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Henderson

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[quote author=Cerberus link=topic=48531.msg1475783#msg1475783 date=1328135291]
Jordan "ready salted" fucking HORRENDERSON. No points for guessing who came up with that one. Anyhooter, I'm not convinced by him. Nothing he does in a game gets my attention. All this "tidy" and "keeps possession" should be a fucking prerequisite for a professional footballer, not their standout attribute.

Youth is on his side however. Hopefully he matures into a dynamic, creative and goal scoring midfielder ala Gerrard. We might have to get out the wonder serum though.
[/quote]

I prefer "Henderwank"
 
He has more raw ability than what Lucas had at 21. So if he has a similar dedication, which he seems to have, he could easily eclipse Lucas as a midfielder..
 
Henderson has a chance to become one of our key players for years and years to come. You guys all say he is "tidy", as if assuming that's he has nothing else in store and will always be nothing more than a "tidy" player. When Lampard was 21, did many people predict he was going to score over 100 PL goals? Henderson obviously has something "extra" in him (at least it's obvious to me), he is mature beyond his years, his fundamental shooting and passing technique is excellent, so it's just a matter of time until he starts scoring regularly IMHO. Most importantly, his attitude couldn't be better. I think Hendo will improve every season and in hindsight, 16 million will look like a steal.

Spearing surprised me in the Wolves game. He looked EXCELLENT. I'd like to see him perform against a quality opposition before making any conclusions.
 
There is definitely a player in there somewhere. At first he was a passenger for us but he has grown into himself a lot more which is positive. Wasn't worth the money we paid for him and he isn't impacting games enough but there is something there. I said from day one that he doesn't have the confidence to express himself yet and should be a bit part player this season. Injuries to Lucas, Stevie and Jay have pushed to the first 11 and he's done okay.

He's great at celebrating goals too btw, the new Arbeloa. Ha.
 
[quote author=hmmmmm1 link=topic=48531.msg1475777#msg1475777 date=1328133689]
He cant tackle, cant pass, cant shoot

He is the white momo Sissoko...
[/quote]

can't pass? I think the amount of misplaced passes by henderson can be counted on one hand
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1475818#msg1475818 date=1328170684]
[quote author=hmmmmm1 link=topic=48531.msg1475777#msg1475777 date=1328133689]
He cant tackle, cant pass, cant shoot

He is the white momo Sissoko...
[/quote]

can't pass? I think the amount of misplaced passes by henderson can be counted on one hand
[/quote]

I stopped when he compared them. Can't tackle? Momo? Yeah right, watch that Chelsea game again when he man handled their midfield singlehandedly and made one of the best tackles I've ever seen on Fat Frank. That said, it's a pointless comparison, one's and attacking midfielder, the others a destroyer.

And yes, as you rightfully pointed out, Henderson CAN pass.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=48531.msg1475820#msg1475820 date=1328174316]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1475818#msg1475818 date=1328170684]
[quote author=hmmmmm1 link=topic=48531.msg1475777#msg1475777 date=1328133689]
He cant tackle, cant pass, cant shoot

He is the white momo Sissoko...
[/quote]

can't pass? I think the amount of misplaced passes by henderson can be counted on one hand
[/quote]

I stopped when he compared them. Can't tackle? Momo? Yeah right, watch that Chelsea game again when he man handled their midfield singlehandedly and made one of the best tackles I've ever seen on Fat Frank. That said, it's a pointless comparison, one's and attacking midfielder, the others a destroyer.

And yes, as you rightfully pointed out, Henderson CAN pass.
[/quote]

It's baffling how people just make up stuff about Sissoko.

Sissoko tackle
 
when it comes to young players (younger than 22) I'm not as critical as I would normally be for someone older. all I need to see is 'something' to build on and I definately see that 'it' with henderson.
 
When played in the middle he's done ok. When played out on the right he's been a waste of a shirt at times.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=48531.msg1475820#msg1475820 date=1328174316]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1475818#msg1475818 date=1328170684]
[quote author=hmmmmm1 link=topic=48531.msg1475777#msg1475777 date=1328133689]
He cant tackle, cant pass, cant shoot

He is the white momo Sissoko...
[/quote]

can't pass? I think the amount of misplaced passes by henderson can be counted on one hand
[/quote]

I stopped when he compared them. Can't tackle? Momo? Yeah right, watch that Chelsea game again when he man handled their midfield singlehandedly and made one of the best tackles I've ever seen on Fat Frank. That said, it's a pointless comparison, one's and attacking midfielder, the others a destroyer.

And yes, as you rightfully pointed out, Henderson CAN pass.

