Football post Messi and Ronaldo

[keniget]

I was chatting to someone (with some very bizarre opinions) about football this morning and the question of the Ballon D'Or came up with him suggesting that neither Ronaldo or Messi deserves to win it based on their seasons so far, so the natural follow up question was "who does?".

Ronaldo and Messi for quite a number of years now have distorted the idea of "world class" to such an extent that even in a so called poor year it becomes hard to justify any other selection.

But nothing lasts forever and over the next few years their era of dominance will be sunsetting.

Who will take their place? Can anyone take their place?

Will 1 goal in 2 go back to being the goal standard for strikers or have the so called second tier of Suarez, Higauin, Aguero et al already put paid to that notion?

 

[Dreambeliever]

Interesting debate, I'm not sure there is anyone in world football currently anywhere near their level or looking like they will get near that level.

Two of the greatest of all time.

 

[Mors]

I presume that when Messi gives it up, it'll be people like Griezmann, Neymar, Dybala, Niguez, Koke, Icardi etc that'll be after it.
Scoring 1 in 2 for Barca and Real isn't that difficult, they always seem to have someone that is there or thereabouts in that league.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Messi will hit 50+ goals this year ... He'll still score a shit load because he really protects himself during games.
Ronaldo is slowing down pace wise - but I can still see him getting 30-40 goals for a few more seasons easy.

So the question is ... how the current 18-22 year olds develop?

Even if they are at the peak of their games - can I see someone scoring 50-+ goals season after season as those two have done?

Nah ... don't think so ... so a level below that, I'd go with Neymar and someone from the following list (assuming these players improve on their current curves): Mbappe, Alli, Dybala

 

[Oncy]

I was thinking the other day how few *superstars* there are in world football these days.

When I was growing up there were dozens of world class players. Then through the 2000's there were still strong representatives from all over. Nowadays I cant think beyond Messi, Neymar, Ronaldo, Suarez......thats it really.

Its not that long ago you had Vieiri, Del Piero, Trezeguet, Shevchenko, Ronaldo, Nedved, Baggio, Shearer, Davids, Raul, Maldini, Carlos, Totti, Vieira, Henry, Keane, Zola, Vialli, Ballack etc etc that list would go on all night. The era before Romario, Maradona, Stoichkov, Hagi, Dalglish, Baresi, Koeman, Van Basten, Gullit etc and that list would be even longer.
I do wonder if thats because I was a kid and just thought they were superstars.
The calibre doesnt seem anywhere near like that anymore, subsequently the blag Ronaldo and Messi are one and two every year.

I guess you have the Lewandowski, Aubamayang, Griezman teir behind that, but look at the most expensive players in the world now, Ronaldo (fair) Bale and Pogba. Are they anywhere near that list above?

The calbre at the top level doesnt seem in any way comparable with years gone by.

Its not that long ago the midfield of the top four boasted Makalele, Pires, Viera, Petit, Scholes, Keane, Beckham, Gerrard, Hamman etc.
Now Herrara, Fellaini, Henderson, Can, Matic, Oxlade Chamberlain etc.

It seems far removed from those names that rolled off the tongue.
Where is the elite level now?

Is it just me?

 

[keniget]

Where is the elite level now?

Is it just me?

Nah, I've had similar thoughts - definitely rings true for me when it comes to defenders and midfielders. It's all about the forwards these days it seems.

And as for forwards, check it out. Higuain scored 36 goals in 35 games last season for Napoli. Aubamayang has 27 in 27 this year I think. These are ridiculous stats that in any other era would have given them god like status. I posted the other day that Robben is surely one of the best wingers / forwards ever. The guy is fucking amazing but he barely gets a mention.

The problem these guys all have is that they are playing in the same era as Messi and Ronaldo.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Good shout on Robben - he is class. Cunt but class.
He's Bayern's most dangerous outlet game after game and he's probably older than most of our grandparents! :-D

 

[Squiggles]

How many players currently playing have won the Ballon D'Or? It can't be more than 3 surely? It's been dominated by these guys for years.

You've obviously got Suarez, Neymar and Bale behind them. I'd bank on Neymar stepping up further and taking it for a couple of years.

 

[Athens]

*Gets football boots out of the cupboard*

 

[Atlas]

*Gets football boots out of the cupboard*

*puts out back tieing the laces*

 

[darkstarexodus]

Honest question - is it that there were so many stars before? Or is it that Ronaldo and Messi are just THAT good? How would we consider the next level of players now in their absence? How would we consider yesteryear''s stars if they were orbiting around Ronaldo and Messi?

 

[Atlas]

For those whose kids are old enough, when the score a goal are they jumping around screaming ronaldo/messi... anyone else?

