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Racist Manchester.

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[quote author=Atlas link=topic=48569.msg1477167#msg1477167 date=1328394214]
What I'm trying to say is if that story of the mp was posted in gc no-one would really give a crap, people are just wylin out now cos the guy had a few words to say re the way lfc handled the Suarez thing, some in his capacity as exec of fare. Like anyone actually gives a crap what he said and who he said it to majority just waiting to see him trip and when he does willin to put the boot in.
[/quote]

You're right in the sense that LFC fans are all over this b/c of who the person is. No questions ask. That doesn't mean he shouldn't be taken to the cleaners ...
 
[quote author=Atlas link=topic=48569.msg1477196#msg1477196 date=1328396749]
So you think 'some people' might think I'm not frothing at the mouth cos piara is Asian?
[/quote]

Just as an FYI - I froth at the mouth 3 times a day.
 
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=48569.msg1477263#msg1477263 date=1328427780]
[quote author=Atlas link=topic=48569.msg1477196#msg1477196 date=1328396749]
So you think 'some people' might think I'm not frothing at the mouth cos piara is Asian?
[/quote]
I didnt say that. I said it could look like that.

You damned Suarez and weren't having the cultural issue, but you are prepared or want to accept that Powars use of racially offensive term was innocuous.

Why are you giving Powar the benefit of doubt?
[/quote]

I think your being kinda lazy spion, you have not really read my posts. I didn't damn Suarez either I pointed out a few times people got the cultural nuances thing.
I absolutely did not 'defend' abbots comments either.
Iv not defended powars comments, iv commented on others comments about him. It's got nothing to do with him being Asian, if people were to think that then more fool them.
 
I didn't give him the benefit of the doubt, I didn't say he didn't use a word that has racial connotations.

I didn't say I knew his intent either way good or bad.
 
[quote author=Atlas link=topic=48569.msg1477303#msg1477303 date=1328438878]
I didn't give him the benefit of the doubt, I didn't say he didn't use a word that has racial connotations.

I didn't say I knew his intent either way good or bad.
[/quote]
But you are giving him the benefit of doubt because you agreed he probably didn't mean it in a racist way. Therefore you ARE suggesting he didn't mean it in a racist way but you don't know his intent!

If you can't or won't see the contradiction then let's just leave it there.
 
Nothing gets me more erect than a racial discussion on here

Actually that's a lie, a good, long, convoluted discussion over benitez really gets my balls bulging
 
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=48569.msg1477309#msg1477309 date=1328440455]
[quote author=Atlas link=topic=48569.msg1477303#msg1477303 date=1328438878]
I didn't give him the benefit of the doubt, I didn't say he didn't use a word that has racial connotations.

I didn't say I knew his intent either way good or bad.
[/quote]
But you are giving him the benefit of doubt because you agreed he probably didn't mean it in a racist way. Therefore you ARE suggesting he didn't mean it in a racist way but you don't know his intent!

If you can't or won't see the contradiction then let's just leave it there.
[/quote]

Aaah right I said it probably wasn't meant in a racist way, rather than condemn him to death. I said similar re Suarez just he figured it pissed evra off and used it to wind him up.
 
In fairness to Asim, Anita hasn't offered an opinion for him to agree with yet, so I can see why he's struggling. Understandable really.
 
[quote author=Gerry_A_Trick link=topic=48569.msg1477328#msg1477328 date=1328442695]
In fairness to Asim, Anita hasn't offered an opinion for him to agree with yet, so I can see why he's struggling. Understandable really.
[/quote]

low.
 
I'm just wondering if there's a chance that any thread on here won't descend into a debate on Suarez and racism...
 
Funnily enough it's probably what spion has done in passing comment re abbot, and me' posting re Suarez. I hardly posted on the abbott thread but I backed her apparently. Why I suggested he was lazy.
 
Oh Gerry, that's terrible.

I think Asim's point is if it hadn't been for the whole Suarez issue and this guy had said what he has, regardless of his position, no one on here would have really cared. And I'm inclined to agree

Also to clarify one Asian guy called another a coconut? I said this on the last racism thread, and it baffles me that people don't get it. The context of two people of the same racial background talking about each others race is TOTALLY different to an example of an incident involving two people of different races. It's an issues of ownership, one who is part of the culture, has ownership of it and therefore has more of a right over it. It doesn't haven't the same racial history/baggage of a cross racial reference.


I dont know why I've posted on this thread, i don't want to argue with posters I like on here again!
 
Hang on a second, because they're both Asian doesn't mean they're of the same race surely? Are they?
 
Of course it has a different context & perhaps in a private conversation two people may say it freely. However, for someone to do so on public forum like twitter is an offence surely?

To be the head of an anti racist group & use that term even in a private conversation would be regarded as misguided & inappropriate at best.
 
I figure they are both of Indian descent Athens.

Gerry ... I agree. As I have done since beginning of the thread
 
Is India not a huge country with as many ethnic groups and languages as Europe?
 
I suppose if your thinking about the word 'coconut' as used in this occasion it probably doesn't matter too much about which part of the sub continent they are from.
 
