Firmino/Striker Discussion

[Frogfish]

I'd be really disappointed. He should be given a decent chance and as much as I have high hopes for Origi, right now I'd put Danny above him in the pecking order.

Ooh that's a tough call. Ings is definitely a goal poacher who gives his all (and I'd like to see come on more often from the bench) but I'm not sure he would be as much as an influence on the team as Origi due to Origi's better technique and breadth of skills (pace, power etc.).

 

[Ryan]

I've tried to make this a wider discussion the gen-gen thread, but perhaps the specifics of Firmino and the ideal striker can exist here.

It's great to see some genuine quality discussion, without the usual crybaby bleating and ill-advised point-scoring (without any points ever being scored), when in actual fact I've never actually said anything inaccurate or without basis in facts.

HAHAHAHAHAHA HAVE YOU READ WHAT YOU FUCKING TYPED?!

You called him a "fat useless spastic" a few weeks ago you tool.

Thankfully the forum has copped on and you're getting rightly shoe'd all over this site in about 7 different threads.

 

[leftpeg]

Is it better than Firmino's though?

Sturridge was, maybe still is, a 60M player, Origi we hope might become one. What does Ings offer that would make the trade worthwhile?

My point is, if the ideal situation is a better, more clinical finisher than Firmino and a harder working, more all round team player than Sturridge, what's wrong with Ings? Firmino and Sturridge both have stronger strengths but does Ings offer more of a complete package? To be fair, we don't know because he hasn't yet had a proper run in the side.

 

[FoxForceFive]

HAHAHAHAHAHA HAVE YOU READ WHAT YOU FUCKING TYPED?!

You called him a "fat useless spastic" a few weeks ago you tool.

Thankfully the forum has copped on and you're getting rightly shoe'd all over this site in about 7 different threads.

Regardless of the veracity of what you just wrote, can we leave the bickering out of this thread please.

I created it simply because the topic Brendan was being raked over the coals over in so many threads actually had a decent debate in there that was being ignored.

This thread has worked & enabled the forum to actually discuss this maturely, I'd prefer the point scoring bollocks from all sides to be left elsewhere.

 

[Hansern]

Will be interesting to see where Ings fits in during the season. He's obviously still short of fitness but he has a lot of great attributes that fits in with Klopps attacking set up. Hope to see more of him as the season progresses.

Firmino will be leading the line for the time being I reckon but Origis performance against Spurs should warrant a start soon. That was impressive.

 

[FoxForceFive]

I really like Ings, & yeah, he could be a good solution to the issue.

However the other night it was blatantly obvious why Klopp hasn't been playing him. He looked a yard off the pace & seemed to struggle keeping up physically at times too.

I assume Klopp has had him doing that really high intensity training that he had sturridge doing which is aimed at making players fit for ninety minutes running but can have endurance issues due to the amount of training involved.

 

[mark1975]

Because his all round game is better than Origi's.

Is it? I don't see it that way at all. Origi has a much better touch, more pace, power and finishing technique. Ings is a hard grafter who can nick in with goals. I like him by the way, so this isn't a slight on Ings, I think his Liverpool career is dead in the water, which is a real shame.

 

[leftpeg]

Is it? I don't see it that way at all. Origi has a much better touch, more pace, power and finishing technique. Ings is a hard grafter who can nick in with goals. I like him by the way, so this isn't a slight on Ings, I think his Liverpool career is dead in the water, which is a real shame.

And you may be right but my point is, we don't know because he hasn't had the chance to show us or Klopp one way or the other. We saw some very promising signs before the injury and I just think it would be a terrible shame and potentially great folly to sack him off and replace him with someone equally unproven or worse, much more expensive before he's shown what he can do.

 

[Avmenon]

To Brendan's point, we do need quality strikers to lead the line aka a Suarez type, but there is a lot of value from the current practice with many quick forwards pulling defenders all over the place. If we could mix things up it would really make us extremely difficult to beat.

