does gerrard now deserve that title?
Greatest Liverpool player ever
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Its possible but not just yet. He's done great things for a very average Liverpool team but his performances have fallen off in the last season or 2 as a consequences of injury or lack of drive. Hasn't been at his best and that is the Gerrard that we need in an improved team to lead us to Premiership glory.
Good summary.
My nomination remains the King. Some folk say "he had a great team around him" whereas Stevie hasn't, and that's true, but for me the fact that the King stood out even in that kind of company shows how magnificent he really was.
My nomination remains the King. Some folk say "he had a great team around him" whereas Stevie hasn't, and that's true, but for me the fact that the King stood out even in that kind of company shows how magnificent he really was.
[quote author=RolandG link=topic=46291.msg1372526#msg1372526 date=1312107400]
Its possible but not just yet. He's done great things for a very average Liverpool team but his performances have fallen off in the last season or 2 as a consequences of injury or lack of drive. Hasn't been at his best and that is the Gerrard that we need in an improved team to lead us to Premiership glory.
[/quote]
if your answer is not yet then it may as well be never because I think injuries will mean he will never be the force of nature he once was.
Its possible but not just yet. He's done great things for a very average Liverpool team but his performances have fallen off in the last season or 2 as a consequences of injury or lack of drive. Hasn't been at his best and that is the Gerrard that we need in an improved team to lead us to Premiership glory.
[/quote]
if your answer is not yet then it may as well be never because I think injuries will mean he will never be the force of nature he once was.
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=46291.msg1372528#msg1372528 date=1312107607]
Good summary.
My nomination remains the King. Some folk say "he had a great team around him" whereas Stevie hasn't, and that's true, but for me the fact that the King stood out even in that kind of company shows how magnificent he really was.
[/quote]
pretty much the same as pelé when people say he was in a brilliant team.
Good summary.
My nomination remains the King. Some folk say "he had a great team around him" whereas Stevie hasn't, and that's true, but for me the fact that the King stood out even in that kind of company shows how magnificent he really was.
[/quote]
pretty much the same as pelé when people say he was in a brilliant team.
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46291.msg1372532#msg1372532 date=1312107886]
[quote author=RolandG link=topic=46291.msg1372526#msg1372526 date=1312107400]
Its possible but not just yet. He's done great things for a very average Liverpool team but his performances have fallen off in the last season or 2 as a consequences of injury or lack of drive. Hasn't been at his best and that is the Gerrard that we need in an improved team to lead us to Premiership glory.
[/quote]
if your answer is not yet then it may as well be never because I think injuries will mean he will never be the force of nature he once was.
[/quote]
You may well be right, but there was a time at the start of the guy's career when similar fears were being expressed, so I'm reserving judgment for now.
[quote author=RolandG link=topic=46291.msg1372526#msg1372526 date=1312107400]
Its possible but not just yet. He's done great things for a very average Liverpool team but his performances have fallen off in the last season or 2 as a consequences of injury or lack of drive. Hasn't been at his best and that is the Gerrard that we need in an improved team to lead us to Premiership glory.
[/quote]
if your answer is not yet then it may as well be never because I think injuries will mean he will never be the force of nature he once was.
[/quote]
You may well be right, but there was a time at the start of the guy's career when similar fears were being expressed, so I'm reserving judgment for now.
Nothing has really changed since this was last asked except his time on the sidelines has increased and the memory of Gerrard at his very best growing all the more distant.
That said, I thought Gerrard was very good at the start of Hodgson's ill-fated tenure. He looked more like his old self again and then he got injured. Shame.
That said, I thought Gerrard was very good at the start of Hodgson's ill-fated tenure. He looked more like his old self again and then he got injured. Shame.
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=46291.msg1372535#msg1372535 date=1312108071]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46291.msg1372532#msg1372532 date=1312107886]
[quote author=RolandG link=topic=46291.msg1372526#msg1372526 date=1312107400]
Its possible but not just yet. He's done great things for a very average Liverpool team but his performances have fallen off in the last season or 2 as a consequences of injury or lack of drive. Hasn't been at his best and that is the Gerrard that we need in an improved team to lead us to Premiership glory.
