Borrell and McParland sacked?
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That's on my bucket list.
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RedZeppelin III
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Is that really true ? i thought Rodgers was all about Youth setup considering he spent a large amount of his career working in it . The problem here could be that he feels he knows a hell of a lot about it and wasn't happy with something in our academy .
I dunno zep. I'll take the guy with experience building the Barca setup over the guy who was involved in Reading, any day of the week. I think the manager needs to focus on his already full plate, and for the club to grow, let others who are more qualified focus on youth development. If they were leaving anyway, that would be fine. But if they were pushed, by Rodgers maneuvering, I would be concerned.
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RedZeppelin III
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Hey , he was mourinho's youth bitch at chelsea too wasn't he ?
but yeah very hard to tell which way this one will go . As someone said in this thread already , we'll see the fruits of their labour in 4-5 yrs . Guess same can be said if letting them go was a bad idea (if they were pushed and didn't walk of course) , we'll find out in a few yrs ! .
but yeah very hard to tell which way this one will go . As someone said in this thread already , we'll see the fruits of their labour in 4-5 yrs . Guess same can be said if letting them go was a bad idea (if they were pushed and didn't walk of course) , we'll find out in a few yrs ! .
I wouldn't mind guessing that the amount of local talent coming through is at the root of all this, compare what the bitters find, develop and bring through compared to us. Just an observation but I'm guessing I'm not that far wide of the mark especialling after reading some of the earlier comments about the philosophy of Inglethorpe
Reds Academy duo stunned by double sacking
22 Nov 2013 09:06
Echo understands Brendan Rodgers instrumental in Academy restructuring
Frank McParland at the LFC Academy
The sense of shock among Liverpool FC supporters at the sacking of Academy chiefs Frank McParland and Rodolfo Borrell was shared by the men whose services have been dispensed with.
Neither saw it coming prior to being informed on Wednesday that they were surplus to requirements at Kirkby.
Academy director McParland and Borrell, who was Academy technical director and head of coaching, were told the club wanted ‘to change the way they do things’.
Liverpool have so far declined to comment on what represents a major overhaul of the Academy. A statement is
expected to be released once severance packages have been agreed.
Manager Brendan Rodgers wouldn’t be drawn on their exit during his weekly press briefing at Melwood yesterday.
However, the ECHO understands Rodgers has been instrumental in the decision to restructure the Academy.
The Northern Irishman had already made changes at under-21 and under-18 level with the appointment of coaches Alex Inglethorpe and Neil Critchley over the past year.
Rodolfo Borrell
Now he has decided he wants new faces at the top.
The timing is certainly strange coming just days before the Merseyside derby and youngsters at the Academy were left stunned by the news yesterday.
Both McParland and Borrell were popular figures at Kirkby and well respected for the work they had done over the past four and a half years.
They were appointed by Rafa Benitez in the summer of 2009 as the then Reds boss sought to kick-start the conveyor belt of youth talent.
Spaniard Borrell boasted an impressive CV having spent 13 years with La Liga giants Barcelona where he helped develop the likes of Lionel Messi, Gerard Pique and Cesc Fabregas.
He started at Kirkby working with the under-18s and then the under-21s before taking up the role of technical director a year ago.
Huyton-born McParland, who had previously served Liverpool as chief scout, was entrusted with making sweeping changes to the club’s coaching network in order to address the dearth of talent emerging from the Academy.
The days of friction between Melwood and Kirkby appeared to have ended following his arrival with much closer ties established between the club’s two training bases.
His work also appeared to be reaping its rewards with no fewer than seven Academy youngsters making their first team debuts last season as Jordon Ibe followed in the footsteps of Suso, Andre Wisdom, Adam Morgan, Samed Yesil, Jerome Sinclair and Conor Coady.
The likes of Raheem Sterling, Jon Flanagan and Jack Robinson have also progressed from Kirkby to the senior set-up during his reign.