[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=48569.msg1477345#msg1477345 date=1328445051]
Also to clarify one Asian guy called another a coconut? I said this on the last racism thread, and it baffles me that people don't get it. The context of two people of the same racial background talking about each others race is TOTALLY different to an example of an incident involving two people of different races. It's an issues of ownership, one who is part of the culture, has ownership of it and therefore has more of a right over it. It doesn't haven't the same racial history/baggage of a cross racial reference.
[/quote]

You don't get it either. It's nowt to do with the terms he used, and everything to do with the intention behind those terms. You and Asim are totally right that his intention and words were not meant to be racist towards Singh. But that isn't the end of the story. All I want is for people to think deeply about these things and look at them from different angles.

Let's translate powars words into plain english. He said "don't take sides with white people, you're an Asian stupid". Offensive to Singh? Probably not. Racist? Yes. Yes that is racist all day long whether Powar has the intellect to see it or not. Racism is not about offense, I mean I would happily offend you if I could just for the satisfaction of it. But racism isn't just offense. It is much more disgusting than that. Powar is disgusting. Diane Abbott is disgusting.
 
[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=48569.msg1477345#msg1477345 date=1328445051]
Oh Gerry, that's terrible.

I think Asim's point is if it hadn't been for the whole Suarez issue and this guy had said what he has, regardless of his position, no one on here would have really cared. And I'm inclined to agree

Also to clarify one Asian guy called another a coconut? I said this on the last racism thread, and it baffles me that people don't get it. The context of two people of the same racial background talking about each others race is TOTALLY different to an example of an incident involving two people of different races. It's an issues of ownership, one who is part of the culture, has ownership of it and therefore has more of a right over it. It doesn't haven't the same racial history/baggage of a cross racial reference.


I dont know why I've posted on this thread, i don't want to argue with posters I like on here again!
[/quote]

You're absolutely right that no one would have commented on those comments had it not been for what he said about Suarez.
That's what happens when you're found out as a fucking hypocrite.

As for whether the term is 'racist'; why do you and Asim feel it isnt?
Because he's Asian as well.

It fails to account for the fact that ONLY an Indian Asian would call another Indian Asian by that terrm
'False consciousness'?
'Coconut'?

Piara Powar basically called that Sikh a brown sahib; and that is extremely offensive.

I've been called that loads of times; and whilst it may not seem racist to you due to some notion of 'ownership'; it certainly did hurt.

I'm not going to post anymore on this; as too many threads are spoilt this way.
I will say though that I think the notion that racist comments are defined by the race of the person uttering them to be a crock of shit.
 
[quote author=monsieurdantes link=topic=48569.msg1477370#msg1477370 date=1328446682]
[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=48569.msg1477345#msg1477345 date=1328445051]
Also to clarify one Asian guy called another a coconut? I said this on the last racism thread, and it baffles me that people don't get it. The context of two people of the same racial background talking about each others race is TOTALLY different to an example of an incident involving two people of different races. It's an issues of ownership, one who is part of the culture, has ownership of it and therefore has more of a right over it. It doesn't haven't the same racial history/baggage of a cross racial reference.
[/quote]

You don't get it either. It's nowt to do with the terms he used, and everything to do with the intention behind those terms. You and Asim are totally right that his intention and words were not meant to be racist towards Singh. But that isn't the end of the story. All I want is for people to think deeply about these things and look at them from different angles.

Let's translate powars words into plain english. He said "don't take sides with white people, you're an Asian stupid". Offensive to Singh? Probably not. Racist? Yes. Yes that is racist all day long whether Powar has the intellect to see it or not. Racism is not about offense, I mean I would happily offend you if I could just for the satisfaction of it. But racism isn't just offense. It is much more disgusting than that. Powar is disgusting. Diane Abbott is disgusting.
[/quote]

Is right.

It's a mentality that old race warriors from the mid 70s have. No place in modern Britain. Better start swimming or you'll sink like a stone.
 
Fucking hell, I know it's all a serious topic and all, but I am sick to death of all these race topics, they all have the same format going round and round the houses and end up with everyone throwing their dummy out of the pram. I know that was not the original posts intention but it always ends up that way.
It's such a popular topic perhaps we should have a separate Racism Forum .


regards
 
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=48569.msg1477378#msg1477378 date=1328447542]
Fucking hell, I know it's all a serious topic and all, but I am sick to death of all these race topics, they all have the same format going round and round the houses and end up with everyone throwing their dummy out of the pram. I know that was not the original posts intention but it always ends up that way.
It's such a popular topic perhaps we should have a separate Racism Forum .


regards
[/quote]
You tell them Vlad. I propose we have a sectarian forum too, for days when I miss Belfast.
 
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=48569.msg1477378#msg1477378 date=1328447542]
Fucking hell, I know it's all a serious topic and all, but I am sick to death of all these race topics, they all have the same format going round and round the houses and end up with everyone throwing their dummy out of the pram. I know that was not the original posts intention but it always ends up that way.
It's such a popular topic perhaps we should have a separate Racism Forum .


regards
[/quote]

Dave suggested just that, tongue in cheek I presume.

It is getting rather tiring, but unfortunately the press keep bringing things up!
 
Oh to be clear it was misguided and inappropriate for him to use that term, especially on twitter. But it's not 'racist'

Oh and based on that picture it looks like it was sent as a direct (private) message rather than a public tweet.
 
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