Emre Can
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I'm not even sure what sort of figure would be market rate for him? Based on his performances this season, it'd probably be sub 5mill. But if you add in his age, potential, he's playing at a big club, german international etc, maybe he'd be worth 20-30mill in todays crazy market, god knows.
He seems a jack at all trades, master at none sort, a utility player. And I'm not sure that's exactly what we need. We've already got Henderson and Milner that can play pretty much all over.
He seems a jack at all trades, master at none sort, a utility player. And I'm not sure that's exactly what we need. We've already got Henderson and Milner that can play pretty much all over.
Issue is in his head imo. He seems to firmly believe he is world class without having to show it. Maybe the penny will drop and he'll realise you need to be at the top of your game week in, week out. If he did that he'd half a chance.
That might be why he feels our offer is below what he deserves. At least that is what the Echo are saying. Difficult to say when we dont know the figure offered obviously.
I'm usually quite measured and analytic in my assessment of players, preferring a systemic and evidence-based approach, before giving any kind of definitive opinion, and this has served me well so far, but Emre Can defies even my scientific method.
I can't recall a player that I've been so conflicted about, almost to the point where I don't feel I could give any opinion with any confidence - and I've seen the multiple threads about him over the last few years in which there doesn't seem much consensus.
Because he's just so infuriatingly inconsistent. Not just the quality of play, but what his actual attributes are. He's been hindered by injury, and has played with lots of different players (and two managers), in various positions, so it's reasonable to suggest he hasn't been able to settle and show his best form for any length of team in a fixed position.
But it's not even that. Sometimes he looks like he can't play football. His passes are all over the place, his movement and positioning woeful, he clumps around the pitch looking like his joints are made of wood.
And then at other times he can look a genuine colossus, with more nimble feet than you might expect, real attacking threat and also making his physicality count, with ball-winning and interceptions.
And there's no rhyme or reason to it. It isn't where he's playing. Or the quality of opposition. Or even form. You simply don't know what you're going to get. He's been awful and impressive in the space of consecutive games. Sometimes even the same game.
Bewildering. It's not even what you might call a "normal" level of inconsistent and consistent displays, that evens out to an acceptable mean of competence. His form since he joined looks like a three year ECG scan of someone having the world's longest cardiac arrest.
I can't recall a player that I've been so conflicted about, almost to the point where I don't feel I could give any opinion with any confidence - and I've seen the multiple threads about him over the last few years in which there doesn't seem much consensus.
Because he's just so infuriatingly inconsistent. Not just the quality of play, but what his actual attributes are. He's been hindered by injury, and has played with lots of different players (and two managers), in various positions, so it's reasonable to suggest he hasn't been able to settle and show his best form for any length of team in a fixed position.
But it's not even that. Sometimes he looks like he can't play football. His passes are all over the place, his movement and positioning woeful, he clumps around the pitch looking like his joints are made of wood.
And then at other times he can look a genuine colossus, with more nimble feet than you might expect, real attacking threat and also making his physicality count, with ball-winning and interceptions.
And there's no rhyme or reason to it. It isn't where he's playing. Or the quality of opposition. Or even form. You simply don't know what you're going to get. He's been awful and impressive in the space of consecutive games. Sometimes even the same game.
Bewildering. It's not even what you might call a "normal" level of inconsistent and consistent displays, that evens out to an acceptable mean of competence. His form since he joined looks like a three year ECG scan of someone having the world's longest cardiac arrest.
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A very succint summary.
I was hoping the opening sentence would generate a bit more outrage/ lulz
Oh well. Give it time.
Oh well. Give it time.
Can is the first Schrodinger's Footballer, existing in a state of simultaneously good and shit, and when you actually watch him, is either good or shit.
Heh, I was going to ask about that...
I still rate Can but it's been a disappointing season from him so far.
I don't think I'd be upset if we sold him and after 3 years that says a lot
It does. I still reckon there's real potential there, but we can't wait for ever for the player to consolidate it and push on.
