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I don't understand our bench today...

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Whaddapie

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Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
 
Our bench today is twice as good as Chelsea have, but only because they have 5 first choice players out injured and there 'rea'l bench are out on the pitch.

Enjoy it, it will never happen again....
 
What is the point of having a creative midfielder on the bench and not using him? Honestly Rafa what is the fucking point?. How you looked at Lucas for 110 minutes today is just beyond my understanding
 
Rafa's substitutions continue to mystify. Yossi was playing well and seemed fit enough. He didn't want to come off, but - in desperate need of a goal - Rafa swaps him for Aurelio ........ a defender.

If Yossi had to come off, surely Aquilani was the right player to bring on?
 
When was the last time Rafa went hell for leather by bringing a defensive player on and replacing him with a more attack minded player. His substitutions are simply a like for like with no consideration of mixing it up with a change of formation. Everything must be in its compartment.
 
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg994902#msg994902 date=1258818358]
Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
[/quote]

I hardly ever agree with anything you write.

But I agree with that. Baffling stuff by Rafa.
 
It might have been easier to understand had Yossi have come off earlier in the second half due to him just coming back from injury, but that explanation doesn't really fly given that it was the 84th minute or so. There was the fact that Insua was having a poor game and getting exposed at the back, so maybe he was just hoping we'd hold onto what we had.

Had we lost against Birmingham and City, Rafa would be under a hell of a lot more pressure than he is under now, if that's possible. Two draws are fucking shit, but read a lot better than another couple of losses.
 
I'm struggling to understand why, when we needed 3 points that we kept Lucas and Mascher on, when there is a bloke who needs match fitness sitting on the bench who apparently is a creative midfielder. I say, apparently because I've seen fuck all of him in a red shirt today.

As an aside, Mascherano was everything you could have wanted him to be today in his role. Pity that some of the other players didn't show his desire and passion to win.
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=37352.msg994977#msg994977 date=1258825487]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg994902#msg994902 date=1258818358]
Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
[/quote]

I hardly ever agree with anything you write.

But I agree with that. Baffling stuff by Rafa.

[/quote]

Really? I never noticed. Seriously, I know we've argued before, but I didn't think it was all that often or all that bad...

Oh well.
 
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg995063#msg995063 date=1258834769]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=37352.msg994977#msg994977 date=1258825487]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg994902#msg994902 date=1258818358]
Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
[/quote]

I hardly ever agree with anything you write.

But I agree with that. Baffling stuff by Rafa.

[/quote]

Really? I never noticed. Seriously, I know we've argued before, but I didn't think it was all that often or all that bad...

Oh well.
[/quote]

I didn't mean it offensively, Whaddapie, and I didn't mean I've ever been offended by you or your views. I just meant what I said: that I usually disagree with what you say.

No big deal.
 
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=37352.msg995083#msg995083 date=1258836692]
He's saying you're foolish Whaddapie. He think you're a bit of a clown. Don't tell him I told you.
[/quote]

Aahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

As always, thanks Emlyn.

Tell me, Brendan thinks I'm ace, doesn't he..?
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=37352.msg995085#msg995085 date=1258836858]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg995063#msg995063 date=1258834769]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=37352.msg994977#msg994977 date=1258825487]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg994902#msg994902 date=1258818358]
Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
[/quote]

I hardly ever agree with anything you write.

But I agree with that. Baffling stuff by Rafa.

[/quote]

Really? I never noticed. Seriously, I know we've argued before, but I didn't think it was all that often or all that bad...

Oh well.
[/quote]

I didn't mean it offensively, Whaddapie, and I didn't mean I've ever been offended by you or your views. I just meant what I said: that I usually disagree with what you say.

No big deal.
[/quote]

No, no big deal. I wasn't offended Bunny - Just surprised. I really didn't know that.
 
[quote author=keniget link=topic=37352.msg994980#msg994980 date=1258825965]
It might have been easier to understand had Yossi have come off earlier in the second half due to him just coming back from injury, but that explanation doesn't really fly given that it was the 84th minute or so. There was the fact that Insua was having a poor game and getting exposed at the back, so maybe he was just hoping we'd hold onto what we had.

