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N'Gog

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[quote author=the_khl link=topic=36729.msg972504#msg972504 date=1256650714]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972438#msg972438 date=1256644010]
the duds haven't amounted to little, its not just about money but also a wasted opportunity and another season without a trophy.

and i'm still old fashioned - a team is only as god as what its won. bar torres and reina our first 11 and squad were arguably stronger when rafa took over than now.
credit where credit is due, reina and torres have been exceptional buys and are clear improvements on what we had there before, johnson most likely will also be. its the lets buy six squad fillers rather than risk buying one good player that rafa has done elsewhere that has cost us.

i really can't see how anyone can argue that rafa has been almost flawless in the transfer market.
[/quote]

That sentence is probably one of the most stupid I've read all year. Cudos.

Johnson, Masherano, Agger, Kuyt, Riera, Aquilani and to some extent Aurelio and Benayoun are all upgrades on the likes of Smicer, Biscan, Diao, Traore, Finnan (although he was very good), Baros, aging Hamann and lil Luis Garcia. How anyone can think different is beyond me?!

Skrtl, Insua, Dossena, Babel, Lucas and Ngog are most certainly better squaplayers than whomever we had back then. The likes of Warnock, Thompson, aging Henchoz and Morientes to mention a few?

The only players I can think off from back then who had a fair chance to get in our side of today is Riise and Alonso (and the five years younger Hamann and Sami).
[/quote]

ok lets see how stupid it really is

johnson > finnan - potentially but finnan was as good a right back as there was
skertel/agger > hyypia - not yet
carra stays the same
aurelio/inusa/doseena > riise - don't think so
masch > didi - not in my opinion, didi had more to his game but at best they were comparable
lucas > igor - i'd take igor
gerrard stays
aquaman > alonso - really? i'm not sure how you can make that claim without actually seeing him play yet in the 1st team
yossi > garcia - yes maybe, i'm coming to that way of thinking
riera > kewell - maybe, but a fit kewell is better than riera at his best

its not as stupid as you make out really is it?

and in the end the 1st rafa team won trophies. this team hasn't. why do you think that is?
 
You missed out:-

Torres > Crouch

EDIT I meant:-

Pepe > Jerzy
Torres > Cisse.

You can't compare the two teams and leave out the goalkeeper and the main goal scorer!
 
[quote author=Tinto link=topic=36729.msg972532#msg972532 date=1256653363]
You missed out:-

Torres > Crouch

EDIT I meant:-

Pepe > Jerzy
Torres > Cisse.

You can't compare the two teams and leave out the goalkeeper and the main goal scorer!
[/quote]

no i acknowledged both pepe and torres earlier. i wouldn't swap either for any like for like player in the world never mind what we had in these positions when rafa arrived.
 
Rage, your initial statement that KHL picked up on was 'when Rafa took over' you can't therefore can't include Alonso and Garcia.
Take Reina and Torres out and I still think this squad of players would beat what GH left behind

Re your question -how, well we see this season that our big signings have been out injured quite often, the squad fillers are required to keep the club going rather than relying on reserves and kids
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972519#msg972519 date=1256652018]
[quote author=the_khl link=topic=36729.msg972504#msg972504 date=1256650714]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972438#msg972438 date=1256644010]
the duds haven't amounted to little, its not just about money but also a wasted opportunity and another season without a trophy.

and i'm still old fashioned - a team is only as god as what its won. bar torres and reina our first 11 and squad were arguably stronger when rafa took over than now.
credit where credit is due, reina and torres have been exceptional buys and are clear improvements on what we had there before, johnson most likely will also be. its the lets buy six squad fillers rather than risk buying one good player that rafa has done elsewhere that has cost us.

i really can't see how anyone can argue that rafa has been almost flawless in the transfer market.
[/quote]

That sentence is probably one of the most stupid I've read all year. Cudos.

