Comolli Sacked!

[keniget]

You're right, focusing on our poor finishing is missing the wood for the trees. We don't create enough chances and certainly not enough clear cut chances. That's the main problem. Now you can point to games where we've had a few bad misses but over the course of the season we've not been creative enough. You only have to look back at the first half of the season where we looked very solid and yet still struggled to make our domination count.

Whilst Javi Martinez is a good player with a huge amount of potential that I'd love for us to sign, he's not going to solve the most glaring issue we have - we're shit in the final third. Gerrard is a fading force, Bellamy is not a 40 game a season player, Maxi and Kuyt are going or gone, Downing is useless, which pretty much leaves all responsibility for giving us that extra spark on Suarez's shoulders. We see it week in, week out. As good as Suarez is, he needs help.

 

[spider-Neil]

You could have Maxi and Bellamy and Raheem now - but they don't get picked. You're mashing two unrelated problems together.

maybe, but for me I see CM as our problem area and more so since the injury of lucas. That's where I would focus the money, but each to their own.

 

[spider-Neil]

You're right, focusing on our poor finishing is missing the wood for the trees. We don't create enough chances and certainly not enough clear cut chances. That's the main problem. Now you can point to games where we've had a few bad misses but over the course of the season we've not been creative enough. You only have to look back at the first half of the season where we looked very solid and yet still struggled to make our domination count.

Whilst Javi Martinez is a good player with a huge amount of potential that I'd love for us to sign, he's not going to solve the most glaring issue we have - we're shit in the final third. Gerrard is a fading force, Bellamy is not a 40 game a season player, Maxi and Kuyt are going or gone, Downing is useless, which pretty much leaves all responsibility for giving us that extra spark on Suarez's shoulders. We see it week in, week out. As good as Suarez is, he needs help.

gerrard isn't a fading force at all, he is being played in an area of the pitch that utterly blunts his effectiveness. it would be like asking suarez to hurt teams from right back.

I see it like this,
you play agger and skrtel together and that allows you to push up,
you play lucas and that allows you to commit more bodies to the attack (because he has the mobility and skill to take on more responisibility shielding the defense.
you get a player 'like' javi martinez (ideally the player himself) and he has the mobility and skill to break from midfield with the ball and get back at break neck speed when we lose it.

the ball gets sucked towards carroll and gerrard, suarez and the last of the attacking 6 latch onto this ball and finish off chances.

simple.
not rocket science.
not brilliant tactics.
just playing to people strengths, compressing the play and playing the numbers.

we're currently going 4-4-2 and we don't have the players for it. gerrard is too far from goal, carroll isolated and suarez doesn't have the players in and around him for the quick give and goes.

let's say the only player we buy in the summer was martinez and lucas came back as good as ever

-------------------pepe------------------
--------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------
-----------lucas---martinez-----------
--suarez------gerrard------maxi-------
---------------carroll--------------------

that's how I see it. carroll wins it/holds it up and the the 3 players behind him who are all goal threats and have good intelligence (in the final third) do the damage.
the player we lack is the one who links the midfield to those front 4 attacking players.
as I said, each to their own but that's what I'd do if I was in charge of spending the money.

 

[Modo]

It's a good theory Neil, but I still think that line up is missing a Iniesta, Mata, Silva - type player.

 

[keniget]

We already know that the attacking players we have aren't good enough. This season has proven that beyond a shadow of a doubt. I'm sure that we can bring about a reasonable degree of improvement by shuffling them about and playing to their strengths but when you have limited resources you have to consider what will give you the biggest bang for your buck. Buying a Martinez isn't going to do that.

I think everyone acknowledges that our midfield needs work. None of us are happy with it but with Lucas, Gerrard, Henderson , Spearing and Shelvey we can manage. Binny posted in the stats thread that only Barcelona have spent more time in the oppositions half than Liverpool. That reinforces the fact that whilst we know the midfield does have issues that need addressing, our most pressing concern is further up the pitch.

