I was about five rows back from that
Pre Match - Arsenal (a) - Weds 20:15
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I didn't hear what Arteta said but TBH box-to-box they were good. Played out well from the back often beating our press (except for the one time we got them in the final third that led to our second - and we should be patting ourselves on the back for that one), in midfield they were aggressive and won the ball back, or played around us, numerous times ... but also TBH they were useless around the box, creating nothing - they had only two real chances (inc. the Martinelli low cross in the 6 yd box) and the other was an awful Thiago back-pass that had little to do with them per se.
So yeah box to box very good but totally lacking creativity as VvD and Robbo nullified Saka / Cedric and (with some effort) Matip, Trent and Hendo containing Martinelli when he broke. Matip being given MotM says a lot.
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Hmmm what is on the menu for the Etihad?
It's a fair point RE playing out but it inevitably always ends up with Martinelli or Saka who, while dangerous, were well contained and didn't really threaten too much in terms of creating clear cut chances.
It's a direct contrast to say away at Burnley, with their direct style, they were usually one offside away from a shot on goal. The direct to goal route seems more effective against us than the box to box measured passing route. So if Arteta thinks his box to box style works well while not really threatening, then more power to him and better for us.
Interesting point. It looks like some PL teams work specifically on ways to breach the high line and those who do it well create lots of problems for both us and City – i.e. Tottenham, West Ham, Leicester – and others like Brighton, Wolves, Arsenal focus more on what happens between the boxes, trying to have good possession and control the midfield. Those can be uncomfortable to play against, but there is more danger in losing points to the first group, the ones who try to hurt you directly.
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Yeah, this was masterful goalkeeping. First, he didn't give Lacazette a chance for a shot at goal, forced him to lay the ball off. Then he focused completely on Odegaard, first keeping his hands and body low to guard against a first-time finish, then as soon as he took the touch he knew it will be hit high and spread his body just in time. In an uncomfortable situation forced off his line, he somehow was always in control.
Brilliance ! 😀
Sweetcorn and olives on the pizza... Heathen.
This is some good writing and good analysis too:
=======================================
Nothing wasted in Jürgen Klopp’s ruthlessly efficient Liverpool
Liverpool withstood everything Arsenal could throw at them and took advantage of fine margins to score their goals
Jonathan Liew
The gap through which Thiago Alcântara threaded his pass to Diogo Jota: a yard, at a generous estimate. The space that Jota found at Aaron Ramsdale’s near post to jam the ball in: maybe a couple of feet. The space in which Roberto Firmino had somehow to divert Andy Robertson’s cross past a goalkeeper literally standing next to him: a matter of inches. These are the margins that are taking Liverpool towards the top of the Premier League, and right now they are managing to find them better than anyone else.
The match in summary: Arsenal were the better side for 50 minutes and did nothing with it. Liverpool were the better side for the next 15 minutes and killed the game comprehensively. As for the rest, who cares? Arsenal ran and rampaged and fumed and fought, just as they had done all night. But there is something heroically dispiriting about giving your best even when you know it is not remotely good enough.
Arsenal are a team in chrysalis, still learning and developing. They were quick and hungry and inventive, passing the ball beautifully through midfield, showing desire and intent, getting themselves into good positions. But they couldn’t find the gaps. When a clinical finish or a pinpoint cross or a perfect through ball was required, they couldn’t locate it. Mikel Arteta has built an excellent playing machine. Jürgen Klopp, by contrast, has built a winning machine, and here the difference between the two was stark.
Thomas Partey was scintillating in the first half but dropped his level in the second. Bukayo Saka was tireless on the right flank but made a crucial error that let Robertson in for Liverpool’s second goal. Martin Ødegaard played some brilliant passes but missed a golden opportunity to put Arsenal in the lead. Meanwhile, Jordan Henderson was excellent for 90 minutes. So was Alisson. So was Virgil van Dijk. That was the difference.
It was a difference in demeanour, too. On the touchline Arteta was a picture of perpetual motion, pointing and waving, squeezing an imaginary accordion between his hands, urging more conviction, more running, more of everything. And for much of the game Arsenal were certainly the more kinetic team, all coiled energy and righteous fury. But somehow Liverpool were always the happier one, confident in their extra gears, their superior big-game nous, the Golden Boot winner sitting on their bench.