[/quote]
It would be remiss of anyone to write off Gerrard just yet. His injury isn't quite as career thretening as a knee injury and I believe that he'll be back with a bang. So until he calls time on his career, let's give him the opportunity and reserve judgement.
if your answer is not yet then it may as well be never because I think injuries will mean he will never be the force of nature he once was.
[/quote]
You may well be right, but there was a time at the start of the guy's career when similar fears were being expressed, so I'm reserving judgment for now.
[/quote]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=46291.msg1372532#msg1372532 date=1312107886]
[quote author=RolandG link=topic=46291.msg1372526#msg1372526 date=1312107400]
Its possible but not just yet. He's done great things for a very average Liverpool team but his performances have fallen off in the last season or 2 as a consequences of injury or lack of drive. Hasn't been at his best and that is the Gerrard that we need in an improved team to lead us to Premiership glory.
[/quote]
It would be remiss of anyone to write off Gerrard just yet. His injury isn't quite as career thretening as a knee injury and I believe that he'll be back with a bang. So until he calls time on his career, let's give him the opportunity and reserve judgement.
if your answer is not yet then it may as well be never because I think injuries will mean he will never be the force of nature he once was.
[/quote]
You may well be right, but there was a time at the start of the guy's career when similar fears were being expressed, so I'm reserving judgment for now.
[/quote]
[quote author=Dylan link=topic=46291.msg1372585#msg1372585 date=1312114227]
No. He'd be in the greatest xi, but he's not top dog. It will take someone incredibly special to knock the King off the top.
[/quote]
This.
No. He'd be in the greatest xi, but he's not top dog. It will take someone incredibly special to knock the King off the top.
[/quote]
This.
[quote author=Modo link=topic=46291.msg1372589#msg1372589 date=1312114487]
Not better than Barnes.
[/quote]
Yes he is.
Not better than Barnes.
[/quote]
Yes he is.
[quote author=Modo link=topic=46291.msg1372614#msg1372614 date=1312120096]
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=46291.msg1372595#msg1372595 date=1312115234]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=46291.msg1372589#msg1372589 date=1312114487]
Not better than Barnes.
[/quote]
Yes he is.
[/quote]
No he's not.
[/quote]
I'm afraid Gerrard has been doing great things for Liverpool for many, many season's. John Barnes although a magnificent player played some great football in the last couple of title wins. However as the team and managers went downhill so did Barnesy, although injuries played a part.
I loved Digger, but his imprint on LFC will be lesser than Gerrards when people look back in the future - and that is not to denigrate Digger's career.
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=46291.msg1372595#msg1372595 date=1312115234]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=46291.msg1372589#msg1372589 date=1312114487]
Not better than Barnes.
[/quote]
Yes he is.
[/quote]
No he's not.
[/quote]
I'm afraid Gerrard has been doing great things for Liverpool for many, many season's. John Barnes although a magnificent player played some great football in the last couple of title wins. However as the team and managers went downhill so did Barnesy, although injuries played a part.
I loved Digger, but his imprint on LFC will be lesser than Gerrards when people look back in the future - and that is not to denigrate Digger's career.
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=46291.msg1372616#msg1372616 date=1312120333]
I'm afraid Gerrard has been doing great things for Liverpool for many, many season's. John Barnes although a magnificent player played some great football in the last couple of title wins. However as the team and managers went downhill so did Barnesy, although injuries played a part.
I loved Digger, but his imprint on LFC will be lesser than Gerrards when people look back in the future - and that is not to denigrate Digger's career.
[/quote]
It's because the younger generation haven't seen Barnes play.
Two player in Liverpool history have won the FWA Footballer of the Year twice.
Can you guess who? A hint, one is the best player we've had and the other is the 2nd best player we've ever had.
I'm afraid Gerrard has been doing great things for Liverpool for many, many season's. John Barnes although a magnificent player played some great football in the last couple of title wins. However as the team and managers went downhill so did Barnesy, although injuries played a part.
I loved Digger, but his imprint on LFC will be lesser than Gerrards when people look back in the future - and that is not to denigrate Digger's career.
[/quote]
It's because the younger generation haven't seen Barnes play.
Two player in Liverpool history have won the FWA Footballer of the Year twice.
Can you guess who? A hint, one is the best player we've had and the other is the 2nd best player we've ever had.
