AVB sacked

[Mystic]

He's done a lot of good for the club, but it was his decision to wrongly sack Redknapp, a decision I'm sure he took because he thought his new Spurs were too good for an old fashioned English manager, now that they'd made the champions league, despite the fact Harry built that team, which has cost them. He then wrongly sold Bale at the last minute of the transfer window, and then gave Baldini all the purchasing power, with little communication with AVB, leaving them where they are today. He's got the last three years very wrong in my books, sure he's a cold ass negotiator, and financially has done very well for Spurs, but Harry is the reason they've risen from mid table obscurity, and sacking him because Chelsea won the champions league was just pathetic. He let that year in the champions league go to his head, and ended up thinking they were bigger than they are.

 

[gkmacca]

I suspect it doesn't help there are so many ex-pros around the place - Ferdinand, King, Sherwood, etc. That bunch are more likely to side with the players than with the manager, and there does seem to be a lot of player power at the club. Redknapp lost their support, now AVB does the same.

 

[keniget]

He's done a lot of good for the club, but it was his decision to wrongly sack Redknapp, a decision I'm sure he took because he thought his new Spurs were too good for an old fashioned English manager, now that they'd made the champions league, despite the fact Harry built that team, which has cost them. He then wrongly sold Bale at the last minute of the transfer window, and then gave Baldini all the purchasing power, with little communication with AVB, leaving them where they are today. He's got the last three years very wrong in my books, sure he's a cold ass negotiator, and financially has done very well for Spurs, but Harry is the reason they've risen from mid table obscurity, and sacking him because Chelsea won the champions league was just pathetic. He let that year in the champions league go to his head, and ended up thinking they were bigger than they are.

I'm not sure I agree with a lot of that.

1. I don't think Redknapp built the team and he's most definitely not the reason they rose from midtable obscurity. That's just revisionist nonsense I'm afraid. Jol led them to their highest finish (5th I think it was) in like 15 years when he was there. The infrastructure and vision at the club was in place well before Redknapp arrived - he just capitalized on that and did well for a period but that's it.

2. Redknapp will only take a team so far. There is a reason he's been at mid-level clubs all his career and is at QPR now instead of another top club. I don't think it was madness to sack him. There were risks associated with sticking as well as twisting.

3. What difference does it make when they sold Bale? To their credit, they spent all the money and a good percentage of it early'ish in the window. You could perhaps argue that it would've been better for stability sake to sell Bale early but they ended up getting a world record fee or close to one so you can hardly say they fucked it up.

There seems to be a lot of speculation in your argument as to how Levy wishes to be perceived or is perceived and what Spurs think they are or aren't and to me that just undermines the credibility of any argument you're making. Well, that and the Redknapp argument.

I am open to there being a load of stuff about Spurs I don't know but thus far I'm really not seeing why Levy is so terrible for them.

 

[gene hughes]

They're in a horrible position in some ways. They need a new coach but really will need to trim down the squad before they can let him rebuild.

They should have kept the manager. I didn't like him but if you hire a very young inexperienced coach you have to accept set backs and they weren't doing too badly at all.

 

[keniget]

They're in a horrible position in some ways. They need a new coach but really will need to trim down the squad before they can let him rebuild.

They should have kept the manager. I didn't like him but if you hire a very young inexperienced coach you have to accept set backs and they weren't doing too badly at all.

Do they really need to rebuild or trim the squad that much?

If it were me I'd finally put Defoe out of his misery and sell him. Buy a couple strikers. Get a CB to replace Dawson who is past it now (though they did have three defenders injured at the weekend which is a little unusual) as well as a first choice LB.

That would leave them in pretty good shape to be honest. It's not a crazy amount of work unless by the end of the season they end up realizing that more than a couple players they bought in the summer aren't worth persisting with.

 

[Mystic]

I'm not sure I agree with a lot of that.

1. I don't think Redknapp built the team and he's most definitely not the reason they rose from midtable obscurity. That's just revisionist nonsense I'm afraid. Jol led them to their highest finish (5th I think it was) in like 15 years when he was there. The infrastructure and vision at the club was in place well before Redknapp arrived - he just capitalized on that and did well for a period but that's it.

2. Redknapp will only take a team so far. There is a reason he's been at mid-level clubs all his career and is at QPR now instead of another top club. I don't think it was madness to sack him. There were risks associated with sticking as well as twisting.

3. What difference does it make when they sold Bale? To their credit, they spent all the money and a good percentage of it early'ish in the window. You could perhaps argue that it would've been better for stability sake to sell Bale early but they ended up getting a world record fee or close to one so you can hardly say they fucked it up.