 

[mark1975]

And you may be right but my point is, we don't know because he hasn't had the chance to show us or Klopp one way or the other. We saw some very promising signs before the injury and I just think it would be a terrible shame and potentially great folly to sack him off and replace him with someone equally unproven or worse, much more expensive before he's shown what he can do.

Completely, he needs to be given a chance, the trouble is that Origi and Sturridge are barely figuring at all in the league, so that leaves Klopp giving those two games in the ELC with Ings coming off the bench.

 

[6TimesaRed]

Jesus wept...

This should not even be up for debate

Too often we have been a Team that has relied upon 1 or 2 individuals, and we have struggled to compete consistently..

This set up is like a machine, each player serves their purpose. Another player will benefit from another's inclusion. Eventually it will become a well oiled machine..

Sturridge as great as he is.. is a Plan B option to have in this system, a great option to have, mind...

But he will be sold, and a player with a similar stature to that of one of our forward 3 will replace him.. Origi is favoured over Sturridge, because he fits into the System, better than Sturridge..

Origi Can Press, has some physicality about him and a bit of pace too, the best bit he is young, so time is certainly on his side to develop further into this system. If the end of last Season was anything to go by, we will eventually have some player on our hands..

That being said, we don't need a free flowing goalscorer when our attacking options more than makes up for that.. We have goals in our team all over the pitch..

I am also to the beleif Firminio will develop into a player that will have more goals to his game as time goes on.. But his game is much more than that, his inclusion with his trickery, positioning and technique, bring others into the game, that in itself breeds goals elsewhere..

 

[keniget]

I don't think anyone really wants to sell Ings - not even Klopp judging by the rumours during the summer - but we play with one striker and he's competing with Origi, Sturridge and Firmino for a spot.

It's a case of a right player, wrong time. We've got a strong group, very few games and he's off the back of a very long spell out the team.

Hopefully both parties will stick it out till next season when - again, hopefully - we will have European games to dish out.

 

[Woland]

Defo a shame for Ings, he did look dead good for those few games. But would anyone drop any of our forward line for him?

I wouldn't sell in January though. This is gonna be a long hard season and we're going to get a few bad injuries before it's over.

 

[TSD]

Ings is definitely a Klopp-shaped striker, has all the attributes, the skill sets. Whether he's good enough is the real question. I'm very optimistic going forward because I'm quite convinced our next (big) striker signing will be the next Suarez, because I reckon Klopp reckons that's the best type of forward for him in the English league.

 

[Hyena]

There's no need to fuss over this boys.

We all know sooner or later Firmino is going to break his leg just as he hits god-like status, and just as Sturridge or Origi find a bit of form they'll crash into a lamppost.

Then we can be glad that we have three non-shit strikers on our f***king bench.

Talk about 1st world problems...................

 

[Modo]

We also know that Mané is going to play for Senegal in January so Sturridge needs to be around.
But if a substantial offer comes from a top team and Sturridge causes a fuss, we might just sell in Jan.

 

[TSD]

We also know that Mané is going to play for Senegal in January so Sturridge needs to be around.
But if a substantial offer comes from a top team and Sturridge causes a fuss, we might just sell in Jan.

I don't think Sturridge will kick up a fuss in Jan, since he'll be getting plenty of playing time during Mane's absence. Other it's a very calculated one.

 

[Oliver Twist]

We also know that Mané is going to play for Senegal in January so Sturridge needs to be around.
But if a substantial offer comes from a top team and Sturridge causes a fuss, we might just sell in Jan.

If by top team, you mean a Prem top team, we'd be fucking loopy to sell Sturridge to them in January. Or to even contemplate it.

 

[Modo]

If by top team, you mean a Prem top team, we'd be fucking loopy to sell Sturridge to them in January. Or to even contemplate it.

Nah don't think we'll sell to Arsenal.
If PSG needs a CL boost...who knows.

 

[tony]

Nah don't think we'll sell to Arsenal.
If PSG needs a CL boost...who knows.

