Manu thoughts

[Stulikesdrums]

[quote author=Gary25 link=topic=47185.msg1412614#msg1412614 date=1318712987]
[quote author=Stulikesdrums link=topic=47185.msg1412607#msg1412607 date=1318712470]
[quote author=Gary25 link=topic=47185.msg1412601#msg1412601 date=1318710956]
[quote author=Stulikesdrums link=topic=47185.msg1412600#msg1412600 date=1318710615]
We kind of just expect quality from Kelly now, don't we? First choice RB all day, every day.
[/quote]

I don't to be honest. Don't get me wrong i think he's a solid enough player, but not as good as what a lot of Liverpool fans think.

I just don't think he has enough class on the ball to be a top class full back.
He could very well become a centre half one day though, but i don't think he's ready for that either.
[/quote]

I agree that CB is his future, I think most would agree.
I'm not saying he is a natural full back either Gary, im just saying that a) for 19 years of age some of his performances are mighty and b) he is better for the team than Johnson.
[/quote]

Kelly is 21 mate but yeah, still young and learning the game.

I do think he has the makings to be a good player, he's athletic and reads the play well. Just think he has some serious limitations which are evident.

Agree that he's better than Johnson, no doubt about that.
[/quote]

I knew that 🙁
I meant he was turning in great performances two years ago!

Kelly is the business, he'll be an LFC & England regular for many years, injury permitting.

 

[Skullflower]

we need 3 wins in our next 3 games.

 

[Fabio]

[quote author=Skullflower link=topic=47185.msg1412646#msg1412646 date=1318716519]
we need 3 wins in our next 3 games.
[/quote]

definitely, and achievable too

providing we're not dealt any cruel injury blows and we actually turn up!

 

[Bob Loblaw]

Adams best game yet and on the flip side Lucas's worst outing for quite some time. I know he has greatly improved but I'm still not convinced he's the long term answer, we certainly looked better when he was swapped for Henderson who chances apart, passes and moves a lot quicker than Lucas and is a better athlete. Hendo is very raw, but I'd still like to see us work with Gerrard, Adam and Henderson next time we have 3 in midfield. Should be enough defensive cover between the 3 of them to do without Lucas who offers very little going forward.

Enrique was excellent again, Carra was excellent again apart for the goal which he was at fault for again (as was Skrtel).

Suarez worked his ass off but is a Number 7 screaming out for a decent finisher to play alongside him.

Gerrard was well Gerrard, not only an improvement of one position but has the ability in coming games to improve the others around him. Downing, Adam, Henderson, Suarez and even Carroll will all beneifit with Stevie in the team.

Bellamy was unlucky not to get a run out, but the game never presented the change so understandable.

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=The_Rule link=topic=47185.msg1412556#msg1412556 date=1318702638]
I have a problem with Downing's performance today.

WHAT THE FUCK DID HE DO TODAY APART FROM LAST MINUTE CROSS TO HENDERSON??? Please someone explain to me.


[/quote]

This is actually a good post.

Downing fucks me off immensely.

 

[Gary25]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47185.msg1412668#msg1412668 date=1318720820]
[quote author=The_Rule link=topic=47185.msg1412556#msg1412556 date=1318702638]
I have a problem with Downing's performance today.

WHAT THE FUCK DID HE DO TODAY APART FROM LAST MINUTE CROSS TO HENDERSON??? Please someone explain to me.


[/quote]

This is actually a good post.

Downing fucks me off immensely.
[/quote]

Me too. He's too tame/weak minded or whatever the hell you call it.

Hope he's benched against Norwich.

 

[Wilko7]

I was delighted to see the Captain back today. I didn't think he was ready for 90 minutes and thought, having been out for so long, his touch would be too heavy and that he shouldn't have taken the freekick. I was happy to be proven wrong on both counts.

 

[Molbystwin]

[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=47185.msg1412547#msg1412547 date=1318701704]
We controlled most of the game and I was pleased with our response to their goal. We didn't look to hang on, but pressed hard for the win.
[/quote]

Is the truth, yes we could have won but we didnt... Glad you picked up on our response to our goal... I dunno...
Other better teams with glorious squads.... CHECK
Overspent on non superstars ....................CHECK
Not really much to look at.........................CHECK
Still waiting 20 years................................CHECK
I keep sitting around thinking the worst sometimes, they are a great team, look who they bought, we played shit there etc, its a tough place to play, we never win there, no way we can do it for a season, too much quality......

Yes.... all of that... all true...Its like painting by numbers.

