Actually, I rather think he does. As did Rodgers before him. The days of the gaffer have long since disappeared-- you only need to look at our feeder club.
Crystal Palace post match
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The jury is still out on Klopp with me. Primarily cos I don't believe for a second that he's been given any significant funds that he hasn't spent.
The negatives are clear, but a lot of them I choose to believe are to do with the squad.
However I expect some quality signings this summer, that go directly into the first team & improve us. I then expect us to show consistency in both defence & attack next season. I also expect Klopp to change games in play when it's not going our way. His ability to change games at half time is pretty good, but unless he can do that when it's clearly going to shit, & do everything else I've just listed, then, & only then, will I start to really wonder if he's the right man long term for this club.
The negatives are clear, but a lot of them I choose to believe are to do with the squad.
However I expect some quality signings this summer, that go directly into the first team & improve us. I then expect us to show consistency in both defence & attack next season. I also expect Klopp to change games in play when it's not going our way. His ability to change games at half time is pretty good, but unless he can do that when it's clearly going to shit, & do everything else I've just listed, then, & only then, will I start to really wonder if he's the right man long term for this club.
I think the questions being asked in this thread of Klopp are fair. No one is throwing him under the bus entirely but we have some long seated issues that look no closer to resolution than under Rodgers.
Maybe. Monchi is available, isn't he?
I kinda trust Klopp to go after the right type of players. We signed a couple duds last summer but there were no signs of mad Balotelli / Carroll style fuck ups.
Hahahahahahahaha!
Of course he hasn't. Otherwise we wouldn't have Milner as our first choice left full back. Don't get me wrong, he's been alright but we miss a specialist and a left footer there.
Last summer out of the 4 players bought for the first team, only Karius is a dud. Matip, Mane and Wijnadum improves us and we're better with them in the side than not.
We're going to need an even better transfer window this summer to make us truly competitive though.
To me the duds were the ones already in the team: Lovren, Lucas, Origi, and Ming. All have at some point proven to be adequate to good but largely their disappointments stand out.
Jury is still out on Gini (can be both sublime and not existent) and Karius (hasn't really been given a chance but the chance he got wasn't a majestic display).
Mane is a success.
And I'm probably missing someone...
We have been royally screwed by injuries. Being without Lallana, Mane and Sturridge for this stage of the season, as well as Henderson, has just knackered us.
Firmino and Origi were woeful today - was the kind of game where one of them should be scoring and they were nowhere to be seen. To not have a shot from open play is just tragic.
As for our defence, its an embarrassment. Teams know that they just need to counter us down the wing or get corners and there's a pretty darn good chance they're going to score at some point.
Can't complain at Klopp not changing anything using subs as that bench was fucking woeful. A bench full of kids.
Firmino and Origi were woeful today - was the kind of game where one of them should be scoring and they were nowhere to be seen. To not have a shot from open play is just tragic.
As for our defence, its an embarrassment. Teams know that they just need to counter us down the wing or get corners and there's a pretty darn good chance they're going to score at some point.
Can't complain at Klopp not changing anything using subs as that bench was fucking woeful. A bench full of kids.
The only change he could have made was maybe sub Lucas for Moreno and push Milner into midfield.
Maybe Moreno's pace, if not his brain, might have shored up our left flank and helped counter Palace's counter attacks. And maybe Milner's clever running off the ball may have helped open up Palace's defence.
I was kinda talking about the defence. But yeah it wasnt clear. Its more about the fact we went and got JURGEN KLOPP! The manager everyone wanted. Hes had 3 windows and improved next to fuck all.
Where to start?
You know when you sign a player and he gives everyone else a lift? I don't think that can happen for our defence, they're woeful fuckers. Clyne has been going backwards for ages, Lovren is an absolute dog's egg (always has been, he looks good on some pictures though), Matip looks like Des Walker but plays like Des Lynam, Milner isn't a LB and we're so bad in other areas we've stopped talking about the abomination in nets.
Needs pointing out again, Matip is decidedly average. And our defence as a whole is wank.
So that's 5 new players needed.
Midfield is pedestrian in the extreme. Wijnaldum is lovely when we're winning 4-0, muck when we're losing 1-0, Henderson is gone, Can is garbage, Lucas is worse than that faker that Souness gave 20 minutes to at Southampton, he'd never played professional footy before I don't think Lucas had BEFORE WE GAVE HIM 350 GAMES! Although I read on here that we don't need Lallana back as we've got Lucas. Fuckin certifiable twats on here.
So that's 3 more new players needed.
