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In 1987...

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[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207307#msg1207307 date=1288264088]
[quote author=Akakabooto link=topic=42443.msg1207285#msg1207285 date=1288260513]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207280#msg1207280 date=1288259814]
I'm biased and I follow certain footballers with great interest for several good reasons.

Anyways to be honest I haven't seen that much of Llorente but why do you all reckon him to be the better striker of the two?
[/quote]

Rotation player from Arsenal vs. one of La Ligas in form players(linked to both Barca and Real) plus a Spanish international? Even if you haven't seen either of them play it shouldnt be a tough choice. : )

[/quote]
Bendtner will soon enough be linked to Barca or Real (if that's a benchmark of value). Or Both. You'll see.

[/quote]

Haha, whatever. I was only pointing out why 'we all reckon him to be the better striker of the two'. Surely even you can see why?
 
I liked him when he was on loan at Birmingham, where he could be a big fish in a relatively small pool, but he hasn't kicked on from there since he went back to the Arse. We could actually do worse as a stand-in for Torres but I can't see him improving beyond that.
 
I barely read KHL's post.

Same old shit, different day. Waste of time.
 
[quote author=Akakabooto link=topic=42443.msg1207334#msg1207334 date=1288267545]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207307#msg1207307 date=1288264088]
[quote author=Akakabooto link=topic=42443.msg1207285#msg1207285 date=1288260513]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207280#msg1207280 date=1288259814]
I'm biased and I follow certain footballers with great interest for several good reasons.

Anyways to be honest I haven't seen that much of Llorente but why do you all reckon him to be the better striker of the two?
[/quote]

Rotation player from Arsenal vs. one of La Ligas in form players(linked to both Barca and Real) plus a Spanish international? Even if you haven't seen either of them play it shouldnt be a tough choice. : )

[/quote]
Bendtner will soon enough be linked to Barca or Real (if that's a benchmark of value). Or Both. You'll see.

[/quote]

Haha, whatever. I was only pointing out why 'we all reckon him to be the better striker of the two'. Surely even you can see why?
[/quote]
I'm glad you're not a scout for Liverpool mate if that's how you make your assessment on players.
 
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207431#msg1207431 date=1288273846]
[quote author=Akakabooto link=topic=42443.msg1207334#msg1207334 date=1288267545]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207307#msg1207307 date=1288264088]
[quote author=Akakabooto link=topic=42443.msg1207285#msg1207285 date=1288260513]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207280#msg1207280 date=1288259814]
I'm biased and I follow certain footballers with great interest for several good reasons.

Anyways to be honest I haven't seen that much of Llorente but why do you all reckon him to be the better striker of the two?
[/quote]

Rotation player from Arsenal vs. one of La Ligas in form players(linked to both Barca and Real) plus a Spanish international? Even if you haven't seen either of them play it shouldnt be a tough choice. : )

[/quote]
Bendtner will soon enough be linked to Barca or Real (if that's a benchmark of value). Or Both. You'll see.

[/quote]

Haha, whatever. I was only pointing out why 'we all reckon him to be the better striker of the two'. Surely even you can see why?
[/quote]
I'm glad you're not a scout for Liverpool mate if that's how you make your assessment on players.

[/quote]

What? Where have I said how I make my assessment on players? Bendtner vs Llorente is just such a non contest at the moment 99% of people would be happy to choose Llorente by seeing their stats alone.
 
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207431#msg1207431 date=1288273846]
[quote author=Akakabooto link=topic=42443.msg1207334#msg1207334 date=1288267545]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207307#msg1207307 date=1288264088]
[quote author=Akakabooto link=topic=42443.msg1207285#msg1207285 date=1288260513]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207280#msg1207280 date=1288259814]
I'm biased and I follow certain footballers with great interest for several good reasons.

Anyways to be honest I haven't seen that much of Llorente but why do you all reckon him to be the better striker of the two?
[/quote]

Rotation player from Arsenal vs. one of La Ligas in form players(linked to both Barca and Real) plus a Spanish international? Even if you haven't seen either of them play it shouldnt be a tough choice. : )

[/quote]
Bendtner will soon enough be linked to Barca or Real (if that's a benchmark of value). Or Both. You'll see.

