The Suarez/Evra Racism Row

[Judge Jules]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Portly link=topic=48021.msg1453317#msg1453317 date=1325417852]
The FA have always reminded me of the old Soviet Union. They have "show trials" in which the accused stands no chance of being acquitted. They have offences that do not exist in normal law, like "bringing the game into disrepute."

In the days of the Soviet Union, the condemned man had no choice but to go on the train to a gulag and hope to survive it and get back to civilisation eventually.

I am beginning to feel that unless LFC's lawyers come up with a brilliant demolition of the committee's version of the evidence, we will just have to shut up, let Suarez serve his time and move on.

It's worth remembering that Ferguson can attribute much of his success to persuading his players that the rest of the world is against them. Maybe Kenny can do likewise.
[/quote]

I reckon he's begun at least to move towards such a policy already. We're definitely becoming more vocal about unfair treatment, poor decisions etc. Frankly I regret the need for it, but the alternative is to let the old goat down the E.Lancs.Rd.continue to reap the rewards of his thuggishness alone.

I despise Ferguson more with each day that goes by. The old bastard has coarsened the game, and his combination of personal unpleasantness and sheer chutzpah has browbeaten too many people into sucking up to him and letting him get away with it. "Services to football" my @rse.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=singlerider link=topic=48021.msg1453312#msg1453312 date=1325417225]
If he has said these things then he deserves a ban, but it seems it's still basically one person's word against another's
[/quote]

Exactly, the whole report is based on ifs and buts.
Open it up in PDF and do a full search for "probab" you get 35 results , with probability and probably..........that says it all for me.
I don't care what anyone says that would get laughed out of a court of law, well the CPS would never let it get there.

It's been a witch hunt from day one.

regards

 

[Woland]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=48021.msg1453326#msg1453326 date=1325418528]

It's been a witch hunt from day one.

[/quote]

Probably

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Portly link=topic=48021.msg1453317#msg1453317 date=1325417852]
The FA have always reminded me of the old Soviet Union. They have "show trials" in which the accused stands no chance of being acquitted. They have offences that do not exist in normal law, like "bringing the game into disrepute."

In the days of the Soviet Union, the condemned man had no choice but to go on the train to a gulag and hope to survive it and get back to civilisation eventually.

I am beginning to feel that unless LFC's lawyers come up with a brilliant demolition of the committee's version of the evidence, we will just have to shut up, let Suarez serve his time and move on.

It's worth remembering that Ferguson can attribute much of his success to persuading his players that the rest of the world is against them. Maybe Kenny can do likewise.
[/quote]

LFC's lawyers aren't brilliant. They're pretty fucking far from brilliant. If I was suarez I'd have McFuckWit do all the donkey work of going throught he 115pages line by line finding fault. Meanwhile I'd get a forensics student from john moores to help me clean up the video footage. Evra says to him fucking hell (you're sisters cunt), why did you foul me. The video camera must have had a clear view of his face because their evidence noted that he looked down to his knee then back up at Suarez. That's the footage I want. Luis had his back to this camera but then shrugs his shoulders. And it's disputed if he said "it was a normal foul/because you black".

Anyway whatever suarez said is obscured and can't be proven. However evra is facing the camera. According to him he said "say it again, and i'll punch you", "right i'm going to punch you"..... and according to suarez it was "you kicked me, i'm going to kick you". All you need to do is zoom into the footage, observe the way his lips were moving, and then transpose both of those spanish phrases on top of it. That would prove who told the truth. Kind of like Cindarella and the shoe.

 

[Hansern]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Thats one of the things that bug me though, how they've come to the conclusion that Evra is the more reliable part. He's changed his story on several parts, they've looked beyond his previous cuntish behaviour, his sexual reference to his sister and the sudaca comment and the language experts found his version unusual. And he was questioned 4 times to Suarez 1.

Its not as cut and dry as you think. Its a joke Imho, but whatever Im done with this thread. Hope we fight it all the way, if Suarez is telling the truth of course. If not he desveres the ban.

