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Gerrard&Carra bust up with Nando?

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yawn, please look in the mirror.

[quote author=singlerider link=topic=42331.msg1201310#msg1201310 date=1287524892]
berate people for making any criticism of Rafa, no matter how justified
[/quote]
 
Speaking of Arbeloa...
Real-Madrid-v-AC-Milan-Ronaldo-Goal-Celeb_2517069.jpg


somethings never change..
 
[quote author=crump link=topic=42331.msg1201095#msg1201095 date=1287515707]
From Guardian:

"The Liverpool striker's frustration betrayed him against Everton. He told Jamie Carragher to "shut up" inside three minutes at Goodison Park and looked over-anxious in front of goal, but poor individual form is not only to blame. The service to the Spain international has been abysmal all season. Even fully fit and secure in his surroundings, Torres would struggle to prosper on a diet of long, hopeful punts towards the corner flag. He has been isolated tactically and personally under Liverpool's new manager. Steven Gerrard was supposed to provide Torres's main support against Everton but, along with his team-mates, was too deep to make an impact. Being singled out as the only Liverpool player with a confidence problem by his manager is also unlikely to help Torres. "I didn't see a lack of confidence in Maxi Rodríguez, Raul Meireles or Steven Gerrard," said Hodgson on Sunday. "Fernando is going through a bad time and if you are talking about him I'd have to agree, but there are not too many lacking confidence.""

from http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2010/oct/19/roy-hodgson-livepool-five-problems
[/quote]

He used to do OK with the long, hopeful punts towards the corner flag under the previous manager's tactics.

I hope Carra/someone has had a go at him, his derby performance was an absolute disgrace.
 
Heh, I flagged the 'Torres has an attitude problem' issue fucking long ago, and was told it was either a) bullshit or b) Rafa's fault.

Pah.
 
[quote author=WinningEleven link=topic=42331.msg1201369#msg1201369 date=1287540567]
yawn, please look in the mirror.

[quote author=singlerider link=topic=42331.msg1201310#msg1201310 date=1287524892]
berate people for making any criticism of Rafa, no matter how justified
[/quote]
[/quote]

And your point is?

Had your criticisms of Carra been justified, they would have been given credence, but the fact that you've obviously identified him as a disruptive figure in the dressing room - one who is willing to throw games in order to undermine the manager - marks you out as a total muppet.

That and your inability to formulate a coherent argument.

You're way out of your depth here son
 
According to rumors on several other sites

Torres and Reina not speaking to Carra and Gerrard. They are primarily pissed off with Carra.
 
[quote author=peekay link=topic=42331.msg1202324#msg1202324 date=1287610225]
According to rumors on several other sites

Torres and Reina not speaking to Carra and Gerrard. They are primarily pissed off with Carra.
[/quote]

frank will sort them out 😉
 
[quote author=singlerider link=topic=42331.msg1201310#msg1201310 date=1287524892]
[quote author=WinningEleven link=topic=42331.msg1201272#msg1201272 date=1287523405]
the defender who scored the most own goals in his Liverpool career is more like it.


[quote author=Brendan link=topic=42331.msg1201260#msg1201260 date=1287522926]
'That's one of the best defenders to ever play for Liverpool' perhaps

Fucking Bilko
[/quote]
[/quote]

You're a fucking jebend.

You'd rather support the manager of Inter Milan than a long serving servant of the club, that came through from the youth ranks and has been integral to every success we've achieved in the past decade, who is *still* employed by Liverpool Football club and will no doubt go down as a legendary figure.

And to top it all off, you've then got the temerity to act like a know-it-all sanctimonious super-fan and berate people for making any criticism of Rafa, no matter how justified


[/quote]

Here endeth the thread. Well in Dan massive big up!
 
At the risk of sounding like a twat...

i hope Gerrard and Torres move on and Carra is dropped from the starting 11.

