Man United (a) post-match

[Irishanfield]

I’ll wager a bet that you’ll be amongst the first ones to start when shit hits the fan.

But still you are the only one to mention it. You obviously believe that we are in the shit and this season and since you believe the klopp out threads will start are looking at a 7th or place finish or worse

 

[MomoWASright]

Ridiculous how? It's facts.

It doesn’t tell you the full story. Have a modestly fit squad and we start

Alisson
Trent
Kanoute
Van Dijk
Robertson

Fabinho
Thiago
Elliott

Salah
Jota/Nunez
Diaz

That’s 6 players who were not here 4 seasons ago.

 

[keniget]

It doesn’t tell you the full story. Have a modestly fit squad and we start

Alisson
Trent
Kanoute
Van Dijk
Robertson

Fabinho
Thiago
Elliott

Salah
Jota/Nunez
Diaz

That’s 6 players who were not here 4 seasons ago.

It tells the right story though. We have too many ageing past their sell by date players that we are having to play because we don't have a modestly fit squad. And with our depth, it doesn't take more than a couple injuries to end up relying on these guys.

 

[binomial]

Except Konate doesn't start over Matip, Elliott doesn't start over Hendo & whats the point putting Thiago in when he's only around 10% of the time?

Nunez/Jota - it's 1 or the other so that only leaves them & Diaz who weren't here 4 years ago.

 

[MomoWASright]

It tells the right story though. We have too many ageing past their sell by date players that we are having to play because we don't have a modestly fit squad. And with our depth, it doesn't take more than a couple injuries to end up relying on these guys.

It does. That would mean our bench has that experience to see out a game. Henderson, Milner, Firmino and Gomez would look a handy bench.

We aren’t looking at one or two out and it all falls down. We have 5 genuine starting XI players out. That would hurt anyone.

 

[moron]

I can't see any other solution here than to sign a couple of midfielders. Maybe that's the emotion of the game, but you look through the squad and apart from Fabinho (who is out of form) and Thiago (who dies repeatedly), none of the rest are either good enough (yet in some cases) or fit enough. Both in some cases.

Henderson - on the wane
Fabinho - top class but out of form
Thiago - top class but dead
Keita - waste of skin
Jones - is he any good? No-one knows anymore
Elliott - promising
Carvalho - promising
Milner - doing great for someone with new hips and knees but not good enough to start
Bajectic - promising
Ox - dead and probably would need three seasons of games to play himself into form

There's no combination of three players which provide a consistently good enough midfield. You can play a sub-par third member of midfield alongside an in-form and fit Fabinho and Thiago; but for a team whose game relies on those two so much it's pretty poor we don't have adequate cover for either.

Maybe if Jones gets fit and we stick with him for a bit he'll step up and become good enough, but I can't see a position he can make his own. But that's a massive punt.

Everyone keeps talking down Jones, but don't any of you guys remember the great impact he had in that pandemic season where he was the only positive, in terms of driving the midfield forward. Then he got that injury late in that season and we never saw him again or was given a run of games last season to get some form. Let's be honest, we lack impact players in that midfield that can carry that ball or make something happen without everyone having to run around like crazy and knacker themselves out. The team is too old.

 

[MomoWASright]

Except Konate doesn't start over Matip, Elliott doesn't start over Hendo & whats the point putting Thiago in when he's only around 10% of the time?

Nunez/Jota - it's 1 or the other so that only leaves them & Diaz who weren't here 4 years ago.

Konate would start against a pacey front line. He started the champions league. And your original comment didn’t include Matip anyway.

Elliott started over Henderson against Palace.

It is more fluid than one or the other with Nunez/Jota.

 

[keniget]

It does. That would mean our bench has that experience to see out a game. Henderson, Milner, Firmino and Gomez would look a handy bench.

We aren’t looking at one or two out and it all falls down. We have 5 genuine starting XI players out. That would hurt anyone.

Sorry, just don't agree with that take on it.

You don't build a squad to see a game out. You build a squad so you have viable alternatives. We don't have them. We can barely rotate let alone cope with injuries.

