Liverpool V Sunderland Season Opener pre-match thread 13/08/11
- Thread starter vikas
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And thats down to pre season. We fucked up. We werent ready, and that showed today. Sunderland looked much more fit than us and thats worrying. Still, a lot of new faces and it will take a while to get going. I dont think we can expect to much during the first weeks. Playing Flanno and Henderson was a bould move that didnt work out. Now we need a good result against the Arse, or were on the backfoot from the start.
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=46358.msg1379483#msg1379483 date=1313252829]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379464#msg1379464 date=1313252142]
[quote author=RedZeppelin link=topic=46358.msg1379451#msg1379451 date=1313251819]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=46358.msg1379403#msg1379403 date=1313250924]
Fuck it. I think what that shows more than anything is our mental fragility. As soon as we conceded, the whole team stopped playing with any tempo or confidence and we started looking nervous. Even at the end, when we should have been battering Sunderland, we just didn't look like we believed we could do it.
[/quote]
Yeah this is a major issue that has hung over us (the players , fans , everyone) for a long time now . I guess only by winning can we install a level of confidence like United or others have , where they just always feel they can win no matter what . Problem is it's hard to take that first giant leap and become winners (of a major trophy)
[/quote]
today wasn't about mental strength, it was about fatigue, plain and simple. we should have made our sub earlier especially for the players who looked knacked after 50 mins
[/quote]
I just disagree. Why would the two youngest players be the least fit? Flanagan looked like he was going to cry after leaving Larsson unmarked for the equaliser, and after that he was *never* in the right position and *all* his passes went to a blue shirt. Fatigue doesn't do that - shattered confidence does.
[/quote]
Carra probably shouted at him.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379464#msg1379464 date=1313252142]
[quote author=RedZeppelin link=topic=46358.msg1379451#msg1379451 date=1313251819]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=46358.msg1379403#msg1379403 date=1313250924]
Fuck it. I think what that shows more than anything is our mental fragility. As soon as we conceded, the whole team stopped playing with any tempo or confidence and we started looking nervous. Even at the end, when we should have been battering Sunderland, we just didn't look like we believed we could do it.
[/quote]
Yeah this is a major issue that has hung over us (the players , fans , everyone) for a long time now . I guess only by winning can we install a level of confidence like United or others have , where they just always feel they can win no matter what . Problem is it's hard to take that first giant leap and become winners (of a major trophy)
[/quote]
today wasn't about mental strength, it was about fatigue, plain and simple. we should have made our sub earlier especially for the players who looked knacked after 50 mins
[/quote]
I just disagree. Why would the two youngest players be the least fit? Flanagan looked like he was going to cry after leaving Larsson unmarked for the equaliser, and after that he was *never* in the right position and *all* his passes went to a blue shirt. Fatigue doesn't do that - shattered confidence does.
[/quote]
Carra probably shouted at him.
We've got to assess if we need a bit more natural game intelligence in the side beyond it being primarily Suarez.
I'd be inclined to keep Aquilani, and play him, and use Maxi from the bench. Also get Gerrard fit.
I think it's a good side though, and with more fitness and understanding between each other they will do well.
I'd be inclined to keep Aquilani, and play him, and use Maxi from the bench. Also get Gerrard fit.
I think it's a good side though, and with more fitness and understanding between each other they will do well.
R
RedZeppelin
Guest
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379482#msg1379482 date=1313252816]
[quote author=RedZeppelin link=topic=46358.msg1379479#msg1379479 date=1313252488]
and they didn't look half as tired as us so why are we so wrecked ?
[/quote]
I think we put too much emphasis on fitness and train the players too hard, it's the same every single season, we look knackered untill the turn of the year and then we look fresh as a daisy in the closing months.
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but we've only had this super-duper medical/fitness team for two preseasons now , before it was Rafa's own guys . Surely these guys are professional enough to know how to get the team fit and not over do it . If not that's just ridiculous .
[quote author=RedZeppelin link=topic=46358.msg1379479#msg1379479 date=1313252488]
and they didn't look half as tired as us so why are we so wrecked ?
[/quote]
I think we put too much emphasis on fitness and train the players too hard, it's the same every single season, we look knackered untill the turn of the year and then we look fresh as a daisy in the closing months.
[/quote]
but we've only had this super-duper medical/fitness team for two preseasons now , before it was Rafa's own guys . Surely these guys are professional enough to know how to get the team fit and not over do it . If not that's just ridiculous .
The fatigue wouldn't have been a problem if we were out of sight in the first half. If we are going to play the pressing in numbers game then we have to be clinical because (barca aside) you cannot keep up that sort of pace for 90 mins.
R
RedZeppelin
Guest
obviously though there were some positives elements to the performance with some good play in the first half . It's just frustrating that we look to still have the same old problems of years gone by , especially how we never looked like picking ourselves up and taking control after their equalizer .
The slight worry is the players were well aware how important getting positive results in the first few games are , it sets such a tone for the season so we really need a big result next weekend already . Anyway , nothing we can do but wait and see.
