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Defense - Agger/Skrtel

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mark1975

mark1975

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I thought it looked good yesterday, now it's finally been given a chance. Also with Kelly in there we were back to having a fullback that tucks inside when needed, so the right sided centre back wasn't left doing two jobs, as is often the case when Magic plays.

Encouraging.
 
The problem is Skrtel is incredibly inconsistent, and Agger is awfully injury prone. And both are horrendous in the air. We need a new centre back as soon as possible.

Also, you've been having a right go at Johnson recently haven't you?

I love Kelly as much as anyone but I still want to see what Kenny can get out of Johnson at right back.
 
Kenny heaped praise on Kelly after the match, I think he will play Johnno on the wing (which we have all been looking to try) and Kelly will make RB his own.

Next step a Striker and maybe a LW this transfer window?
 
Kelly's been absolutely superb at right-back but I'll be more than slightly disappointed if we convert him into a permanent full-back as I genuinely believe he's the heir apparent to Carra.
 
There is nothing wrong with him playing full-back for the time being. He's doing very well there and it's giving him a route into the first team where he can gain confidence. There is plenty of time for him to end up at CB if that's where he's going to end up. Besides, there are plenty of very good players that have played both the full-back and centre-back positions.
 
Agger and Skrtel would get fucked over by anyone half decent in the air.

Agger has his moments where he can win a load of headers.. He also has this bizaree heading upwards thing that is laughably shite. Every second game he will try and clear the ball and simply put it 10 feet into the air.

Skrtel - Shite in the air, gives away countless freekicks when asked to challenge long balls.

If we want to challenge for honours we need another Sami. The Spartan is great in the air.. but has 0.9% of the ability Sami had to organise the defence.
 
[quote author=keniget link=topic=43531.msg1248370#msg1248370 date=1294651929]
There is nothing wrong with him playing full-back for the time being. He's doing very well there and it's giving him a route into the first team where he can gain confidence. There is plenty of time for him to end up at CB if that's where he's going to end up. Besides, there are plenty of very good players that have played both the full-back and centre-back positions.
[/quote]

Agreed keni. What I'm saying is that I still think Johnson should be the first-choice right-back. I've never really warmed to the idea of Johnson at right wing. I think Kenny can light that fire under his arse to get him defending properly.

As for Kelly, I do believe that we can start giving him games at centre-back ahead of Agger or Skrtel, if need be. It'll be a tremendous challenge but I really think he's up to it. And I mean now.
 
I think the back four needs to contain Kelly, Skrtel and Agger from now on. Aurelio and Carra can alternate at left back.

Johnson could do with looking at Kelly's performance yesterday and learn from it how to defend at the back post on crosses, how to block crosses and when to go forward from the full back position.
 
On paper, I'd say our best defence is this:

Kelly - Carra - Agger - Aurelio


That left side is still a bit soft though, and we're still a bit weak aerially. Ideally we'd sign a new LB and a new CB in January, but I think both is unlikely, so we'll have to manage with that four or something similar to it for the rest of the season.

When is Carra back? I don't hate Skrtel as much as some on here, but he looks much better next to Carra than he does next to Agger or the Greek.
 
[quote author=gareth_thomas link=topic=43531.msg1248374#msg1248374 date=1294652086]
Agger and Skrtel would get fucked over by anyone half decent in the air.

Agger has his moments where he can win a load of headers.. He also has this bizaree heading upwards thing that is laughably shite. Every second game he will try and clear the ball and simply put it 10 feet into the air.

Skrtel - Shite in the air, gives away countless freekicks when asked to challenge long balls.

If we want to challenge for honours we need another Sami. The Spartan is great in the air.. but has 0.9% of the ability Sami had to organise the defence.
[/quote]

Ya...agree with this.

Agger is good at getting his head to the ball, but he doesn't alway head it with conviction. Which is also the reason his headers are too weak or off target when he is attacking a corner.

Skrtel is plain shit in the air. But Kelly seems decent.

In theory, It should Be Kelly...Carra...Agger...Aurelio, when Carra comes back from injury. I say in theory because Agger and Aurelio are likely to be injured when Carra is back.

I wouldn't mind if we end up selling Agger and Skrtel for one dominant CB signing in the summer. Kyrgiakos can remain as squad cover if he is not earning big money. Ideally i would sell Skrtel and Kyrgiakos, but we are not likely to get much for the greek.
 
[quote author=dmishra link=topic=43531.msg1248379#msg1248379 date=1294652410]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=43531.msg1248370#msg1248370 date=1294651929]
There is nothing wrong with him playing full-back for the time being. He's doing very well there and it's giving him a route into the first team where he can gain confidence. There is plenty of time for him to end up at CB if that's where he's going to end up. Besides, there are plenty of very good players that have played both the full-back and centre-back positions.
[/quote]

Agreed keni. What I'm saying is that I still think Johnson should be the first-choice right-back. I've never really warmed to the idea of Johnson at right wing. I think Kenny can light that fire under his arse to get him defending properly.