[/quote]

Haha, whatever. I was only pointing out why 'we all reckon him to be the better striker of the two'. Surely even you can see why?
[/quote]
I'm glad you're not a scout for Liverpool mate if that's how you make your assessment on players.

[/quote]

This is a losing battle,Kris.

I'm surprised you're contesting it.

If there was a poll here between choosing either Bendtner or Llorent, I can guess that Bendtner would get just one vote.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=42443.msg1206467#msg1206467 date=1288126665]
Luis Suarez (20m) ST
Van Der Vaart (20m) CF/AM
Bastian Schweinsteiger (30m) LW



[/quote]

You´d like to play Schweinsteiger as LW when he now has found his best position?
 
Striker: Suarez
No 10: Sanchez (from Udinese) but a not-crazy Cassano would have been my first choice.
LW: Granero (Real Madrid)
 
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207317#msg1207317 date=1288265261]
We've been linked to Mario Gomez yet again.

Bayern wants Dzeko and that'll free him for his duties.

I actually wouldn't mind that bet. Not at £20M but say for half of that - he could turn out to be a good option.

Big and strong and at least once back in his Stuttgart days he knew how to find the net on a regular basis.
[/quote]

Where do you have this one from?
 
[quote author=keniget link=topic=42443.msg1207477#msg1207477 date=1288277294]
Granero as a LW?

Why?
[/quote]

I have a soft spot for Granero and he can play as lw, cm, am and rw.
 
Yeah I know, but he's probably best suited to some sort of more traditional midfield role rather than someone who the team looks to for genuine attacking intent. I just thought it odd that out of all the attacking players out there you'd pick a utility midfielder.
 
Right, so instead of twiddling my thumbs in the office, I tried to imagine how the stattos in NESV would look at stats for a striker. There's no getting away from the goals per game ratio, I thought.

Young David Ngog has had an (less than) average start to his career with us: 18 goals in 69 games, or 0.26 goals per game. But his premier league record, ignoring the fact that he’s brought on mostly as a substitute is appalling: 8 in 43, or 0.18.

Surely it doesn’t take much to better that? So I had a look at some strikers in the same league and their stats for their present clubs in the PL only. The usual caveats apply.

Bendtner has been touted by the usual suspect, so how does his record fare? 21 goals in 83 games, or 0.253.

Andy Carroll – 8 goals in 37 games, or 0.258.

Kenwyne Jones – 26 in 94 games, or 0.276.

Pavlychenko – 13 in 52, or 0.25.

Jermaine Defoe – 64 in 181, or 0.353.

Yak – 24 in 67, or 0.358.

John Carew – 37 in 102, 0.36.

Darren Bent – 29 in 47, or 0.617.

Interestingly, in recent memory, the minimum standards we expected of our strikers before shipping them out, were Robbie Keane – 5 in 19 for us, or 0.263. Peter Crouch had 22 in 85 (0.258).
 
Good thread.
Just shows you how overvalued current players are. The 1987 players were more or less the best in their respective positions at that time and cost approx 3.6M between them. That must be about 13M today. You’d get fuck all for that.
To me, taking into account player profile and the likely impact of the transfers, a similar signing spree would be something like Bale, Bent & Rooney which would likely cost over 120 million. 9/10 times what the 1987 players cost us; who were much better than those anyway.
 
i don't know where you're getting the £13m figure from, but it's way off. £1.9m was the british transfer record back then, so given that it's over £30m now i'd say there's been roughly a 15 factor increase in prices since. that'd make the £3.6m more like £55m today.

that'd still buy a lot today, although i'm sure the budgets of man city and real madrid have distorted the top end of the market in the last couple of years - without them the likes of rooney and torres would be valued at £40m tops, imo.
 
[quote author=i_rushie link=topic=42443.msg1207596#msg1207596 date=1288312330]
Right, so instead of twiddling my thumbs in the office, I tried to imagine how the stattos in NESV would look at stats for a striker. There's no getting away from the goals per game ratio, I thought.