But, would a person with a black grandfather say, I dont talk to blacks? Really? Come on.

 

[i_rushie]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Woland link=topic=48021.msg1453330#msg1453330 date=1325418718]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=48021.msg1453326#msg1453326 date=1325418528]

It's been a witch hunt from day one.

[/quote]

Probably
[/quote]

Ditto. But as Dantes says, quite how our lawyers, Peter McCormick and Natalie Wignall mishandled this is shocking. like bringing knives to a gunfight with the FA.

 

[LarryHagman]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

As much as I'm a Liverpool fan, Suarez has racially abused Evra at least 7 times in 1 game, fact. How you choose to act on that statement is up to you, but its there.

 

[Rosco]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Hansern link=topic=48021.msg1453335#msg1453335 date=1325419040]
Thats one of the things that bug me though, how they've come to the conclusion that Evra is the more reliable part. He's changed his story on several parts, they've looked beyond his previous cuntish behaviour, his sexual reference to his sister and the sudaca comment and the language experts found his version unusual. And he was questioned 4 times to Suarez 1.

Its not as cut and dry as you think. Its a joke Imho, but whatever Im done with this thread. Hope we fight it all the way, if Suarez is telling the truth of course. If not he desveres the ban.

But, would a person with a black grandfather say, I dont talk to blacks? Really? Come on.
[/quote]

It's really clear you still haven't bothered to read it.

There was no sudaca comment. Suarez told the panel that Evra called him a South American in English. The language experts said sudaca would be an offensive term - amazingly somehow that started getting reported as what was said.

Sooner or later you're going to realise the club have lied all the way through this process, briefing the media with bullshit.

 

[King Binny]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Hansern link=topic=48021.msg1453335#msg1453335 date=1325419040]

But, would a person with a black grandfather say, I dont talk to blacks? Really? Come on.
[/quote]

Noted and discussed from points 339-345 on the report.

 

[Judge Jules]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=48021.msg1453340#msg1453340 date=1325419325]
As much as I'm a Liverpool fan, Suarez has racially abused Evra at least 7 times in 1 game, fact. How you choose to act on that statement is up to you, but its there.
[/quote]

"Suarez has racially abused Evra 7 times in 1 game" says a panel which appears to have slanted the whole proceedings in Evra's favour, and to have been allowed to do so by a display of breathtaking incompetence (at best) from Suarez' lawyers. Fact.

 

[Rosco]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Let's bring in Bob Dylan.

It worked for the Hurricance.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

You're picking and choosing facts Ross, neglecting to answer questions you know there are no answers too (i.e. there is no player who heard the terms etc). Just get the 8 game ban over with.

What's saddened me most about this episode is not the opposition fans (expected), FA, Evra or Fergie. It's how quickly so many fans have turned on Suarez and the club ... Best fans in the world definitement!

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1453341#msg1453341 date=1325419327]
[quote author=Hansern link=topic=48021.msg1453335#msg1453335 date=1325419040]
Thats one of the things that bug me though, how they've come to the conclusion that Evra is the more reliable part. He's changed his story on several parts, they've looked beyond his previous cuntish behaviour, his sexual reference to his sister and the sudaca comment and the language experts found his version unusual. And he was questioned 4 times to Suarez 1.

Its not as cut and dry as you think. Its a joke Imho, but whatever Im done with this thread. Hope we fight it all the way, if Suarez is telling the truth of course. If not he desveres the ban.

But, would a person with a black grandfather say, I dont talk to blacks? Really? Come on.
[/quote]

It's really clear you still haven't bothered to read it.

There was no sudaca comment. Suarez told the panel that Evra called him a South American in English. The language experts said sudaca would be an offensive term - amazingly somehow that started getting reported as what was said.

Sooner or later you're going to realise the club have lied all the way through this process, briefing the media with bullshit.
[/quote]

With respect you're a human and you get lied to on a daily basis. But only a bonafide genius would have any hope of getting a lie past dantes. Trust me these are the people who have lied and conspired....