[/quote]
he passes sideways far too often

Not adams biggest fan but he at least creates

momo maybe was too harsh, perhaps a poor mans deshamps is more accurate

though I do hope he comes good
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=48531.msg1475820#msg1475820 date=1328174316]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1475818#msg1475818 date=1328170684]
[quote author=hmmmmm1 link=topic=48531.msg1475777#msg1475777 date=1328133689]
He cant tackle, cant pass, cant shoot

He is the white momo Sissoko...
[/quote]

can't pass? I think the amount of misplaced passes by henderson can be counted on one hand
[/quote]

I stopped when he compared them. Can't tackle? Momo? Yeah right, watch that Chelsea game again when he man handled their midfield singlehandedly and made one of the best tackles I've ever seen on Fat Frank. That said, it's a pointless comparison, one's and attacking midfielder, the others a destroyer.

And yes, as you rightfully pointed out, Henderson CAN pass.
[/quote]

Chelsea get Momo'd
 
he's young and quite assured in possession. he brings some balance to the midfield and it's certainly necessary when paired with adam who tries more creative things and as a result can lose the ball.
 
Comparison to Lucas is a bit uneven. Lucas was decent/annoying at 21, Henderson is decent/annoying at 21. Now Lucas is a very good DM. So in a few years Henderson will be a good midfielder?

I think its much harder for a player to develop the skills to play the position Lucas was asked to fill; i,e good positioning, good tackling, quick pass to the attacking players. He's still not very creative going forward, but he has gotten very good on the ball/wriggling out of pressure. I think he's come good because he was always a good footballer who finally learned his position. If you need proof, just watch Adam/Spearing play the same role. Adam can't anticipate movement, Spearing gets easily pulled into wide positions and struggles to get back.

You can try to expect the same out of Henderson, but he's not learning a new role. At first he was occasionally being played wide, now he's in the center (usually) at the role he's played most of his career. What he lacks though is something that is much harder to learn, if it even can.

For one, he has a weak fucking shot. I'd even say dainty. Maybe that's confidence, but it don't take learnin' to hit the ball harrrd. To hammer a cross instead of lofting it. And I don't understand why people praise all this running. It's not skill to chase the ball and run at the passer. I don't see that creating much panic in the opposition. In fact, it looks fucking stupid. You can challenge for the ball, cut off the pass, but chasing it? When you're 8 someone running at you might have force an error off you. When you're a pro, some small dude running at you and stopping 5 yards off trying to "block" the pass, in that sumo stance Henderson takes... FFS.

I do think he has some good vision, and he seems best when he can slide the ball through a defense. That pass to Downing against Citeh was slick, and he had a similar pass against Wolves. Maybe dude's got vision, and is to timid to see it through. Maybe. I'd be more than thrilled if he becomes a good footballer. But at 21 there's enough to see that he's not going to be the next Gerrard.

In short, Henderson will develop into a better player, but he'll probably only be decent/boring.
 
[quote author=ElMalarkey link=topic=48531.msg1475976#msg1475976 date=1328193230]
What he lacks though is something that is much harder to learn, if it even can.

For one, he has a weak fucking shot. I'd even say dainty. Maybe that's confidence, but it don't take learnin' to hit the ball harrrd. To hammer a cross instead of lofting it. And I don't understand why people praise all this running. It's not skill to chase the ball and run at the passer. I don't see that creating much panic in the opposition. In fact, it looks fucking stupid. You can challenge for the ball, cut off the pass, but chasing it? When you're 8 someone running at you might have force an error off you. When you're a pro, some small dude running at you and stopping 5 yards off trying to "block" the pass, in that sumo stance Henderson takes... FFS.

I do think he has some good vision, and he seems best when he can slide the ball through a defense. That pass to Downing against Citeh was slick, and he had a similar pass against Wolves. Maybe dude's got vision, and is to timid to see it through. Maybe. I'd be more than thrilled if he becomes a good footballer. But at 21 there's enough to see that he's not going to be the next Gerrard.

In short, Henderson will develop into a better player, but he'll probably only be decent/boring.
[/quote]

Is the right answer.
 
[quote author=ElMalarkey link=topic=48531.msg1475976#msg1475976 date=1328193230]

For one, he has a weak fucking shot. I'd even say dainty. Maybe that's confidence, but it don't take learnin' to hit the ball harrrd.
[/quote]

I remember how Fabregas seemed unable to strike the ball hard. For all his passing brilliance, he was scoring very little. Then something clicked and he started to score at a better rate than most strikers.

I expect something similar from Henderson. He has precision and very good fundamental technique of striking the ball. Power will come later. So will confidence.
 
It was blatantly obvious that Fabregas was immensely talented from a very young age, though. The same is not true of Henderson.