Sanchez is now striker at the Arse isn't he so Studge would be swapping one bench for another.

 

[Insignificance]

We also know that Mané is going to play for Senegal in January so Sturridge needs to be around.
But if a substantial offer comes from a top team and Sturridge causes a fuss, we might just sell in Jan.

Where on the Fuzzometer do he need to be to sell? We can use a random 6CM thread as reference ;-)

 

[King Binny]

 

[Comical Aly]

Flabby Melt makes me think of this. Maybe some photoshop whizz can stick Firmino's face on it.

 

[willby]

Page 8 and still no youtube compilation of his assists or just of him winning the ball back from opposition players....

*waits some more*

 

[cloggypop]

Post it yourself you fat lazy melt.

 

[HC]

was that the first time we saw firmino play as a legitimate striker ? He played it perfectly whatever it was

 

[King Binny]

Missed having such firepower!
[article]– After 11 league games in 2013-14 five players had scored for Liverpool but 10 have already got their names on the score-sheet so far this season and Daniel Sturridge is still yet to get off the mark.

– Liverpool had 17 shots on target against Watford on Anfield – the most Opta Stats have ever recorded in a Premier League fixture.

– It was the fifth time they had scored four or more goals during their 6-1 victory on Sunday and Liverpool have achieved it in just 11 games so far compared to the entire season needed to record the same achievement in 2013-14.

– Liverpool currently have three players in the top 10 Premier League goalscorers list (Sadio Mane, Philippe Coutinho and Roberto Firmino) and that’s more than any other team.[/article]

[article]In addition, Liverpool have now found the net 30 times in 11 games and should their average rate of goals continue, they would reach over 100. It is 5/2 that they reach this landmark this season (2/7 they do not).

But these aren’t the only amazing statistics backing up their title credentials….

• Sadio Mane has scored in five goals in his five Premier League appearances at Anfield for Liverpool.
• Philippe Coutinho has had a hand in eight goals in his last seven PL appearances for Liverpool (three goals, five assists).
• Similarly, Roberto Firmino has scored five times and assisted three goals in his last seven league games for Liverpool.
• Coutinho has been involved 53 PL goals since making his debut in February 2013 (level with Sturridge).
• Watford have conceded more goals today v Liverpool (6) than they had in their last six PL games combined (5).
• Adam Lallana has recorded five assists this season, with only Kevin De Bruyne providing more in the Premier League this season (6).
• Liverpool are averaging 19.1 shots per game – the highest in the Premier League and the third highest in Europe’s top five leagues behind Real Madrid (20.3) and Roma (19.6)
• Liverpool boast European football’s most potent attack – with an average of 7.8 shots per game hitting the target (next highest in the Premier League is Chelsea with 6.4)
• Liverpool are the Premier League’s top scorers with 30; four ahead of nearest rivals Chelsea
• Liverpool are averaging 58% possession – the second highest in the Premier League behind Man City (61.1%)
• According to whoscored.com ratings, Liverpool have three of the top five players in the Premier League this season (Coutinho 1st, Firmino 3rd, Mane 5th)
• And finally, Liverpool are top of the Premier League at the end of a day for the first time since May 2014 – 916 days ago.

[/article]

 

[cloggypop]

Sturridge could have had about 4 himself yesterday.

 

[Modo]

Sturridge could have had about 4 himself yesterday.

Can't believe that Sturridge still hasn't scored in the prem. Very unlucky yesterday.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Let's examine the what and why of our current, lofty position in a positive way, and debate. Has there been a team who have played like this, with the same set-up, that you have seen? Can we win the title? What can stop us? (we probably need to talk about defence in a different thread). Because I certainly don't think United or Burnley were results that had anything to do with the opposition finding us out, otherwise it would have happened more often.

I would say his Dortmund teams - though the names became 'massive names', they were not household names before they were in his system (Sahin, Goetze, Reus etc etc).