Firmino's great apart from scoring (you work it out, I can't. It's like being a priest who doesn't believe in God), Coutinho's great in bursts, Origi's stock only rises when he's on the bench, Sturridge may as well be dead.
So that's 3 more new players needed. Giving us a grand total of ... erm ... 11.
As for Klopp, he's no better than Rodgers. He's foreign, grins a lot, looks good on flags etc. but he's no great shakes. Not the first LFC manager to be out-thunk by Fat Sam, probably not the last. We'd have probably won today if that fat pissflap was our manager, think about that. Klopp is useless during the game, absolutely useless. But he gives everyone a big hug afterwards, nice that.
So, that's a new manager needed as well.
We're so fair-weather it's criminal. Winning 4-0 we play like Brazil, getting beat 1-0 or under the cosh, we play like Alan Brazil. We need some bastards. But, we did in 1997 when we signed Ince, all a bit cyclical this isn't it? We don't learn.
If we don't get top 4, we want shooting. Because the other teams around us are as shit as we are.
You know when you sign a player and he gives everyone else a lift? I don't think that can happen for our defence, they're woeful fuckers. Clyne has been going backwards for ages, Lovren is an absolute dog's egg (always has been, he looks good on some pictures though), Matip looks like Des Walker but plays like Des Lynam, Milner isn't a LB and we're so bad in other areas we've stopped talking about the abomination in nets.
Needs pointing out again, Matip is decidedly average. And our defence as a whole is wank.
So that's 5 new players needed.
Midfield is pedestrian in the extreme. Wijnaldum is lovely when we're winning 4-0, muck when we're losing 1-0, Henderson is gone, Can is garbage, Lucas is worse than that faker that Souness gave 20 minutes to at Southampton, he'd never played professional footy before I don't think Lucas had BEFORE WE GAVE HIM 350 GAMES! Although I read on here that we don't need Lallana back as we've got Lucas. Fuckin certifiable twats on here.
So that's 3 more new players needed.
Firmino's great apart from scoring (you work it out, I can't. It's like being a priest who doesn't believe in God), Coutinho's great in bursts, Origi's stock only rises when he's on the bench, Sturridge may as well be dead.
So that's 3 more new players needed. Giving us a grand total of ... erm ... 11.
As for Klopp, he's no better than Rodgers. He's foreign, grins a lot, looks good on flags etc. but he's no great shakes. Not the first LFC manager to be out-thunk by Fat Sam, probably not the last. We'd have probably won today if that fat pissflap was our manager, think about that. Klopp is useless during the game, absolutely useless. But he gives everyone a big hug afterwards, nice that.
So, that's a new manager needed as well.
We're so fair-weather it's criminal. Winning 4-0 we play like Brazil, getting beat 1-0 or under the cosh, we play like Alan Brazil. We need some bastards. But, we did in 1997 when we signed Ince, all a bit cyclical this isn't it? We don't learn.
If we don't get top 4, we want shooting. Because the other teams around us are as shit as we are.
Whilst the above from Larry was pretty humorous and had quite a bit of merit, I'd like to add some perspective.
Firstly, this thread is fucking painful. We won 2 in a row, and seriously no one gave a fuck. We lose, and everyone's here moaning about Klopp not being good enough, Lucas, Firmino, Origi, etc etc. I'm not exaggerating this - there are people on here delighted that they're able to wheel out their complaints, gripes, overwrought analogies, and criticisms about some of our players. What's fucking wrong with you? Why do you take greater comfort in criticism? We were pretty poor today - no doubt about it, but the glee with which some of you lot enjoy such negativity is frankly weird.
I know we oscillate from week to week, but I don't think anyone got too carried away after beating West Brom away, so must we go over the top after losing to Crystal Palace?
They ventured forward twice for the game and scored. Good for them, and Allardyce was right - they were tactically astute. Really though, Coutinho should have buried the game with his second half chance, and we should be able to manage a 1-0 lead better - so they shouldn't have had a sniff. Deja vu of course, and no less frustrating.
We have 66 points with 4 games to play - could finish up with 78, we'll likely get what, 74, 75? I dunno, something like that.
We finished last season with 62 points. Finished with that. 62. I argued at the start of the year - in the 'where will we finish?' thread - that given the quality of teams around us positions could be difficult to gauge, but we should look to improve our points tally and that that was the measure for assessing improvement. We already have, and we'll likely improve by up to 16 points year over year. That's significant.
