed reading. Sorry to go all "The Athletic" on you in the levels of detail. I'll split it up with some TLDR summaries for each bit.
No he didn't.. he said Villa owe us.Not bad Beamy but you missed out the 42M we're owed from Barca and that Nike are forking out for M'bappe's contract for the shirt sales.
I mean, I even put a smiley next to it FFS! 😉No he didn't.. he said Villa owe us.
Stop reading the TLDR versions and read the whole thing doc.
I've been caught out.I mean, I even put a smiley next to it FFS! 😉
Remember the camping edict : Leave No Trace !Starts to pack up and clear out the "MBappe to Liverpool" campsite.
Thanks for the analysis mate.CASH FLOW
TLDR - starting to look more normal, I'm not convinced we'll be spending a lot on new players this summer.
Historically, the key to understanding LFC’s finances was cash.
Between 2011-12 (FSG acquired LFC) and 2017-18, the total cash flow was a net increase of £8m (total). The cash flow in/out was never more than £6m in any of those individual years. Basically, we spent what we earned.
In 2018-19, that started to change. Cash inflow was £27m, then £112m inflow in 2019-20, followed by £118m OUT in 2020-21. So across those three years, a total of £21m IN. That suggests it’s probably best to ignore the year-on-year differences and focus on the three year-cycle (which is closer to the previous long-term pattern).
Of course, in those three years we had a CL/EPL runner up spot, a CL win, a EPL win and covid. All of those things will have thrown things out of whack with cash being earned after the January transfer window (when we might have spent it had we known it was coming in). For reasons I still don’t understand, the club drew down all but £3m of its bank facility at the end of 2019-20 (leaving a wad of cash in the bank), but it has gone back to a more normal pattern in 2020-21 (still a high cash balance by historic standards, but just £32m, compared to £149m the year before (long-term trend prior to 2018-19 was single-digit £millions).
My reading is that, in a normal year, the club spends on players what it earns on operations, but bear in mind that cash spending can include instalments on deals in prior years, so although our net spend (ignoring timing differences) in 2019-20 was basically £nil, our net cash out was £90m, because we were still finishing paying instalments for Alisson, Fabinho, Keita, Salah, VVD. By contrast, in 2020-21, our purchases less sales were £93m, but our cash out was £56m (so there’ll be more to pay this year and next).
The club doesn’t split out transfer debtors and creditors, but the amounts due after more than one year are almost certainly transfers, which says that we’ve got a starting balance to pay in 2022-23 of £46m (net of receipts on sales), before taking into account any spending in the current season.
So that says to me that the likelihood of major spending in the summer is dependent on four things:
- Whether we make any big sales
- How successful we are this year in bringing prize money in for CL / EPL
- Spending on the Anfield Road stadium (which could easily be £40-50m this year)
- Whether Aston Villa finally pay us the £42m that Barca owe us for Coutinho 🙂
To me, it looks unlikely we will splash the cash in a big way this summer, and we know Diaz was a deal that was brought forward to January due to Tottenham’s interests, but it’s one we could probably afford because of how well we’re doing this year. I’d like to be wrong.
EDIT - also if we're forecasting a big surplus for 2022-23 (i.e. increase in operating profits) then that would also give us some extra money to spend in Summer, but I'm not aware of any major factors which would suggest exceptional profits.
Broadly, yes (that was what I meant by my point 1).Thanks for the analysis mate.
I assume that if we were to cash in on one our players this summer then your opinion on our transfer budget/spending might change.
Hypothetically, a transfer fee of £100m for Salah would allow us to bring in two £50m players
I know I’ve probably been banging this drum for a while, but the only space we have in the current squad is for a homegrown player.
If Adrian’s contract runs out at the end of the season we’re short a 3rd choice experienced keeper with a slot each for home grown and overseas.
The only notable loan players I think we need to make a call on whether to release or include are Nathan Phillips, Ben Davies and Ben Woodburn.
I expect they’ll all be sold for whatever we can get - we don’t need specific replacements.
I really don’t see us adding much more to the team, other than obvious bare essentials, unless we either decide to sell Salah, or we decide to get rid of either Keita or Thiago and look for a more central midfield type.
McGinn from Villa… maybe.
I know I’ve probably been banging this drum for a while, but the only space we have in the current squad is for a homegrown player.
If Adrian’s contract runs out at the end of the season we’re short a 3rd choice experienced keeper with a slot each for home grown and overseas.
The only notable loan players I think we need to make a call on whether to release or include are Nathan Phillips, Ben Davies and Ben Woodburn.
I expect they’ll all be sold for whatever we can get - we don’t need specific replacements.
I really don’t see us adding much more to the team, other than obvious bare essentials, unless we either decide to sell Salah, or we decide to get rid of either Keita or Thiago and look for a more central midfield type.
McGinn from Villa… maybe.
That's assuming no deparatures though, isn't it?
I do agree with you that generally, we don't make a lot of wholesale changes. But Keita, Ox, Salah, Mane, Firmino have their contracts ending in summer of 2023. Milner this summer and Origi, either this summer or the next depending on how the automatic extension kicks in. I cannot see FSG agreeing to contract extension for all of them in the first group. Outside of the fringe players like Woodburn and Adrian, there is a good chance that we see two or three departures (atleast one among Keita,Ox; atleast one among Salah, Mane, Firmino) among the players. Whether the sales will raise enough money to get replacements, I am not sure.
Yeah… but next summer is when a lot of the kids - Jones, Neco will need to be registered.
I see a few of those players extending or being allowed to leave on a free.
I just don’t see us making wholesale changes.
I agree that Keita might be the one to go, but unless others push to leave - then I’m kind of happy for them to stay.
Not arguing with you, just curious, you think all three of Mane, Salah, Firmino will still be with us next season?
Not arguing with you, just curious, you think all three of Mane, Salah, Firmino will still be with us next season?
Personally, given the age profile of our squad, I wouldn't be surprised if FSG does not approve of the renewal of the contract of all three. Particularly Firmino. Unless he is willing to take a wage cut. Which I highly doubt he will agree to.