Johnson, Masherano, Agger, Kuyt, Riera, Aquilani and to some extent Aurelio and Benayoun are all upgrades on the likes of Smicer, Biscan, Diao, Traore, Finnan (although he was very good), Baros, aging Hamann and lil Luis Garcia. How anyone can think different is beyond me?!

Skrtl, Insua, Dossena, Babel, Lucas and Ngog are most certainly better squaplayers than whomever we had back then. The likes of Warnock, Thompson, aging Henchoz and Morientes to mention a few?

The only players I can think off from back then who had a fair chance to get in our side of today is Riise and Alonso (and the five years younger Hamann and Sami).
[/quote]

ok lets see how stupid it really is

johnson > finnan - potentially but finnan was as good a right back as there was
skertel/agger > hyypia - not yet
carra stays the same
aurelio/inusa/doseena > riise - don't think so
masch > didi - not in my opinion, didi had more to his game but at best they were comparable
lucas > igor - i'd take igor
gerrard stays
aquaman > alonso - really? i'm not sure how you can make that claim without actually seeing him play yet in the 1st team Alonso was Rafa's player
yossi > garcia - yes maybe, i'm coming to that way of thinking
riera > kewell - maybe, but a fit kewell is better than riera at his best

its not as stupid as you make out really is it?

and in the end the 1st rafa team won trophies. this team hasn't. why do you think that is?


[/quote]
You said first XI and squad' mind you.

That means you can't really compare Aurelio, Insua and Dossena with Riise and then just pick the latter. You have to include Traore and Warnock as well. Who'd you pick then? (Personally I'm of the opinion that Riise wasn't going to take us further and I'd choose a fit Aurelio over him as he's more suited to our style of play today).

Masher is the Argentinian captain and even though Hamann was a great player for us most would certainly pick the little one I'm sure when taking the latters age into consideration. I know I would.

Sami was better than Agger/Skrtl but again who were 3rd and 4th choice back then? Today we've got Skrtl and Kyrgiakos. And as both Agger and Skrtl are only still 24-25-years-old age is one again on this teams side. Something you just can't neglect when/if you compare team.

Biscan, Baros, Smicer and Cisse were common starters back then and none of them would get anywhere near todays team. Only Cisse would make the bench really.

Kewell and Garcia (who's also a Rafa-player mind, ty Asim) had great games but were often passangers as well. I'm nor sure any of those two would be an improvement compared to Kuyt, Benayoun and Riera. Actually rather the opposite.

Torres and Reina is massive upgrades in the World Class bracket.

Aquilani comes with a massive rep, and even though we are yet to see him in action he's most definitely a more attacking-minded player than Alonso (if he should be considered at all). If he's as good as I think/hope he is we'll see a more balanced central midfield pairing in Masher/Aquilani than for a long time.

What other squadies from back then you reckon is better than today? Diao? Warnock? Thompson? I've-lost-my-touch-completely-Morientes? Cheyrou? Le Tallec?
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972537#msg972537 date=1256654278]
[quote author=Tinto link=topic=36729.msg972532#msg972532 date=1256653363]
You missed out:-

Torres > Crouch

EDIT I meant:-

Pepe > Jerzy
Torres > Cisse.

You can't compare the two teams and leave out the goalkeeper and the main goal scorer!
[/quote]

no i acknowledged both pepe and torres earlier. i wouldn't swap either for any like for like player in the world never mind what we had in these positions when rafa arrived.


[/quote]

???

So your conclusion is ultimately we have a better team now then when Rafa too over?

This is going to turn out like that Aquilini thread and midfielders needing to be of a certain build... or maybe not.
 
[quote author=Asim link=topic=36729.msg972543#msg972543 date=1256654933]
Khl- you can't include morientes/Alonso/Garcia Rafa brought them.
[/quote]
Cheers mate.

I forgot that Garcia and Morientes were Rafa's buys and then got confused about what team Rage were refrring too as he included Alonso.