My views on Gerrard's leadership skills have always been less than admirable. His on- field drive and determination would inspire our players.. Now he just seems to throw his arms around and hang his head, strolling back to posistion. I think he's a bit of a twat, but a great Footballer, The problem is.. i dont think he wants to be at Liverpool. I think part of him is still bitter that he couldnt do what he wanted to do and stayed around with promises that things would improve - Truth is, Things have become MUCH MUCH worse and it could be argued that he has spent his best footballing years throughout rebuilding phases.
I think he has to be considered up there with one of the best players we have ever had, I was very happy when he turned down Chelsea, but he deserves his move. It should also provide us with more funds to purchase players suited to our current blight. Gerrard is an ego and bitter one at that..

Torres - 70 million?? Considering we arnt 1 or 2 players away from challenging for the premiership turning down such an offer is stupid. He is rarely fit and four players worth 15 - 20 million would benefit the team a hell of a lot more than one superstriker that receives NO SUPPLY and injury prone. It would appear that with Gerrard and Torres all of our eggs are in 2 pretty fragile baskets.


Carra- He hasnt played that well for sometime. Our defence has been fucking woeful for nearly two years.. surely he has to take some blame????? He is the worst right back ive ever seen - Mainly due to his inability to beat players and his on the ball ability reminds me of the early versions of the sensible soccer games - when the player would turn and the ball would continue to go straight. He is incredibly keen to shout at players on the pitch. Other than new players and Kuyt.. We rarely see players receiving encouragements after mistakes - Its generally just shouting at them.

If this was the environment i would have to face at work - id be fucking unhappy too..
 
I agree with some of his reasoning, but not his conclusions.

Carra needs to tone down a bit. He is treading on thin-ice when he is shouting at all these players, considering he himself has been very prone to mistakes and it has been a while since we received a performance from him. Hypocrisy is the most difficult thing to digest in a competitive working environment......we don't need that shite right now.

I agree regarding Steven Gerrard. If he wants a move, we should give it to him. No point in having a grumpy player. But i don't think he wants a move at this stage in his career. He will finish his career at Liverpool.

Torres, if we get a big offer and we had a plan we could consider moving him on, but that should not be the default option every time a player has an argument. For fucks sake, they are all adults. It's time they ironed their differences out and man the fuck up and drag us back to a respectable place in the table.

A new manager and a new result will do us a world of good.
 
If Carra has had a go at Torres, and I hope he has, it will not be because he has made mistakes, it will be because HE PUTS NO FUCKING EFFORT IN WHATSOVER.

Are players who care not allowed to reprimand those who don't for fear of upsetting them?

Will poor old Nando demand a transfer now because nasty Carra shouted at him?

Fuck him, as Ryan said, and as we've mentioned on here before, his attitude stinks when he doesn't fancy it; always has. There is another thread here about how he's disillusioned with Woy. Well, he was disillusioned with Benitez as well. I would imagine he'd be disillusioned with a Manager who was a hybrid of Shanks, Jock Stein & Brian Clough; he strikes me as that type of bloke.

The bottom line is we are in a relegation spot & have just played perhaps the most important derby game in years and he couldn't be bothered. Sure, there were others, but he was the worst.

As for selling him, forget 70mil. When Barca can sign Villa for 38, why would they pay 70 for Torres? A City/Chelsea bidding war might get the price up but do we want him playing for them? I'd guess low 30s if he does go. He's a gamble, fitness wise and attitude wise.
 
There's a lot of that I'd agree with Larry, no doubt.

Re your earlier comment about his effort and attitude on Sunday being the worst ever. Well I'd put forward last year's Brum away game when Benitez gave him the shepherd hook as worse than Sunday.
 
Torres at times does look a little dis-interested...

However, he has no support up there. He gets kicked to fuck. He knows that his form is shit but he is still asked to play 'isolated' against 3 defenders that rough him up. The way we are playing at the moment is making him look fucking daft. Could you imagine Fowler in the current system?? he wouldnt even touch the ball over 90 minutes.

Torres is trying to work his way back into form - but playing with one up front is not going to do that. He is struggling - the away fans give him shit constantly - He knows he can do much better but he getting hung out to dry.

I dont think its all down to not giving a shit - in fact, i think he is genuinely depressed as fuck with the way things are.

The squad is so disjointed and jaded at the moment, gaping holes everywhere. The best thing would be a complete revamp. Starting from the manager - If we bring in another defensive minded workaholic that loves stucture more than goals ill jump off a cliff.
 
Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher are at the heart of efforts to stifle growing unrest in the Liverpool dressing-room about the capabilities of under-fire manager Roy Hodgson.

Should West Ham claim at least a point against Newcastle today, Liverpool will be rock bottom of the Barclays Premier League before Blackburn's crucial visit to Anfield tomorrow.

It is understood that several Liverpool stars - including striker Fernando Torres and goalkeeper Pepe Reina - are questioning whether Hodgson has what it takes to lead the Anfield club away from the relegation zone.


However, Sportsmail has been told that captain Gerrard and central defender Carragher believe the former Fulham manager should be given time to turn things around.

Gerrard and Carragher are the two most influential players at Anfield and are understandably concerned about a season that has plunged into disarray.

It is understood that they have personally told some of their teammates that they should keep faith with Hodgson's training methods and tactics, at least until Christmas.

Hodgson felt confident enough yesterday to laugh off claims he has fallen out with Liverpool's £21million record signing Torres.

'It's sad really that we should have to put up with things like this,' he said. 'People write the most ridiculous things on these websites, like I'm having fights with Fernando Torres. Just ridiculous.


'Someone told me yesterday that they had me falling out with the rest of my staff, and then they had me resigning. I wouldn't take it too seriously, if I were you, I really wouldn't. The dressing-room, staff, everyone around the place is 100 per cent solid behind what we are trying to do.

'I am here to try to get Liverpool back to where they belong, but I can't do it overnight, when you consider what I walked into. I met the owners, and they made it clear they thought I had inherited a really bad situation but that I was the right man to put it right.

'I would agree that I am the right man to put it right. After three-and-a- half months, I haven't suddenly become someone who has lost all confidence in himself. What I have found is that I have taken on a difficult job at a club that needs a lot of sorting out, and unfortunately I haven't had a good start.


'But I had a bad start at Fulham, and we were favourites to go down with four games left. You have periods like that in your life that you have to live through. I can't say I am happy about it, but it's nothing a few victories wouldn't change.

'It wouldn't stop websites putting out ridiculous stories, but I will have to learn to live with that. It probably comes with the territory of working at Liverpool.'

Hodgson has also had to contend with reports that his job is about to be offered to Frank Rijkaard, but Sportsmail understands the former Barcelona coach is in no hurry to return to management after leaving Galatasaray on Wednesday.

Family matters are taking precedence at his home in Amsterdam, after a week that has included the death of his father and birth of his first child with his current partner, and he is unlikely to consider another managerial post until the new year.

Blackburn counterpart Sam Allardyce tried to ease the pressure on Hodgson by telling his old foe Rafa Benitez to accept his share of the blame for Liverpool's decline.

Allardyce, who often clashed with the Spaniard, said: 'As a manager, we live in the world of perception rather than reality. I feel for Roy and he's taking the brunt of the criticism, but given time he will get it right.'


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1323009/Anfield-divide-Jamie-Carragher-Steven-Gerrard-lead-fight-save-boss-Roy-Hodgson-Liverpool-revolt.html#ixzz138GogGQY
 
If we lose this weekend, it'll be depressing. If we win this weekend, he'll stay on and it'll be depressing.

NESV are pretty quiet mind.
 
[quote author=localny link=topic=42331.msg1203925#msg1203925 date=1287795560]
If we lose this weekend, it'll be depressing. If we win this weekend, he'll stay on and it'll be depressing.

NESV are pretty quiet mind.


[/quote]

This is an attitude I can't understand. If we win this weekend, I'll be really happy, because we desperately need a win. Teams at the very bottom of the table should want wins and everything else is secondary.

Unless Hodgson had some sort of miraculous turn around and was afforded the time to do so, it's unlikely he was going to stay much beyond owners coming in. This was always the case. A few wins isn't going to secure his future, but it'll make me slightly less suicidal, and it'll allow the club time to breath.
 
It obviously won't.

Your sort of attitude is exactly what I was saying is wrong in another thread. Winning always has to be the priority, and especially in times like these.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=42331.msg1203931#msg1203931 date=1287799742]
It obviously won't.

Your sort of attitude is exactly what I was saying is wrong in another thread. Winning always has to be the priority, and especially in times like these.
[/quote]

Squiggles, do me a favor. Save the Holier than thou attitude for Sundays.

