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Carra might be out for long

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[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=42963.msg1226371#msg1226371 date=1291103941]
I tend to agree with kingjulian on this one. We do need a commanding CB, but in January? Let's face it: this season is pretty much a write-off. We're not going to finish top 4 and we're not going to get relegated. The Europa League is our only realistic chance of winning anything. We may as well use Carra's absence to blood our promising young defenders. If we buy someone now, how will we ever find out if Wilson is good enough, or if Kelly can reproduce his full-back form in the centre? It's a transitional season: we may as well use it move forward in some meaningful way. Wait till the summer, then decide who of Agger/Skrtel/Greek we want to sell in order to bring in the next Sami.

[/quote]

We could be in trouble though if one of our remaining centre backs isn't up to the task. I doubt if Agger will even play another game for us so it's not even worth including him, Soto can't play every game (and has been guided through many BY Carra). I know we need to give young players a chance, I'm just unsure whether this is the time to do that. Though I guess we at least now have a situation where we can try them out til January and go from there.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=42963.msg1226372#msg1226372 date=1291104069]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=42963.msg1226371#msg1226371 date=1291103941]
I tend to agree with kingjulian on this one. We do need a commanding CB, but in January? Let's face it: this season is pretty much a write-off. We're not going to finish top 4 and we're not going to get relegated. The Europa League is our only realistic chance of winning anything. We may as well use Carra's absence to blood our promising young defenders. If we buy someone now, how will we ever find out if Wilson is good enough, or if Kelly can reproduce his full-back form in the centre? It's a transitional season: we may as well use it move forward in some meaningful way. Wait till the summer, then decide who of Agger/Skrtel/Greek we want to sell in order to bring in the next Sami.

[/quote]

We could be in trouble though if one of our remaining centre backs isn't up to the task. I doubt if Agger will even play another game for us so it's not even worth including him, Soto can't play every game (and has been guided through many BY Carra). I know we need to give young players a chance, I'm just unsure whether this is the time to do that. Though I guess we at least now have a situation where we can try them out til January and go from there.
[/quote]

To quote Primo Levi: if not now, when?
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=42963.msg1226373#msg1226373 date=1291104219]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=42963.msg1226372#msg1226372 date=1291104069]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=42963.msg1226371#msg1226371 date=1291103941]
I tend to agree with kingjulian on this one. We do need a commanding CB, but in January? Let's face it: this season is pretty much a write-off. We're not going to finish top 4 and we're not going to get relegated. The Europa League is our only realistic chance of winning anything. We may as well use Carra's absence to blood our promising young defenders. If we buy someone now, how will we ever find out if Wilson is good enough, or if Kelly can reproduce his full-back form in the centre? It's a transitional season: we may as well use it move forward in some meaningful way. Wait till the summer, then decide who of Agger/Skrtel/Greek we want to sell in order to bring in the next Sami.

[/quote]

We could be in trouble though if one of our remaining centre backs isn't up to the task. I doubt if Agger will even play another game for us so it's not even worth including him, Soto can't play every game (and has been guided through many BY Carra). I know we need to give young players a chance, I'm just unsure whether this is the time to do that. Though I guess we at least now have a situation where we can try them out til January and go from there.
[/quote]

To quote Primo Levi: if not now, when?

[/quote]

This is it, I just don't want us to struggle any more than we are doing. Like I said though, there's a month until the window opens anyway so we'll more or less have to, at least that gives us a month to decide and have a look.
 
I actually think Wilson would step up if he is given the chance. Really hope he plays on thursday.
 
Agree with Hansern that we'll probably be on the lookout for a CB. Already did - with the recent Rami link, but perhaps will be even more active in watching potential targets in this area.

kingjulian and Bunny's point about giving younger players a go too, is obviously valid. Cos its in time's of injuries and suspensions that these type of players really get a chance to prove their worth. Can't expect them to fight their way into manager's plan with just one good performance on the odd 1st team appearance.