Posts above got me thinking abiut playground games of football, it was replicating a weah, beckham, zizou, ronaldo, Ronaldinho etc

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Honest question - is it that there were so many stars before? Or is it that Ronaldo and Messi are just THAT good? How would we consider the next level of players now in their absence? How would we consider yesteryear''s stars if they were orbiting around Ronaldo and Messi?

I think that's the answer ... You have two players who are in the discussion of the GREATEST OF ALL TIME ... and they CONSTANTLY perform for two of the biggest teams in football. So everyone (rightly?) focuses on them and the next tier - where there are players as good as those mentioned by Andy - gets little attention overall.

 

[Kay Age El]

New stars will emerge soon enough.

It's all cyclical.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

New stars will emerge soon enough.

It's all cyclical.

But at that level (besides Dollberg)?

 

[Kay Age El]

But at that level (besides Dollberg)?

No one in their right mind would predict that we'd ever see players of Pelé or Cruyff or Platini or Maradona's caliber again.. then came along Laudrup and Zidane and Baggio and Fat Ronaldo and Gerrard and then Zlatan and Messi and Cristiano and in a few years time we'll all be creaming ourselves over.. [insert name]

 

[Kay Age El]

Dolberg is a good shout though. He is outstanding I tell you..

OUTSTANDING!

 

[Kay Age El]

And Freddy Adu..

 

[Fabio]

And Freddy Adu..

He's got time, he's still only 17

 

[Kay Age El]

He's got time, he's still only 17

Aren't we all?

 

[LeTallecWiz]

No one in their right mind would predict that we'd ever see players of Pelé or Cruyff or Platini or Maradona's caliber again.. then came along Laudrup and Zidane and Baggio and Fat Ronaldo and Gerrard and then Zlatan and Messi and Cristiano and in a few years time we'll all be creaming ourselves over.. [insert name]

You really put Laudruop, Zidane, Baggie etc along with Pele, Maradona, Messi & Cristiano? I don't think any of them in the GOAT discussion - definitely phenomenal talents who were great to watch, but 'greatest ever'?

 

[Kay Age El]

You really put Laudruop, Zidane, Baggie etc along with Pele, Maradona, Messi & Cristiano? I don't think any of them in the GOAT discussion - definitely phenomenal talents who were great to watch, but 'greatest ever'?

I agree with that. Enjoyed watching them all play is all.

 

[Kay Age El]

..actually when thinking about it, I do believe that Zidane was VERY close to be classified as one of the greatest ever. I haven't since nor before his time seen such an accomplished play-maker really, watching him on his best days was, for me, like watching pure art in motion.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

..actually when thinking about it, I do believe that Zidane was VERY close to be classified as one of the greatest ever. I haven't since nor before his time seen such an accomplished play-maker really, watching him on his best days was, for me, like watching pure art in motion.

I think he was just below them - but definitely agree with your conclusion ... he was a joy to watch, and i'm eternally grateful for his headbutt.

 

[Hansern]

Of the young up and coming stars, there arent reallt that many ar there?

Donnarumma is one I guess. Mbappe maybe. Possibly Dembele. Anyone else?

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Of the young up and coming stars, there arent reallt that many ar there?

Donnarumma is one I guess. Mbappe maybe. Possibly Dembele. Anyone else?

DOLBERG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Hansern]

DOLBERG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I didnt think we were including Liverpool players... Goalberg is an obvious one!

 

[Kay Age El]

Of the young up and coming stars, there arent reallt that many ar there?

Donnarumma is one I guess. Mbappe maybe. Possibly Dembele. Anyone else?

There are many more. Some have shown glimpses, some are still well hidden, but they'll be there in due time.

Remember when Ronaldo was 18/19 he was obv good but no-one could predict the force he became. He even had a rather mediocre first season with United if I remember correctly.

 

[Kay Age El]

I didnt think we were including Liverpool players... Goalberg is an obvious one!

That's one of your best posts ever. Want to like it twice. 😀

PS Out of curiosity what's the story with Ødegaard? I have tried to keep tabs on him at Herenveen but it seems he's not had the best of starts there either? Surely, there's a great talent in him, but has he stagnated or are there still hope?

 

[Kay Age El]

DOLBERG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I watched him again at the weekend against PSV, Ajax lost and he didn't score but he was still truly immense more or less every time he was involved. He looks SO intelligent on the pitch, seems to make the right decision 9 out of 10 times, rarely loses the ball and his movement is something else. Normally young players, and especially forwards are so eager to get involved, but Dolberg just seems to await the right moment every time which really gives him an edge.

Having watched Origi and Dolberg within hours I have to say, there's a gulf between them in class already. And I am not one of Origi's biggest critics, nor his biggest fan, but Dolberg is just another class all together.


I am not the only one who's seeing it either..