What Themn said.
[quote author=Modo link=topic=46291.msg1372618#msg1372618 date=1312120623]
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=46291.msg1372616#msg1372616 date=1312120333]
I'm afraid Gerrard has been doing great things for Liverpool for many, many season's. John Barnes although a magnificent player played some great football in the last couple of title wins. However as the team and managers went downhill so did Barnesy, although injuries played a part.
I loved Digger, but his imprint on LFC will be lesser than Gerrards when people look back in the future - and that is not to denigrate Digger's career.
[/quote]
It's because the younger generation haven't seen Barnes play.
Two player in Liverpool history have won the FWA Footballer of the Year twice.
Can you guess who? A hint, one is the best player we've had and the other is the 2nd best player we've ever had.
[/quote]
You fucking sanctimonious bellend. Don't try and preach LFC history to me.
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=46291.msg1372616#msg1372616 date=1312120333]
I'm afraid Gerrard has been doing great things for Liverpool for many, many season's. John Barnes although a magnificent player played some great football in the last couple of title wins. However as the team and managers went downhill so did Barnesy, although injuries played a part.
I loved Digger, but his imprint on LFC will be lesser than Gerrards when people look back in the future - and that is not to denigrate Digger's career.
[/quote]
It's because the younger generation haven't seen Barnes play.
Two player in Liverpool history have won the FWA Footballer of the Year twice.
Can you guess who? A hint, one is the best player we've had and the other is the 2nd best player we've ever had.
[/quote]
You fucking sanctimonious bellend. Don't try and preach LFC history to me.
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=46291.msg1372629#msg1372629 date=1312123700]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=46291.msg1372618#msg1372618 date=1312120623]
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=46291.msg1372616#msg1372616 date=1312120333]
I'm afraid Gerrard has been doing great things for Liverpool for many, many season's. John Barnes although a magnificent player played some great football in the last couple of title wins. However as the team and managers went downhill so did Barnesy, although injuries played a part.
I loved Digger, but his imprint on LFC will be lesser than Gerrards when people look back in the future - and that is not to denigrate Digger's career.
[/quote]
It's because the younger generation haven't seen Barnes play.
Two player in Liverpool history have won the FWA Footballer of the Year twice.
Can you guess who? A hint, one is the best player we've had and the other is the 2nd best player we've ever had.
[/quote]
You fucking sanctimonious bellend. Don't try and preach LFC history to me.
[/quote]
Somehow I always tend to push the right buttons.
Spionkop69 - Allergic to history lessons. *check*
Btw, nothing's gonna get me to admit that Gerrard is better than Barnes. I'm sorry, but Barnes helped us win two league titles. He's the only midfielder along with Gerrard that has scored over 100 goals for Liverpool.
He scored 75 goals in all competitions in his first 4 seasons for Liverpool.
If it hadn't been for Liverpool being banned from European football, it would have definitely meant more.
Barnes was the better footballer and IMO was the better player for Liverpool.
I have a challenge for Gerrard, win us the title, and I'll review this comparison again.
[quote author=Modo link=topic=46291.msg1372618#msg1372618 date=1312120623]
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=46291.msg1372616#msg1372616 date=1312120333]
I'm afraid Gerrard has been doing great things for Liverpool for many, many season's. John Barnes although a magnificent player played some great football in the last couple of title wins. However as the team and managers went downhill so did Barnesy, although injuries played a part.
I loved Digger, but his imprint on LFC will be lesser than Gerrards when people look back in the future - and that is not to denigrate Digger's career.
[/quote]
It's because the younger generation haven't seen Barnes play.
Two player in Liverpool history have won the FWA Footballer of the Year twice.
Can you guess who? A hint, one is the best player we've had and the other is the 2nd best player we've ever had.
[/quote]
You fucking sanctimonious bellend. Don't try and preach LFC history to me.
[/quote]
Somehow I always tend to push the right buttons.
Spionkop69 - Allergic to history lessons. *check*
Btw, nothing's gonna get me to admit that Gerrard is better than Barnes. I'm sorry, but Barnes helped us win two league titles. He's the only midfielder along with Gerrard that has scored over 100 goals for Liverpool.
He scored 75 goals in all competitions in his first 4 seasons for Liverpool.