This fella shouldn't have been let within an asses roar of our club, and I don't want any more time afforded to him and his mediocre ways. Every added day he is with us, is a day in further crisis. We need a fresh start and need it now. a CL spot is still in sight if we had 8 out 10 wins in the next few weeks. I've seen it before.

Of course I want a feckin' win, but I don't want it to seen by some (and it will be ) as Roy needs more time. That he's turning the ship around.

Jesus H, why do some people think they are better fans than others.
 
NESV are smarter than you give them credit for. They're not morons, and they certainly won't think Roy is the messiah because he beat an average Blackburn side at home. Instead they'll think, "Good, we won, now things are a bit less shit", and so should everyone else.
 
I think that's a bit of an overreaction localny. The thing is, some people seem to be fairly cavalier about being in the relegation spots, and yes it SHOULD be the case that we are better than our position reflects, and it SHOULD be the case that we turn it around, but it'll help the club to no end to just get some wins together. I really don't think that'll have any impact on NESV's planning.

If we win, I'll be pleased, and sadly surprised.
 
[quote author=peekay link=topic=42331.msg1203912#msg1203912 date=1287789263]
Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher are at the heart of efforts to stifle growing unrest in the Liverpool dressing-room about the capabilities of under-fire manager Roy Hodgson.

Should West Ham claim at least a point against Newcastle today, Liverpool will be rock bottom of the Barclays Premier League before Blackburn's crucial visit to Anfield tomorrow.

It is understood that several Liverpool stars - including striker Fernando Torres and goalkeeper Pepe Reina - are questioning whether Hodgson has what it takes to lead the Anfield club away from the relegation zone.


However, Sportsmail has been told that captain Gerrard and central defender Carragher believe the former Fulham manager should be given time to turn things around.

Gerrard and Carragher are the two most influential players at Anfield and are understandably concerned about a season that has plunged into disarray.

It is understood that they have personally told some of their teammates that they should keep faith with Hodgson's training methods and tactics, at least until Christmas.

Hodgson felt confident enough yesterday to laugh off claims he has fallen out with Liverpool's £21million record signing Torres.

'It's sad really that we should have to put up with things like this,' he said. 'People write the most ridiculous things on these websites, like I'm having fights with Fernando Torres. Just ridiculous.


'Someone told me yesterday that they had me falling out with the rest of my staff, and then they had me resigning. I wouldn't take it too seriously, if I were you, I really wouldn't. The dressing-room, staff, everyone around the place is 100 per cent solid behind what we are trying to do.

'I am here to try to get Liverpool back to where they belong, but I can't do it overnight, when you consider what I walked into. I met the owners, and they made it clear they thought I had inherited a really bad situation but that I was the right man to put it right.

'I would agree that I am the right man to put it right. After three-and-a- half months, I haven't suddenly become someone who has lost all confidence in himself. What I have found is that I have taken on a difficult job at a club that needs a lot of sorting out, and unfortunately I haven't had a good start.


'But I had a bad start at Fulham, and we were favourites to go down with four games left. You have periods like that in your life that you have to live through. I can't say I am happy about it, but it's nothing a few victories wouldn't change.

'It wouldn't stop websites putting out ridiculous stories, but I will have to learn to live with that. It probably comes with the territory of working at Liverpool.'

Hodgson has also had to contend with reports that his job is about to be offered to Frank Rijkaard, but Sportsmail understands the former Barcelona coach is in no hurry to return to management after leaving Galatasaray on Wednesday.

Family matters are taking precedence at his home in Amsterdam, after a week that has included the death of his father and birth of his first child with his current partner, and he is unlikely to consider another managerial post until the new year.

Blackburn counterpart Sam Allardyce tried to ease the pressure on Hodgson by telling his old foe Rafa Benitez to accept his share of the blame for Liverpool's decline.

Allardyce, who often clashed with the Spaniard, said: 'As a manager, we live in the world of perception rather than reality. I feel for Roy and he's taking the brunt of the criticism, but given time he will get it right.'