McParland was excited about the potential of the next crop coming through as he rated the current group of under-18 players, which includes the likes of Sinclair, Ibe, Harry Wilson, Ryan Kent, Lloyd Jones, Cameron Brannagan, Jordan Rossiter, Sergi Canos and Pedro Chirivella as the best he had ever been involved in.
As well as unearthing gems from abroad, McParland, a lifelong Liverpool fan, was also passionate about bringing through home-grown talent.
What’s clear is that he’s left the Academy in infinitely better shape than he found it.
Now Liverpool must find suitable replacements capable of building on the solid foundations McParland and Borrell have laid.
22 Nov 2013 09:06
Echo understands Brendan Rodgers instrumental in Academy restructuring
Frank McParland at the LFC Academy
The sense of shock among Liverpool FC supporters at the sacking of Academy chiefs Frank McParland and Rodolfo Borrell was shared by the men whose services have been dispensed with.
Neither saw it coming prior to being informed on Wednesday that they were surplus to requirements at Kirkby.
Academy director McParland and Borrell, who was Academy technical director and head of coaching, were told the club wanted ‘to change the way they do things’.
Liverpool have so far declined to comment on what represents a major overhaul of the Academy. A statement is
expected to be released once severance packages have been agreed.
Manager Brendan Rodgers wouldn’t be drawn on their exit during his weekly press briefing at Melwood yesterday.
However, the ECHO understands Rodgers has been instrumental in the decision to restructure the Academy.
The Northern Irishman had already made changes at under-21 and under-18 level with the appointment of coaches Alex Inglethorpe and Neil Critchley over the past year.
Now he has decided he wants new faces at the top.
The timing is certainly strange coming just days before the Merseyside derby and youngsters at the Academy were left stunned by the news yesterday.
Both McParland and Borrell were popular figures at Kirkby and well respected for the work they had done over the past four and a half years.
They were appointed by Rafa Benitez in the summer of 2009 as the then Reds boss sought to kick-start the conveyor belt of youth talent.
Spaniard Borrell boasted an impressive CV having spent 13 years with La Liga giants Barcelona where he helped develop the likes of Lionel Messi, Gerard Pique and Cesc Fabregas.
He started at Kirkby working with the under-18s and then the under-21s before taking up the role of technical director a year ago.
Huyton-born McParland, who had previously served Liverpool as chief scout, was entrusted with making sweeping changes to the club’s coaching network in order to address the dearth of talent emerging from the Academy.
The days of friction between Melwood and Kirkby appeared to have ended following his arrival with much closer ties established between the club’s two training bases.
His work also appeared to be reaping its rewards with no fewer than seven Academy youngsters making their first team debuts last season as Jordon Ibe followed in the footsteps of Suso, Andre Wisdom, Adam Morgan, Samed Yesil, Jerome Sinclair and Conor Coady.
The likes of Raheem Sterling, Jon Flanagan and Jack Robinson have also progressed from Kirkby to the senior set-up during his reign.
McParland was excited about the potential of the next crop coming through as he rated the current group of under-18 players, which includes the likes of Sinclair, Ibe, Harry Wilson, Ryan Kent, Lloyd Jones, Cameron Brannagan, Jordan Rossiter, Sergi Canos and Pedro Chirivella as the best he had ever been involved in.
As well as unearthing gems from abroad, McParland, a lifelong Liverpool fan, was also passionate about bringing through home-grown talent.
What’s clear is that he’s left the Academy in infinitely better shape than he found it.
Now Liverpool must find suitable replacements capable of building on the solid foundations McParland and Borrell have laid.
this is the kind of guff I was questioning yesterday.
I think it's clear from Rodgers comments that he wasn't particularly happy with whatever was happening or not happening. So the stories about how everything is great since Borrell and McParland got involved - despite the contrary indications, have to be taken with a pinch of salt.
