Poll 6CM Voting Poll
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Wow, British politics has suddenly become interesting. I definitely want some form of PR now.
Any chance Clegg might be PM if he agrees a deal with Labour? It would make more sense, democratically, than the next Labour leader taking over, given that no one has actually voted for them.
Any chance Clegg might be PM if he agrees a deal with Labour? It would make more sense, democratically, than the next Labour leader taking over, given that no one has actually voted for them.
Those Boulton & Campbell interviews are amusing but Boulton did not come well out of either of them, you can tell Campbell doesn't doesn't take the "threat" of being interrogated by boulton particularly seriously and was swatting him away with ease. Boulton seems to get very flustered when he becomes slightly agitated.
Vince Cable would make a significantly better chancellor of the exchequer than Osbourne but will Cameron be prepared to sacrifice his Bullingdon Buddy.
Vince Cable would make a significantly better chancellor of the exchequer than Osbourne but will Cameron be prepared to sacrifice his Bullingdon Buddy.
Vlad, I was merely responding to Fox's post. No inside info from me sadly but you'll be first to hear if I get any!
Dep PM is a bit of a non-job in the Tory party. Its different in the Labour party but then they can't offer it as its elected. Having said that Hezza was dep PM in the 90s. It depends on what is made of the job.
Dep PM is a bit of a non-job in the Tory party. Its different in the Labour party but then they can't offer it as its elected. Having said that Hezza was dep PM in the 90s. It depends on what is made of the job.
Whichever party isn't in the coalition government is going to win the next election with a comfortable majority. In a way I would love to see a Lab/Lib coalition for its comedy potential, and the journalists would be like pigs in shit.
However, it wouldn't be in the national interest because of its instability and the huge amount of horsetrading that would be going on to keep the coalition on the road. It would also be very unfair that Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland would be exempted from the forthcoming public expenditure cuts in return for the votes of the nationalist MP's.
However, it wouldn't be in the national interest because of its instability and the huge amount of horsetrading that would be going on to keep the coalition on the road. It would also be very unfair that Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland would be exempted from the forthcoming public expenditure cuts in return for the votes of the nationalist MP's.
Much as I hate the Tories, I must admit that a Con-Lib alliance would have more credibility as a government. The idea that a new Labour leader could become PM despite not receiving a single vote seems absurd to me. I also think, if the Lib Dems can get AV and the Tories have to make all the cuts, they will almost certainly lose the next election - whether to a revitalised Labour Party or to a Lib-Lab coalition.
You broke your promise about predicting, Richey, btw. As I said in the PL thread: typical Tory.
The Lib Dems seem to be overplaying their hand or are simply incompetent. It seems that they've woken up one morning with the prospect of power (something they've dreamed of for decades) and had no plan to take advantage.
This shows the horsetrading that would follow every election in a PR system. Now we are to get a government nobody voted for. What's interesting attractive about that?
This shows the horsetrading that would follow every election in a PR system. Now we are to get a government nobody voted for. What's interesting attractive about that?
The thing with a coalition is though that it wouldn't be just the Tories making cuts (not that cuts were really on the agenda anyway but thats another issue) it would be the LibDems. If they join with the Tories they take the good and the bad of the govt's record.
Whoever comes in wouldn't do much right now anyway.
Whoever comes in wouldn't do much right now anyway.
Clegg has to be very careful. He is in danger of going from public fave man to spoilt loser wanting everything for himself without thinking about the bigger picture for the country.
As most rags are Torie centric I tink Clegg is on thin ice and in danger of lookng a right mug.
Rifkin was interesting on the radio this morning. He accused Clegg od being dishonest by having meetings with Brown without telling Cameron and accused his politics of last few days to being Mugabe like. Strong words indeed from old Malcom.
Does this suggest that the tories think they have lost th chance now?
I don't think the public will stand for this, even labour MPs are coming out now and saying them leading is wrong. they know a year in opposition will do them no harm whilst all the shit decisions are made and their new leader gets in.
As most rags are Torie centric I tink Clegg is on thin ice and in danger of lookng a right mug.
Rifkin was interesting on the radio this morning. He accused Clegg od being dishonest by having meetings with Brown without telling Cameron and accused his politics of last few days to being Mugabe like. Strong words indeed from old Malcom.
