The Suarez/Evra Racism Row

[Judge Jules]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=vantage link=topic=48021.msg1451147#msg1451147 date=1325088387]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=48021.msg1451126#msg1451126 date=1325086013]
I think that Dantes response to that article was spot on.

If you start an argument in Spanish using a Spanish insult when the person you say that to responds in Spanish using normal Spanish terms to address you then getting offended by that term because in the country you are currently standing in it sounds like a word that may cause offence is fucking ridiculous & beyond taking the piss. When you factor the fact his collegues call him that term & it is used by seemingly all Spanish & south American footballers towards black players is descends into farce.
[/quote]

I'm with you on this one. It seems a shame that it has polarised the board so much and that a fair few of us are being made to feel like racists.......
[/quote]

Speak for yourself on that last bit, mate. The way that side of the debate has had to resort to childish sarcasm makes me more sure of my ground than ever.

 

[Judge Jules]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=monsieurdantes link=topic=48021.msg1451150#msg1451150 date=1325088834]
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=48021.msg1451131#msg1451131 date=1325086705]
I think Tony Evans is spot on, the club should apologise immediately, Suarez too, and move on. It is making us look ridiculous at best and accepting of racism at worst.

He did it, he's admitted as much and in doing so he gave that complete cunt of a manc the opportunity to screw us..... well done....

Us showing solidarity with him is one thing, us moaning about the FA witchhunt or the press or whatever... who gives a fuck.

We should man up a bit and do the right thing, apologise and move on. The mewling and bitching of the club and the fans is almost as embarrassing as the stupidity involved in the whole affair.

IMO it is the only right thing to do because it IS the right thing to do.
[/quote]

It really isn't the right thing to do at all. When the rules are wrong or being unjustly applied, then the right thing is to do something about it. Through history, it's the people who didn't shut up, apologize and move on that have been the the most important and the most respected.
[/quote]

x 2

 

[mark1975]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Dantes is bang on. The.FA have made an example of us, over a clouded arguement lost in translation and interpreted by a corrupt & confused organisation. Molby's post has really got me fucking seething.

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Portly link=topic=48021.msg1451160#msg1451160 date=1325090242]
It's going to take the FA committee a few weeks to publish the evidence against Suarez so until we know officially what it is, it would be wrong to jump to conclusions.

Along with many others, I suspect that when it appears, this evidence is going to be insubstantial particularly bearing in mind Evra's volatile personality and his past history of accusations.

I'm certainly not going to insist that Suarez is guilty and should take his punishment, just to prove I am more anti-racist than everybody else.
[/quote]

It will be insubstantial alright. Read carefully what they will be releasing.... it's not evidence, it's not a dossier of different statements and testimony, or a considerations of the case. It's nothing. It's just this very simple (a) (b) and (c)...

The Independent Regulatory Commission will provide written reasons for its decision in due course setting out:

(a) the findings of fact made by it; their finding of fact is what Suarez told them, that he said negro/negrito, Evra's offense to being called that, and that the referee noted an argument between them during the game....nothing gets past the FA they conducted an awesome investigation to find these facts. yeah hats off to them, to their persitence, their perseverence, their investigative nous, its all remarkable, what amazing facts. WHAT AMAZING FACTS!!! give them a a round of applause. a big fucking round of applause.

(b) the reasons for its decision finding the charge proved; and it was proved from the outset, because of the wording of the rules they applied, so the reason is along the lines of duhhhh we read these words in english, we then read these other words in english, and duhhh uhhh they match up. Oh what a surprise who would have thought it? Can you believe it? I can't? Well done the FA, for proving such a complicated case. another round of applause

(c) the reasons for the penalty. this will be written in the rules, where it has a 4 game ban, and then the reference to colour doubles that to 8 games, and because Suarez pleaded not guilty that is why they opted for the maximum allowable under the rules

 

[Jack D Rips]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1451104#msg1451104 date=1325084657]
[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=48021.msg1451103#msg1451103 date=1325084607]
Tony Evans might be a joke or get lots wrong, I dunno, I can't say I know much about him, but I don't think he's got much wrong in that article.
[/quote]

His big mistake was adopting the common sense position on the debate.
[/quote]

Yes it really was common sense starting an article about an argument in Spanish thus: "I don’t know much about South American culture and slang"

 

[Judge Jules]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Absolutely. For "common sense" read "I can't be bothered with all that 'different culture' nonsense, and besides I don't want other people to think I might be a wacist."