There were signs early in the second half that Liverpool were on the move. There was a conscious effort to be tidier in possession, to get the ball down and play it through Arsenal rather than punting it over the top. It was from just such a pass that Thiago found Jota for the opening goal: a goal that sprang not just from immense technical quality but pure faith, faith in the method, belief in the plan.
Jota scored and was hauled straight off for Firmino. The coldness! This is the other thing about Liverpool these days: in times past you might have sensed them getting a little jittery as the game reached the hour mark, nervously glancing over at the bench and wondering whether Xherdan Shaqiri would really be an upgrade on anything. Now they have a bench as good as any in Europe. Beat them once, and you then have to do it all over again.
Firmino deftly flicked in the second goal and Liverpool saw out the game with few alarms. You could hardly blame them for pedalling down a little. This was Henderson’s 40th game of the season in all competitions, Jota’s 38th, Van Dijk’s 37th. These guys have played essentially an entire Premier League season by March. There is still a cup run and a European campaign to be pursued.
And so what they have learned over the years is the ability to pace themselves, to harness their physical and emotional resources, to pare and slice away anything extraneous until only what is most essential remains. They hardly ever waste energy on a ruck. They press not with mindless abandon but with surgical precision, picking their moments and targets. This is a Liverpool side without an ounce of fat on it: no frills, no flourishes, no passengers.
Will this hold true for the season as a whole? Certainly Liverpool look a more complete and consistent team than Manchester City right now: not quite as good at controlling games or creating chances, but certainly more efficient. Long before their plane touches down in the north-west, Arsenal will be forgotten. On to the next, and the next, and the next. In a title race that will be defined by the very finest of margins, it may just be enough.
=======================================
Nothing wasted in Jürgen Klopp’s ruthlessly efficient Liverpool
Liverpool withstood everything Arsenal could throw at them and took advantage of fine margins to score their goals
Jonathan Liew
The gap through which Thiago Alcântara threaded his pass to Diogo Jota: a yard, at a generous estimate. The space that Jota found at Aaron Ramsdale’s near post to jam the ball in: maybe a couple of feet. The space in which Roberto Firmino had somehow to divert Andy Robertson’s cross past a goalkeeper literally standing next to him: a matter of inches. These are the margins that are taking Liverpool towards the top of the Premier League, and right now they are managing to find them better than anyone else.
The match in summary: Arsenal were the better side for 50 minutes and did nothing with it. Liverpool were the better side for the next 15 minutes and killed the game comprehensively. As for the rest, who cares? Arsenal ran and rampaged and fumed and fought, just as they had done all night. But there is something heroically dispiriting about giving your best even when you know it is not remotely good enough.
Arsenal are a team in chrysalis, still learning and developing. They were quick and hungry and inventive, passing the ball beautifully through midfield, showing desire and intent, getting themselves into good positions. But they couldn’t find the gaps. When a clinical finish or a pinpoint cross or a perfect through ball was required, they couldn’t locate it. Mikel Arteta has built an excellent playing machine. Jürgen Klopp, by contrast, has built a winning machine, and here the difference between the two was stark.
Thomas Partey was scintillating in the first half but dropped his level in the second. Bukayo Saka was tireless on the right flank but made a crucial error that let Robertson in for Liverpool’s second goal. Martin Ødegaard played some brilliant passes but missed a golden opportunity to put Arsenal in the lead. Meanwhile, Jordan Henderson was excellent for 90 minutes. So was Alisson. So was Virgil van Dijk. That was the difference.
It was a difference in demeanour, too. On the touchline Arteta was a picture of perpetual motion, pointing and waving, squeezing an imaginary accordion between his hands, urging more conviction, more running, more of everything. And for much of the game Arsenal were certainly the more kinetic team, all coiled energy and righteous fury. But somehow Liverpool were always the happier one, confident in their extra gears, their superior big-game nous, the Golden Boot winner sitting on their bench.
There were signs early in the second half that Liverpool were on the move. There was a conscious effort to be tidier in possession, to get the ball down and play it through Arsenal rather than punting it over the top. It was from just such a pass that Thiago found Jota for the opening goal: a goal that sprang not just from immense technical quality but pure faith, faith in the method, belief in the plan.
Jota scored and was hauled straight off for Firmino. The coldness! This is the other thing about Liverpool these days: in times past you might have sensed them getting a little jittery as the game reached the hour mark, nervously glancing over at the bench and wondering whether Xherdan Shaqiri would really be an upgrade on anything. Now they have a bench as good as any in Europe. Beat them once, and you then have to do it all over again.