If it hadn't been for Liverpool being banned from European football, it would have definitely meant more.
Barnes was the better footballer and IMO was the better player for Liverpool.
I have a challenge for Gerrard, win us the title, and I'll review this comparison again.
Barnes didn't win us the title though did he?
He had a better manager and better squad around him than gerrard has had. You could argue easily enough gerrard has won us finals on his own or made incredible impacts through his dynamism
You're effectively saying because gerrard hasn't won a title he's worse than digger.
Fat ronaldo was overrated because he didn't win a cl.
He had a better manager and better squad around him than gerrard has had. You could argue easily enough gerrard has won us finals on his own or made incredible impacts through his dynamism
You're effectively saying because gerrard hasn't won a title he's worse than digger.
Fat ronaldo was overrated because he didn't win a cl.
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=46291.msg1372697#msg1372697 date=1312137032]
Barnes didn't win us the title though did he?
He had a better manager and better squad around him than gerrard has had. You could argue easily enough gerrard has won us finals on his own or made incredible impacts through his dynamism
You're effectively saying because gerrard hasn't won a title he's worse than digger.
Fat ronaldo was overrated because he didn't win a cl.
[/quote]
89/90 - last time we won.
Barnes scored 22 goals in the league, remember this is a left winger we're talking about. He scored 28 goals in all competitions.
If he didn't win us the league that year who did?
Football writers player of the year in 1990?
Digger...
Barnes didn't win us the title though did he?
He had a better manager and better squad around him than gerrard has had. You could argue easily enough gerrard has won us finals on his own or made incredible impacts through his dynamism
You're effectively saying because gerrard hasn't won a title he's worse than digger.
Fat ronaldo was overrated because he didn't win a cl.
[/quote]
89/90 - last time we won.
Barnes scored 22 goals in the league, remember this is a left winger we're talking about. He scored 28 goals in all competitions.
If he didn't win us the league that year who did?
Football writers player of the year in 1990?
Digger...
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=46291.msg1372697#msg1372697 date=1312137032]
Barnes didn't win us the title though did he?
[/quote]
that's debateable.
Barnes didn't win us the title though did he?
[/quote]
that's debateable.
1 player doesn't make a team modo. Would Barnes have got that many if he wasn't surrounded by exceptional talent? Rush scored 18 that season, beardo 10 etc. Shall we discount them and their goals because they didn't score as many as barnes?
Gerrard generally gets double figures a season (providing he's fit) from central midfield. He inspires the team and can completely dominate a game in defence and attack. He offers all the attributes of the greatest midfielders to have graced us. Passion, aggression, vision. He is the complete package and will be the best we will see on a red shirt for a long time.
Gerrard generally gets double figures a season (providing he's fit) from central midfield. He inspires the team and can completely dominate a game in defence and attack. He offers all the attributes of the greatest midfielders to have graced us. Passion, aggression, vision. He is the complete package and will be the best we will see on a red shirt for a long time.
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=46291.msg1372717#msg1372717 date=1312140790]
1 player doesn't make a team modo. Would Barnes have got that many if he wasn't surrounded by exceptional talent? Rush scored 18 that season, beardo 10 etc. Shall we discount them and their goals because they didn't score as many as barnes?
Gerrard generally gets double figures a season (providing he's fit) from central midfield. He inspires the team and can completely dominate a game in defence and attack. He offers all the attributes of the greatest midfielders to have graced us. Passion, aggression, vision. He is the complete package and will be the best we will see on a red shirt for a long time.
[/quote]
if you're going to ding points off barnes because he was being surrounded by quality you may as well do the same thing to kenny.
1 player doesn't make a team modo. Would Barnes have got that many if he wasn't surrounded by exceptional talent? Rush scored 18 that season, beardo 10 etc. Shall we discount them and their goals because they didn't score as many as barnes?
Gerrard generally gets double figures a season (providing he's fit) from central midfield. He inspires the team and can completely dominate a game in defence and attack. He offers all the attributes of the greatest midfielders to have graced us. Passion, aggression, vision. He is the complete package and will be the best we will see on a red shirt for a long time.
[/quote]
if you're going to ding points off barnes because he was being surrounded by quality you may as well do the same thing to kenny.
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