Comolli
Evra
Ferguson
The referee Marriner
Evra's teamates
The FA Investigative team

 

[King Binny]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=i_rushie link=topic=48021.msg1453337#msg1453337 date=1325419126]
[quote author=Woland link=topic=48021.msg1453330#msg1453330 date=1325418718]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=48021.msg1453326#msg1453326 date=1325418528]

It's been a witch hunt from day one.

[/quote]

Probably
[/quote]

Ditto. But as Dantes says, quite how our lawyers, Peter McCormick and Natalie Wignall mishandled this is shocking. like bringing knives to a gunfight with the FA.
[/quote]

Agreed

 

[Woland]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Suarez put the lawyers in a corner by admitting it. He should have told everyone to fuck off and kept his gob shut - but the problem is he's not just a racist, he's a stupid racist.

 

[LarryHagman]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=48021.msg1453348#msg1453348 date=1325419706]
[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=48021.msg1453340#msg1453340 date=1325419325]
As much as I'm a Liverpool fan, Suarez has racially abused Evra at least 7 times in 1 game, fact. How you choose to act on that statement is up to you, but its there.
[/quote]

"Suarez has racially abused Evra 7 times in 1 game" says a panel which appears to have slanted the whole proceedings in Evra's favour, and to have been allowed to do so by a display of breathtaking incompetence (at best) from Suarez' lawyers. Fact.
[/quote]

Yawn. Like I said, how you choose to act on that statement is up to you. I didn't really expect Liverpool fans to embrace the final decision.

Personally, I don't give a fuck who's racist and who's not. But, if you're interested, Suarez is.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=48021.msg1453361#msg1453361 date=1325420047]
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=48021.msg1453348#msg1453348 date=1325419706]
[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=48021.msg1453340#msg1453340 date=1325419325]
As much as I'm a Liverpool fan, Suarez has racially abused Evra at least 7 times in 1 game, fact. How you choose to act on that statement is up to you, but its there.
[/quote]

"Suarez has racially abused Evra 7 times in 1 game" says a panel which appears to have slanted the whole proceedings in Evra's favour, and to have been allowed to do so by a display of breathtaking incompetence (at best) from Suarez' lawyers. Fact.
[/quote]

Yawn. Like I said, how you choose to act on that statement is up to you. I didn't really expect Liverpool fans to embrace the final decision.

Personally, I don't give a fuck who's racist and who's not. But, if you're interested, Suarez is.
[/quote]

That's lovely. Evra, Ross and the FA don't believe this - yet you do. Good man!

 

[Judge Jules]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Larry, get off your high horse. The mere fact that "it's there" doesn't automatically make it true - not unless you're too lazy to want to bother thinking about it.

 

[LarryHagman]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

If he wasn't a footballer, and you didn't support Liverpool, you'd hate him. Coz he's a cunt. Stop being a ten year old sticker collector.

 

[Woland]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

To be fair to Suarez, Larry, some of his best grandads are black. And some of his best friends have shoulders - there's no way he'd bite one.

It's not like he's impetuous little shitbag who's got loads of form for winding people up, getting wound up, breaking rules, doing stupid shit on the spare of the moment getting sent off and ending up with long suspensions is it? That's why we can all defend him knowing he's one of football's nice guys.

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

After the match when Ferguson and Evra went to the referee this is what was overheard by our man standing outside...

Mr Haughan told us that he heard Sir Alex say "I want to make a complaint because
Suarez has called him (meaning Evra) a nigger five times." Mr Haughan heard the referee
ask Sir Alex to close the door and the door was closed.

The complaint was about the word nigger. Then all the stuff with Comolli happened, and then Dalglish goes into the ref's room and...

After Sir Alex Ferguson and Mr Evra had left the referee's dressing room, Mr Marriner
asked Mr Dowd to go and find Mr Dalglish and Mr Suarez and ask that they come to the
referee's room so that he could speak to them.