The slight worry is the players were well aware how important getting positive results in the first few games are , it sets such a tone for the season so we really need a big result next weekend already . Anyway , nothing we can do but wait and see.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379501#msg1379501 date=1313253819]
The fatigue wouldn't have been a problem if we were out of sight in the first half. If we are going to play the pressing in numbers game then we have to be clinical because (barca aside) you cannot keep up that sort of pace for 90 mins.
[/quote]
Ergo it was mental fitness like wot Bunny said.
As soon as they scored, our heads went down, this naturally affects your physically and, as shown, we seem more tired.
And, by the way, you can sustain 90 minutes of intensive pace when you're winning.
The fatigue wouldn't have been a problem if we were out of sight in the first half. If we are going to play the pressing in numbers game then we have to be clinical because (barca aside) you cannot keep up that sort of pace for 90 mins.
[/quote]
Ergo it was mental fitness like wot Bunny said.
As soon as they scored, our heads went down, this naturally affects your physically and, as shown, we seem more tired.
And, by the way, you can sustain 90 minutes of intensive pace when you're winning.
Well, I don't think it was tiredness, we just lost the plot when they scored. Suarez and Adam had poor games. With Suarez it was mainly his touch was like Dirk on a bad day but Adam worried me more. We could see today how he is often poorly positioned, slow to react, prone to stupid free kicks and all the other things we were worried about.
I really don't understand why Kuyt and Kelly didn't play on the right.
I'm also a bit worried by the way we just seemed to throw everything up to Carroll in the last half hour.
Knee jerk reactions are one thing but I think any reasonable person can see that there are real concerns about some of our players, the team selection and the way we're trying to play. This was a step back from when Maxi and Meireles and Suarez and Kuyt were swapping positions and running people ragged at the end of last season.
I really don't understand why Kuyt and Kelly didn't play on the right.
I'm also a bit worried by the way we just seemed to throw everything up to Carroll in the last half hour.
Knee jerk reactions are one thing but I think any reasonable person can see that there are real concerns about some of our players, the team selection and the way we're trying to play. This was a step back from when Maxi and Meireles and Suarez and Kuyt were swapping positions and running people ragged at the end of last season.
The first half was awesome so it's not like we can't play that way with the new players. The right hand side only became a problem when they ran out of steam.
He was shite apart from the goal.
[quote author=Cerberus link=topic=46358.msg1379535#msg1379535 date=1313254987]
Did he sign on a free as well? If so, fucking he'll.
[/quote]
he did.
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=46358.msg1379536#msg1379536 date=1313255013]
He was shite apart from the goal.
[/quote]
Harsh gene, he whipped in some lovely crosses and was their only player who looked dangerous
Did he sign on a free as well? If so, fucking he'll.
[/quote]
he did.
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=46358.msg1379536#msg1379536 date=1313255013]
He was shite apart from the goal.
[/quote]
Harsh gene, he whipped in some lovely crosses and was their only player who looked dangerous
[quote author=themn link=topic=46358.msg1379543#msg1379543 date=1313255891]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379120#msg1379120 date=1313240433]
glad henderson has got the nod over kuyt, YEAH, I SAID IT, WANT TO FIGHT ABOUT IT!!
[/quote]
LOL !
[/quote]
Don't regret my words and kuyt did nothing when he came on to make me regret my words either. I want Henderson to start at right midfield this season.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379120#msg1379120 date=1313240433]
glad henderson has got the nod over kuyt, YEAH, I SAID IT, WANT TO FIGHT ABOUT IT!!
[/quote]
LOL !
[/quote]
Don't regret my words and kuyt did nothing when he came on to make me regret my words either. I want Henderson to start at right midfield this season.
Sven has value. When he predicts we'll lose we always win and for that reason alone he should be allowed to stay
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379548#msg1379548 date=1313256204]
[quote author=themn link=topic=46358.msg1379543#msg1379543 date=1313255891]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379120#msg1379120 date=1313240433]
glad henderson has got the nod over kuyt, YEAH, I SAID IT, WANT TO FIGHT ABOUT IT!!
[/quote]
LOL !
[/quote]
Don't regret my words and kuyt did nothing when he came on to make me regret my words either. I want Henderson to start at right midfield this season.
[/quote]
You just prefer his pretty boy swag over Dirk's orcish roughness
[quote author=themn link=topic=46358.msg1379543#msg1379543 date=1313255891]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379120#msg1379120 date=1313240433]
glad henderson has got the nod over kuyt, YEAH, I SAID IT, WANT TO FIGHT ABOUT IT!!
[/quote]
LOL !
[/quote]
Don't regret my words and kuyt did nothing when he came on to make me regret my words either. I want Henderson to start at right midfield this season.
[/quote]
You just prefer his pretty boy swag over Dirk's orcish roughness
[quote author=jan link=topic=46358.msg1379555#msg1379555 date=1313256585]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379548#msg1379548 date=1313256204]
[quote author=themn link=topic=46358.msg1379543#msg1379543 date=1313255891]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379120#msg1379120 date=1313240433]
glad henderson has got the nod over kuyt, YEAH, I SAID IT, WANT TO FIGHT ABOUT IT!!