Kenny saying earlier in the week that its just another game, the Liverpool way etc.... We havent been at the races yet have we.


Wait a minute though. Just taking a step back and looking at it all so far....

We didnt just boss United on the pitch today we bossed em before they even fucking arrived on it. Fergie happy with a point before the game kicks off? Doesnt that strike you as a bit strange? No we are not top of the league, we are not chock full of game changing superstars on 250K a week pining for the barrios... or getting a new hair weave.... what are we at the minute exactly? What do we look like? How are the players holding themselves on the pitch? Is anyone else seeing what im seeing?

When they nicked their goal look how we responded... we went fucking nuts and threw the kitchen sink at the cunts... we did everything but score in fact... we are not good enough though arent we? We've got no chance?

Nah... What i saw today was a really good team playing together with determination and without fear, THEY had the fucking fear.

What do you actually need to win? In the big picture sort of thing.....
Belief? I think its fair to say we have that.
Confidence? that was STEVEN FUCKING GERRARD running about today wasnt it?it did look like him...
Class on the ball? we've got some of that...
Determination and desire? You'd probably have to ask maybe Carra... Suarez has at times looked a tad determined...
Hungry? Well if the players are not i reckon the fans can do that for em...

Not in a jokey dumbledores army way, nor in a blindly optimistic hopeful way, more in a using my own eyes and seeing what im seeing kind of way ....we are very VERY much in this ladies and gentlemen, I can just sense it.... i can see it.... it doesnt mean we will win it mind you... but....

We go out to play our next game, and just like Kenny (p.b.u.h) says it is the most important, and we try and tear them a new asshole....just like we did after the mancs nicked one..... and then we try and do it again the week after that and then the week after that.

At the end lets count the points.

Im well up for it.

 

[ILD]

[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47185.msg1412630#msg1412630 date=1318714065]
big game player though...
[/quote]

Fabio was that sarcastic. I love ya dude but come on? Kuyt scored a hatrick against United last season and justified his inclusion after playing well in the Derby. Against Everton he hit the post, had a nice duck for Andy to hammer home and Baines didn't get one chance to gallop forward. Henderson comes on and has a good ten minutes where he didn't score or assist anything but played very lively. I'm delighted for him and hope he kicks on from here.

I do feel at times there is a split on this site and some sort of Kuyt Vs Henderson camps have emerged. I love Dirk, everyone knows that but I also want Jordan to succeed here. It doesn't have to be mutually exclusive but the Henderson fans do seem to put Dirk down given the chance and vise versa. I don't like to see it I tells ya, don't like it at all.

 

[SaintGeorge67]

Dirk's the fucking man.

That doesn't mean he's immune from criticism, as yesterday, he was shite.


Henderson looked promising, and with Lucas suspended has a big opportunity in the middle (I assume) vs. Norwich.

 

[ILD]

I totally agree, he isn't immune to criticism. It's the Henderson vs Kuyt face off that annoys me. It shouldn't be mutually exclusive, it doesn't have to be one over the other.

Yep, hope to see Henderson play centrally against Norwich. He's dynamic, good touch and technique. I just wanted him to imply himself and that drop to the bench probably helped him.

 

[ILD]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47185.msg1412668#msg1412668 date=1318720820]
[quote author=The_Rule link=topic=47185.msg1412556#msg1412556 date=1318702638]
I have a problem with Downing's performance today.

WHAT THE FUCK DID HE DO TODAY APART FROM LAST MINUTE CROSS TO HENDERSON??? Please someone explain to me.


[/quote]

This is actually a good post.

Downing fucks me off immensely.
[/quote]

Harsh. He also put in a beautiful ball for Kuyt which the keeper saved. He was direct and he links up well with Enrique.

Yeah obv not worth the 16-20mil we paid but lets not look for things to pick at in a game he did well in .

 

[Hansern]

Downing improved as the game went on. Played some excellent crosses for both Kuyt and Henderson. Has had a decent start to his Liverpool career, and will only get better as will his understanding with Enrique.

Did his share of the defensive duties aswell.

 

[ILD]

On a side note Ashley Young was a non entity in the game too btw.

 

[Hansern]

Martin Kelly was excellent

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=ILD link=topic=47185.msg1412711#msg1412711 date=1318747050]
On a side note Ashley Young was a non entity in the game too btw.
[/quote]

Agreed. But, how many goals and assists has he got against his name this season?