I think it's clear from Rodgers comments that he wasn't particularly happy with whatever was happening or not happening. So the stories about how everything is great since Borrell and McParland got involved - despite the contrary indications, have to be taken with a pinch of salt.
Yet again our new press supremo decides the best way to manage the news is to lock herself in her office and take the phones off the hooks. I know there are probably contractual reasons for discretion, but in this day and age you can't keep acting as if it's just John Keith standing outside the ground with a homburg hat and a notebook.
It's better than sending them pretentious letters i guess
I reckon they were fired from the grassy knoll.
What are the 'contrary indications'?
Rosco thinks the fact we haven't won the Youth Cup under their watch is indication of failure. Never mind the stream of players who have been making the step from the academy to Melwood.
While their influences might have impacted the lower age groups, the way things have been portrayed as being positive seem to be based on how the young players made it to 1st team in recent seasons.
Like I mentioned in earlier post, I'm not sure if the player's involvement in the 1st team esp. last season is a valid factor for the rosy picture. Necessity
played a huge part in their selection. How many manage to break into the 18 man squad to feature regularly?
For example:
Yesil - 125 min in League Cup
Coady - 2 min in League, 60 min in Europa League
Morgan - 122 min in Europa League, 45 min in FA Cup
Thus, I can see why Rosco's stand about "taking stories about how great they are with a pinch of salt".
Like I mentioned in earlier post, I'm not sure if the player's involvement in the 1st team esp. last season is a valid factor for the rosy picture. Necessity
played a huge part in their selection. How many manage to break into the 18 man squad to feature regularly?
For example:
Yesil - 125 min in League Cup
Coady - 2 min in League, 60 min in Europa League
Morgan - 122 min in Europa League, 45 min in FA Cup
Thus, I can see why Rosco's stand about "taking stories about how great they are with a pinch of salt".
I get your point mate, but that's not of importance to me and not a point I agree on with Rosco. I've stated my views in my earlier post why I have my own doubts though (about the impact created/rosy picture that seems to be painted). Like I also mentioned, its purely paper talk from me but I'm not judging simply based on reports/hear-say and reputation.
I've never said they failed - I said the main reason people think they're great is because of stock phrases that appear in articles, and we've seen little in the way of evidence to back it up.
The stream of players you refer to were pretty much all signed from outside and not academy products
13 of the present present under 21 squad (33 players listed) came from the academy. Let's see what happens with the current academy players in the next couple of years - then we can have some indication they were doing something right.
What's the job spec ?
If you judge it the way Doc does, money to sign lots of young players makes a good academy director.
Ross, if you don't know what the job spec is, how can you criticise others then?
I don't know much about it either, but I find it rather strange (and quite the cheap shot) for you to be sarcastically deriding others opinions, without putting forward any of your own.
Tell us why these two guys haven't done a good job if you're that insistent everyone else is wrong.
Here's my first post in the thread Ryan.
What I've done since then is point out the opinions people hold of Borrell and McParland are not really based on anything other than a narrative that was set in train a few years ago.
And yet you went on to criticise them for not winning the bloody Youth Cup? If you don't know the success metrics of their job, how can you judge them?
I'd say there are two fairly obvious assumptions we could make regarding the responsibilities for an Academy Director(s) of a football club (and feel free to correct me if you think these are incorrect assumptions to make);
- Find young talent and bring it to the club
- Develop them so they can transition to the senior squad/team.
In both respects, these two have succeeded. In fact, I can't recall having so many young players in our squad who look capable of being a long-term part of the club. In fact, here's Frank McParland's opening line on the club website with regard to his role as Academy Director:
"At the Liverpool FC Academy we have one simple aim - to produce footballers of the future by nurturing the natural talent of youngsters from Merseyside and beyond." So it seems my assumption was correct.
It also seems to me that you're playing the contrarian, again, (without proffering a decent counter-argument of your own) for the sake of it Ross.