 

[spider-Neil]

It's a good theory Neil, but I still think that line up is missing a Iniesta, Mata, Silva - type player.

gerrard, maxi and suarez have the ability to crave open chances and lucas has the ability to ensure we don't get killed on the counter attack.
reports of gerrard's demise are exaggerated, he is being asked to perform a roll that simply doesn't suit him, maxi/bellamy haven't played enough and suarez feels he has to do it all on his own because of lack of support. you only have to look at the difference with suarez' performance first and second half with a lack of support as everton pushed us back first half and second half were we pushed higher searching for the winner.

 

[spider-Neil]

I think everyone acknowledges that our midfield needs work. None of us are happy with it but with Lucas, Gerrard, Henderson , Spearing and Shelvey we can manage.

I'm not buying that. maybe jonjo and henderson in time but certainly not now.

 

[Modo]

There are better options out there than Maxi. He's also 31 years old.

 

[keniget]

I'm sure Gerrard still has more in him than he's showing right now but he's never going to reproduce the form we saw in 07/08 for, example, hence fading force.

As for not buying 'that'... you don't need to. You have the evidence of this season to go on. Our midfield hasn't been great by any stretch of the imagination but it's done enough. Our attackers have not.

 

[spider-Neil]

There are better options out there than Maxi. He's also 31 years old.

I don't have a problem with us getting another attacking midfielder and giving raheem more time but I personally would prioritize CM, but as I said that's just me, there is certainly enough evidence to justify splashing out on attacking players and gamble what we have in CM is enough. each to their own.

 

[spider-Neil]

I'm sure Gerrard still has more in him than he's showing right now but he's never going to reproduce the form we saw in 07/08 for example, hence fading force.

As for not buying 'that'... you don't need to. You have the evidence of this season to go against. Our midfield hasn't been great by any stretch of the imagination but it's done enough. Our attackers have not.

as I said, I think gerrard can be as good as ever if he plays in the right areas of the pitch and the hattrick confirmed this for me.

 

[Niall K]

as I said, I think gerrard can be as good as ever if he plays in the right areas of the pitch and the hattrick confirmed this for me.

Why hasn't he got himself into the right areas more often then this season ? He's been a shadow of his former self this season and hasn't looked particuarly interested either.

In my opinion he no longer has that pace or power that defined him as a great player so yes we do need to use him somewhat differently and I reckon out on the right wing would be the best option now as long as he doesn't get all mardy about it.

 

[Jürgen4PM]

I think it's pretty clear that our main focus this summer should be based on signing more quality attackers, yet i wouldn't feel comfortable starting the new season relying on Stevie as an integral part of our midfield.

 

[spider-Neil]

Why hasn't he got himself into the right areas more often then this season ?

because his starting position is too far from goal. when he was younger his lung bursting runs negated this but being on the wrong side of 30 it's definately a factor now.

 

[Delinquent]

as I said, I think gerrard can be as good as ever if he plays in the right areas of the pitch and the hattrick confirmed this for me.

All the hattrick confirmed is that, like most ageing stars, Stevie is still capable of turning it on every now and again. There's been no evidence to suggest that he can do it consistently for quite some time now.

 

[peterhague]

i like the idea of signing quality (hopefully mainly foreign) u21 players. if we can add £45-50m to the budget by selling Downing, Adam, Carroll, Aquilani and Johnson then so much the better. i think we might as well keep Maxi and Kuyt for their experience; i'm less sure about Carragher as his wages are a pisstake for what he's capable of contributing. Sign:

RB - £5m
First XI striker - £15m
Reserve striker - £7.5m
2 creative forwards/wingers - £30m
Versatile CM - £15m

Total = £72.5m

 

[Insignificance]

Stevie need to take a long good look in the mirror and make an honest decision if he wants to invest what it takes to lift his game again. He has been plagued by injuries, and he has struggled to come back to his former level. He has also played with a worse team than he usually does, and noone can guarantee him that the team will see new established talent enter the team next year. Therefore the excisting players will have to run that halfmile longer, and sprint that second faster, pass that inch more accurate and keep the ball better. It is tough to improve in his stage of the career, but we are depending on it.

 

[spider-Neil]

i like the idea of signing quality (hopefully mainly foreign) u21 players. if we can add £45-50m to the budget by selling Downing, Adam, Carroll, Aquilani and Johnson then so much the better. i think we might as well keep Maxi and Kuyt for their experience; i'm less sure about Carragher as his wages are a pisstake for what he's capable of contributing. Sign:

RB - £5m
First XI striker - £15m
Reserve striker - £7.5m
2 creative forwards/wingers - £30m
Versatile CM - £15m

Total = £72.5m

and thread water for 3 seasons? I'd be prepared to wait that long but I doubt the majority of our fans or the owners would.