As for Kelly, I do believe that we can start giving him games at centre-back ahead of Agger or Skrtel, if need be. It'll be a tremendous challenge but I really think he's up to it. And I mean now.
[/quote]

Kelly was excellent against the Mancs(and has been every time I've seen him play this season) so I hope he keeps his place in the team. I'd not play him as CB yet though as I feel the full back position is much better for his development for now.

As for Johnson, If we can find a proper buyer I'd sell him and buy a decent RB to alternate/cover for Kelly. I'd also buy a new CB as I don't think Skrtel is good enough. Mertesacker or Hangeland would be my choice. I'm also keeping my fingers crossed Agger stays fit. I had almost forgotten how much I like him as a player. He has never really played with a partner best suited for him either(the ones mentioned above would correct this imo).
 
Agent: Agger will not be leaving Liverpool
By talkSPORT
Monday, January 17

Liverpool defender Daniel Agger has pledged his long-term future to the club and is relishing the chance to play under Kenny Dalglish.

Agger, 26, has been strongly linked with a move to Malaga and Fiorentina, but he is determined to stay at Anfield and help the club challenge in the top half of the table again.

The Danish defender has already held talks with Dalglish over his future and is fully committed to the Merseyside club.

Agger’s agent Per Steffensen admits there has been interest in Agger but has ruled out any chance of him leaving Liverpool in January.

Steffensen said: “Kenny Dalglish thinks a lot about Daniel and has made that clear to him in a meeting.”
 
What a difference a manager makes eh?

Anyways fingers, legs, and toes crossed he can stay clear of more niggling injuries.
 
I genuinely like Agger but even he needs to up his game and steer clear of injuries.

A regular run of games will improve his form and consistency.

I'd be happy to flog Skrtel because of late he is our worst defender and a liability.
 
I've usually defended Skrtel on here, but it's becoming more difficult with each game that passes.

That said, I'm not much more impressed with Agger from what I've seen so far. AFAIC the jury's still out on him, and I certainly expect him to keep his big mouth zipped in the media in future.
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=43531.msg1255013#msg1255013 date=1295274558]
agger can stay, skrtel needs to be fucked off asap.
[/quote]

What's Agger done that's so special it gives him a reprieve? We're still conceding goals, he's gobbed off to the media more than once, he's unavailable for selection more than he's available, and he's also questionable in defence and isn't quite the brilliant all rounder people on here seem to believe.

Skrtel's had a woeful season, but our defensive issues don't end there. I'd be happy to see the back of all of them bar Carra and Kelly, they're all questionable.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=43531.msg1255017#msg1255017 date=1295274817]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=43531.msg1255013#msg1255013 date=1295274558]
agger can stay, skrtel needs to be fucked off asap.
[/quote]

What's Agger done that's so special it gives him a reprieve? We're still conceding goals, he's gobbed off to the media more than once, he's unavailable for selection more than he's available, and he's also questionable in defence and isn't quite the brilliant all rounder people on here seem to believe.

Skrtel's had a woeful season, but our defensive issues don't end there. I'd be happy to see the back of all of them bar Carra and Kelly, they're all questionable.
[/quote]

Wow another Anti Agger post, what did he say? Was he quoted in the media?

The only time I saw him say anything bad was about Roys tactics when Roy wanted him to hoof more long balls and stop playing football?

Are there any links?

Not pulling you up, just want to see where you are coming from
 
If we are expected to believe that Agger is young enough to improve in terms of injury and performance (he is not some World beater even when he is fit) then why wouldn't Skrtel be able to do the same, given that they are roughly the same age?

I think they are both good players, who possibly haven't quite lived up to their potential yet.
Agger has a reputation beyond his entitlement in some ways because he doesn't play as often.
 
[quote author=Richey link=topic=43531.msg1255046#msg1255046 date=1295275696]
If we are expected to believe that Agger is young enough to improve in terms of injury and performance (he is not some World beater even when he is fit) then why wouldn't Skrtel be able to do the same, given that they are roughly the same age?

I think they are both good players, who possibly haven't quite lived up to their potential yet.
Agger has a reputation beyond his entitlement in some ways because he doesn't play as often.


[/quote]
Agger is a potential world beater IF he stays fit. You all know that's my opinion. Whether I'll ever be proved right (or wrong) is however another matter and it all comes down to whether he can stay fit. Because of his injury-record he's still not lived up to his potential as you say. Hopefully he can make amends soon enough.

With regards to Skrtel. From the first year and onwards he's failed to impress me, on a regular basis at least, and I believe this latest run of his perfectly underlines why myself and others on here - never really have been convinced he's got what it takes at this level. Not as a starter week in, week out at least.