Sure we lose to Crystal Palace, and Bournemouth, and every other mid-lower league dross. It's shit, and extremely fucking annoying. Watching us probe aimlessly today, whilst hoping that Firmino or Coutinho could conjure something out of their arse was painful. Hope is not a strategy. And we need better players - in central defence, full back, midfield, up front, etc. It's acknowledged, and unarguable. But we're a far better side than this time 12 months ago, we can still finish in the top 4, and with the right signings we'll improve again.
I'm no fucking superfan, but the reactionary bollocks in here is nauseating. What were your expectations? That we'd win every week? That we wouldn't play fucking shit? It happens - and bar Chelsea and Spurs - it happens to everyone of our rivals, all of whom in my view have a better side than us. You can debate whether it was the manager's prerogative not to add to the squad or not, but in my view arguing whether he's a good manager or not is kneejerking to the extreme. Did you watch us last year? There was a reason why we finished with 62 fucking points. Everton are gonna beat that this year for fuck's sake.
We've got Watford, Southampton, West Ham and Boro left. Take 10 points or better from that and we'll have 75+ points, and have enjoyed a terrific year.
Firstly, this thread is fucking painful. We won 2 in a row, and seriously no one gave a fuck. We lose, and everyone's here moaning about Klopp not being good enough, Lucas, Firmino, Origi, etc etc. I'm not exaggerating this - there are people on here delighted that they're able to wheel out their complaints, gripes, overwrought analogies, and criticisms about some of our players. What's fucking wrong with you? Why do you take greater comfort in criticism? We were pretty poor today - no doubt about it, but the glee with which some of you lot enjoy such negativity is frankly weird.
I know we oscillate from week to week, but I don't think anyone got too carried away after beating West Brom away, so must we go over the top after losing to Crystal Palace?
They ventured forward twice for the game and scored. Good for them, and Allardyce was right - they were tactically astute. Really though, Coutinho should have buried the game with his second half chance, and we should be able to manage a 1-0 lead better - so they shouldn't have had a sniff. Deja vu of course, and no less frustrating.
We have 66 points with 4 games to play - could finish up with 78, we'll likely get what, 74, 75? I dunno, something like that.
We finished last season with 62 points. Finished with that. 62. I argued at the start of the year - in the 'where will we finish?' thread - that given the quality of teams around us positions could be difficult to gauge, but we should look to improve our points tally and that that was the measure for assessing improvement. We already have, and we'll likely improve by up to 16 points year over year. That's significant.
Sure we lose to Crystal Palace, and Bournemouth, and every other mid-lower league dross. It's shit, and extremely fucking annoying. Watching us probe aimlessly today, whilst hoping that Firmino or Coutinho could conjure something out of their arse was painful. Hope is not a strategy. And we need better players - in central defence, full back, midfield, up front, etc. It's acknowledged, and unarguable. But we're a far better side than this time 12 months ago, we can still finish in the top 4, and with the right signings we'll improve again.
I'm no fucking superfan, but the reactionary bollocks in here is nauseating. What were your expectations? That we'd win every week? That we wouldn't play fucking shit? It happens - and bar Chelsea and Spurs - it happens to everyone of our rivals, all of whom in my view have a better side than us. You can debate whether it was the manager's prerogative not to add to the squad or not, but in my view arguing whether he's a good manager or not is kneejerking to the extreme. Did you watch us last year? There was a reason why we finished with 62 fucking points. Everton are gonna beat that this year for fuck's sake.
We've got Watford, Southampton, West Ham and Boro left. Take 10 points or better from that and we'll have 75+ points, and have enjoyed a terrific year.
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Can't argue with any of that really to be fair.
My biggest gripe is Klopp not getting to grips with this whole having his team defend like one thing. It was something you and many others called out and hammered Rodgers for (rightly so at times)
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Points well made but aren't the 'Watfords, West Hams, Southamptons and Boros' the teams that are responsible for the pain? 10 points indeed.
And we did rest players and so on for the last 5 or 6 League games last season as we went all out for the Europa so that's arguably a factor in us having no more than 62 points.
I dunno, maybe we're all overreacting to one defeat but we're at home to relegation fodder (who werent even that good y'day) with the chance to cement our place in the top 4 and we churn out that muck for 90 minutes with the same old glaring weaknesses exposed once again...that shit has to be hard to stomach for the most positive Liverpool fan.
I dunno, maybe we're all overreacting to one defeat but we're at home to relegation fodder (who werent even that good y'day) with the chance to cement our place in the top 4 and we churn out that muck for 90 minutes with the same old glaring weaknesses exposed once again...that shit has to be hard to stomach for the most positive Liverpool fan.