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1323009/Anfield-divide-Jamie-Carragher-Steven-Gerrard-lead-fight-save-boss-Roy-Hodgson-Liverpool-revolt.html#ixzz138GogGQY
[/quote]

Yeah Roy. We're right behind you.

We understand your situation. It's not your fault.

Take as much time as you need ok. It's ok even if you haven't won an away match for donkey years...take your time.

It's ok if you get us relegated at the end of this season. Take your time.

YNWA Roy. We love you really, we do.
 
[quote author=My_Blood_Bleeds_Red link=topic=42331.msg1203948#msg1203948 date=1287812285]
[quote author=peekay link=topic=42331.msg1203912#msg1203912 date=1287789263]
Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher are at the heart of efforts to stifle growing unrest in the Liverpool dressing-room about the capabilities of under-fire manager Roy Hodgson.

Should West Ham claim at least a point against Newcastle today, Liverpool will be rock bottom of the Barclays Premier League before Blackburn's crucial visit to Anfield tomorrow.

It is understood that several Liverpool stars - including striker Fernando Torres and goalkeeper Pepe Reina - are questioning whether Hodgson has what it takes to lead the Anfield club away from the relegation zone.


However, Sportsmail has been told that captain Gerrard and central defender Carragher believe the former Fulham manager should be given time to turn things around.

Gerrard and Carragher are the two most influential players at Anfield and are understandably concerned about a season that has plunged into disarray.

It is understood that they have personally told some of their teammates that they should keep faith with Hodgson's training methods and tactics, at least until Christmas.

Hodgson felt confident enough yesterday to laugh off claims he has fallen out with Liverpool's £21million record signing Torres.

'It's sad really that we should have to put up with things like this,' he said. 'People write the most ridiculous things on these websites, like I'm having fights with Fernando Torres. Just ridiculous.


'Someone told me yesterday that they had me falling out with the rest of my staff, and then they had me resigning. I wouldn't take it too seriously, if I were you, I really wouldn't. The dressing-room, staff, everyone around the place is 100 per cent solid behind what we are trying to do.

'I am here to try to get Liverpool back to where they belong, but I can't do it overnight, when you consider what I walked into. I met the owners, and they made it clear they thought I had inherited a really bad situation but that I was the right man to put it right.

'I would agree that I am the right man to put it right. After three-and-a- half months, I haven't suddenly become someone who has lost all confidence in himself. What I have found is that I have taken on a difficult job at a club that needs a lot of sorting out, and unfortunately I haven't had a good start.


'But I had a bad start at Fulham, and we were favourites to go down with four games left. You have periods like that in your life that you have to live through. I can't say I am happy about it, but it's nothing a few victories wouldn't change.

'It wouldn't stop websites putting out ridiculous stories, but I will have to learn to live with that. It probably comes with the territory of working at Liverpool.'

Hodgson has also had to contend with reports that his job is about to be offered to Frank Rijkaard, but Sportsmail understands the former Barcelona coach is in no hurry to return to management after leaving Galatasaray on Wednesday.

Family matters are taking precedence at his home in Amsterdam, after a week that has included the death of his father and birth of his first child with his current partner, and he is unlikely to consider another managerial post until the new year.

Blackburn counterpart Sam Allardyce tried to ease the pressure on Hodgson by telling his old foe Rafa Benitez to accept his share of the blame for Liverpool's decline.

Allardyce, who often clashed with the Spaniard, said: 'As a manager, we live in the world of perception rather than reality. I feel for Roy and he's taking the brunt of the criticism, but given time he will get it right.'


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1323009/Anfield-divide-Jamie-Carragher-Steven-Gerrard-lead-fight-save-boss-Roy-Hodgson-Liverpool-revolt.html#ixzz138GogGQY
[/quote]

Yeah Roy. We're right behind you.

We understand your situation. It's not your fault.

Take as much time as you need ok. It's ok even if you haven't won an away match for donkey years...take your time.

It's ok if you get us relegated at the end of this season. Take your time.

YNWA Roy. We love you really, we do.
[/quote]
We must understand that we are expecting to much. There will be lots of games this season that we will expect to win but dont. Honesty is a much appreciated skill, and if you doubt you must remember that reliant sources claims that Roy Hodgson is a well respected man around Europe.
 
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