Does this suggest that the tories think they have lost th chance now?
I don't think the public will stand for this, even labour MPs are coming out now and saying them leading is wrong. they know a year in opposition will do them no harm whilst all the shit decisions are made and their new leader gets in.
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102856#msg1102856 date=1273565842]
Whoever comes in wouldn't do much right now anyway.
[/quote]
They will have to, like all governments they will be driven by events. I agree with John Reid, a politician for whom I have a lot of respect. If Labour go into some kind of arrangement with the Lib Dems, they will be committing political suicide.
Whoever comes in wouldn't do much right now anyway.
[/quote]
They will have to, like all governments they will be driven by events. I agree with John Reid, a politician for whom I have a lot of respect. If Labour go into some kind of arrangement with the Lib Dems, they will be committing political suicide.
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102831#msg1102831 date=1273563257]
And yes Clegg could be PM. Its not a huge leap from what happened in the 30s. Its not likely though.
It is very odd that the country rejected the LDs comrehensibly yet they are now in line to get anything they want.
[/quote]
The Lib Dems polled more votes than they have done at any other election. Nearly a quarter, in fact. Admittedly not as well as they'd hoped to do but hardly a comprehensive rejection. The fact of the matter is that the country did not have sufficient confidence in any of the candidates to give them a majority, despite a voting system that gives significant advantage to the two strongest parties. If we had a representative voting system then we'd already have a perfectly stable Lab-Lib coalition, representing a majority of the electorate.
And yes Clegg could be PM. Its not a huge leap from what happened in the 30s. Its not likely though.
It is very odd that the country rejected the LDs comrehensibly yet they are now in line to get anything they want.
[/quote]
The Lib Dems polled more votes than they have done at any other election. Nearly a quarter, in fact. Admittedly not as well as they'd hoped to do but hardly a comprehensive rejection. The fact of the matter is that the country did not have sufficient confidence in any of the candidates to give them a majority, despite a voting system that gives significant advantage to the two strongest parties. If we had a representative voting system then we'd already have a perfectly stable Lab-Lib coalition, representing a majority of the electorate.
[quote author=Delinquent link=topic=40111.msg1102877#msg1102877 date=1273566955]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102831#msg1102831 date=1273563257]
And yes Clegg could be PM. Its not a huge leap from what happened in the 30s. Its not likely though.
It is very odd that the country rejected the LDs comrehensibly yet they are now in line to get anything they want.
[/quote]
The Lib Dems polled more votes than they have done at any other election. Nearly a quarter, in fact. Admittedly not as well as they'd hoped to do but hardly a comprehensive rejection. The fact of the matter is that the country did not have sufficient confidence in any of the candidates to give them a majority, despite a voting system that gives significant advantage to the two strongest parties. If we had a representative voting system then we'd already have a perfectly stable Lab-Lib coalition, representing a majority of the electorate.
[/quote]
Surely under any system that is used to calculate the seats the Tories would still have got the most votes though?
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102831#msg1102831 date=1273563257]
And yes Clegg could be PM. Its not a huge leap from what happened in the 30s. Its not likely though.
It is very odd that the country rejected the LDs comrehensibly yet they are now in line to get anything they want.
[/quote]
The Lib Dems polled more votes than they have done at any other election. Nearly a quarter, in fact. Admittedly not as well as they'd hoped to do but hardly a comprehensive rejection. The fact of the matter is that the country did not have sufficient confidence in any of the candidates to give them a majority, despite a voting system that gives significant advantage to the two strongest parties. If we had a representative voting system then we'd already have a perfectly stable Lab-Lib coalition, representing a majority of the electorate.
[/quote]
Surely under any system that is used to calculate the seats the Tories would still have got the most votes though?
If you just forget for a minute who the parties are and imagine this kind of thing is going on in another country it seems absurd that a party can win the most votes, the most seats and can still be excluded from government if all the losers combine. Its the sort of thing we would laugh at elsewhere.
I was listening to the radio last night and heard a lot of Labour people saying the same thing. They will be relying on all sorts of people from all sorts of places turning up for every single vote. Everyone will be demanding God knows what for their constituencies
I was listening to the radio last night and heard a lot of Labour people saying the same thing. They will be relying on all sorts of people from all sorts of places turning up for every single vote. Everyone will be demanding God knows what for their constituencies
[quote author=Portly link=topic=40111.msg1102866#msg1102866 date=1273566279]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102856#msg1102856 date=1273565842]
Whoever comes in wouldn't do much right now anyway.