There seems to be a lot of speculation in your argument as to how Levy wishes to be perceived or is perceived and what Spurs think they are or aren't and to me that just undermines the credibility of any argument you're making. Well, that and the Redknapp argument.

I am open to there being a load of stuff about Spurs I don't know but thus far I'm really not seeing why Levy is so terrible for them.

I'm not doubting he's built a good base for them, but you need more than that, Spurs were in the relegation zone when Harry took over, he then lead them to the champions league and bought out the best in lots of their players, and pretty much made Bale the player he is, I'm not fan of Redknapp, but finishing 4th/5th/4th cant be argued with.

The problem with Levy is that he's sabotaging the ambitious plan he set in motion all those years back. Sacking Harry to then go and replace him with a foreign young manager who had just been made a fool out of at one of their rivals was an awful decision, Levy should have supported Harry, but instead he isolated him and kicked him out. I understand the sense in selling Bale late to get the best money, but there's two problems. Firstly, all that was spoke about all summer was Bale, it must have been so distracting and detrimental to the team, it most definitely had an effect on the team, Rodgers and Henry made it clear that after a certain date, we wouldn't entertain any offer for Suarez, sure we didn't sell him in the end anyway, but it was one hundred percent the right thing to do, Madrid would have stumped up if Levy stood firm. Secondly, and yes its right to say its speculative, but I'm pretty damn sure its true, they bought the best players for the price, not the best players for the team. Its obvious that AVB was consulted, but it wasn't his choices, he should have been driving the purchases, as if they're happy to fire a fourth place finishing manager for this guy, they've got to be happy to invest in his team, not Levy or Baldini's. Those two should come out and accept responsibility, but instead they're hiding behind AVB.

 

[737Max]

I've been having a look at 'The Fighting Cock' forum for a post match giggle. Most of the Spurs fans are of the same opinion as you @peekay in that Levy should take some blame. They also really hate (amazingly) Suarez as well! 😀

@Red Astaire, best quote from that forum re: Levy has to be this:

Honestly, I couldn't give a shit right now.... He clearly doesn't!!

As long as the books balance, who cares about a 5-0 drubbing at home, so soon after a 6-0 raping away!!
Until the Russians or Arabs turn up, we're playing 2nd fiddle with the other 17 teams.... only we're not as good as them, and have sold our soul long ago!

We haven't quite been the same since ArseAnal shat in our lasagne...

 

[Spaghetti Legs]

Delusions of granduer sums that club up perfectly, get back in you're place Spurs.

 

[keniget]

@Mystic, I don't know, I don't really agree. I can see the logic in sacking Redknapp so clearly won't agree with the main thrust of your argument and as far as Bale goes that's a one off situation.

In terms of backing the manager, that's a very English opinion. Clubs on the continent don't seem to do too badly with the DoF model in place.

I agree that there was an overly heavy focus on midfielders but then they've been buying players in bulk for years now and it's worked - sort of. They've made some bad decisions in the striking department and I think that's what has really hurt them. Signing Adebayor was an awful decision and now they're lumbered with him. Defoe should've been sold because his face clearly doesn't fit. So they're really only left with Soldado who for various reasons isn't doing what they need him to do.

 

[Hansern]

Sherwoods a pretty decent coach isnt he? Heard he's highley rated.
Levy hasnt done much wrong. He got close to a world record fee for Bale, and they spent more than that on new players.
Trusting Baldini with all those funds could have been a mistake though. They've got a potential 30 mill down the drain in Soldado. The others are young and can probably be sold for a decent fee if needed.

Sounds as though Baldini and AVB didnt agree about some of the players. There were loads of rumours about that this summer.

 

[red_maradona]

strange decision - 4 points off 4th place in a topsy turvy league with no clear frontrunner? Highest points total last year and this year. Doing well in cups. team acclimatising. 2 points ahead of Utd...

 

[iseered]

Redknapp is clearly happy about it.

Because once again he is the fairest one of all.

 

[Judge Jules]

I can see both sides of the argument over Redknapp, but the choice of AVB as manager was always a poor one and that's Levy's responsibility first and foremost.

 

[gene hughes]

Do they really need to rebuild or trim the squad that much?

If it were me I'd finally put Defoe out of his misery and sell him. Buy a couple strikers. Get a CB to replace Dawson who is past it now (though they did have three defenders injured at the weekend which is a little unusual) as well as a first choice LB.

That would leave them in pretty good shape to be honest. It's not a crazy amount of work unless by the end of the season they end up realizing that more than a couple players they bought in the summer aren't worth persisting with.

I know what you mean but you're saying they need two top strikers and two too defenders after spending over 100m in the summer. That's assuming the new coach likes all the midfielders. If he doesn't he'll have to sell before he buys and few of them will fetch the money they cost. I expect they'll have a little surge now regardless of who's put in charge but longer term I think they've fucked up their squad with some bad decisions.