I agree with Ryan, I didn't watch the game but Jesus Chris compare this thread with some of the stuff written in the last few weeks and it really gets you scratching your head.
Every fan knows we need improving and that many of our current players are average at best but considering our squad compared with what's around us we are doing very well.
4th is still very much on the cards with the fixtures everyone else has.
As for Palace, they have looked good for a couple of months now and have a manager who's is excellent at making teams hard to beat and good at set pieces.
They fucking came from 1-0 down to be the champions a elect a few weeks ago.
Get a fucking grip.
Every fan knows we need improving and that many of our current players are average at best but considering our squad compared with what's around us we are doing very well.
4th is still very much on the cards with the fixtures everyone else has.
As for Palace, they have looked good for a couple of months now and have a manager who's is excellent at making teams hard to beat and good at set pieces.
They fucking came from 1-0 down to be the champions a elect a few weeks ago.
Get a fucking grip.
Anyway, in terms of the match itself - thought I'd highlight how poor Origi was.
This fucking frustrating tendency of being either flat-footed or caught behind the centre back everytime the ball came into the box did my head in. Decent at holding it up sure, but he never seperated himself from anyone, his movement was limited and slow, and he looked a yard off the pace.
Shit effort.
This fucking frustrating tendency of being either flat-footed or caught behind the centre back everytime the ball came into the box did my head in. Decent at holding it up sure, but he never seperated himself from anyone, his movement was limited and slow, and he looked a yard off the pace.
Shit effort.
It's a bit of a myth, this "people only post when we lose" jarg.
The Stoke match thread was 16 pages, the palace one 17 pages. Both post match threads are 6 pages, with another thread 4 pages long devoted to Lucas, after the Stoke match. So it's fairly insignificant. People DO post when we win and the so called moaners all contributed to both games respective threads, so it's not really true at all. Maybe narrow wins against teams we should beat, promotes less talking points, than beating a top team, getting beat by a minnow at home or battering someone. I'd say that's fairly normal.
People go over the top both ways, we lose and the sky is caving in, we win and the happy clappy bunch were right all along, we're amazing. It'd be weird if there was a happy medium, because football is such a polarising subject.
The Stoke match thread was 16 pages, the palace one 17 pages. Both post match threads are 6 pages, with another thread 4 pages long devoted to Lucas, after the Stoke match. So it's fairly insignificant. People DO post when we win and the so called moaners all contributed to both games respective threads, so it's not really true at all. Maybe narrow wins against teams we should beat, promotes less talking points, than beating a top team, getting beat by a minnow at home or battering someone. I'd say that's fairly normal.
People go over the top both ways, we lose and the sky is caving in, we win and the happy clappy bunch were right all along, we're amazing. It'd be weird if there was a happy medium, because football is such a polarising subject.
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Wow. This thread? Quite a few here seriously need to get laid....
City are taking 3rd. Bar the Manc derby, their run-in is a gift. 4th place is a straight fight between us and United.
They've got to go to Man City, Arsenal and Spurs. They're not taking 9 points from that. No fucking chance.
If we take 10 points from our remaining 4 games, we'll make top 4.
They've got to go to Man City, Arsenal and Spurs. They're not taking 9 points from that. No fucking chance.
If we take 10 points from our remaining 4 games, we'll make top 4.
This is where I think it's narrow though, because United are equally as unpredictable, especially when it comes to bigger games. They have a habit of getting results when you least expect them to. So I expect them to get a few points despite the difficulty of the games and for us to drop some, despite how easy they look on paper. Fingers crossed we do it, it's in our hands really so we have to.
Great post Ryan. Hit the nail on the head there.
I think we need about 10 points to have a chance if Utd continue to have this sort of form.
I do however think it might take just one loss to get them a bit shaken. Hopefully that comes on Thursday.
City surely will have a point to prove and Utd have got so many injuries now. Pogba is probably out aswell.
I think we need about 10 points to have a chance if Utd continue to have this sort of form.
I do however think it might take just one loss to get them a bit shaken. Hopefully that comes on Thursday.
City surely will have a point to prove and Utd have got so many injuries now. Pogba is probably out aswell.
You really can't call how many points we will get from that list. What's our average points per game without playing the top 7? It will probably be something similar. I reckon we will get maybe 7/8 points from those 4 games. I really don't think we will get top 4 now.
This is exactly the same point I made when I saw the run in a few weeks ago. It's all about the fact that we struggle against the kind of teams we have left. I'd rather have a derby and a top six game or two. Fourth is still possible of course, but I don't think we will get it. I hope I'm wrong.
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