You are completely right though.

Who were third and fourth strikers back then? Pongolle and.. Mellor?

Le Tallec, Diao, Biscan and Cheyrou in central midfield to pick from besides Hamann? (I know Gerrard played further down back then too).

*cringe*
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972519#msg972519 date=1256652018]
[quote author=the_khl link=topic=36729.msg972504#msg972504 date=1256650714]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972438#msg972438 date=1256644010]
the duds haven't amounted to little, its not just about money but also a wasted opportunity and another season without a trophy.

and i'm still old fashioned - a team is only as god as what its won. bar torres and reina our first 11 and squad were arguably stronger when rafa took over than now.
credit where credit is due, reina and torres have been exceptional buys and are clear improvements on what we had there before, johnson most likely will also be. its the lets buy six squad fillers rather than risk buying one good player that rafa has done elsewhere that has cost us.

i really can't see how anyone can argue that rafa has been almost flawless in the transfer market.
[/quote]

That sentence is probably one of the most stupid I've read all year. Cudos.

Johnson, Masherano, Agger, Kuyt, Riera, Aquilani and to some extent Aurelio and Benayoun are all upgrades on the likes of Smicer, Biscan, Diao, Traore, Finnan (although he was very good), Baros, aging Hamann and lil Luis Garcia. How anyone can think different is beyond me?!

Skrtl, Insua, Dossena, Babel, Lucas and Ngog are most certainly better squaplayers than whomever we had back then. The likes of Warnock, Thompson, aging Henchoz and Morientes to mention a few?

The only players I can think off from back then who had a fair chance to get in our side of today is Riise and Alonso (and the five years younger Hamann and Sami).
[/quote]

ok lets see how stupid it really is

johnson > finnan - potentially but finnan was as good a right back as there was
skertel/agger > hyypia - not yet
carra stays the same
aurelio/inusa/doseena > riise - don't think so
masch > didi - not in my opinion, didi had more to his game but at best they were comparable
lucas > igor - i'd take igor
gerrard stays
aquaman > alonso - really? i'm not sure how you can make that claim without actually seeing him play yet in the 1st team
yossi > garcia - yes maybe, i'm coming to that way of thinking
riera > kewell - maybe, but a fit kewell is better than riera at his best

its not as stupid as you make out really is it?

and in the end the 1st rafa team won trophies. this team hasn't. why do you think that is?


[/quote]

Well, Garcia, Alonso weren't at the club weren't at the club when Benitez "took over".

As for Carra "staying the same" - bollocks. He's improved enormously under Benitez.
 
[quote author=Asim link=topic=36729.msg972538#msg972538 date=1256654316]
Rage, your initial statement that KHL picked up on was 'when Rafa took over' you can't therefore can't include Alonso and Garcia.
Take Reina and Torres out and I still think this squad of players would beat what GH left behind

Re your question -how, well we see this season that our big signings have been out injured quite often, the squad fillers are required to keep the club going rather than relying on reserves and kids
[/quote]

in that case i apologise, in my mind i was referring to the istanbul team. but also neither alonso nor garcia are here any more.

and this season when the squad fillers have been called up they have been found wanting on the most.

what gets me most is that i feel that we had a great first 11 to build on, indeed rafa managed it well in his 1st season through introducing garcia and alonso. but we have not progressed at the rate that i would have liked to have seen.

players like n'gog don't bother me. its the time and cost that's gone into players like doseena, josemi, degen, gonzales, lucas, leto, voronin, bellamy, morinetes, riera and 10 reserve keepers.

now i maybe being simple here but i don't care if we allegedly made a profit on some of these. they cost us in wages and cost us points on the pitch.

i actually think rafa has got it right with n'gog. if he'd done the same with a keeper, a centre back, a left back, a right back (degen, doseena, the greek and the brazillian keeper that replaced itandje) then we'd be 20 to 25 million pounds better off.

in the end i was maybe clumsily countering the oversimplification that our dud signings amounted to pellegrino, josemi, voronin and morientes and that it hadn't cost us much. this is nonsense
 
Even though I accidentially 'gave' Rage a few Rafa-players it still doesn't add up in my opnion.