 

[Spionkop69]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1450716#msg1450716 date=1324578049]
Right the much cleverer than me merry band are out in force, so I won't bother to reply to you all individually.

Here's the the important evidence:
Evra accuses Suarez of calling him a negro, Suarez admits to saying it.

The FA Panel has to decide whether to find Luis guilty or not, knowing that the media spotlight is on them. Knowing full well their decision is setting a high profile precedent that will be followed in future.

You expect them to deem it okay for Suarez to call Evra a negro, on the basis that either:

a) it's not offensive where he comes from
b) it was said in Spanish, not English
c) it was said in a friendly manner

If the FA Panel follows that line of argument, think of the precedent that sets:

If you're playing football in England you can call a black man a negro so long as you either:

a) Say Negro in Spanish, not English
b) claim where you grew up it's not offensive
c) claim to have said it in a friendly manner.

Now given the FA are committed to trying to eradicate racism and not encourage it, which decision is more likely to achieve that? Do you send out a message that you won't tolerate people being called negro, or say you can call people negro so long as you use one of our convenient list of excuses to get yourself off ?

They were never going to say: "you can use Negro in certain circumstances" - It's much easier and much more preferable to not allow it all. Do you really want genuinely racist cunts having an easy way out like that ?

And lastly some of the people posting in defence of using negro because it's in Spanish should go back and read some old threads, particularly re Fabregas , Aragones or even fucking Paddy and see how much your own opinion now a Liverpool player is involved is at variance with what you said back then.

Actually fuck it, I'll post some of them:

LTW on Cesc's comment (where he used negro) to Kanoute (in Spanish and in Spain):

I think IF Cesc said those things, it's disgraceful AND wrong

Doc Mac on a thread regarding themn taking issue with Ryan calling Thierry Henry fat lipped:

If Themn took offence then it is reason enough. A focus on racial characteristics in an otherwise humourous rant is unacceptable. I take Mamma Mia's posts with the respect they deserve as someone who has been on the rough end of discriminatory behaviour, but it was still inappropriate. I like Ryan a lot, and think he is one of the best posters in this site, but he needs to wise the bap with comments which are likely to cause offence. His comments are accretive in their ability to cause offence. If somebody without form for racial slurs on black people had posted this I'm sure Themn would have been less sensitive. In this case I completely understand.

Vantage's comments on the same thread:

MM, I'm not the most politically correct person on here, yet even I would agree that comments like that can be taken as having racist feelings.

Did Ryan mean it? I doubt it. Is Themn right in taking offence? Of course. If he wants to, which he clearly does.

Spionkop in the same thread:

Does that mean its not racist or that its water off a duck's back to you?

Using "fat lipped" towards somebody black is generally considered a racial slur in this country.

I'm not posting any further on the topic.
[/quote]

What the fuck are dragging me into this mess for?

 

[LadyRed]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

My favourite bit of the article was about how many Liverpool supporters are suddenly Spanish linguist experts. Rang true

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=48021.msg1451191#msg1451191 date=1325093251]
My favourite bit of the article was about how many Liverpool supporters are suddenly Spanish linguist experts. Rang true
[/quote]

I think that's a tad bit insulting ... I asked as many South Americans as I knew (around 10-20) and there was no real change in the answer (and most were women, so they - as far as I know - had no idea why I was asking the question) ... I'd assume most have asked, or read up on it, because it involves our player. As Ross's example with me proved earlier, when the term involved Fabregas - I didn't bother looking into the word etc ...

 

[mark1975]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=48021.msg1451191#msg1451191 date=1325093251]
My favourite bit of the article was about how many Liverpool supporters are suddenly Spanish linguist experts. Rang true
[/quote]

It works both ways that Anita, enough posters on here have been quick enough to make a conclusive decision that it was a racist comment even though it's been obvious from the outset that there's a cultural issue going on here and clarity isn't that easy to come by. No one has acted the expert, I think most are annoyed that from the outset, from the minute Fergie held Evra's hand to the referees office, there was only going to be one result.

As for Molby saying we should apologise. Shall we apologise for Evra calling Suarez a 'little South American'? An incident that seems to have fallen on deaf ears.