In your starting XI, 7/11 spots were filled by first choice players and another was left out by choice.

 

[Donavan Ried]

Those drops are not sudden, some of those players have been in decline for several seasons.

Firmino and Henderson shouldn't be starters anymore they don't have the legs for it. Milner has gone a season too far, maybe two. It was cringey watching him barge around shouting at teammates while actually being the worst player on the pitch.

You can carry an underperforming older player when their experience makes up for a drop in performance level, if everyone else is right on their game. You can't carry 3 or 4 of them phoning it in and expect to get away with it.

We are playing for top 4, this team does not have a title challenge in them. The squad is full of unreliable or unfit players that can't step up when needed. The likes of Ox and Keita should have been moved on years ago, it's hubris on Klopps part to think he can turn them into top class players, he can't no-one can. It's too late now to sell most of them because they are in their last 12 months and will walk for free. We just have to wear this season as a write off.

The only thing that I disagree with here is "Ox and Keita should have been moved on years ago," The Ox should have been moved on two, maybe three seasons ago

 

[Donavan Ried]

I hope we aren't fickle like Dortmund fans. He will turn it around.

Think this season is gone as far as the title is concerned.
Yes City or whoever wins the title will not find things as easy to win games. But will should start planing for next season and who we want to buy and sell from now

 

[binomial]

Ox shouldv'e never been bought to begin with, we knew his was injury prone and he was average at best in a crap Arsenal side.

 

[My_Blood_Bleeds_Red]

But still you are the only one to mention it. You obviously believe that we are in the shit and this season and since you believe the klopp out threads will start are looking at a 7th or place finish or worse

If I ran any organisation like that, i might as well just pack my bags and shut it down.

But people need a place to vent their frustrations...the sentiment here will change when Nunez comes back and scores a hattrick.

 

[mark1975]

No it isn´t. We also watch the game you know. Lacks both speed, tackling and physicality for that role.

Yes it is. It only fails when he's not complimented by those around him. He did his bit in tracking two players, he gave those around him enough time to then close in on the United players, but they didn't and were made to look like chumps. He was our best midfielder against Palace and our most effective defensively, he tracked back everything and won the ball back for us a few times when Palace were looking to break. He's not the most physically dominating player, but he makes up for that in awareness and being quick to spot danger. It's not his fault that more experienced players around him are well off their game.

Put him in a midfield with a fit Fabinho and Thiago and he'll be perfect. And saying he lacks speed is utter fucking bollocks, he's quicker than Henderson, Thiago and Fabinho. "We watch the game you know". He's probably been our best midfielder this season, which is as much about his own qualities as it is about the failings of others.

 

[mark1975]

Think this season is gone as far as the title is concerned.
Yes City or whoever wins the title will not find things as easy to win games. But will should start planing for next season and who we want to buy and sell from now

It really isn't. I don't think we have the quality to win the title, but all this making predictions after three games is FIFA generation bollocks. We've fucked up, if anyone can put it right it's Klopp. Jeez. I'm far from a happy clappy super fan, but some of you bellends need to get a grip.

 

[737Max]

Fannies the lot of you.

We were 14.... Yep 14 points behind city in January.

Keep the faith, trust the big bearded cuddly German and we will be fine.

Christ almighty, fist sign of trouble and half of you are lighting the flares.

Dig deep, locate your balls and paddle.

 

[737Max]

Oh and if you feel like quitting now and signed up to the Kelly's Heroes thread kindly go back in there and remove your name from the list. We don't want quitters

 

[MomoWASright]

Sorry, just don't agree with that take on it.

You don't build a squad to see a game out. You build a squad so you have viable alternatives. We don't have them. We can barely rotate let alone cope with injuries.

In your starting XI, 7/11 spots were filled by first choice players and another was left out by choice.

That’s missing more than a quarter of the first choice. It’s 40% of the outfield team. I think you build a squad capable of challenging and that includes swapping one or two out when needed and using your bench to its fullest. You need those who are in decline to come of the bench and give it their all for 30 minutes and mentor those younger players in the squad.