Todays squad and XI are more than just a tad better than back then. I can't fathom why anyone would say otherwise really.
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972546#msg972546 date=1256655260]
i actually think rafa has got it right with n'gog. if he'd done the same with a keeper, a centre back, a left back, a right back (degen, doseena, the greek and the brazillian keeper that replaced itandje) then we'd be 20 to 25 million pounds better off.
[/quote]

Can you break that down for me please? I'd like to understand how you got to this 25M figure.
 
I said before EVERY manager makes some dud buys and I have been a little annoyed at some of Rafa's purchases but you are being harsh on some of those player that you have listed above.

Bellamy would still get in the side, it was just his attitude that messed up his chance of playing for us, Gonzo bottled it imo (like Babel) they could have gone on to be good good players for us but they didn't have the heart to fight and battle and that is somethings a difficult thing for a manager to figure out just ask Wenger with regards to Reyes and Fergie and Veron etc.

It's also unfair to put Riera in that list, he gave us something very important last season in width and options far left. What some people need to realise is that it takes time, effort and resources to build that full team, imo the likes of nunez, josemi, moro needed to be brought to plug gaps and 'do a job' for a while.

Where messed Rafa/LFC up this summer was Alonso going and Barry proving he was a complete loser, that left Rafa in a predicament of who to buy, the only player really that was a worthy replacement and available was Aqua. So what do ya do? like you say buy another squad filler? or purchase a player who you believe is quality and will make an improvement but you will have to wait possibly 3 months till he is match fit?

I think most of us would have gone with Aqua
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972546#msg972546 date=1256655260]
[quote author=Asim link=topic=36729.msg972538#msg972538 date=1256654316]
Rage, your initial statement that KHL picked up on was 'when Rafa took over' you can't therefore can't include Alonso and Garcia.
Take Reina and Torres out and I still think this squad of players would beat what GH left behind

Re your question -how, well we see this season that our big signings have been out injured quite often, the squad fillers are required to keep the club going rather than relying on reserves and kids
[/quote]

in that case i apologise, in my mind i was referring to the istanbul team. but also neither alonso nor garcia are here any more.


[/quote]

What's the fucking point of your argument then? You're arguing against (Rafa's)) players and offering up his own signings as an alternative. You're also conveniently overlooking the fact that the league is now alot stronger and we now prioritise domestic cups alot less than we did then and that same team won the CL also failed to finish in the top four. 38 games across a season is a greater measure of success and this side finished second last season while that team finished 5th. Cup's are a different measure of success because a fair deal of luck is also involved, the luck of the actual draw for one.

And regards that CL run anyway, a great amount of that success was down to Garcia and his goals that helped us get there in the first place, a player who happens to be a Benitez signing, a player we've now improved upon anyway.

And lastly, Benitez has had the best of Gerrard, he's got the best out of him, so regardless of who had him first, he still had to harness his talents and make sure he got what he could from him, and he has. It's not simply a case of 'Gerrard stays', Gerrard has unarguably been better under Rafa than Houllier.
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972546#msg972546 date=1256655260]
i actually think rafa has got it right with n'gog. if he'd done the same with a keeper, a centre back, a left back, a right back (degen, doseena, the greek and the brazillian keeper that replaced itandje) then we'd be 20 to 25 million pounds better off.
[/quote]

How do you make that out?