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=48021.msg1451191#msg1451191 date=1325093251]
My favourite bit of the article was about how many Liverpool supporters are suddenly Spanish linguist experts. Rang true
[/quote]

Learning all of the definitions of a single word is not difficult. And you can do so within the space of a minute, so yeah it is quite "sudden". Shocking isn't it. How people are capable of learning things.

 

[Molbystwin]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=vantage link=topic=48021.msg1451147#msg1451147 date=1325088387]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=48021.msg1451126#msg1451126 date=1325086013]
I think that Dantes response to that article was spot on.

If you start an argument in Spanish using a Spanish insult when the person you say that to responds in Spanish using normal Spanish terms to address you then getting offended by that term because in the country you are currently standing in it sounds like a word that may cause offence is fucking ridiculous & beyond taking the piss. When you factor the fact his collegues call him that term & it is used by seemingly all Spanish & south American footballers towards black players is descends into farce.
[/quote]

I'm with you on this one. It seems a shame that it has polarised the board so much and that a fair few of us are being made to feel like racists.......
[/quote]

I'm not accusing anyone of being racist at all, I'm sincerely sorry if you read what I wrote as an accusation, it was not my intention.

I do not however agree as to the strength of the linguistic/cultural defence and I also feel that it is part of our duty as a club is to help in stamping out racism in the game and that the wider perception/reputation of the club will suffer, indeed is suffering, by virtue of this ridiculous incident and the uneccesary hoo-haa aaround it.

In short i do not see what is to be gained from taking the position we have as a club, it won't change anything in the eyes of the FA nor the public and it is highly embarrassing. It may be that when published the findings exonerate Suarez is some eyes to a certain extent, but I'm not going to jump to his defence just solely because he is our player and/or didnt "feel" he was being racist linguistically. If Evra was offended or not is almost irrelevent referring to someones race in order to wind them up during a match is just daft and in my eyes at least worthy of punishment. As for it being 8 games and Suarez clearly being thrown onto a big political bonfire well.... that doesnt change the fact that he did it. Regardless of whether Evra or Man U or the FA or the press are being cunts we should not be, I do not believe for a second that Suarez is a racist, clearly the players do not feel he is either but that doesnt mean that he can racially abuse an opponent and then hide behind semantics. It is part of our LFC fan culture to support our players but that doesnt mean they should be given carte blanche to act stupidly nor does it mean that i expect the manager and the club to support him in doing so while crying foul.

The best possible solution I can see for Suarez and the club is too publically apologise in full and take the ban and move on. I hope we do it soon.

 

[Molbystwin]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=48021.msg1451196#msg1451196 date=1325093916]
[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=48021.msg1451191#msg1451191 date=1325093251]
My favourite bit of the article was about how many Liverpool supporters are suddenly Spanish linguist experts. Rang true
[/quote]

It works both ways that Anita, enough posters on here have been quick enough to make a conclusive decision that it was a racist comment even though it's been obvious from the outset that there's a cultural issue going on here and clarity isn't that easy to come by. No one has acted the expert, I think most are annoyed that from the outset, from the minute Fergie held Evra's hand to the referees office, there was only going to be one result.

As for Molby saying we should apologise. Shall we apologise for Evra calling Suarez a 'little South American'? An incident that seems to have fallen on deaf ears.
[/quote]

Mark, not trying to make you seeth.

All you wrote is clearly true.

Don't be mislead into thinking that I don't think it fucking sucks the way its been done, by Evra By fergie and by the FA. It fucking stinks to high heaven and I'm sure there is a fairly hefty little slice of nobbling of LFC by Man U going on.... plus sticking the V's up to Blatter by the FA.... it fucking reeks of politics and its wrong.... on that we are agreed.

That doesnt mean Suarez and the club can be dickheads IMO.

And for almost golden indignance of ...oh but didnt suarez not report being called a "sudaka" to the FA!

I suspect that IF Suarez didn't report the racial abuse he received it is because he would know that if he were to claim being racially absued he could hardly argue his defence that "negrito" was being used as a term of endearment. I just wish some people would see the logic of it a bit more clearly because in honesty I think many fans and the club are trying to defend the indefensible. None of those defending him or the club seem to be looking at the reality of it, we will not get out this situation untarnished UNLESS we apologise and leave the others to worry about their own consciences.