I don't really understand all these comparisons with other players. "Well, such and such wasn't very good when he was younger, so if Henderson can improve as much as him, he'll be well worth the money." It seems to me like a convenient way of justifying our overspend on a fundamentally average player.

It's no doubt true that Lucas has improved immeasurably, and beyond what many of us thought capable. But let's not forget that this is not the norm. More often than not, young, average footballers turn into slightly older average footballers, before retiring as average veterans. We can't simply assume that because player A far exceeded expectations, that player B will do the same. It is highly improbable, and not a good premise to build our transfer policy on.

And Henderson is not suddenly going to develop a rocket shot, either.
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1475687#msg1475687 date=1328124633]
bren hates him with a passion. well, he (bren) needs someone hate on now that lucas has improved.

I mostly agree with mark's post. I think his progress has stalled with the injury to lucas. I thought henderson would be able to sit deep and sheild the defence but give more going forwards than spearing or lucas but clearly in the absence of both players he has had to hold his position which pretty much killed dead his forward runs.

I like the player, he does the simple things well, too often am I thinking 'fucks sakes the pass was on there' but I rarely if ever have to say that about henderson because if the pass is on 9/10 he will make it and often he will make the pass early. I think the better our pass and move gets the better he will get because he suits a one touch team far better than a team that will send it long or run with the ball.

count me in the camp that likes the player but currently he is treading water and if jonjo (for example) were to establish himself then henderson is the most likely to make way for him. jordan needs to add goals and assists to his game if he wants to continue being a mainstay of the team, either that or learn to tackle.
[/quote]

Spidey - do you remember 2-3 months ago when you insisted Lucas should be dropped and Henderson deployed in his place because (andIquote) "teams are playing through us at the moment" which you argued would be countered by Henderson's deployment in the centre, and that he "offers more going forward than Lucas". your argument being that Henderson would shield the defence better and provide a greater attacking threat. It was wonderful stuff.

I note above in your opening paragrpah that you believe Henderson's "progress has stalled with the injury to Lucas".

I would ask for an explanation, but I really don't want one. I just wanted to highlight your nonsensical jibber-jabber.
 
Henderson int the finnished article yet, but he has it in him to become a great player. the price is of course over the top, but it is the same price as i.e. Hargreaves, Andersson and Carrick had. CMs with reputation cost, and so does the ones with great potenetial.

I like the untypical Liverpool way he chooses to look in front of him instead of the ever boring short pass sideways or back. he dares to look at rooms ahead of him, and he has some power and drive to his game. He needs to keep on developing it, but he has the future. I also like that heis mobile and athletic. I hope Lucas gets back on the feet and can build a good partnership with Hendo in the start of the new campaign!
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=48531.msg1480074#msg1480074 date=1328845872]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1475687#msg1475687 date=1328124633]
bren hates him with a passion. well, he (bren) needs someone hate on now that lucas has improved.

I mostly agree with mark's post. I think his progress has stalled with the injury to lucas. I thought henderson would be able to sit deep and sheild the defence but give more going forwards than spearing or lucas but clearly in the absence of both players he has had to hold his position which pretty much killed dead his forward runs.

I like the player, he does the simple things well, too often am I thinking 'fucks sakes the pass was on there' but I rarely if ever have to say that about henderson because if the pass is on 9/10 he will make it and often he will make the pass early. I think the better our pass and move gets the better he will get because he suits a one touch team far better than a team that will send it long or run with the ball.

count me in the camp that likes the player but currently he is treading water and if jonjo (for example) were to establish himself then henderson is the most likely to make way for him. jordan needs to add goals and assists to his game if he wants to continue being a mainstay of the team, either that or learn to tackle.
[/quote]

Spidey - do you remember 2-3 months ago when you insisted Lucas should be dropped and Henderson deployed in his place because (andIquote) "teams are playing through us at the moment" which you argued would be countered by Henderson's deployment in the centre, and that he "offers more going forward than Lucas". your argument being that Henderson would shield the defence better and provide a greater attacking threat. It was wonderful stuff.

I note above in your opening paragrpah that you believe Henderson's "progress has stalled with the injury to Lucas".

I would ask for an explanation, but I really don't want one. I just wanted to highlight your nonsensical jibber-jabber.
[/quote]

I've said before that what I thought would happen with henderson, didn't. note: I was only taking about games where we would need a bit extra to break down the opposition and we still need this if the sea of home draws is anything to go by.
I don't have some massive ego that I can't admit that I was wrong about some speculation about a player.
henderson has proved not to be that player but I think the general idea is sound (two players in CM that are potent in an attacking and defensive sense).
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=48531.msg1480074#msg1480074 date=1328845872]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1475687#msg1475687 date=1328124633]
bren hates him with a passion. well, he (bren) needs someone hate on now that lucas has improved.