[/quote]
They will have to, like all governments they will be driven by events. I agree with John Reid, a politician for whom I have a lot of respect. If Labour go into some kind of arrangement with the Lib Dems, they will be committing political suicide.
[/quote]
I have now decided that is what I am hoping for. Maybe the Conservatives could then move Dave aside and put Hague back in.
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102856#msg1102856 date=1273565842]
Whoever comes in wouldn't do much right now anyway.
[/quote]
They will have to, like all governments they will be driven by events. I agree with John Reid, a politician for whom I have a lot of respect. If Labour go into some kind of arrangement with the Lib Dems, they will be committing political suicide.
[/quote]
I have now decided that is what I am hoping for. Maybe the Conservatives could then move Dave aside and put Hague back in.
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102924#msg1102924 date=1273569472]
If you just forget for a minute who the parties are and imagine this kind of thing is going on in another country it seems absurd that a party can win the most votes, the most seats and can still be excluded from government if all the losers combine. Its the sort of thing we would laugh at elsewhere.
I was listening to the radio last night and heard a lot of Labour people saying the same thing. They will be relying on all sorts of people from all sorts of places turning up for every single vote. Everyone will be demanding God knows what for their constituencies
[/quote]
Yes, if Lib/Lab get together they will still need support from the Sweaties and The Mighty Welsh ( 😉 ) to form an effective government. They will be held to ransome big style.
If you just forget for a minute who the parties are and imagine this kind of thing is going on in another country it seems absurd that a party can win the most votes, the most seats and can still be excluded from government if all the losers combine. Its the sort of thing we would laugh at elsewhere.
I was listening to the radio last night and heard a lot of Labour people saying the same thing. They will be relying on all sorts of people from all sorts of places turning up for every single vote. Everyone will be demanding God knows what for their constituencies
[/quote]
Yes, if Lib/Lab get together they will still need support from the Sweaties and The Mighty Welsh ( 😉 ) to form an effective government. They will be held to ransome big style.
[quote author=vantage link=topic=40111.msg1102926#msg1102926 date=1273569602]
I have now decided that is what I am hoping for. Maybe the Conservatives could then move Dave aside and put Hague back in.
[/quote]
Part of me thinks the same way, but another part of me says that it wouldn't be in the national interest to have such an ineffective - probably comical - government in place at a time of economic crisis.
I have now decided that is what I am hoping for. Maybe the Conservatives could then move Dave aside and put Hague back in.
[/quote]
Part of me thinks the same way, but another part of me says that it wouldn't be in the national interest to have such an ineffective - probably comical - government in place at a time of economic crisis.
[quote author=vantage link=topic=40111.msg1102929#msg1102929 date=1273569727]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102924#msg1102924 date=1273569472]
If you just forget for a minute who the parties are and imagine this kind of thing is going on in another country it seems absurd that a party can win the most votes, the most seats and can still be excluded from government if all the losers combine. Its the sort of thing we would laugh at elsewhere.
I was listening to the radio last night and heard a lot of Labour people saying the same thing. They will be relying on all sorts of people from all sorts of places turning up for every single vote. Everyone will be demanding God knows what for their constituencies
[/quote]
Yes, if Lib/Lab get together they will still need support from the Sweaties and The Mighty Welsh ( 😉 ) to form an effective government. They will be held to ransome big style.
[/quote]
can you imagine the uproar in England if the deals allow Scotland and Wales to miss public spending cuts.
This is getting shit
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102924#msg1102924 date=1273569472]
If you just forget for a minute who the parties are and imagine this kind of thing is going on in another country it seems absurd that a party can win the most votes, the most seats and can still be excluded from government if all the losers combine. Its the sort of thing we would laugh at elsewhere.
I was listening to the radio last night and heard a lot of Labour people saying the same thing. They will be relying on all sorts of people from all sorts of places turning up for every single vote. Everyone will be demanding God knows what for their constituencies
[/quote]
Yes, if Lib/Lab get together they will still need support from the Sweaties and The Mighty Welsh ( 😉 ) to form an effective government. They will be held to ransome big style.