 

[Oncy]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

I see youre all still on this.
Fair play.
I would have thought youd have moved on.

 

[vantage]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Andy this will rumble on until the FA give their written verdict, then it will kick off again.

 

[Judge Jules]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Molby, I like you as a poster and it's rare that I disagree with you as strongly as I must about this. WTF does it matter what other people, including the FA, think? If the club thinks - and it does, whether you agree or not - that the verdict is unjust, there's a VERY clear reason not simply to give in to it. Giving in not only means we accept our player is guilty, when that is NOT the club's view - it also says to Ferguson and the FA that they can pull a stroke like this whenever they want.

Nor is the cultural argument mere "semantics". Suarez and Evra had a conversation in Spanish (which incidentally I do know a bit), but it's being judged as though it were in English. That's ridiculous and inherently unfair. In short, it's what's really "indefensible" in all this.

 

[Oncy]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=vantage link=topic=48021.msg1451201#msg1451201 date=1325096476]
Andy this will rumble on until the FA give their written verdict, then it will kick off again.
[/quote]Aah right.
Im beyond giving a fuck to be honest v.
If suarez was on fire and we were riding high in the table and this was going to derail us id probably give a bit of a shit. But he's played like 20 games and got 5 goals and we are shite.
Maybe having him out the team might improve our shite situation.
Hes not good enough as a goalscorer for me to be that fucked about him being banned.

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

It is not a cultural/linguistic defense. It's actually a fact....

Suarez is not a racist. Nor did he use racist language, or racist abuse or anything of the kind. Saying "He's not a racist, but he used a racist word" might sound like you are being charitable towards him and everything, but it's a lie.

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=48021.msg1451204#msg1451204 date=1325096759]
[quote author=vantage link=topic=48021.msg1451201#msg1451201 date=1325096476]
Andy this will rumble on until the FA give their written verdict, then it will kick off again.
[/quote]Aah right.
Im beyond giving a fuck to be honest v.
If suarez was on fire and we were riding high in the table and this was going to derail us id probably give a bit of a shit. But he's played like 20 games and got 5 goals and we are shite.
Maybe having him out the team might improve our shite situation.
Hes not good enough as a goalscorer for me to be that fucked about him being banned.
[/quote]

This isn't about a ban, it's about his reputation and what it says about the country. The people siding with you are so caught up in racism they are missing the important thing which escapes the FA....

Look, racism is so obviously wrong, they don't need to "give out a message" or "make a stand" against it. But in their paranoid insecurity they're prepared to make an example of an innocent man, just so as to show everyone we're against racism. Well, I couldn't give a flying fuck. Because I live in the real world, where people, including black people, are not stupid children that need to be told this message. Don't insult their intelligence.

What is really at stake here is the disgusting message this will send out to latin people. About how we are judging their culture to be outdated/backward/offensive and whatever else. And this isn't so obviously wrong, since we do it all the time in other situations. For example we say Japan are cunts for killing whales. We say islamic states are cunts for the way they treat women. Those are fine and there are good reasons to back it up. But judging the latin use of the word negro as racist isn't fine. It's simply a disgusting slur upon South America.

 

[Rosco]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=monsieurdantes link=topic=48021.msg1451206#msg1451206 date=1325097503]
It is not a cultural/linguistic defense. It's actually a fact....

Suarez is not a racist. Nor did he use racist language, or racist abuse or anything of the kind. Saying "He's not a racist, but he used a racist word" might sound like you are being charitable towards him and everything, but it's a lie.
[/quote]

It's amazing how you can, earlier in this thread see the difficulty with the actual charges -then come out with this.

 

[Molbystwin]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=48021.msg1451203#msg1451203 date=1325096568]
Molby, I like you as a poster and it's rare that I disagree with you as strongly as I must about this. WTF does it matter what other people, including the FA, think? If the club thinks - and it does, whether you agree or not - that the verdict is unjust, there's a VERY clear reason not simply to give in to it. Giving in not only means we accept our player is guilty, when that is NOT the club's view - it also says to Ferguson and the FA that they can pull a stroke like this whenever they want.

Nor is the cultural argument mere "semantics". Suarez and Evra had a conversation in Spanish (which incidentally I do know a bit), but it's being judged as though it were in English. That's ridiculous and inherently unfair. In short, it's what's really "indefensible" in all this.
[/quote]

Igualmente Jules, estamos en acuerdo.