I don't know the answer but if it's 1 then it's 1 more than our fucking Stewart has the non-contributing joke.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=47185.msg1412677#msg1412677 date=1318726683]
Not in a jokey dumbledores army way, nor in a blindly optimistic hopeful way, more in a using my own eyes and seeing what im seeing kind of way ....we are very VERY much in this ladies and gentlemen, I can just sense it.... i can see it.... it doesnt mean we will win it mind you... but....

We go out to play our next game, and just like Kenny (p.b.u.h) says it is the most important, and we try and tear them a new asshole....just like we did after the mancs nicked one..... and then we try and do it again the week after that and then the week after that.

At the end lets count the points.

Im well up for it.

[/quote]


as far as I'm concerned, manu is just another game, another 3 points to be won. who will win the league will be the team that secures the most points or another way to look at it is which team will drop the least points and currently we are just not clinical enough. what is going to happen to turn that profligacy around?

 

[jimmy]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47185.msg1412733#msg1412733 date=1318756811]
[quote author=ILD link=topic=47185.msg1412711#msg1412711 date=1318747050]
On a side note Ashley Young was a non entity in the game too btw.
[/quote]

Agreed. But, how many goals and assists has he got against his name this season?

I don't know the answer but if it's 1 then it's 1 more than our fucking Stewart has the non-contributing joke.
[/quote]

It's 2 goals and 6 assists.
Downing has 0 and 0.

I really hope this changes soon.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=jimmy link=topic=47185.msg1412748#msg1412748 date=1318759433]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47185.msg1412733#msg1412733 date=1318756811]
[quote author=ILD link=topic=47185.msg1412711#msg1412711 date=1318747050]
On a side note Ashley Young was a non entity in the game too btw.
[/quote]

Agreed. But, how many goals and assists has he got against his name this season?

I don't know the answer but if it's 1 then it's 1 more than our fucking Stewart has the non-contributing joke.
[/quote]

It's 2 goals and 6 assists.
Downing has 0 and 0.

I really hope this changes soon.
[/quote]

chances created is a better barometer than assists, the crosses for kuyt and henderson were mouth watering and ONE of them should have converted

 

[FoxForceFive]

Positives:
We battered them second half & should've won;
Enrique (bar one mistake) was good at the back & pushing forward;
Suarez is a creative genius & made their entire defence foul him or be left for dead. He made Rio look like a 2nd division CB yesterday;
Adam was great going forwards & showed why Kenny has put faith in him;
We've accidentally discovered a very promising midfield.

Negatives:
Downing offered very little;
Lucas was that bad I would have gladly booted the cunt of the pitch yesterday, the amount of times he lost the ball was scary;
Suarez cant finish well enough to be relied on to score, he needs a striking partner;
We looked scared of an exceptionally dour & average Utd side, gave them far too much respect;
We forgot how to press Utd high up the pitch the first half, they looked like they had an extra man most of the game cos we sat back so much.

I've just seen someone mention Lucas is suspended. That's boss, cos he shouldn't get near the side until he's discovered how not to lose possession every two minutes again, & how not to made stupid fucking needless bad tackles in the middle of the park.

Henderson looked great up top again, he shows real promise there & almost won us the game. Stevie managed to stay back in that deep lying CM/DM role much more rigidly than I thought possible, he pushed up a little every now & then but impressed. Adam looks way more comfortable with Stevie behind or alongside him too, he can push forward well & offers way more than alongside Lucas.

 

[Wizardry]

We do certainly need to be a little more clinical but, while it cost us, it's not the reason we got a single point.

We've needed someone to sit in the centre of defense for a couple of years. Instead we decided to cover everything else. Skittles lost his man but it started with Carra losing his man for the flick.

Manu had 3 corners and got one goal. Why? Cause it's 50:50 when the ball goes in.

Impressed with Hendo and he improved on Lucas without doubt. Want to see him start rather than come up against tired legs first but he's a definite option we need to look at.

 

[mark1975]

One thing I noticed yesterday and against Everton is that we're leaving the centre backs isolated, no one is getting infront of the back four and protecting them, Saha had a free reign and two good shots on goal in the derby because of it and it happened a few times yesterday aswell. It really highlights our lack of a natural DM.

 

[Glock21]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=47185.msg1412752#msg1412752 date=1318759849]
[quote author=jimmy link=topic=47185.msg1412748#msg1412748 date=1318759433]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47185.msg1412733#msg1412733 date=1318756811]
[quote author=ILD link=topic=47185.msg1412711#msg1412711 date=1318747050]
On a side note Ashley Young was a non entity in the game too btw.
[/quote]

Agreed. But, how many goals and assists has he got against his name this season?