 

[Woland]

If the rest of that side was nearly as good as Gerrard we wouldn't have a problem.

 

[Insignificance]

If the rest of that side was nearly as good as Gerrard we wouldn't have a problem.

True. There are plenty of players who need to lift their game. On the other hand it is probably easier for young guys in their early twenties to mentally prepare themselves for the lift, than for Stevie. They haven't been the places he has been, and they don't have to carry the biggest load either.

 

[spider-Neil]

gerrard was one of the most prolific fowards in the country playing off torres, there is no way on this earth you can expect that type of return or impact with him playing 20 yards deeper and bogged down with defensive duties. his age doesn't help but his starting position is key.

 

[peterhague]

and thread water for 3 seasons? I'd be prepared to wait that long but I doubt the majority of our fans or the owners would.

better than treading water for 22 seasons. plus, with the quality of young players those figures would get you you'd still get plenty of impact in the short-term as well. enough to at least compete for a CL place, i'd have thought. as for whether the owners would settle for it - yes, because it seems to me that it'll be their deliberate strategy. i think fans are patient as long as they can see hope and some kind of strategy.

 

[Insignificance]

I agree. he should deploy his resources higher up in the field. But we unfortunately doesn't have the CMs needed to relieve him those duties.

 

[spider-Neil]

I agree. he should deploy his resources higher up in the field. But we unfortunately doesn't have the CMs needed to relieve him those duties.

bingo!

 

[spider-Neil]

better than treading water for 22 seasons. plus, with the quality of young players those figures would get you you'd still get plenty of impact in the short-term as well. enough to at least compete for a CL place, i'd have thought. as for whether the owners would settle for it - yes, because it seems to me that it'll be their deliberate strategy. i think fans are patient as long as they can see hope and some kind of strategy.

they demanded CL football at the start of the season and got out the knives when that target wasn't achieved. they take a long term on players but a short term view on results.

 

[peterhague]

gerrard was one of the most prolific fowards in the country playing off torres, there is no way on this earth you can expect that type of return or impact with him playing 20 yards deeper and bogged down with defensive duties. his age doesn't help but his starting position is key.

i definitely agree he should be playing in the hole. not only is he better there but it's a position he can play with relatively little physical exertion. my problem is planning much around him at all, tbh. still excellent on his day, but he's struggled for form and fitness for quite a while now.

 

[Insignificance]

they demanded CL football at the start of the season and got out the knives when that target wasn't achieved. they take a long term on players but a short term view on results.

I am not sure it was a purely resultfiasco that led to Comollis departure. They have worked closely with him for a year and a half, and they know what they are looking for. They want to build a force to be reckon in world soccer, and they just decided that COmolli didn't fit the bill after all. He sold himself in as a Footballs Billy Bean, and clearly he hasn't delivered value for money. If we were 10 points nearer a CL spot I think his fate would still be the same based on his and not the teams performance.

 

[spider-Neil]

i definitely agree he should be playing in the hole. not only is he better there but it's a position he can play with relatively little physical exertion. my problem is planning much around him at all, tbh. still excellent on his day, but he's struggled for form and fitness for quite a while now.

jonjo looks to me the player who is his natural replacement in that area of the pitch.

 

[peterhague]

they demanded CL football at the start of the season and got out the knives when that target wasn't achieved. they take a long term on players but a short term view on results.

I've got my own misgivings about the owners but I think there's way more to what happened last week than that. IMO what they've been most dissatisfied with is that there didn't seem to be any obvious long-term progress to compensate for the short-term problems. I think they're tightening their control over things now: whoever comes in as DOF will have almost total power over signings imo, with Kenny deliberately weakened by their clear dissatisfaction both with the signings he played a large part in and the results on the pitch.

 

[peterhague]

jonjo looks to me the player who is his natural replacement in that area of the pitch.

yes, i suppose if you plan for Gerrard to play there with Shelvey as his backup that'd decent enough for now.