Another question then, whats more important that we receive justice that we like OR what the rest of the footballing world and the public at large think is justice? I live in Spain, I speak spanish in my daily life, my ex girlfriend is south american, my mate Adriano i drink down the bar watching the game with is a mad Liverpool fan from montevideo.... and YES he is disgusted at the judgement.....

It clearly does matter what was said and how it was said etc.... but please lets not buy into this neutral use of colour terms in Spanish or indeed south american spanish..... it is not strictly speaking true, and at best is disengenuous IMHO.

They were trying to wind each other up they both used racially based language (even in spanish it is only a term of endearment when it is used as such!) Evra being the fucking jumped up manc prick that he is and Fergie backing him all the way got it front of the FA and the FA fed us to the flames they were trying to start under Blatter.... aren't we whiter than white so to speak.... marvellous.

To me if Suarez did not report being called a sudaka or panchito or whatever the fuck he was called the only possible reason i can see him for him not to do that is that he KNOWS he was on a wind up using the word Negrito and couldnt offer the "neutral" language defence whilst simultaneously accusing Evra or racially abusing him. Thats just what it is no more and no less....

Attacking Evra and the FA and claiming it isnt really racist is just piss poor IMO and it DOES matter what the rest of the public thinks. Right now we are being kicked around like a football and we have to stop it, defend Suarez as a man by all means, say you think its unfair of course that is a right, but please please please make a public apology and stop claiming to be the victim of it all. He was stupid and got involved in something silly which has far too much weight on it in these parts and not enough in Uruguay, forget it apologise and move on.....

Im getting sick of these cunts enjoying writing about it.

Lets do our seething hard done to act in private and ram it back down their fucking throats on the pitch.... we got whacked..... it wasnt fair but we asked for it....Show some fucking pride apologise and get over it.

Thats the way I see it.

I can see the way you see it too Jules I really can and i'm not calling nobody a racist here or nothing silly.... i just dont see how you can win the argument and Im aware that even trying to do so will cost larger and larger chunks of our reputation in the eyes of many.

 

[jexykrodic]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

I fail to see that Suarez would happily admit to using a word had he known it was considered racial abuse. He could merely have denied it and waited for the FA to provide evidence.

We all know this. Hanging him out to dry to prove your anti-racist credentials is muddled thinking and feeble.

Even more worrying is the failure to see that this episode declares Suarez racist. This business of saying that he's not considered racist but has used racist abuse is absurd and cowardly. The racism is implied.

He must be allowed to clear his name and I suspect that will involve legal action after exhausting the FA's procedures. Then the FA will have to prove his intent and that will be difficult as there is distinct doubt about the terms use in different language.

 

[Rosco]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Both the FA and United/Evra both state their belief that Luis isn't racist.

And the implication you derive from that is the exact opposite of what they're saying ?

 

[Molbystwin]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=jexykrodic link=topic=48021.msg1451225#msg1451225 date=1325100746]
I fail to see that Suarez would happily admit to using a word had he known it was considered racial abuse. He could merely have denied it and waited for the FA to provide evidence.

We all know this. Hanging him out to dry to prove your anti-racist credentials is muddled thinking and feeble.

Even more worrying is the failure to see that this episode declares Suarez racist. This business of saying that he's not considered racist but has used racist abuse is absurd and cowardly. The racism is implied.

He must be allowed to clear his name and I suspect that will involve legal action after exhausting the FA's procedures. Then the FA will have to prove his intent and that will be difficult as there is distinct doubt about the terms use in different language.
[/quote]

My anti racist credentials?? WTF....

I'm not saying we should hang anyone out to dry at all, im saying that Suarez should make his own defence in public explain that what was said was not thrown as heavily as it was caught apologise to Evra and move on. I would also suggest that if he had done that straight away we would not all be eating the enormous shit sandwich that right now we seem intent on garnishing.

Suarez has been subjected to abuse from opposition fans commentators and press men alike and now the FA have seen fit to make an example of him, Im right behind him as a player and a man, i just think it would be better for him and for the club and for the game as a whole if he came out and made a well worded apology.

Then we can let the rest of the cunts point the finger at themselves safe in the knowledge that even though they haven't we've done everything the way it should be done.

 

[jexykrodic]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1451229#msg1451229 date=1325101463]
Both the FA and United/Evra both state their belief that Luis isn't racist.