I don't know the answer but if it's 1 then it's 1 more than our fucking Stewart has the non-contributing joke.
[/quote]

It's 2 goals and 6 assists.
Downing has 0 and 0.

I really hope this changes soon.
[/quote]

chances created is a better barometer than assists, the crosses for kuyt and henderson were mouth watering and ONE of them should have converted
[/quote]


Could that be the ONLY two successful crosses that Downing provide this season after what 8 games?? ?? Fucking hell.

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=Hansern link=topic=47185.msg1412708#msg1412708 date=1318746478]
Downing improved as the game went on. Played some excellent crosses for both Kuyt and Henderson. Has had a decent start to his Liverpool career, and will only get better as will his understanding with Enrique.

Did his share of the defensive duties aswell.
[/quote]

Why is there an assumption that Downing "will only get better" ?

I could do the Premiership proven thing here again, but I'll spare you it, Downing is exactly the player we've seen so far. He's alright and that's all he'll ever be.

 

[singlerider]

I'm kind of surprised at the number of people who are lashing Downing yet lauding Enrique.

I thought neither were poor, nor particularly good - they were both fairly average. Enrique had a pretty reasonable game defensively, but there were some errors there as well. Downing I thought helped out tracking back, and although there wasn't much of note there were the 2 crosses late on which deserved goals, and the beautiful 45 yard crossfield ball to Gerrard in the opening 5 minutes. Apart from a lot of running that initially seemed promising but ultimately fizzled out, I'm not sure what Enrique did to gain such plaudits, I only remember 1 or 2 of his crosses beating the first man.

Smalling had an excellent game against the both of them IMO, and I think Ginsoak playing Park helped negate some of the threat from Enrique.

Suarez looks lonely up top, Adam looked much better today, aside from the goal I thought both Carra and Skrtel were having decent games (especially Carra), I would maybe liked to have seen Bellers come on, either for Downing or Kuyt

 

[Skullflower]

we should have bought downing for ten mill years ago (though i didn't want to). we've paid well too much for him.

 

[singlerider]

I'm also surprised at the number of people slating Lucas for the amount of times he gave the ball away, yet praising Stevie.

His 2nd half was obviously much better thanks to the goal, but in the 1st he was giving it away more cheaply and more often than Lucas

 

[FoxForceFive]

He really wasnt single, the majority of the section we were sat in were screaming at Lucas time & again. Gerrard did have a poor first half though, thats undeniable, but he was nowhere near as bad as Lucas, the only way I could put it is unforced errors, time & again.

 

[Hansern]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=47185.msg1412823#msg1412823 date=1318775264]
[quote author=Hansern link=topic=47185.msg1412708#msg1412708 date=1318746478]
Downing improved as the game went on. Played some excellent crosses for both Kuyt and Henderson. Has had a decent start to his Liverpool career, and will only get better as will his understanding with Enrique.

Did his share of the defensive duties aswell.
[/quote]

Why is there an assumption that Downing "will only get better" ?

I could do the Premiership proven thing here again, but I'll spare you it, Downing is exactly the player we've seen so far. He's alright and that's all he'll ever be.

[/quote]


Because he has delivered goals and assists in every season in the Premiership for, what, 7 odd years.
That wont change. He's in a much betterteam, and when things really clicks we'll see the best of him aswell.

 

[the_khl]

Still sad we didn't get all three after a game we mostly dominated. Been a while since a game really got on my tits like this one did.

This is a good thing mostly I reckon because it means we're close now, a win would've close the gap completely. Almost. A few years back we'd be trailing 20 points anyways but this time around we're still in the competition and has got a chance but we need to address a few issues.

Our set-piece defending. Can't believe we're still seeing school-boy errors like the one Skrtel made. That's NOT the way you mark a man - at no point was he aware of the ball and he then fell over in his efforts to litterally hold his man. Abysmal defending that completely ruined an otherwise decent performance. Carra should've attacked Wellbeck for the ball but he stood in the right position at least and had Skrtel faced the right way as well we'd won the game.

Kuyt was bad and he squandered that major chance that he'd normally bury. Needs to improve as we've got good cover on the bench as especially Henderson showed.

Gerrard is back. Despite not enjoying the best first 45 he improved rapidly after the break and looks to be getting there. Vital.

Suarez was wonderful but he missed Carroll at times and found himself too isolated at times. I'd love to see them both play more.

Kelly is going to make it hard for Johnson but if Agger gets injured again perhaps we should try him in central alongsige Carra. Wouldn't mind that.