Degen - "Free"
Zorba - £1.5M
Calvalry - £3M
Dossena - £7M

Can we just leave it that Rafa has signed somer corkers and some lemons - fortunately the lemons were cheaper
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36729.msg972551#msg972551 date=1256656263]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972546#msg972546 date=1256655260]
[quote author=Asim link=topic=36729.msg972538#msg972538 date=1256654316]
Rage, your initial statement that KHL picked up on was 'when Rafa took over' you can't therefore can't include Alonso and Garcia.
Take Reina and Torres out and I still think this squad of players would beat what GH left behind

Re your question -how, well we see this season that our big signings have been out injured quite often, the squad fillers are required to keep the club going rather than relying on reserves and kids
[/quote]

in that case i apologise, in my mind i was referring to the istanbul team. but also neither alonso nor garcia are here any more.


[/quote]

What's the fucking point of your argument then? You're arguing against (Rafa's)) players and offering up his own signings as an alternative. You're also conveniently overlooking the fact that the league is now alot stronger and we now prioritise domestic cups alot less than we did then and that same team won the CL also failed to finish in the top four. 38 games across a season is a greater measure of success and this side finished second last season while that team finished 5th. Cup's are a different measure of success because a fair deal of luck is also involved, the luck of the actual draw for one.

And regards that CL run anyway, a great amount of that success was down to Garcia and his goals that helped us get there in the first place, a player who happens to be a Benitez signing, a player we've now improved upon anyway.

And lastly, Benitez has had the best of Gerrard, he's got the best out of him, so regardless of who had him first, he still had to harness his talents and make sure he got what he could from him, and he has. It's not simply a case of 'Gerrard stays', Gerrard has unarguably been better under Rafa than Houllier.
[/quote]

Well done, you should have just called him a wanker and be done
 
[quote author=Dee link=topic=36729.msg972552#msg972552 date=1256656274]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972546#msg972546 date=1256655260]
i actually think rafa has got it right with n'gog. if he'd done the same with a keeper, a centre back, a left back, a right back (degen, doseena, the greek and the brazillian keeper that replaced itandje) then we'd be 20 to 25 million pounds better off.
[/quote]

How do you make that out?

Degen - "Free"
Zorba - £1.5M
Calvalry - £3M
Dossena - £7M

Can we just leave it that Rafa has signed somer corkers and some lemons - fortunately the lemons were cheaper


[/quote]

degen wasn't free unless you want to forget the 2 million signing on fee.

how do i get to 20 to 25 million.

2 reserve keepers in cav and itandge in transfers cost c 5million. add 4 years of wages at 20k a week (i'm guessing but it will be around this and at one point we were paying both their wages) 208 weeks x 20,000 = £4million plus 5 million in purchase. £9 million there

degen will have cost 4 million in two seasons

zorba will have cost 3 million by the end of this season. even if he didn't get injured what and when would he have played in?

doseena's 7 million plus 2 seasons of wages at c40k per week amounts to £11 million.

so that's well over 25 million. all this net and gross bollocks that people use to defend rafa they forget that whilst we have shite players on our books we have to pay them wages.
 
Ha!

So, let's labour under the assumption that you are privy to what these players get in signing on fees and wages.

That takes care of the players we shouldn't have bought. What about the players we should have bought then? You said that we'd be 20-25M better off had we have bought differently.

So, please detail the transfer fees, signing on fees and wages over the same time period for this hypothetical set of players as well. You must surely have all this in mind otherwise it'd make your 20-25M better off statement rather stupid, wouldn't you agree?
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36729.msg972551#msg972551 date=1256656263]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972546#msg972546 date=1256655260]
[quote author=Asim link=topic=36729.msg972538#msg972538 date=1256654316]
Rage, your initial statement that KHL picked up on was 'when Rafa took over' you can't therefore can't include Alonso and Garcia.
Take Reina and Torres out and I still think this squad of players would beat what GH left behind

Re your question -how, well we see this season that our big signings have been out injured quite often, the squad fillers are required to keep the club going rather than relying on reserves and kids
[/quote]

in that case i apologise, in my mind i was referring to the istanbul team. but also neither alonso nor garcia are here any more.