[/quote]
LOL !
[/quote]
Don't regret my words and kuyt did nothing when he came on to make me regret my words either. I want Henderson to start at right midfield this season.
[/quote]
You just prefer his pretty boy swag than Dirk's orcish roughness
[/quote]
Ha ha ya got me :laugh:
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379548#msg1379548 date=1313256204]
[quote author=themn link=topic=46358.msg1379543#msg1379543 date=1313255891]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379120#msg1379120 date=1313240433]
glad henderson has got the nod over kuyt, YEAH, I SAID IT, WANT TO FIGHT ABOUT IT!!
[/quote]
LOL !
[/quote]
Don't regret my words and kuyt did nothing when he came on to make me regret my words either. I want Henderson to start at right midfield this season.
[/quote]
You just prefer his pretty boy swag than Dirk's orcish roughness
[/quote]
Ha ha ya got me :laugh:
R
RedZeppelin
Guest
haha that sven lad...you forget about him and then sure enough after a bad result he turns up like some pantomime villain and in just a few words drives the whole place mad . It's funny rather then anything else.
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=46358.msg1379508#msg1379508 date=1313254067]
Well, I don't think it was tiredness, we just lost the plot when they scored. Suarez and Adam had poor games. With Suarez it was mainly his touch was like Dirk on a bad day but Adam worried me more. We could see today how he is often poorly positioned, slow to react, prone to stupid free kicks and all the other things we were worried about.
I really don't understand why Kuyt and Kelly didn't play on the right.
I'm also a bit worried by the way we just seemed to throw everything up to Carroll in the last half hour.
Knee jerk reactions are one thing but I think any reasonable person can see that there are real concerns about some of our players, the team selection and the way we're trying to play. This was a step back from when Maxi and Meireles and Suarez and Kuyt were swapping positions and running people ragged at the end of last season.
[/quote]Hmmm. Its strange that no one on here suggested keeping faith with the players who played so well after new year. And no one thought today Kuyt, Kelly, Spearing and Maxi should have retained their places. It seems to me that Downing, Adam, Henderchild and Carroll were universally suggested as the players to go with.
And again even today no one suggested that we should not make wholesale changes and that a side containing 5 new players is a worry.
Hmmmm.
Well, I don't think it was tiredness, we just lost the plot when they scored. Suarez and Adam had poor games. With Suarez it was mainly his touch was like Dirk on a bad day but Adam worried me more. We could see today how he is often poorly positioned, slow to react, prone to stupid free kicks and all the other things we were worried about.
I really don't understand why Kuyt and Kelly didn't play on the right.
I'm also a bit worried by the way we just seemed to throw everything up to Carroll in the last half hour.
Knee jerk reactions are one thing but I think any reasonable person can see that there are real concerns about some of our players, the team selection and the way we're trying to play. This was a step back from when Maxi and Meireles and Suarez and Kuyt were swapping positions and running people ragged at the end of last season.
[/quote]Hmmm. Its strange that no one on here suggested keeping faith with the players who played so well after new year. And no one thought today Kuyt, Kelly, Spearing and Maxi should have retained their places. It seems to me that Downing, Adam, Henderchild and Carroll were universally suggested as the players to go with.
And again even today no one suggested that we should not make wholesale changes and that a side containing 5 new players is a worry.
Hmmmm.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379522#msg1379522 date=1313254382]
The first half was awesome so it's not like we can't play that way with the new players. The right hand side only became a problem when they ran out of steam.
[/quote]
Agreed we played some good stuff first half, but I always thought Henderson and Flanagan looked a bit lightweight as a right-sided partnership. They're both physically quite slight and they're both very young and inexperienced. It just seemed an odd choice to me.
The first half was awesome so it's not like we can't play that way with the new players. The right hand side only became a problem when they ran out of steam.
[/quote]
Agreed we played some good stuff first half, but I always thought Henderson and Flanagan looked a bit lightweight as a right-sided partnership. They're both physically quite slight and they're both very young and inexperienced. It just seemed an odd choice to me.
*Puts hand up*
I did Mr Onceared Sir
I did Mr Onceared Sir
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=46358.msg1379561#msg1379561 date=1313257003]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379522#msg1379522 date=1313254382]
The first half was awesome so it's not like we can't play that way with the new players. The right hand side only became a problem when they ran out of steam.
[/quote]
Agreed we played some good stuff first half, but I always thought Henderson and Flanagan looked a bit lightweight as a right-sided partnership. They're both physically quite slight and they're both very young and inexperienced. It just seemed an odd choice to me.
[/quote]
I think until flannal or hendo develops more, Kelly or kuyt should be behind/infront
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46358.msg1379522#msg1379522 date=1313254382]
The first half was awesome so it's not like we can't play that way with the new players. The right hand side only became a problem when they ran out of steam.
[/quote]
Agreed we played some good stuff first half, but I always thought Henderson and Flanagan looked a bit lightweight as a right-sided partnership. They're both physically quite slight and they're both very young and inexperienced. It just seemed an odd choice to me.
[/quote]
I think until flannal or hendo develops more, Kelly or kuyt should be behind/infront
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