We can’t have 22 top tier players that are 21-27 years old so you can just replace like for like. Unless you are paying absolute top dollar. We don’t have the money for it and never will.

Swapping out Henderson for Thiago is fine. Then Firmino for Jota that’s okay, we should be able to beat most of the league. But doing it for 4 or more positions is not something you plan for. Otherwise you’d have a bloated squad full of players kicking off at not getting enough game time.

 

[MomoWASright]

Oh and if you feel like quitting now and signed up to the Kelly's Herpes thread kindly go back in there and remove your name from the list. We don't want quitters

Herpes?

 

[tomasjj]

Yes it is. It only fails when he's not complimented by those around him. He did his bit in tracking two players, he gave those around him enough time to then close in on the United players, but they didn't and were made to look like chumps. He was our best midfielder against Palace and our most effective defensively, he tracked back everything and won the ball back for us a few times when Palace were looking to break. He's not the most physically dominating player, but he makes up for that in awareness and being quick to spot danger. It's not his fault that more experienced players around him are well off their game.

Put him in a midfield with a fit Fabinho and Thiago and he'll be perfect. And saying he lacks speed is utter fucking bollocks, he's quicker than Henderson, Thiago and Fabinho. "We watch the game you know". He's probably been our best midfielder this season, which is as much about his own qualities as it is about the failings of others.

I don´t think he has the attributes to start in a midfield three. It exposes us too much. A midfield which already has to cover for Trent and make the work for our high line work, amongst other things.
He is starting due to injuries, which is understandable. As one of the three in a 4231, I´d have no problems with him starting.

 

[Woland]

It's a good job we're gonna win the CL or I'd be getting a bit annoyed

 

[peterhague]

I still don't get this thing of playing Elliott on the right of midfield. Inverted wingers make sense but inverted midfielders is a weird concept to me. When he gets through in a little channel he always has to make the crucial final ball with his wrong foot. And he's always biased towards building play down the win, rather than moving infield.

Anyway, I think it's clear we desperately need more pace in midfield. Time for the nuclear option of trying Trent there.

Fabinho holding, Trent right, Elliott left. Not like we've got that much to lose until Thiago is back.

We should sell Firmino if we can. He seems to be basically useless at this point.

 

[tomasjj]

I was dying for us to have a proper striker to sub on late last night. Imagine if that little argie center back of theirs had to deal with someone like Origi.
Hell, I was even thinking of Mellor, and the impact he had.

 

[MomoWASright]

I was dying for us to have a proper striker to sub on late last night. Imagine if that little argie center back of theirs had to deal with someone like Origi.
Hell, I was even thinking of Mellor, and the impact he had.

Imagine had the spaz not been a spaz last week. As useless as I think he is, he’s better than Firmino.

 

[StevieM]

Right… bunch of fannies the lot of you… I’m taking it upon myself to “fix” our season and will take on the pre-match thread - when are we ready to start talking about it?

 

[737Max]

Herpes?

Yeah. The dirty bastard

 

[StevieM]

I also have so me good advice for you all - don’t get through a bottle of Bandol Rose and Cote du Rhone red at dinner before smashing 5 pints of various local Parisien IPA within hours of stepping off a 24 hour flight from Australia.

I feel like Thiago today…

 

[tomasjj]

Imagine had the spaz not been a spaz last week. As useless as I think he is, he’s better than Firmino.

the spaz being Nunez?

 

[Fabio]

We need another centre forward. Promote cannonier if we're not buying one. Nunez will get more reds this season, and Jota will pick up more knocks

 

[SummerOnions]

That graphic and point is exceptionally misleading.

Konate
Thiago
Jota/Nunez

Missing for one reason or another and all of them would’ve been involved. So potentially 6 changes from 4 years ago meaning more than half the side.

I just thought it was interesting - I don't think it's so usual to be able to field so close to the same team from 4 years ago even if it's not 'first choice'

 

[binomial]

Imagine had the spaz not been a spaz last week. As useless as I think he is, he’s better than Firmino.