[/quote]

What's the fucking point of your argument then? You're arguing against (Rafa's)) players and offering up his own signings as an alternative. You're also conveniently overlooking the fact that the league is now alot stronger and we now prioritise domestic cups alot less than we did then and that same team won the CL also failed to finish in the top four. 38 games across a season is a greater measure of success and this side finished second last season while that team finished 5th. Cup's are a different measure of success because a fair deal of luck is also involved, the luck of the actual draw for one.

And regards that CL run anyway, a great amount of that success was down to Garcia and his goals that helped us get there in the first place, a player who happens to be a Benitez signing, a player we've now improved upon anyway.

And lastly, Benitez has had the best of Gerrard, he's got the best out of him, so regardless of who had him first, he still had to harness his talents and make sure he got what he could from him, and he has. It's not simply a case of 'Gerrard stays', Gerrard has unarguably been better under Rafa than Houllier.
[/quote]

nonsense

the league is now a lot stronger? maybe this season but the last 5 its been pretty constant
bar some awful man management gerrard would have matured under any manager
i don't think we got a lucky draw to istanbul

i agree with the garcia point and i've tried to clarify my point there.

i could argue that we finished 2nd in the weakest league in years, chelsea lost their manager, arsenal are in transition and utd were over reliant on ronaldo.

i'll go back to my original point - you cannot disguise rafa has had his fair fair of shit buys rather than bullshiting it was only 8 million and all it was were pellagrino, josemi, voronin and morintes.
 
[quote author=keniget link=topic=36729.msg972562#msg972562 date=1256657422]
Ha!

So, let's labour under the assumption that you are privy to what these players get in signing on fees and wages.

That takes care of the players we shouldn't have bought. What about the players we should have bought then? You said that we'd be 20-25M better off had we have bought differently.

So, please detail the transfer fees, signing on fees and wages over the same time period for this hypothetical set of players as well. You must surely have all this in mind otherwise it'd make your 20-25M better off statement rather stupid, wouldn't you agree?
[/quote]

degen's signing on fee is public knowledge.

we could easily have managed without these players if we had trusted kids like n'gog. insua and kelly

these players are already here. i'm not saying substitute one set of players for another new set of players.

i was asked to quantify where i got the figure from, i'd like to see any of you dispute this amount.

it still adds up to far more than 8 million though doesn't it?
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972560#msg972560 date=1256657156]
degen wasn't free unless you want to forget the 2 million signing on fee.

how do i get to 20 to 25 million.

2 reserve keepers in cav and itandge in transfers cost c 5million. add 4 years of wages at 20k a week (i'm guessing but it will be around this and at one point we were paying both their wages) 208 weeks x 20,000 = £4million plus 5 million in purchase. £9 million there

degen will have cost 4 million in two seasons

zorba will have cost 3 million by the end of this season. even if he didn't get injured what and when would he have played in?

doseena's 7 million plus 2 seasons of wages at c40k per week amounts to £11 million.

so that's well over 25 million. all this net and gross bollocks that people use to defend rafa they forget that whilst we have shite players on our books we have to pay them wages.
[/quote]

I'll take that as a "No, I can't let this go and I want to dig my hole a little deeper"

1. We needed to have a back-up keeper I'm guessing (could be wrong) that Cavalry is paid the average for a back-up keeper. I certainly wouldn't call him shit - he seems reasonably competent for the EPL.

2. We needed a back-up right back. So we had to pay somebody, I'd prefer someone other than Degen but even a £2M who elese could you have bought?

3. If we really couldn't persuade Sami to stay then we needed cover. Zorba seems to be competent and, most importantly, cheap. Who else could we have had for £1.5M?

4. Dossena is shite
 
[quote author=Dee link=topic=36729.msg972571#msg972571 date=1256658212]
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972560#msg972560 date=1256657156]
degen wasn't free unless you want to forget the 2 million signing on fee.

how do i get to 20 to 25 million.