That said, Mark's analysis of our current CB options is valid too, esp with Soto's and Agger's situation. We'll probably still have to bring in 1 CB within the next 2 transfer windows, regardless of how well Kelly or Wilson might do. Dec and Jan will be busy months packed with games and it'll be interesting to see the likes of Wilson being given a run of games (although I guess it'll be Soto+Skrtel mostly). Meanwhile, we'll be on the lookout for CBs just as Hansern pointed out, not that I'd mind, if the right one is available for the right price.
 
Don't we get Ayala back in January? I wouldn't want to waste the money on a CB. Wingers and a Striker please. LB if the right one is available.
 
I'm fairly confident that HOdgson will looking for a *stop-gap* CB in January; not a top one though, since that might impede the progression of Wilson and Kelly.
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=42963.msg1226371#msg1226371 date=1291103941]
I tend to agree with kingjulian on this one. We do need a commanding CB, but in January? Let's face it: this season is pretty much a write-off. We're not going to finish top 4 and we're not going to get relegated. The Europa League is our only realistic chance of winning anything. We may as well use Carra's absence to blood our promising young defenders. If we buy someone now, how will we ever find out if Wilson is good enough, or if Kelly can reproduce his full-back form in the centre? It's a transitional season: we may as well use it move forward in some meaningful way. Wait till the summer, then decide who of Agger/Skrtel/Greek we want to sell in order to bring in the next Sami.

[/quote]

I think buying a CB should have been a priority even without Carra's injury. Stability at the back affects so much more than meets the eye and a strong central defense is a foundation of almost every top team. It would be a pain to start rebuilding with a below par backline and it would be that much harder for the likes of Hazard(yeah yeah) to settle in if the confidence towards our defense just isn't there.

You are right this season is a write-off but shouldn't the time be used in forming a good partnership at the back? I'd rather the new defenders settled in(and got their early mistakes out of way) this season rather than in the beginning of next. There's still plenty of games left to give the likes of Wilson a few games too.
 
wow

Since the start of the 2004-2005 season until now, jamie carragher has missed just 9 league matches
 
Re: wow

Wow indeed, but isn't there already a Carra thread just below this?

Am I being a thread Nazi here?
 
Skrtel, Kyrgiakos, Kelly and Wilson are good enough for three months. Three of them are full internationals, and the other is a England under 21 captain.

If we are buying a CB who will be better than Carra, i see the point of buying a CB. Because Carra needs to be replaced with a younger player in the near future anyway. But if we buy a stop gap, it will be a really really shitty purchase, and i don't see how a management team worth anything, can allow for that sort of panic decision to be made by the Coach.

We have quite a bit of protection where CB is concerned. If i was holding the purse i wouldn't let a single penny be wasted on a stop gap. Because in the summer then we will be faced with offloading at least three CBs and bringing in someone good, which is not an easy task.

I hope we focus on adding players who would address our horrible weakness - LB, Wing, Forwards. I would actually even not mind if we don't improve on Lucas and Poulsen in this transfer window itself.
 
[quote author=Assulin link=topic=42963.msg1226386#msg1226386 date=1291105890]
Don't we get Ayala back in January? I wouldn't want to waste the money on a CB. Wingers and a Striker please. LB if the right one is available.
[/quote]

yeah, ayala tends to get overlooked but he's right up there with wilson and kelly in terms of promise.

i can see both points of view, but in general i'm in favour of giving the youngsters a chance and holding fire on a new signing until the summer (also, i don't think the agger situation's quite as drastic as mark's making out). we've got these 3 quality youngsters - there's never a good time to blood centre halves, there'll always be reasons not to. sometimes you just have to be brave and bite the bullet, otherwise you might as well not bother investing in young defenders ever again.
 
I agree with kingjulian's last post. Buying a defender that has no long term future here would be the most idiotic choice possible.

Regarding our youngsters, I have seen them play far less than I'd like but Wilson is the one that has shown most promise to me.
 
Mark is biased against Agger and that much is undeniable. I think Agger will be fit and available to play after January. He has only been advised rest to prevent Calcification. It's not as if he is broken.

Even if he isn't available for the rest of the season...we have enough to carry through till Carra returns from injury. If the right kind of player is available i would buy the CB, but i'd rather let a new manager purchase that CB and not Hodgson.
 