Had we lost against Birmingham and City, Rafa would be under a hell of a lot more pressure than he is under now, if that's possible. Two draws are fucking shit, but read a lot better than another couple of losses.
[/quote]

That's precisely how I read it. I was livid. And he wonders why people call him a 'cautious' manager. I also think it sends out a pretty shit message to Alberto, who was obviously itching to get on. How about showing a little faith in our £20m 'bargain' signing?

Given that Rafa said in an interview the other week that the only way the boy is going to get match fitness is by playing matches, I would've thought that he would be doing everything he can to get him up to speed. But hey, at least we didn't lose.

*muted celebration*
 
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg995086#msg995086 date=1258837065]
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=37352.msg995083#msg995083 date=1258836692]
He's saying you're foolish Whaddapie. He think you're a bit of a clown. Don't tell him I told you.
[/quote]
Aahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
As always, thanks Emlyn.
Tell me, Brendan thinks I'm ace, doesn't he..?
[/quote]

Not sure. Do you want me to find out?
 
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=37352.msg995095#msg995095 date=1258837810]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg995086#msg995086 date=1258837065]
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=37352.msg995083#msg995083 date=1258836692]
He's saying you're foolish Whaddapie. He think you're a bit of a clown. Don't tell him I told you.
[/quote]
Aahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
As always, thanks Emlyn.
Tell me, Brendan thinks I'm ace, doesn't he..?
[/quote]

Not sure. Do you want me to find out?
[/quote]

That's be great - But please don't tell him that I asked you to ask him, 'cos if he said "no", it'd be akward between us...
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=37352.msg994977#msg994977 date=1258825487]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg994902#msg994902 date=1258818358]
Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
[/quote]

I hardly ever agree with anything you write.

But I agree with that. Baffling stuff by Rafa.

[/quote]

What do you agree with?

We were forced into making two substitutions inside the first 30 minutes.

After that Rafa (and just about every manager going) was never going to make a third sub with anything less than 10 minutes left given how vunerable we'd have been ahad someone else got injured. city were on top from the minute we scored, did you want him to make an attacking sub?

Benayoun was fucked so had to come off, the only thing you could argue was whether he was to be replaced by Riera or Aurelio. Rafa probably felt it wasn't worth risking Riera and the possibility of another injury, I dunno. Hardly a massive game-changing decision though was it? Riera or Aurelio? Who gives a fuck.

Aquilani was a victim of circumstances unfortunately. I'm sure Rafa had earmarked gametime for him, but that went out the window once Agger and Babel went down injured.

The only issue I had with the subs was why El Zhar was amongst them. I thought that was pretty pointless.
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=37352.msg995955#msg995955 date=1258936908]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=37352.msg994977#msg994977 date=1258825487]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg994902#msg994902 date=1258818358]
Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
[/quote]

I hardly ever agree with anything you write.

But I agree with that. Baffling stuff by Rafa.

[/quote]

What do you agree with?

We were forced into making two substitutions inside the first 30 minutes.

After that Rafa (and just about every manager going) was never going to make a third sub with anything less than 10 minutes left given how vunerable we'd have been ahad someone else got injured. city were on top from the minute we scored, did you want him to make an attacking sub?

Benayoun was fucked so had to come off, the only thing you could argue was whether he was to be replaced by Riera or Aurelio. Rafa probably felt it wasn't worth risking Riera and the possibility of another injury, I dunno. Hardly a massive game-changing decision though was it? Riera or Aurelio? Who gives a fuck.
Aquilani was a victim of circumstances unfortunately. I'm sure Rafa had earmarked gametime for him, but that went out the window once Agger and Babel went down injured.

The only issue I had with the subs was why El Zhar was amongst them. I thought that was pretty pointless.
[/quote]

I give a fuck.

If he's not worth risking, why is he on the bench?

If he's on the bench, and we need to grab a late winner, why not play him, an attacker, rather than a defender who can play in midfield.

Or, if you're not going to go with the more attack minded player, why not bring on our 20m midfield "saviour" to see if his creative passong could open things up a little?
 
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg996014#msg996014 date=1258942402]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=37352.msg995955#msg995955 date=1258936908]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=37352.msg994977#msg994977 date=1258825487]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg994902#msg994902 date=1258818358]
Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
[/quote]

I hardly ever agree with anything you write.

But I agree with that. Baffling stuff by Rafa.

[/quote]

What do you agree with?

We were forced into making two substitutions inside the first 30 minutes.