I mostly agree with mark's post. I think his progress has stalled with the injury to lucas. I thought henderson would be able to sit deep and sheild the defence but give more going forwards than spearing or lucas but clearly in the absence of both players he has had to hold his position which pretty much killed dead his forward runs.

I like the player, he does the simple things well, too often am I thinking 'fucks sakes the pass was on there' but I rarely if ever have to say that about henderson because if the pass is on 9/10 he will make it and often he will make the pass early. I think the better our pass and move gets the better he will get because he suits a one touch team far better than a team that will send it long or run with the ball.

count me in the camp that likes the player but currently he is treading water and if jonjo (for example) were to establish himself then henderson is the most likely to make way for him. jordan needs to add goals and assists to his game if he wants to continue being a mainstay of the team, either that or learn to tackle.
[/quote]

Spidey - do you remember 2-3 months ago when you insisted Lucas should be dropped and Henderson deployed in his place because (andIquote) "teams are playing through us at the moment" which you argued would be countered by Henderson's deployment in the centre, and that he "offers more going forward than Lucas". your argument being that Henderson would shield the defence better and provide a greater attacking threat. It was wonderful stuff.

I note above in your opening paragrpah that you believe Henderson's "progress has stalled with the injury to Lucas".

I would ask for an explanation, but I really don't want one. I just wanted to highlight your nonsensical jibber-jabber.
[/quote]

Ahhh, there you are. In some sick twisted way I missed reading your posts. You can be such a cockass though.


I will never forget this:

"Ha ha ha.

Did you see the rules upon registration too mate?

'I agree to abide by the racism, incest, necrophilia, discrimination, innuendo, and everything else this site has to offer on a thrice daily basis. In turn, I will continue not to use moisturiser, conditioner, toothpaste, and anything else that falls under the catgory of 'non-manly. I shall commit to not using toilet paper to wipe my hole, will deny all knowledge of any such word as 'cappucino', will endeavour to rid the world of any deoderant that doesn't have the words 'old' and 'spice' in it's title, will spit at them gays in the street, will walk manfully through the wind, snow and rain (minus a poofy scarf of course) proclaiming that 'I AM A MAN AND I USE THE LIVERPOOL WAY'

Pretty strict criteria."

One of the funniest posts ever. Fuck me sideways...
 
Fuckin el! I had to do a double take when I saw CAD posting !! Good to see som old faces returning
 
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=48531.msg1480453#msg1480453 date=1328907320]
Fuckin el! I had to do a double take when I saw CAD posting !! Good to see som old faces returning
[/quote]

all we need is DJ and the family will be complete 🙂
 
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=48531.msg1480453#msg1480453 date=1328907320]
Fuckin el! I had to do a double take when I saw CAD posting !! Good to see som old faces returning
[/quote]

Hey Sunny - Give my regards to Pete. Good to see you 🙂

PS: You know it's ok to come back when you cant really remember why you had to leave. Isnt that about right?
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1480455#msg1480455 date=1328907495]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=48531.msg1480453#msg1480453 date=1328907320]
Fuckin el! I had to do a double take when I saw CAD posting !! Good to see som old faces returning
[/quote]

all we need is DJ and the family will be complete 🙂
[/quote]

Ouch...
 
[quote author=CAD link=topic=48531.msg1480457#msg1480457 date=1328907583]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1480455#msg1480455 date=1328907495]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=48531.msg1480453#msg1480453 date=1328907320]
Fuckin el! I had to do a double take when I saw CAD posting !! Good to see som old faces returning
[/quote]

all we need is DJ and the family will be complete 🙂
[/quote]

Ouch...
[/quote]

ha ha I liked DJ, he was aces. he'd get into arguements and when he was losing he'd just ban the person. he's like ryan but with power 😉
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1480459#msg1480459 date=1328907821]
[quote author=CAD link=topic=48531.msg1480457#msg1480457 date=1328907583]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=48531.msg1480455#msg1480455 date=1328907495]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=48531.msg1480453#msg1480453 date=1328907320]
Fuckin el! I had to do a double take when I saw CAD posting !! Good to see som old faces returning
[/quote]

all we need is DJ and the family will be complete 🙂
[/quote]

Ouch...
[/quote]

ha ha I liked DJ, he was aces. he'd get into arguements and when he was losing he'd just ban the person. he's like ryan but with power 😉
[/quote]

PMSL! DJSYD never had the wit though. Whatever happend to him??
 
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