Firmino deftly flicked in the second goal and Liverpool saw out the game with few alarms. You could hardly blame them for pedalling down a little. This was Henderson’s 40th game of the season in all competitions, Jota’s 38th, Van Dijk’s 37th. These guys have played essentially an entire Premier League season by March. There is still a cup run and a European campaign to be pursued.
And so what they have learned over the years is the ability to pace themselves, to harness their physical and emotional resources, to pare and slice away anything extraneous until only what is most essential remains. They hardly ever waste energy on a ruck. They press not with mindless abandon but with surgical precision, picking their moments and targets. This is a Liverpool side without an ounce of fat on it: no frills, no flourishes, no passengers.
Will this hold true for the season as a whole? Certainly Liverpool look a more complete and consistent team than Manchester City right now: not quite as good at controlling games or creating chances, but certainly more efficient. Long before their plane touches down in the north-west, Arsenal will be forgotten. On to the next, and the next, and the next. In a title race that will be defined by the very finest of margins, it may just be enough.
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I always find it hard to correlate what I read in our match thread with what I'm watching / saw. This time I'm looking at individual player stats and it makes surprising reading at times.
Ali : 8 - Imperious. The only reason it's only an 8 is because in truth he had little to do but what he did do was superb.
Robbo : 8 - Passing off a little (as per most of the team in the 1st half) but he did a superb job on Saka/Cedric and his energy was invaluable.
VvD : 8 - very weird criticism on here that he looked 'too laid back'. That's how he always looks ! With Robbo tied them up and nullified their much vaunted (on here) front 4.
Matip : 9 - superb all over the pitch. No weird mis-kicks or losing possession in midfield. He was always in the right place to help out Trent or stifle an attack. Deserved his MotM.
Trent : 6 - less of an attacking threat despite playing as an advanced winger (clearly on instructions) for much of the game ! Struggled badly against Martinelli and definitely needed the help he received. If he's going to play so advanced it has to be worth it - today it wasn't.
Fabinho : 8 - Superb, what we've come to expect from Fabs at his best. His match stats surprised me though (2 tackles - I thought it was far more) but as interceptions were not shown on the individual's stats I saw (though we made 11 as a team) I'm sure he made more than his fair share of those.
Thiago : 7 - Surprisingly good when looking at the stats. I didn't notice him as a stand out player (probably because the one episode that comes to mind was his terrible back pass that would have put us behind but for the wonderful Ali). However we then see how defensively effective he was : SIX tackles (Robbo had 4 and Fabs 2, no-one else more than 1) and that lovely assist pass (Wright called it 'brilliant' as does another Journo report - having less than a metre at most to thread it through 3-4 players) that we were crying out for in the first half was decisive in terms of winning the match. NB. In his post match interview Thiago said he didn't understand how Robbo got MotM as he (Thiago) had 'almost' two assists. Haha!
Hendo : 6 - going strictly by the figures he was our least effective player by a long way and peripheral at best (just 50 passes, 53 touches and 76% passing), however I feel it was more about instructions and hanging back/right to enable Trent to get forward. I don't think those tactics worked to our best advantage today TBH.
Diaz : 4 - completely ineffective, just 25 touches (virtually the same as Mo and Bobby) before being withdrawn. Arsenal's tactic of pushing up their FBs totally nullified him. Concerning (not his performance per se as he still kept possession well but how ineffective he was due to those tactics).
Jota - 6 - it's tough to rate him when he scored the breakthrough goal but that was also down to Ramsdale. Otherwise he was as ineffective as Diaz and our 'new' front three were a total failure in the first half.
Mane - 3 - Sublime or ridiculous, often both in the same match ... but not today. Even his disallowed goal was a poor offside as he was looking along the line and not once onside in that move. He gave away 4 fouls (nobody else more than 1) and 3 times he hurled himself to the turf to win a FK that didn't come close to conning the ref. Earning two waves to get up. Made just 13 passes (from 32 touches) in the whole 90 mins.
Mo. 6 - lively, nice passing, but never threatened the goal.
Bobby - 7.5 - beautifully taken goal and was immediately more effective in pressing and flustering their back line. One winning press which then led to the second goal.
Shearer : (on Firmino) elite movement from the very best (to get that ½ m for his goal)
Barnes : 2nd half was Men against Boys.
Wright : Liverpool went on to win very very comfortably
Ali : 8 - Imperious. The only reason it's only an 8 is because in truth he had little to do but what he did do was superb.