If that's for real then sell. He will be in the last year of his contract in the summer, no doubt Juventus will low ball us into a loan if he refuses a new deal. He really hasn't kicked on this season.
I agree 100% with Brendan - I keep telling everyone the "jury is out" but he's been here three years FFS.
I think it's fair to say that if anyone,including myself, hasn't made their mind up on a first team regular it should be an indication that there is something wrong with them.
He will probably be stalling on a new contract as he knows when everyone is fit he's likely to be the odd man out -and that's before we strengthen and Grujic gets a shot- I say sell him
I think it's fair to say that if anyone,including myself, hasn't made their mind up on a first team regular it should be an indication that there is something wrong with them.
He will probably be stalling on a new contract as he knows when everyone is fit he's likely to be the odd man out -and that's before we strengthen and Grujic gets a shot- I say sell him
Does it have to be a case of all or nothing?
Put aside the contract situation, Can has had enough good games to demonstrate that he's a decent squad player if nothing else.
Is it really worthwhile selling given the trouble we seem to have getting good squad players let alone first teamers?
Is he that bad?
Put aside the contract situation, Can has had enough good games to demonstrate that he's a decent squad player if nothing else.
Is it really worthwhile selling given the trouble we seem to have getting good squad players let alone first teamers?
Is he that bad?
why sell him at the behest of keeping Grujic involved? There is zero evidence to suggest that Grujic will ever reach Can's levels of ability and whatever criticism is levelled against him, he's proven to be better than average and has played all the way up & down the spine of the side bar forward and goalkeeper.
I dont think its possible to tear can a new one without looking at Henderson, who had a good month in like, October and November and suddenly gained bulletproof status, he's largely been average over the past 12 months, certainly performance levels haven't been far ahead of Can
Can is mobile? He's rapid over short distances ? bursting past players and/or closing down opponents , in fact Id say Cans athleticism was one of his key attributes.
Ive not seen enough of Grujic for the club to really gauge how good he currently is or will be but from what limited bits i have seen of him, I cant say he has more potential than Can or even that he will go on to be a steady performer for the club like Can.
Ive not seen enough of Grujic for the club to really gauge how good he currently is or will be but from what limited bits i have seen of him, I cant say he has more potential than Can or even that he will go on to be a steady performer for the club like Can.
I think I like Can as a footballer but I can totally understand the ones that also airs frustrations with his lack of impact/progress. He kinda also does my head in as well.
As Keni touched upon I don't think it would make sense to ship now him unless we had a very clear idea of whom we were going to get in instead.
For starters if we ever are going to see the best of him I think he should play week in week out, to me he looks like a player that needs games and some security regarding his position in the team if he's going to improve and blossom. I am not sure if Klopp believes he's good enough to hold a spot of his own, but on the other hand he actually might.
So to sum up, I have no clue really. But I think I like him more than I don't.
As Keni touched upon I don't think it would make sense to ship now him unless we had a very clear idea of whom we were going to get in instead.
For starters if we ever are going to see the best of him I think he should play week in week out, to me he looks like a player that needs games and some security regarding his position in the team if he's going to improve and blossom. I am not sure if Klopp believes he's good enough to hold a spot of his own, but on the other hand he actually might.
So to sum up, I have no clue really. But I think I like him more than I don't.
I don't think any of us have seen enough of Grujic pre injury to form an opinion but Can thinks he is better than reality and won't hang around if he's not a first choice
yeah ,perhaps . We've also seen different grujic' if you see him as a quicker,more promising Can.
im not discounting that can hasn't had a stinker or two in recent weeks BUT He's still a young,versatile player with plenty of promise, its be a mistake to get rid of him in light of all that, imo
im not discounting that can hasn't had a stinker or two in recent weeks BUT He's still a young,versatile player with plenty of promise, its be a mistake to get rid of him in light of all that, imo
We need another top quality Central Midfielder whatever Can does, and he needs to be able to play at the required level NOW.
I thought he was ok yesterday. I was surprised he was taken off instead of Studge/Hendo yesterday. Hopefully he will keep improving his form and be a real asset against Chelsea!!
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