[quote author=peterhague link=topic=42963.msg1226407#msg1226407 date=1291107027]
[quote author=Assulin link=topic=42963.msg1226386#msg1226386 date=1291105890]
Don't we get Ayala back in January? I wouldn't want to waste the money on a CB. Wingers and a Striker please. LB if the right one is available.
[/quote]

yeah, ayala tends to get overlooked but he's right up there with wilson and kelly in terms of promise.

i can see both points of view, but in general i'm in favour of giving the youngsters a chance and holding fire on a new signing until the summer (also, i don't think the agger situation's quite as drastic as mark's making out). we've got these 3 quality youngsters - there's never a good time to blood centre halves, there'll always be reasons not to. sometimes you just have to be brave and bite the bullet, otherwise you might as well not bother investing in young defenders ever again.
[/quote]


I agree with your view, and julian's...but Hodgson might feel 'some' pressure to at least deliver 'something'.

(God knows what)

He might feel he needs to spend some money on CB.
 
[quote author=Avmenon link=topic=42963.msg1226413#msg1226413 date=1291107655]
[quote author=peterhague link=topic=42963.msg1226407#msg1226407 date=1291107027]
[quote author=Assulin link=topic=42963.msg1226386#msg1226386 date=1291105890]
Don't we get Ayala back in January? I wouldn't want to waste the money on a CB. Wingers and a Striker please. LB if the right one is available.
[/quote]

yeah, ayala tends to get overlooked but he's right up there with wilson and kelly in terms of promise.

i can see both points of view, but in general i'm in favour of giving the youngsters a chance and holding fire on a new signing until the summer (also, i don't think the agger situation's quite as drastic as mark's making out). we've got these 3 quality youngsters - there's never a good time to blood centre halves, there'll always be reasons not to. sometimes you just have to be brave and bite the bullet, otherwise you might as well not bother investing in young defenders ever again.
[/quote]


I agree with your view, and julian's...but Hodgson might feel 'some' pressure to at least deliver 'something'.

(God knows what)

He might feel he needs to spend some money on CB.
[/quote]

oh yeah, i expect he will, i just don't think we should. why will he? because he doesn't trust youngsters, that's why.


only joking, mark.
 
3 months wow

I suppose it is a position on the pitch where we have decent cover though. I assume this blows Agger's chance of a Jan move

Shame as Carra had returned to form recently, he was amazing at Spurs
 
3 months out. Fuck sake.

New cb will be signed in january then, or maybe Agger will get a chance to prove himself if he promises Roy not to persist with the short passing and lump it up field.
 
I don't agree with buying a stop gap in January. If someone of good enough quality were available, we should buy, otherwise we'll make do with what we have. It's time to see if Kelly and Wilson are good enough to step up. We won't get a better opportunity.
 
This is a serious blow to the club.

Carra has in my opnion been one the best performers all Season I'm very concerned with regards to a Skrtel/Greek partnership to say the least. Both decent defenders but they are both often looking rather headless without Carra alongside them.

Agger's posibility to claw his way back however as it will be rather difficult for Roy to overlook him should he get ready to play.

That said I agree very much with the sentiment that to go out and buy a stop gap at this stage would be daft.

Step up Wilson/Ayala anyone.

*And pleasepleasepleaseplease be less injured Agger!!!
 
The added blow on top of losing Carra as a defender is that we'll be losing his leadership, passion and commitment in his absence.
 
Sometimes losing players like Carragher really helps others to step forward and show some leadership and really bond with the club and the fans with some amazing performances.

I'm not talking about Spoiled Brats like Torres, but players like Meirles, Skrtel, the Greek, maybe even Josephine Cole.

Did anyone see Torres turn his back on the penalty kick at the weekend, before it had even been taken. He really can't be arsed.
 
I could be wrong but I think Torres often turns away from penalty kicks.
He watches the crowd and gauges the outcome by their reaction.
He certainly did it during the Sunderland match.
I don't think it is a sign of disinterest, quite the contrary actually.
 
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