Dalglish tells the ref about Suarez having said "you are black"...which was a Comolli lie. But then look at what was said in the hearing....

Mr Marriner explained to Mr Dalglish what had been reported to him by Sir Alex and Mr Evra. Mr
Marriner said in his witness statement that Mr Evra had told him that Mr Suarez had said
to him "I don't talk to you because you niggers", although Mr Dalglish told us that he did
not remember the referee saying that to him. Since Mr Suarez accepted Mr. Marriner's
witness statement, we accept Mr Marriner's evidence that he said this to Mr Dalglish.

Marriner is now pretending that ferguson said the same thing (with the word because). Dalglish says he doesn't remember that. Whose word to you believe? Do me a fucking favour.

What happened was Ferguson complained about the word nigger.
Then Dalglish admitted that the phrase was "because you black"
Then, and only then, does that phrase become a part of Evra's testinomy. And to back it up they get Marriner to lie in his witness statement so that it appears like this was the complaint all along.
Bullshit. They saw this from what Dalglish said in the ref's room. Then doctored all their statements afterwards
It is telling that all the players in the man u dressing room are vague in their recollections. They can't remember "exactly" but give statements that now fit in with what Dalglish admitted.

I'm sorry. But you have no idea how to spot a lie Ross, because you are quite simply not in my league. No lawyer on earth is.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Mr. H is a perfect example of why this episode has been disastrous for Liverpool ... Nothing to do with FA, the ban or Evra.

 

[LarryHagman]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Woland link=topic=48021.msg1453371#msg1453371 date=1325420409]
To be fair to Suarez, Larry, some of his best grandads are black. And some of his best friends have shoulders - there's no way he'd bite one.

It's not like he's impetuous little shitbag who's got loads of form for winding people up, getting wound up, breaking rules, doing stupid shit on the spare of the moment getting sent off and ending up with long suspensions is it? That's why we can all defend him knowing he's one of football's nice guys.
[/quote]

Touche Turtle.

 

[Judge Jules]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

If he wasn't a footballer, and I didn't support Liverpool, I wouldn't know about him, let alone hate him. Stop being an attitudinising poser.

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

And then to top it all off the refs original notes were "destroyed". Fuck off. Open you're eyes dude.

Then Evra's statement is more "probable" because it is consistent and matched what Dalglish said. I'm sorry, it only matched what Dalglish said afterwards. There is no evidence at the time for it matching at all. Only statements given days later. And just look at the extracts from the statements of nani, hernandez, valencia et al. They are so obviously aware they are telling lies and trying to qualify things by saying "I don't remember exactly".

You're problem ross is that you look for the obvious lies. But there is no such thing. Noone would tell and obvious lie. The real lies are the clever ones which are cleverly hidden. That's how to spot a lie. By being clever and outhinking your brainless opponents.

 

[Rosco]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

Dantes really is mental

 

[monsieurdantes]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=48021.msg1453385#msg1453385 date=1325420894]
Dantes really is mental
[/quote]

Liar!

 

[LarryHagman]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=48021.msg1453377#msg1453377 date=1325420542]
If he wasn't a footballer, and I didn't support Liverpool, I wouldn't know about him, let alone hate him. Stop being an attitudinising poser.
[/quote]

Great word use, has to be said.

 

[Woland]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

If Suarez's crime what he admitted - pinching Evra while calling him a black (and let's face it, he wasn't saying it in any sort of endearing way at all, he was sneering at him) and then admitting it - he should still be fined by the club and suspended for making everyone look a cunt. He's a fucking dope. He makes me want my fucking money back, the stupid fucking tit.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Re: The Suarez/Evra Racism Row (continued)

[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=48021.msg1453389#msg1453389 date=1325421033]
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=48021.msg1453377#msg1453377 date=1325420542]
If he wasn't a footballer, and I didn't support Liverpool, I wouldn't know about him, let alone hate him. Stop being an attitudinising poser.
[/quote]

Great word use, has to be said.
[/quote]

I wonder if I'm the only one who has no idea what it means.