People claim he's stronger, and quicker than Agger, and perhaps they are right, but his use of his strength and ability is what concerns me the most. First quarter of the Season we conceeded goals because he was nowhere to be seen around his opponent - constantly glaring at the ball - now he's probably been told to stop watching football and take his marker instead. Something that has resulted in Skrtel now only looking at his man instead of the ball. The way he tried to mark Felliani and Beckford I reckon it was, without looking at the ball at all (same fault made with regards to Blackpools second mind) was mind-boggling to say the least. Not the sign of a good defender at all to be honest, lacking confidence or not.

With Skrtel or even Kyrgiakos for that matter playing we are far to easy to close down as well, always an opponent around Agger (or Carra to some extent even) so their partner has to move the ball forward, hence we're far to often losing possession although Skrtel - at least when on confidence - isn't to bad in this department. Better than his rep at least.

For me Skrtel isn't as bad as he's been of late, but he's not that good either when on form, so either way I reckon we're CB short - and preferably one who's legendary in the air, because that's obviously one area where Agger - fit or not - doesn't do to well in either. And Carra certainly isn't getting any taller himself. Or younger.
 
Sell Agger as we need stability in our defence (thats why we're shaky IMO) and he gets injured all the funking time! I rate his ability in defence and attack and it would be a shame to see him go, but his fitness is awful
Sell skrtel as he is inconsistent. Fantastic one game, a liability the next. We should try wilson in the next few games to see if he can cover appropriately. If he can then great, sell one. Also try and get a powerhouse of a defender who can organise for when carra is out. Mertesacker would be coup if we could. If not then we need to put the feelers out ASAP
 
[quote author=Asbo link=topic=43531.msg1255043#msg1255043 date=1295275594]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=43531.msg1255017#msg1255017 date=1295274817]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=43531.msg1255013#msg1255013 date=1295274558]
agger can stay, skrtel needs to be fucked off asap.
[/quote]

What's Agger done that's so special it gives him a reprieve? We're still conceding goals, he's gobbed off to the media more than once, he's unavailable for selection more than he's available, and he's also questionable in defence and isn't quite the brilliant all rounder people on here seem to believe.

Skrtel's had a woeful season, but our defensive issues don't end there. I'd be happy to see the back of all of them bar Carra and Kelly, they're all questionable.
[/quote]

Wow another Anti Agger post, what did he say? Was he quoted in the media?[/quote]


I'll try and find it, but he gave an interview recently which was widely quoted on here in which he said that, if he was fit, he "expected" to play "in this team". Those are the words of a player who is far too full of himself. I don't give a stuff whether it's justified or not (though I for one don't think it is) - you just don't do that.
 
This is from last week via his agent and him:

"If I’m not playing in the Liverpool team on a regular basis, then I am ready to move on," he said last week.

"I have only just returned from three months out injured, so I am in no position, at the moment, to say I must be in the side for every game.

"But once I have made a few appearances and regained full fitness, I would expect to be starting games. If I’m not playing, I can’t see a reason for staying."

Brovarone claims Agger now is haggling with La Viola over the annual salary on offer.

He said: "The Viola have put forward a contract proposal to Agger, offering him €1.5million (£1.3M), but he wants €2million (£1.7M) per season.

"Now we have to wait and see what Liverpool say about it."
 
And from Sept 2010

Daniel Agger has hit out at Roy Hodgson's style of play at Liverpool.
The furious Kop star raged: "I like to keep the ball on the ground and I'm going to keep doing that. The manager has a philosophy we're playing football further up the pitch and you have to play a different kind of football at the back.

"But I'm not going to be a player that unloads the ball every single time I get it."

"Whether he'll use me or not, time will tell.

"I'll fight for my chance but I know what I represent, and I think he also knows that.

"Our play has changed but I'm not going to adjust 100 per cent."
 
From Feb 2009, when not starting every game after recently returning from injury, and then getting a run after Skrtel's injury v Man City:

"Let me be honest and admit that, if I don't play, then it's untenable and it can't go on like that," said the Dane.

Agger has only enjoyed a consistent run this season after Skrtel suffered a cruciate ligament injury at Manchester City in October. The £5.8m signing from Brondby was restricted to two starts in 12 matches before the City game as he returned from a metatarsal injury, and has started only once – at Portsmouth on Saturday – since Skrtel reclaimed his place against Stoke City on 10 January.

The frustrated defender added: "It's never fun as a footballer when you don't play every time. That's no secret. But that's my situation in the club right now; that he [Benítez] won't let me play. That's not my decision. The question now is whether this is the right thing for me, because I would like to play some football. But for now I have chosen to give it some time and give it a chance and fight for my spot in the team. I feel I'm good enough. For the same reason it's annoying that I don't play.I'll wait for the chance and then I will prove that I'm good enough. I'll show them - no doubt about that."
 
You can't argue with players wanting to play, but he came out with a similar interview to last weeks one back at the beginning of the season when he was playing left back and a bit part (again, after returning from injury). Issuing a threat that he would leave if he didn't start playing.

Understandable if it was 6 months down the line maybe, but not after a short spell of games after months in the treatment room. He really needs to learn to keep his gob shut and just get on with it.
 
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