2 reserve keepers in cav and itandge in transfers cost c 5million. add 4 years of wages at 20k a week (i'm guessing but it will be around this and at one point we were paying both their wages) 208 weeks x 20,000 = £4million plus 5 million in purchase. £9 million there

degen will have cost 4 million in two seasons

zorba will have cost 3 million by the end of this season. even if he didn't get injured what and when would he have played in?

doseena's 7 million plus 2 seasons of wages at c40k per week amounts to £11 million.

so that's well over 25 million. all this net and gross bollocks that people use to defend rafa they forget that whilst we have shite players on our books we have to pay them wages.
[/quote]

I'll take that as a "No, I can't let this go and I want to dig my hole a little deeperW
[/quote]

what hole? prove me otherwise. show me an alternate set of figures. please go right ahead. in the end i'll bet my life savings that it'll come closer to my figures that some bullshit all we've wasted is 8 million.
 
I put 'for example' to make that point clear, and went on to say his most costly mistake has been Babel, and then of the rest, none of them have cost any more than £6m, (though naturally you'll just quote what best fits your agenda).

I could have also argued that we more than made our money back on most of them too.

So how exactly is that "bullshiting it was only 8 million and all it was were pellagrino, josemi, voronin and morintes"???
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972569#msg972569 date=1256657963]

nonsense

the league is now a lot stronger? maybe this season but the last 5 its been pretty constant

[/quote]

No way, the years Chelsea won with a gazillion pounds behind them and the squad.
They changed the goalposts loads and the league is so much stronger now than it has been in the past, pointing to the English teams dominance in Europe also indicates this to be true
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972570#msg972570 date=1256658172]


it still adds up to far more than 8 million though doesn't it?
[/quote]

Look, you brainless fucking oaf, that quote came from me, and any cunt who can read can see that I clearly bracketed 'for example' after that and went on to outline his other transfer errors. So why the fuck are trying to take the quote out of context, when it's plain to see to everyone on the forum that that was not the point being made AT ALL?

Nowhere has anyone said it's just 'amounted to £8m', you tiresome cunt.
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972577#msg972577 date=1256658454]
because its cost us far more than 8 million perhaps?
[/quote]

I didn't say it cost £8m, are you dyslexic as well as blatantly fucking stupid?
 
I'll take that as a "No, I can't let this go and I want to dig my hole a little deeper"

1. We needed to have a back-up keeper I'm guessing (could be wrong) that Cavalry is paid the average for a back-up keeper. I certainly wouldn't call him shit - he seems reasonably competent for the EPL.

2. We needed a back-up right back. So we had to pay somebody, I'd prefer someone other than Degen but even a £2M who elese could you have bought?

3. If we really couldn't persuade Sami to stay then we needed cover. Zorba seems to be competent and, most importantly, cheap. Who else could we have had for £1.5M?

4. Dossena is shite

Go on save us £25M
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972546#msg972546 date=1256655260]
i actually think rafa has got it right with n'gog. if he'd done the same with a keeper, a centre back, a left back, a right back (degen, doseena, the greek and the brazillian keeper that replaced itandje) then we'd be 20 to 25 million pounds better off.
[/quote]

Rafa got it right with a player he bought in N'Gog. He wasn't already here - he came at the same time as some of the others you mention.

[quote author=rage link=topic=36729.msg972570#msg972570 date=1256658172]
we could easily have managed without these players if we had trusted kids like n'gog. insua and kelly

these players are already here. i'm not saying substitute one set of players for another new set of players.
[/quote]

So, Rafa bought N'Gog and Insua, okay, we can keep him. So that still leaves us with a keeper, right back and centre back that we need figures on. Go.
 
ah so you don't like things being taken out of context do you not?

nor do you like someone ignoring a later post you've made to explain what you said either?

me brainless...... remind me what you do for a living shithead?
 
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