Robbo : 8 - Passing off a little (as per most of the team in the 1st half) but he did a superb job on Saka/Cedric and his energy was invaluable.
VvD : 8 - very weird criticism on here that he looked 'too laid back'. That's how he always looks ! With Robbo tied them up and nullified their much vaunted (on here) front 4.
Matip : 9 - superb all over the pitch. No weird mis-kicks or losing possession in midfield. He was always in the right place to help out Trent or stifle an attack. Deserved his MotM.
Trent : 6 - less of an attacking threat despite playing as an advanced winger (clearly on instructions) for much of the game ! Struggled badly against Martinelli and definitely needed the help he received. If he's going to play so advanced it has to be worth it - today it wasn't.
Fabinho : 8 - Superb, what we've come to expect from Fabs at his best. His match stats surprised me though (2 tackles - I thought it was far more) but as interceptions were not shown on the individual's stats I saw (though we made 11 as a team) I'm sure he made more than his fair share of those.
Thiago : 7 - Surprisingly good when looking at the stats. I didn't notice him as a stand out player (probably because the one episode that comes to mind was his terrible back pass that would have put us behind but for the wonderful Ali). However we then see how defensively effective he was : SIX tackles (Robbo had 4 and Fabs 2, no-one else more than 1) and that lovely assist pass (Wright called it 'brilliant' as does another Journo report - having less than a metre at most to thread it through 3-4 players) that we were crying out for in the first half was decisive in terms of winning the match. NB. In his post match interview Thiago said he didn't understand how Robbo got MotM as he (Thiago) had 'almost' two assists. Haha!
Hendo : 6 - going strictly by the figures he was our least effective player by a long way and peripheral at best (just 50 passes, 53 touches and 76% passing), however I feel it was more about instructions and hanging back/right to enable Trent to get forward. I don't think those tactics worked to our best advantage today TBH.
Diaz : 4 - completely ineffective, just 25 touches (virtually the same as Mo and Bobby) before being withdrawn. Arsenal's tactic of pushing up their FBs totally nullified him. Concerning (not his performance per se as he still kept possession well but how ineffective he was due to those tactics).
Jota - 6 - it's tough to rate him when he scored the breakthrough goal but that was also down to Ramsdale. Otherwise he was as ineffective as Diaz and our 'new' front three were a total failure in the first half.
Mane - 3 - Sublime or ridiculous, often both in the same match ... but not today. Even his disallowed goal was a poor offside as he was looking along the line and not once onside in that move. He gave away 4 fouls (nobody else more than 1) and 3 times he hurled himself to the turf to win a FK that didn't come close to conning the ref. Earning two waves to get up. Made just 13 passes (from 32 touches) in the whole 90 mins.
Mo. 6 - lively, nice passing, but never threatened the goal.
Bobby - 7.5 - beautifully taken goal and was immediately more effective in pressing and flustering their back line. One winning press which then led to the second goal.
Shearer : (on Firmino) elite movement from the very best (to get that ½ m for his goal)
Barnes : 2nd half was Men against Boys.
Wright : Liverpool went on to win very very comfortably
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Total sportek (and the usual .com) always have the full matches (maybe just highlights too).
About right. Diaz probably was more a 5 for me, he was helping Robbo with Cedric & Saka (worked well), and was shifted to try and help Trent with Tierney & Martinelli (didn't work).
In the second half you could see he was given more of a licence to go forward, but Klopp hooked him just after the goal.
If Jota didn't score, he'd have been a 4.
Yeah maybe I overlooked the work Diaz did tracking back.
Huh? That's unfair, it was a great pass.
You have to be fucking joking. Look again. Threaded a 20m pass through 3-4 players at the perfect speed.
I really hope that was Chorizo OR vegan sausage, and not both on the same pizza.
I'm not saying it wasn't a good pass, but it didn't create a goalscoring opportunity. Jota did that all by himself. He had no right to score when he picked up that pass. All he was on the pitch to do was bide his time and then produce magic, which is exactly what he did and is exactly why we got three points.
Yeah because 6 tackles (almost as much as the rest of the team put together) mattered defensively and that pass/goal was decisive. It's a 7 not an 8 or a 9 !
Haha yeah I thought that was a rather strange combination. Maybe half / half for the vegans.
Yet amazingly if his backpass leads to an Arsenal goal your theory goes to shit.
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