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Let's talk about Curtis

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peekay said:
He is the best midfielder at the club right now. He is still very young for a midfielder. I hope next season we buy enough midfielders so that we don't have to rely on Jones starting every game. Not because I don't rate Jones. But given his injury troubles, he should be given the time to develop at his own pace.
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Yep this, - the problem we have is that we are always playing with 10 men when we have Henderson in the team for more than 20-30 minutes. The story is Jones-Trent in midfield and the trust they have between them. Jones is better at keeping the ball than any player at our club, and probably - I dare say - the entire league. If we have him in our team, our possession stats will always be higher than any other team - guarantee. Note also I saw a stat earlier today that said that he (Jones) made the most runs into the final third. There is no midfielder in the whole of Europe that can keep the ball better than Jones - so all of you please learn to appreciate the talent we have.
 
momoWASboss said:
Trent won’t be the midfielder everyone is predicting. He will remain the right quarter back so he’s out of the equation.

The main middle trio for next season should be new midfielder 1, new midfielder 2 and Badger. Jones in first or second backup.
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Honestly think that given how happy Trent looks playing football again, there must have been something in his head for the last 7 years where he always thought he would play eventually in midfield, maybe he was expecting it this season and it never happened and that's why his performances were completely lacking in any intensity. I would not put it past our club that they promised him this in some way but never recruited for that position and decided to spend elsewhere, because he was setting a new standard for RB's all over the world in past seasons. How else can anyone explain that look he had on his face when he had to track back etc.
 
I'm glad, for the team's sake, that he seems to be in better headspace these days, but it's not like we should be feeling sorry for Trent for being caged in a position he didn't like, and saddled with the thoroughly unenjoyable task of defending. More than half of his assists in the last 4 games were assists he would have made from his RB position in seasons past.

If anything, it feels like he downed tools for most of the season to make it clear that he didn't want to be playing RB until a compromise position could be found for him.
 
Klopp’s always said the answers tend to be closer to home and rails, sometimes with justification, at the constant clamour to spend and spend, and then spend again. Jones, injuries permitting, has shown in the last few matches he may actually be good enough to start. He’ll have to justify that but Klopp seems satisfied so far.
 
I thought Jones had another good game vs. West Ham. Will he be a starter for us next season? Not if we have designs on winning anything. But I'm coming around to the idea of him being good enough for back up (sub, injuries, cups).

If we received a very good offer for him though I'd sell in a heartbeat.
 
Red Bird said:
Klopp’s always said the answers tend to be closer to home and rails, sometimes with justification, at the constant clamour to spend and spend, and then spend again. Jones, injuries permitting, has shown in the last few matches he may actually be good enough to start. He’ll have to justify that but Klopp seems satisfied so far.
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Our midfield targets are Onana, Gueye, and Doucore?
 
Frogfish said:
I thought Jones had another good game vs. West Ham. Will he be a starter for us next season? Not if we have designs on winning anything. But I'm coming around to the idea of him being good enough for back up (sub, injuries, cups).

If we received a very good offer for him though I'd sell in a heartbeat.
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you do have to remember the home grown rule. English players come at a premium and we will be losing at least a couple in summer.
 
What am I missing for someone to call him a Generational Talent? I think his performance was decent but for people to call him our best MF just tells you far the likes of Fab and Hendo have fallen.
When you're passing 5 yards, your pass accuracy will stay high
 
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You’re missing that we have won three matches on the trot. Those victories are real but the term “generational talent” is nothing but media nonsense.
 
bluebell said:
You don't think that has more to do with Trent?
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It has to do with many not just one— Jota’s scoring, Alexander Arnold’s being narrower and more advanced and Jones’s looking after the ball better than the Fabinho and Henderson.
 
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tombrown said:
Trent has spent most of the season being the scapegoat & the main reason we weren't doing it well, now he is the sole cause for our revival .. I bet he craves a place in the middle
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Switching him to MF has changed our tempo. Now if Fab could pick up his game, then we really would far less leaky at the bavk
 
tombrown said:
Trent has spent most of the season being the scapegoat & the main reason we weren't doing it well, now he is the sole cause for our revival .. I bet he craves a place in the middle
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CJ is much improved but he is an average MF. He just looks great because Hendo and Fabs are so awful at the moment
 
moron said:
Yep this, - the problem we have is that we are always playing with 10 men when we have Henderson in the team for more than 20-30 minutes. The story is Jones-Trent in midfield and the trust they have between them. Jones is better at keeping the ball than any player at our club, and probably - I dare say - the entire league. If we have him in our team, our possession stats will always be higher than any other team - guarantee. Note also I saw a stat earlier today that said that he (Jones) made the most runs into the final third. There is no midfielder in the whole of Europe that can keep the ball better than Jones - so all of you please learn to appreciate the talent we have.
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I like how your assessment of Jones’s ball-keeping abilities keeps escalating throughout the post :) A few more sentences and he would be upgraded to an intergalactic football deity and Scouse reincarnation of Maradona.
 
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momoWASboss said:
If we want to win leagues, Curtis Jones isn’t one you turn to start the majority of games. Is he our second best midfielder this season? Yes. But would you start him ahead of Badger? I wouldn’t. The likely inbound midfielders will be higher quality which pushes him further down the pecking order.

I dunno what I’m saying (for a change). Would I keep him ahead of Milner and Hendo? Deffo. Is he the messiah? Nah.
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I think every player in a world-class team needs to be a match-winner - they can perform a functional role most of the time, but they need to truly shine and carry the team through a difficult patch at least a few times every season to warrant their place.

