I'm fairly certain we won't finish top 4. There may be more margin for error, but our players are more susceptible to getting beat by a load of plodders like they did yesterday.
Bin the Europa League off
- Thread starter Oliver Twist
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I understand why you would say that, but I disagree, (a) because the Prem is so open this season and (b) because we're no less likely to get beaten by a bunch of plodders in the Europa League - probably more so, in fact, because they won't even be familiar plodders.
In a one off knockout game in Europe (or two-legged tie in this case) I'd fancy us to keep our concentration. Klopp has a good European pedigree and the players are more likely to be concentrated on the task at hand. Over 38 games in the league we will see a fair few slip ups. If we take it as a given that City, Arse and Utd will finish in the top 4, then that leaves one spot. One spot that we have to fight it out with Spurs (4 points above us), Leicester (who are likely to fall away, but are already 8 points ahead), West Ham (will fall away too, but 4 points ahead), Saints (3 points ahead), Everton (level on points and a similar level team to ourselves in this moment) and then Chelsea who can't stay this bad surely? They're only 6 points behind. I think that's only marginally a better chance (maybe) than going all the way in the Europa League. Both will be extremely difficult. But I don't think our players have the mentality of a long slog in the league.
So we'll slip up in the league but not in the Europa?
I think your reasoning is very flimsy
To be honest, I think we will slip up in both. There's just loads more chances to fuck up in the league.
Yeah. But one fuck up could mean the end of the Europa League. But not the league
And I think/hope that's what would be in the manager's and players' minds in the Europa league. "One fuck up and we're out, so let's not pass it to Yannick Bolasie in our 6 yard box."
We've been doing that thing in the league for years where we go "We're only 9 points behind fourth, if we win these 4 games, and the Arsenal squad come down with a case of Ebola we MIGHT qualify on goal difference." We're already playing catch up and we're fucking shit at it.
I'm not sure that a bad weekend means we should head for the exit in other competitions. I want the manager of Liverpool FC to show some ambition and look to try to win and progress in all competitions.
This manager is as good as we could've hoped for and I'm sure has pretty much written his own contract, hopefully without those stupid pressure inducing targets. He's here for the long haul I'd hope and must be allowed to develop the team and that is only going to happen if it's formed in the heat of competition.
I don't want the club to be prioritizing this and that game in an attempt to finish fourth and I bet Klopp doesn't. He wants believers, doubting we're capable of playing two games in a week isn't what he wants, certainly not from his players which he has made abundantly clear.
He wants the supporters on board and all he's getting at present is a chorus of cynicism and reasons why this and that can't be done.
If this guy doesn't inspire then I don't know who will.
This manager is as good as we could've hoped for and I'm sure has pretty much written his own contract, hopefully without those stupid pressure inducing targets. He's here for the long haul I'd hope and must be allowed to develop the team and that is only going to happen if it's formed in the heat of competition.
I don't want the club to be prioritizing this and that game in an attempt to finish fourth and I bet Klopp doesn't. He wants believers, doubting we're capable of playing two games in a week isn't what he wants, certainly not from his players which he has made abundantly clear.
He wants the supporters on board and all he's getting at present is a chorus of cynicism and reasons why this and that can't be done.
If this guy doesn't inspire then I don't know who will.
Er, right. Ok, because sport always follows what these guys say. Forgot about that.
Shall we give back the 5th CL trophy? Or the following FA cup?
Talk about wrong mentality.
The team should get used to playing in Europe followed by a PL game. Get used to the traveling and the varying styles the team is likely to come up against.
Way to miss the point, bro.
"Wrong mentality" my foot - I said I didn't want us to give up on the Europa League. But we're just not ready as a squad to go balls out for everything so we have to prioritise, and the league has to be priority one.
Excellent post. Bonus points for exceptional use of 'balls out'.
The league offers margin for error, but it offers margin for error for our competition as well. I really dont think we have the top 4 settled squads in the league thats the reason i dont think we will do anything in the league even if we prioritize. I actually think Chelsea overtaking us again is far more likely to happen than us overtaking spurs. Especially given our injury situation.
Not an unreasonable view, but premature IMHO in such a topsy-turvy season, and it leaves untouched the basic points (a) that a Cup competition is inherently even more of a risk and (b) that, if at our current stage of development - or lack of it - we go for everything equally, we'll be trying to run before we can walk and will reduce our chances of making any of those efforts count.
Clever question. The answer is the Europa league, but that's not and never has been the issue. We have a better chance of getting 4th in the Prem than we have of winning any knockout competition and the rewards will be far greater if we do, so that's what we should prioritise, IMHO anyway.
It's an opinion I can understand, but don't share. I'd much rather win stuff than get 4th in the hope that it helps us win stuff later.
Let's agree to differ. I want LFC to win not just any trophies but the biggest ones, I want us doing so on a regular basis again and it's clear to me that the way to achieve that will necessarily involve progressing in the league. Cup competitions are the icing - we have to bake the cake first.
You've used that analogy before, I still like it just as much though. Very Shankly-esque.
Are the rewards for getting 4th really greater than winning the EL?
Definitely. Someone posted the figures on here a while back and, though I don't have them in front of me, the list indicated there was a lot more to be won in EPL top four prize money than from winning the Europa League. Longer term there's a massive amount more still to be gained from becoming a regular top four side and, as I've said above, it's clear to me that progress in the league is what will lead to that outcome.
I don't think there would be that much difference financially between coming 4th and coming, say, 6th and also winning the EL.
Ged put us back on the map in Europe and Rafa put us right in the centre of it. Currently, we're off the map again. We need to get back on it if we are to attract the players we need to win the league.
The league is always the priority even if we have CL footie but we can't afford to ignore the EL right now.
Your final sentence is an excellent summary of the situation IMO and I haven't said we should ignore the Europa League. Prioritising the Prem doesn't mean giving up on the EL which, as long as we're in it, we should defo try to win. There will be times, though, when team selection will be affected by the fact that we're still in both competitions, and will depend on which we regard as more important to us. It's at those times that the Prem should always be top priority, IMO at any rate.
This thread reminds me of Mystic's "should I go new build thread".
Ultimately it's nice to win something just like it's nice to buy a shiny new house but the dreams of winning fall down around our ears. Like a new build.
Or something. I'm not good at analogies.
Ultimately it's nice to win something just like it's nice to buy a shiny new house but the dreams of winning fall down around our ears. Like a new build.
Or something. I'm not good at analogies.
That's not a bad one actually. Shiny and new is nice, but not the most important thing - you have to lay proper foundations if you want something to last.
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