Young David Ngog has had an (less than) average start to his career with us: 18 goals in 69 games, or 0.26 goals per game. But his premier league record, ignoring the fact that he’s brought on mostly as a substitute is appalling: 8 in 43, or 0.18.

Surely it doesn’t take much to better that? So I had a look at some strikers in the same league and their stats for their present clubs in the PL only. The usual caveats apply.

Bendtner has been touted by the usual suspect, so how does his record fare? 21 goals in 83 games, or 0.253.

Andy Carroll – 8 goals in 37 games, or 0.258.

Kenwyne Jones – 26 in 94 games, or 0.276.

Pavlychenko – 13 in 52, or 0.25.

Jermaine Defoe – 64 in 181, or 0.353.

Yak – 24 in 67, or 0.358.

John Carew – 37 in 102, 0.36.

Darren Bent – 29 in 47, or 0.617.

Interestingly, in recent memory, the minimum standards we expected of our strikers before shipping them out, were Robbie Keane – 5 in 19 for us, or 0.263. Peter Crouch had 22 in 85 (0.258).
[/quote]

Bent is awesome.
 
[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=42443.msg1207604#msg1207604 date=1288320901]

As I said, current players are way, way overvalued. 3.6M from 1987 is less than 13M today in real terms.


[/quote]

But you can't do a simple black and white comparison mate.

Football of 1987 isn't the fucking booming industry that it is today.
 
[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=42443.msg1207604#msg1207604 date=1288320901]

As I said, current players are way, way overvalued. 3.6M from 1987 is less than 13M today in real terms.


[/quote]

In 1987 there was no Bosman rule.
 
[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=42443.msg1207604#msg1207604 date=1288320901]

As I said, current players are way, way overvalued. 3.6M from 1987 is less than 13M today in real terms.


[/quote]

no it's not: in real terms it's something around £55m, as i posted above. you can't apply general RPI to football because clubs' revenues have grown at levels way above - way, way, above - the rest of the economy.
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=42443.msg1207614#msg1207614 date=1288325144]
[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=42443.msg1207604#msg1207604 date=1288320901]

As I said, current players are way, way overvalued. 3.6M from 1987 is less than 13M today in real terms.


[/quote]

But you can't do a simple black and white comparison mate.

Football of 1987 isn't the fucking booming industry that it is today.
[/quote]


Trufax, Emlyn Hughes was the top earning player in 1980 and he was on £390 per week which was 5 times the national average! I would guess Kolo Toure (bizarrely) is the top earner currently, I think he's on £220,000 which is about 500 times the average weekly wage in the country.
 
Bent would be a good signing. High goals per game ratio is a good indicator...maybe the stattos are on to something.

But I hope they realise that our greatest ever player had a ratio of about 1 in 3. Id be interested to see what Rushies goal to game ratio was in his 1st spell at the club, at least 1 in 2 id expect.
 
[quote author=KHL link=topic=42443.msg1207249#msg1207249 date=1288256690]
[quote author=Whitey85 link=topic=42443.msg1207246#msg1207246 date=1288256556]
Yet another little fantasy transfer thread ruined by talk of Bendtner. Arsenal fans don't even fucking like him.
[/quote]
Arsenal fans love him to bits. At least the clever ones.

Anyways back to Carroll and Llorente then.
[/quote]

This is utter, utter bollocks. Maybe you mean "clever Arsenal fans from Copenhagen"?

I'm surrounded by Arsenal fans, and not a single one of them "love" him, even the clever ones. He is seen as one dimensional, arrogant, and not having delivered anything meaningful for someone who gobs off so much. He is very much a backup player behind RVP.
 
That's an excellent point, and just shows how these figures can be misleading.

Rushie didnt start that great, but was playing well enough to consider himself worthy of a raise.

Paisley told him he wasnt worth a raise since he was there to get goals and he wasn getting enough to justify a raise.

Also told him he had to be more selfish in front of goal to be worth anything to the club.

That lit a fire under his arse and the rest was history.

So much of a footballer's quality is in physical and mental strength, and in determination and will.

These numbers can't show that.
 
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