So far Jones proved he can perform a functional role next to Trent Alexander-Arnold; his qualities complement Trent well and for now our new system is in its “honeymoon period,” so to speak, when the opponents didn’t have time to develop effective countermeasures just yet. Harder tests are coming and when teams learn how to negate Trent to some extent, it will be up to the likes of Curtis (or whoever is playing at LCM or RCM) to provide that extra match-winning spark - just doing a functional role won’t be enough. That’s the next level he should be aspiring to.
 
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rurikbird said:
I like how your assessment of Jones’s ball-keeping abilities keeps escalating throughout the post :) A few more sentences and he would be upgraded to an intergalactic football deity and reincarnation of Maradona.
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Even Curtis Jones's mum wouldn't praise CJ like Moron does.
 
bluebell said:
What am I missing for someone to call him a Generational Talent? I think his performance was decent but for people to call him our best MF just tells you far the likes of Fab and Hendo have fallen.
When you're passing 5 yards, your pass accuracy will stay high
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Considering Klopp has said those 5 yard passes are exactly what he instructed us to do then I’m ok with it. Couple that with the fact for most of the season we couldn’t string 5 passes together it’s a welcome development!
 
rurikbird said:
I think every player in a world-class team needs to be a match-winner - they can perform a functional role most of the time, but they need to truly shine and carry the team through a difficult patch at least a few times every season to warrant their place.

So far Jones proved he can perform a functional role next to Trent Alexander-Arnold; his qualities complement Trent well and for now our new system is in its “honeymoon period,” so to speak, when the opponents didn’t have time to develop effective countermeasures just yet. Harder tests are coming and when teams learn how to negate Trent to some extent, it will be up to the likes of Curtis (or whoever is playing at LCM or RCM) to provide that extra match-winning spark - just doing a functional role won’t be enough. That’s the next level he should be aspiring to.
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You mean like he did against Everton?
 
Dreambeliever said:
You mean like he did against Everton?
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Yes, exactly like that - this has been the only match-winning moment in his LFC career so far that I can remember and for a while every time he got the ball in a similar position you could see he’s still thinking about that goal. It’s time to create new moments like this if he is to justify his presence in next season’s midfield.
 
bluebell said:
CJ is much improved but he is an average MF. He just looks great because Hendo and Fabs are so awful at the moment
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That's obviously bollocks. Curtis keeps the ball well, moves the ball well, increases the tempo of the midfield and is always on the front foot. You know, Lucas got 350 games here without doing as much. Gavi and his mate at Barca are obvs good players but there's not a great deal of difference other than they have a better MF with them. Since Curtis has had a run in the team, he's been our best MF by far. I don't want to make him sound like Lothar Matthaus because his isn't, his end product is lacking. But, he's a good player, certainly good enough for us at the moment.
 
Red Bird said:
You’re missing that we have won three matches on the trot. Those victories are real but the term “generational talent” is nothing but media nonsense.
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@bluebell - it's unfair to blame any of the media calling Jones a 'Generational Talent', as I used that phrase here and that is my opinion alone at this point in time. But I love the kid, he has bags of confidence in himself and believes he should be always starting regardless of how good the other players around him might be perceived to be. For record I want new signings because I don't believe that Jones will stay fit long enough in any one season where we can fully rely on him. But there are very few midfielders in world football that can keep the ball as well as him. He's better at it than anyone in our team (yes even dodgy Thiago). For those that argue about the bar not being that high to be good in our midfield - ask yourself these questions:

1) Was Fabinho ever fast ? he's been as slow as he has always been, but more exposed this season due to his mates also being shit.
2) Was Hendo ever press resistant ? did he ever play long enough for us to suggest that he is a progressive baller ?
3) Thiago was never a runner until he joined us, and we have done a great job to reduce the usage of his good qualities. Against low block teams, its pretty pointless having a deep lying creative midfielder.

The only other midfielder I trust in our team at this moment is actually Milner, who I think is very under-rated. I am still amazed how he contained the likes of Phil Foden in our home game against City earlier this season.

The big change this season is very simple - our midfield is being engaged by opposition midfielders for the first time - probably because a lot of the foreign managers have finally realized like many of us that our midfielders are just workmen/recycling the ball, with very little ball skills , and this kind of made it even more obvious when Gini left us. This was always going to happen at some stage - its happened so much this season because as well as being pretty skill-less they no longer have the legs to run.
 
I was watching Redmen TV's assessment on CJ. They were obviously applauding him whilst going through his stats where he makes a lot of side passes like David Batty. Anyoone remember that crab?
CJ is doing a good job at the moment. I mean Naby had good games too, however, none of us want Naby anymore.
What I fear is the board and Klopp thinking CJ solves a problem and we end up not getting a player we need
 
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Yeah that sounds likely. At the next board meeting they're going to say, happy with seventh yeah? We've been a bit better since the injury prone kid replaced the other injury prone kid, so we're ok till 2025? All in favour? Unanimous. Motion passed. Next item, should we not order any gin for the lounges just to do we everyone's head in? All in favour?
 
rurikbird said:
Yes, exactly like that - this has been the only match-winning moment in his LFC career so far that I can remember and for a while every time he got the ball in a similar position you could see he’s still thinking about that goal. It’s time to create new moments like this if he is to justify his presence in next season’s midfield.
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Bar one obvious game, I don't recall Gini ever being a match winner, yet he was key to our success
 
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