Firminio doesn't need to up his goal tally..
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Can see where Klopp is coming from. An improvement in his finishing will bring him to another level.
Firmino got the same number of assists as both Kane and Costa. So the idea he sacrifices goals to create them for others doesn't really work for me when much higher scoring forwards create just as many.
But Firmino runs more! Super. Give him a sticker. Firmino absolutely has to up his totals this year, IMO. There was just too many matches where he didn't even get a shot away.
But Firmino runs more! Super. Give him a sticker. Firmino absolutely has to up his totals this year, IMO. There was just too many matches where he didn't even get a shot away.
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Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but doesn't that stat say he gets a third more assists than anybody else?
Yeah, 50% more than both Kane and Costa. But stats aside, if you can't see what Firmino brings to the table then, quite frankly, you're either tthick, blind or both.
It is a shame, thankfully he brings much much more to the table to make up for it.
We failed time and time again to be clinical against the bottom half last season.
And? Weren't we the same one season when we had Torres?
Hang on that can't be right, only Suarez could improve on Firmino.
And those stats are England only.
My point all along is we need both and I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect it and not just sit there and say we can never get that and Firmino is fine.
I like him and think he's a good footballer with a great work rate but he needs to improve his finishing massively if we are going to win things.
I think the fact everyone would straight swap him for a Studge of 13/14 just shows he can be improved on and this rubbish that there aren't players out there than we can get is lazy.
Anyway it's been done to death, hopefully he catches fire this season and the topic becomes irrelevant
100% agree, the number stat that matters to be first in is fucking goals closely followed by assists.
The rest is nice but nowhere near as important.
Yes, agree it's been done to death.
Can you answer me this, though: Why, if we are scoring enough as a team (which we did last season), is it so important that Firmino scores the goals? If we scored the same number last season but Firmino scored 25 of them, what difference would it have made? Suarez scored 35 goals one season and we didn't win anything. I just don't get the obsession with who is scoring the goals. I really don't. 5 x 10 and 1 x 50 is the same fucking number.
Again, that's not to say we can't improve everywhere, it's just that we need to improve at the other end of the pitch first.
To be fair Firmino's problem isn't technique, it's composure.
I appreciate the workrate, skill and disruption Firmino brings to our game but would appreciate a little more "Fowler" in his striking. I doubt he'll change as the skills are quite different, so the question is, is there someone as good and aggressive in ball winning as Firmino with better scoring stats? [Genuine Q]
If this does exist then I'd imagine they'd cost a fortune since high-pressing, attacking football is not a rarety anymore.
If this does exist then I'd imagine they'd cost a fortune since high-pressing, attacking football is not a rarety anymore.
Dunno about stats but just from watching Sanchez looks like Firmino plus goals.
I'm hoping Firmino is gonna do that thing some players do out of the blue, like Suarez or Drogba and double their return one season to the next. I think he's got the skillz, but despite his work ethic he doesn't seem to have that pathological desire. He's always laughing instead of nutting people or diving like all the world's really best players
I'm hoping Firmino is gonna do that thing some players do out of the blue, like Suarez or Drogba and double their return one season to the next. I think he's got the skillz, but despite his work ethic he doesn't seem to have that pathological desire. He's always laughing instead of nutting people or diving like all the world's really best players
See I don't think we scored enough in so far as we didn't score enough in the games against deep lying defenses or games where chances were at a premium.
A great example was Southampton away. We drew 0-0 and he missed a golden chance I would expect a top striker to bury.
I expect our most central and forward player to be the most clinical and it showed last year in a number of games that we lacked that.
No point scoring 13 goals in 3 games and then losing to a bottom six side and not being able to break them down.
Salah will help but I think we need more from our main striker.
Completely agree.
Oh and I agree our defence is shite but we will always be somewhat exposed to the counter attack due to our high pressing style and bottom half teams looking to sit deep.
The main bulk of the argument is some people believe that scoring 20+ is more important than scoring 10 and assisting 10+
They're not mutually exclusive though. That season we had Suarez scoring stupid amounts, we also had Sturridge scoring stupid amounts and laying on goals. We had sterling scoring decent amounts, as well as the midfield
I rate firmino and I'm happy as the main striker, mainly because I can't think of another target who offers enough help for the whole team. To say he doesn't need to score more goals though is fucking daft. He should be scoring comfortably more goals than mane and Coutinho primarily because of the position he finds himself in (edge of box, 6 yard line, drifting in from deep). He's so good at utilising the space, as well as his close control, he SHOULD be in positions to score, rather than taking pot shots.
They're not mutually exclusive though. That season we had Suarez scoring stupid amounts, we also had Sturridge scoring stupid amounts and laying on goals. We had sterling scoring decent amounts, as well as the midfield
I rate firmino and I'm happy as the main striker, mainly because I can't think of another target who offers enough help for the whole team. To say he doesn't need to score more goals though is fucking daft. He should be scoring comfortably more goals than mane and Coutinho primarily because of the position he finds himself in (edge of box, 6 yard line, drifting in from deep). He's so good at utilising the space, as well as his close control, he SHOULD be in positions to score, rather than taking pot shots.
So according to Squawka, Firmino created something like 76 scoring chances last season, which was nearly twice that created by the next highest of Kane, Costa and Aguero. He only ended up with the same number of assists as Kane and Costa though. Do a comparison of stats with other attacking midfielders and you'll find he is most productive in areas most commonly associated with that group of players, notwithstanding his role as a "9".
He was supplying to Mane and Origi last season. This season it's going to be Mane and Salah. It's reasonable to assume that more of the same this season will see more of those chances going to Salah, who already appears to be a superior finisher than Origi, and hopefully result in more goals.
As ever, there is a unique need in this board to qualify any defense of Firmino's qualities with the caveat that he can obviously improve his goal tally.
He was supplying to Mane and Origi last season. This season it's going to be Mane and Salah. It's reasonable to assume that more of the same this season will see more of those chances going to Salah, who already appears to be a superior finisher than Origi, and hopefully result in more goals.
As ever, there is a unique need in this board to qualify any defense of Firmino's qualities with the caveat that he can obviously improve his goal tally.
Coutinho ? I read both he and Firmino had the same goals & assists total last season (all games).
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As someone mentioned mate he was actually second behind Sanchez (who spends more time wide and creating anyway) in that list but you can't ignore this ....
Actually Oliver whilst I agree with the theory, and to be totally pedantic, in actuality we didn't score enough goals (78) last season. Chelsea (85) and Spurs (86) set the benchmark there so we need to find another 8-10 goals at least. I believe that with the addition of Salah, dropping Coutinho into CM, no AFCON and hopefully our top players not spending as much time injured this coming season, we will surpass 85. Fingers crossed.
And therein lies the conundrum. We'd all love a 25+ goals a season striker but finding one with the qualities to fit into our team, a la Firmino, isn't just difficult it's bloody expensive. Otherwise surely some of teams around Europe, more focused on developing young players, would have found them already. We are also at the stage in our development that we really can't take chances on 'unknowns with potential'.
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You certainly can ignore Sprints and distance covered, given that Lukaku is bottom of the league and scored about a zillion goals.
But we were top scorers and top of the league at Christmas!!!!
That counts for something surely?*
*If you're retarded
The issue was our GD, not the amount of goals we scored. Sure, it'd be great to score more goals but it isn't necessary to do so to win things. Sorting out the defence is a necessity, though. We'll win fuck all unless we do that.
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