The sad thing is that all the in-fighting and silly sulks and political games, which have been allowed to go on ever since the Academy was opened, has alienated most of the local talent. Even many LFC-supporting kids, with LFC-supporting parents, would rather go to Everton because the stories about the chaos in Kirkby scares them off. And it's Everton who have more of a chance of uncovering great local talent as a consequence. The real problem, as I said earlier, is at the source, not the subsequent schooling. I do believe that really great young payers will come through the system no matter how average that system is. They just do. (It's obviously sensible to coach them as well as possible, but you've got to have the raw talent.) Owen had Lilleshall, I guess, but he looked phenomenal as a prospect right from the start. Hardly any young players look like that now. Rossiter does, IMHO, but otherwise you've got degrees of promise which all fall short of making you get really excited about how far they can go. So the most important of all the tasks remains, I think, spotting local talent and persuading them to come here. Until and unless we do that well again, no amount of reshuffles of the staff is going to improve our quota of youth players making it into the first team squad - unless we just lower the standards required for making it into the first team squad. So we need better scouting and also we should really make use of ex-players of recent vintage, such as Fowler, to draw the players to the club, just like Kenny did with Fowler. But it worries me that everyone at the club and the Academy still don't seem to realise how much damage their own internal battles are doing to the cause.
we have like no academy players that have been good enough for the lower sides of the premiership, compare that to united who have a few in lower teams, i have no idea whether thats any indication of failure/success though cause i dont know a fucking thing about any of this
I think we can judge their success by how many of the players they were responsible for go on to be first team regulars or first team stars. And at the moment, I can't see either of those being likely. And I think the current lot are much helped by the fact Rodgers is in charge, likes playing youth players, and that we had a small squad last year. If we had a big name foreign manager and a decent sized squad would they have got a chance? Not as much I'd have thought.
The difficult thing is, you'd expect their players to be ready for the first team around the age of 20-21, and if they've picked them up at 16 or younger, that's a 5year minimum turnaround. And since Borrell only came to the club 4yrs ago, how is he meant to have a chance in that time? I personally don't think any of the ones in and around the squad at the moment will make it, but I'd love to be wrong. But these are the ones that are the first signs of what he's been upto.
I know teams like southampton have a larger catchment area, but I think they're also doing something differently behind the scenes to bring these players through. Arsenal too. Maybe this is why Rodgers and the club wanted rid? Maybe they've not seen enough in the 4yrs to convince them that it's going in the right direction of these other clubs that are doing it.
Like Macca mentioned though, to the kids and their parents, we need to be seen as an attractive club to go to, where they'll be nurtured properly and get a chance at the first team, I think Rodgers has proven the later part, bit the first part needs sorting else they'll go elsewhere.
The difficult thing is, you'd expect their players to be ready for the first team around the age of 20-21, and if they've picked them up at 16 or younger, that's a 5year minimum turnaround. And since Borrell only came to the club 4yrs ago, how is he meant to have a chance in that time? I personally don't think any of the ones in and around the squad at the moment will make it, but I'd love to be wrong. But these are the ones that are the first signs of what he's been upto.
I know teams like southampton have a larger catchment area, but I think they're also doing something differently behind the scenes to bring these players through. Arsenal too. Maybe this is why Rodgers and the club wanted rid? Maybe they've not seen enough in the 4yrs to convince them that it's going in the right direction of these other clubs that are doing it.
Like Macca mentioned though, to the kids and their parents, we need to be seen as an attractive club to go to, where they'll be nurtured properly and get a chance at the first team, I think Rodgers has proven the later part, bit the first part needs sorting else they'll go elsewhere.
From the limited amount I seen of our academy teams the sad thing is that the youngsters do look to be more " technical " and the style of play very much is based on short neat quick passing so perhaps Borrell's influence is starting to bear fruit. It is mad to use the youth cup to compare progress over the years as we have been playing very young teams in this competion recently.
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