 

[Whirly]

Caption it!

 

[SummerOnions]

Your beard has the majesty of a thousand suns

 

[Mystic]

@Mystic, I don't know, I don't really agree. I can see the logic in sacking Redknapp so clearly won't agree with the main thrust of your argument and as far as Bale goes that's a one off situation.

In terms of backing the manager, that's a very English opinion. Clubs on the continent don't seem to do too badly with the DoF model in place.

I agree that there was an overly heavy focus on midfielders but then they've been buying players in bulk for years now and it's worked - sort of. They've made some bad decisions in the striking department and I think that's what has really hurt them. Signing Adebayor was an awful decision and now they're lumbered with him. Defoe should've been sold because his face clearly doesn't fit. So they're really only left with Soldado who for various reasons isn't doing what they need him to do.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I truly think Levy has made some shocking knee jerk decisions as soon as his club got some form of success, he thinks they're much bigger than they are and he's trying to rush force things to quickly, which is strange considering the methodical but steady growth he'd been driving before.

 

[Buddha]

 

[moron]

I guess the 'Project' could not be delivered.

 

[Mors]

Sherwood currently the favourite for the job at 5/2 lolz

Have 2 managers been sacked before the end of the season before?

 

[LaoTzu]

It seems to me that under his stewardship they've gone from being a fairly nothing midtable side to aspirational top 4 contenders without the help of a sugar daddy.

Spurs owner is Joe Lewis!
They're not as ostentatious with it as Chelsea and Man City but there's serious money behind Spurs...

Joe Lewis (born 5 February 1937) is a British businessman who currently lives in Lyford Cay, New Providence, Bahamas.
Lewis' total wealth is estimated at $4.2 billion, and he is listed as the 308th richest person of Forbes’ List of billionaires (2013). Forbes reports Lewis is the ninth wealthiest person in Britain.

 

[Molbystwin]

I certainly wasn't trying to belittle our achievement Jules, I just think we should guard against any undue triumphalism after what was a great result. Those flaws in the team might have been exaggerated and the confidence gained is VERY WELCOME and cannot really be over estimated so Sunday was a thing of beauty. Agreed.

And you are right, before the game if Spurs had of won then the picture would be as different for them now as it is for us.

It was a strong blow right on the money. POW.

I'm chuffed I really am, I just think if you had asked to swap midfields before the game most of us would have done it without thinking twice.

 

[rurikbird]

I'm chuffed I really am, I just think if you had asked to swap midfields before the game most of us would have done it without thinking twice.

I wouldn't. I always thought Allen and Lucas were underrated by our fans, and to some extent Henderson too. And I don't share the view that we have some kind of dire need for a powerful, physical "presence" in midfield like M'Villa or any of the Spurs midfield 3. I like Paulinho, but I don't think Dembele is all that – he is a CM who stands out because he can dribble past people which is just about the most useless quality for a CM. I read somewhere he Dembele had 3 successful dribbles on Sunday, while our midfield 3 didn't attempt a single dribble – and they didn't need to, as they totally outplayed the Spurs midfield 3 with their passing, pressing and movement. If you're relying on your central midfielder to dribble past people to develop an attacking move, rather than doing it through pass-and-move, you're doing it wrong.

 

[keniget]

Spurs owner is Joe Lewis!
They're not as ostentatious with it as Chelsea and Man City but there's serious money behind Spurs...

Joe Lewis (born 5 February 1937) is a British businessman who currently lives in Lyford Cay, New Providence, Bahamas.
Lewis' total wealth is estimated at $4.2 billion, and he is listed as the 308th richest person of Forbes’ List of billionaires (2013). Forbes reports Lewis is the ninth wealthiest person in Britain.

I know but he's no sugar daddy, is he? They don't spend in the same way City and the like do. They run the football club like a business rather than a plaything.

 

[StevieM]

The problem with Spurs is that... well.... they're Spurs.

The sooner they realise that upper mid table and a great cup run once a decade is all their lot, then better it'll be for them - less painful.

 

[Mystic]

The problem with Spurs is that... well.... they're Spurs.

The sooner they realise that upper mid table and a great cup run once a decade is all their lot, then better it'll be for them - less painful.

Yep, delusions of grandeur, Everton are a bigger club than them.

 

[StevieM]

Interesting....

 

[gkmacca]

Interesting....

What the feck does it have to do with HIM?

 

[StevieM]

Dunno. Who Are the doctors at Spurs?

 

[Rosco]

Presumably it's a reference back to the to we had with the medical team over Lloris' concussion.

AVB fell out with everyone it seems. That's the sign of a great manager. He demands more of those around him and won't rest until everybody toes the line