And the implication you derive from that is the exact opposite of what they're saying ?
[/quote]

Luis stated the belief that the word he used isn't racist abuse but you derive the exact opposite of what he's saying?

 

[Portly]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1451229#msg1451229 date=1325101463] Both the FA and United/Evra both state their belief that Luis isn't racist.

[/quote]

The 8-match ban says that they do think he's racist but are nervous of saying so in case they get sued.

 

[Rosco]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=jexykrodic link=topic=48021.msg1451232#msg1451232 date=1325101766]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1451229#msg1451229 date=1325101463]
Both the FA and United/Evra both state their belief that Luis isn't racist.

And the implication you derive from that is the exact opposite of what they're saying ?
[/quote]

Luis stated the belief that the word he used isn't racist abuse but you derive the exact opposite of what he's saying?


[/quote]

No the FA panel did.

 

[jexykrodic]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=48021.msg1451231#msg1451231 date=1325101740]
[quote author=jexykrodic link=topic=48021.msg1451225#msg1451225 date=1325100746]
I fail to see that Suarez would happily admit to using a word had he known it was considered racial abuse. He could merely have denied it and waited for the FA to provide evidence.

We all know this. Hanging him out to dry to prove your anti-racist credentials is muddled thinking and feeble.

Even more worrying is the failure to see that this episode declares Suarez racist. This business of saying that he's not considered racist but has used racist abuse is absurd and cowardly. The racism is implied.

He must be allowed to clear his name and I suspect that will involve legal action after exhausting the FA's procedures. Then the FA will have to prove his intent and that will be difficult as there is distinct doubt about the terms use in different language.
[/quote]

My anti racist credentials?? WTF....

I'm not saying we should hang anyone out to dry at all, im saying that Suarez should make his own defence in public explain that what was said was not thrown as heavily as it was caught apologise to Evra and move on. I would also suggest that if he had done that straight away we would not all be eating the enormous shit sandwich that right now we seem intent on garnishing.

Suarez has been subjected to abuse from opposition fans commentators and press men alike and now the FA have seen fit to make an example of him, Im right behind him as a player and a man, i just think it would be better for him and for the club and for the game as a whole if he came out and made a well worded apology.

Then we can let the rest of the cunts point the finger at themselves safe in the knowledge that even though they haven't we've done everything the way it should be done.
[/quote]
I wasn't replying to you individually as it happens but I'm not surprised; it's a sensitive subject.

Suarez was merely asked what was said. He told them,obviously unaware of the implications. His explanation has been ignored (which it wouldn't be in court).

Evra was brought in several times and despite admitting to abusing Suarez he has not been charged.

Sanction has not been applied equally and a guilty verdict given where there is obvious doubt, again this will be taken into account in court.

 

[jexykrodic]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1451234#msg1451234 date=1325101824]
[quote author=jexykrodic link=topic=48021.msg1451232#msg1451232 date=1325101766]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1451229#msg1451229 date=1325101463]
Both the FA and United/Evra both state their belief that Luis isn't racist.

And the implication you derive from that is the exact opposite of what they're saying ?
[/quote]

Luis stated the belief that the word he used isn't racist abuse but you derive the exact opposite of what he's saying?


[/quote]

No the FA panel did.
[/quote]

You have every right to support that FA and it's panel. An attempt to divert from the obvious implication is er, muddled thinking and feeble though.

 

[Rosco]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=jexykrodic link=topic=48021.msg1451238#msg1451238 date=1325102961]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1451234#msg1451234 date=1325101824]
[quote author=jexykrodic link=topic=48021.msg1451232#msg1451232 date=1325101766]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1451229#msg1451229 date=1325101463]
Both the FA and United/Evra both state their belief that Luis isn't racist.

And the implication you derive from that is the exact opposite of what they're saying ?
[/quote]

Luis stated the belief that the word he used isn't racist abuse but you derive the exact opposite of what he's saying?


[/quote]

No the FA panel did.
[/quote]

You have every right to support that FA and it's panel. An attempt to divert from the obvious implication is er, muddled thinking and feeble.
[/quote]

I think it takes more than one incident of this kind to declare someone a racist, I think it might be because I've got some perspective or something.

Actions are a much better indicator than words, anybody could do similar to Luis in a heated match.