After that Rafa (and just about every manager going) was never going to make a third sub with anything less than 10 minutes left given how vunerable we'd have been ahad someone else got injured. city were on top from the minute we scored, did you want him to make an attacking sub?

Benayoun was fucked so had to come off, the only thing you could argue was whether he was to be replaced by Riera or Aurelio. Rafa probably felt it wasn't worth risking Riera and the possibility of another injury, I dunno. Hardly a massive game-changing decision though was it? Riera or Aurelio? Who gives a fuck.
Aquilani was a victim of circumstances unfortunately. I'm sure Rafa had earmarked gametime for him, but that went out the window once Agger and Babel went down injured.

The only issue I had with the subs was why El Zhar was amongst them. I thought that was pretty pointless.
[/quote]

I give a fuck.

If he's not worth risking, why is he on the bench?

If he's on the bench, and we need to grab a late winner, why not play him, an attacker, rather than a defender who can play in midfield.

Or, if you're not going to go with the more attack minded player, why not bring on our 20m midfield "saviour" to see if his creative passong could open things up a little?
[/quote]

Could you imagine the outcry if we'd brough Aquilani on to play on the left-wing? It's not his position, and there are two left-sided players sitting on the bench already.

When Benayoun couldn't continue, it was naturally one of Riera or Aurelio. As for choosing between them; well neither score or create that many goals so it's not that big a deal as far as I'm concerned. Aurelio's been used as a late sub before, and can put in a decent free-kick or set-piece from time to time (The corner which Lucas missed from being one example) so I can see the rationale behind it.
 
Understand that rationale, in fairness.

I just don't get it, when it's set against the background of the current situation and Rafa's penchant for playing people out of position when he thinks it would work...

If Riera can't be risked for even the last 6 minutes, why was he there at all? If Riera can't be risked, and he and Yossi have almost identical injuries, how come Yossi can be risked? Aqualani was fit for 15 minutes or so two weeks ago, but couldn't have started yesterday, with Lucas or Mascher to come on after 60 minutes, if necessary (understanding that plan would obviously have changed...)?

Etc...
 
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg996022#msg996022 date=1258943826]
Understand that rationale, in fairness.

I just don't get it, when it's set against the background of the current situation and Rafa's penchant for playing people out of position when he thinks it would work...

If Riera can't be risked for even the last 6 minutes, why was he there at all? If Riera can't be risked, and he and Yossi have almost identical injuries, how come Yossi can be risked? Aqualani was fit for 15 minutes or so two weeks ago, but couldn't have started yesterday, with Lucas or Mascher to come on after 60 minutes, if necessary (understanding that plan would obviously have changed...)?

Etc...




[/quote]

Well you could question quite a lot of things I suppose.

And if he hadn't have put Riera on the bench, who would he have stuck there? Voronin? Degen? Who else is there?

A semi-fit Riera is probably still a better option.
 
Again, no real issues with any of that, except to say that a semi-fit Riera is only a better option if he's actually got a shot at playing. Otherwise, he's just a wasted spot on the bench...
 
So all in all we should have had the option of bringing on a reserve instead of a half-fit Riera. It's not really a huge decision is it?

Ryan's called it right.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37352.msg996044#msg996044 date=1258950585]
So all in all we should have had the option of bringing on a reserve instead of a half-fit Riera. It's not really a huge decision is it?

Ryan's called it right.
[/quote]

Squiggles, why put him on the bench if he can't even play his own position for 6 minutes? That's what I don't understand, mate.

That's all. There's no argument here.
 
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=37352.msg994902#msg994902 date=1258818358]
Two weeks ago, we lost Riera and Yossi for a month.

Two weeks ago, Aquilani played 20 minutes quite well, and has been training ever since.

Today, Yossi came on as a sub, but was so short of match fitness, he had to come off again, too.

And Aquilani watched the entire game from the bench.

Erm....?
[/quote]

Benayoun should not have came on, Aquilani should replace Babel. Gerrard play on the left. After all, for the first 20 mins Gerrard always get to the left of midfield to play with Babel and Insua. Its so simple and yet Rafael tinker too much and get Benayoun in and subs him 5 mins before the game end. Fucking hell!

El Zhar or Benayoun to replace Lucas at 65 mins. Lucas has been shit this season.
 
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