[/quote]
can you imagine the uproar in England if the deals allow Scotland and Wales to miss public spending cuts.
This is getting shit
From what I have read in various places Labour and especially the LDs are not doing themselves that many favours with all of this anyway.
I think the British public in general take a pretty dim view of something that they don't consider fair play, and for Labour and the Lib Dems to act in this kind of fashion may well turn people off them
I think the British public in general take a pretty dim view of something that they don't consider fair play, and for Labour and the Lib Dems to act in this kind of fashion may well turn people off them
[quote author=Portly link=topic=40111.msg1102940#msg1102940 date=1273570047]
[quote author=vantage link=topic=40111.msg1102926#msg1102926 date=1273569602]
I have now decided that is what I am hoping for. Maybe the Conservatives could then move Dave aside and put Hague back in.
[/quote]
Part of me thinks the same way, but another part of me says that it wouldn't be in the national interest to have such an ineffective - probably comical - government in place at a time of economic crisis.
[/quote]
Economic crisis? Are we in an economic crisis?? News to me, I was under the impression that the biggest crisis we have in this country is the fucking voting system!
[quote author=vantage link=topic=40111.msg1102926#msg1102926 date=1273569602]
I have now decided that is what I am hoping for. Maybe the Conservatives could then move Dave aside and put Hague back in.
[/quote]
Part of me thinks the same way, but another part of me says that it wouldn't be in the national interest to have such an ineffective - probably comical - government in place at a time of economic crisis.
[/quote]
Economic crisis? Are we in an economic crisis?? News to me, I was under the impression that the biggest crisis we have in this country is the fucking voting system!
[quote author=Portly link=topic=40111.msg1102914#msg1102914 date=1273568717]
True a Lab/Lib coalition would represent a majority of the electorate, but a Con/Lib coalition would represent a bigger majority and a Con/Lab coalition an even bigger one! ;D
[/quote]
Of course it would, but the two parties are fundamentally opposed.
True a Lab/Lib coalition would represent a majority of the electorate, but a Con/Lib coalition would represent a bigger majority and a Con/Lab coalition an even bigger one! ;D
[/quote]
Of course it would, but the two parties are fundamentally opposed.
[quote author=Delinquent link=topic=40111.msg1102976#msg1102976 date=1273571634]
[quote author=Portly link=topic=40111.msg1102914#msg1102914 date=1273568717]
True a Lab/Lib coalition would represent a majority of the electorate, but a Con/Lib coalition would represent a bigger majority and a Con/Lab coalition an even bigger one! ;D
[/quote]
Of course it would, but the two parties are fundamentally opposed.
[/quote]
So what say you to all of those people who voted LibDem in order to get rid of the Labour govt?
[quote author=Portly link=topic=40111.msg1102914#msg1102914 date=1273568717]
True a Lab/Lib coalition would represent a majority of the electorate, but a Con/Lib coalition would represent a bigger majority and a Con/Lab coalition an even bigger one! ;D
[/quote]
Of course it would, but the two parties are fundamentally opposed.
[/quote]
So what say you to all of those people who voted LibDem in order to get rid of the Labour govt?
[quote author=Richey link=topic=40111.msg1102983#msg1102983 date=1273572257]
[quote author=Delinquent link=topic=40111.msg1102976#msg1102976 date=1273571634]
[quote author=Portly link=topic=40111.msg1102914#msg1102914 date=1273568717]
True a Lab/Lib coalition would represent a majority of the electorate, but a Con/Lib coalition would represent a bigger majority and a Con/Lab coalition an even bigger one! ;D
[/quote]
Of course it would, but the two parties are fundamentally opposed.
[/quote]
So what say you to all of those people who voted LibDem in order to get rid of the Labour govt?
[/quote]
They failed!
[quote author=Delinquent link=topic=40111.msg1102976#msg1102976 date=1273571634]
[quote author=Portly link=topic=40111.msg1102914#msg1102914 date=1273568717]
True a Lab/Lib coalition would represent a majority of the electorate, but a Con/Lib coalition would represent a bigger majority and a Con/Lab coalition an even bigger one! ;D
[/quote]
Of course it would, but the two parties are fundamentally opposed.
[/quote]
So what say you to all of those people who voted LibDem in order to get rid of the Labour govt?
[/quote]
They failed!
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